Withdrawing from percocet AND valium at the same time

[[Su...]]

Hi,

 

Successfully transferred off of xanex and onto valium.  Decided to deal with my pain medications since I read that those drugs should be gotten off of first.  However, wanted to do both at the same time.  So far I'm having a lot of success (not to mention crying and feeling sick to my stomach).  Know the crying and sick to my stomach is due to going from a maximum of 70 oxycodone daily to 15 hydrocodone in a relatively short time.  Also went from 4 mg xanex to 20 mg of valium in about the same amount of time.  Trying to stabilize on the 20 mg of valium and 15 mg of hydrocodone until the crying and stomach illness, not to mention stress diminishes. 

 

Never took meds to get high, just to deal with anxiety and disabiling neck pain.  Still in pain, but substituting either ibuprofen or tyelenol to get through it.

 

Anybody else ever go thru this?

[[Sa...]]

Summer,

 

Just to be clear, you crossed over from 4mg of Xanax to 20mg of Valium?  Isn't 4mg of Xanax equivalent to 80mg of Valium according to Ashton? 

 

Sandy

[[Su...]]

Sandy,

 

Yes, and I'm an idiot.  In fact, I believe all the equivalency charts, including Ashton's is wrong.  Seems to me that .5 mg of xanex is equal to about 40 mg of valium (at least in terms of anti-anxiety effects).

 

Went to 20 mg because my doctor thinks that 1 mg of xanex is equal to 5 mg of valium although he did prescribe 40 mg/daily dosage for substitution. 

 

I just wanted to come off these stupid drugs so fast.  I'm in agony and do not recommend anyone else ever try this.  I just don't know what to do now that I'm on 20 mg (afraid of going up and afraid not to).

[[Sa...]]

Sandy,

 

Yes, and I'm an idiot.  In fact, I believe all the equivalency charts, including Ashton's is wrong.  Seems to me that .5 mg of xanex is equal to about 40 mg of valium (at least in terms of anti-anxiety effects).

 

Went to 20 mg because my doctor thinks that 1 mg of xanex is equal to 5 mg of valium although he did prescribe 40 mg/daily dosage for substitution. 

 

I just wanted to come off these stupid drugs so fast.  I'm in agony and do not recommend anyone else ever try this.  I just don't know what to do now that I'm on 20 mg (afraid of going up and afraid not to).

 

Summer,

 

I am a true believer in Ashton's equivalence chart because that is in fact what I followed when I crossed over from 1.5mg of Ativan to 15mg of Valium and think I have done quite well following her method.  It is only now on these lower doses where I've had to make some changes. I am now tapering .04mg every day and am now at 1.38mgs.  I'm actually doing really well right now. 

 

If it were me,  I would crossover to the amount that Ashton recommends if you want to find some relief.  If your doctor is willing to write out the prescription than why not, especially if you are having a hard time.  Her method does work.  I have many friends who have gotten off benzos this way.  They have now returned to normal life and most of them are experiencing minimal protracted  w/d s/x.

 

Sandy

 

 

[[Su...]]

Sandy,

 

Yes, I agree with Ashton's charts.  I just meant that xanex relieved my anxiety way more than valium does, but then again, I didn't follow the directions. 

 

Can I get your opinion?  Since I've already gone 5 days on the 20 mg valium (with terrible effects), should I go up to the 40 mg valium and then taper to get some relief and then follow Ashton to the letter?  Or is that going backwards since I've come so far (but at what a cost)?

 

I really don't have a problem with my doctor writing me scripts for the 40 and then slowly tapering me.

 

I should have listened to Colin and Ashton and all of you people that are following the right schedule.  I just wanted to be off meds so bad and to do it as fast as possible, ignoring Colin and Ashton's warning about protracted withdrawal syndrome.

 

What to do?  Please help Sandy.

[[Co...]]

Hi Summer,

 

I think that you should think about stabilising your dose for a while. You switched over to an insufficient amount of Valium. Give your GABA system time to catch up with the shortfall, then start to taper again once you feel somewhat better.

[[Sa...]]

Hi Summer,

 

I think that you should think about stabilising your dose for a while. You switched over to an insufficient amount of Valium. Give your GABA system time to catch up with the shortfall, then start to taper again once you feel somewhat better.

 

Summer,

 

I would do what Colin suggested as well. 

 

Don't lose hope.  Things will get better with time.  They did for me.

 

Sandy

[[Su...]]

Colin,

 

Need to stabilize on something.  Sorry I wrote in personal message, but wasn't sure where to post where you would see the message.

 

Yesterday I had a horrid day and took 25 mg of valium and 1 xanex (after not having a xanex for a couple of weeks).  Had to go out and make an anxious trip to see my mother and could not make it without the meds (hard to make it even with the meds).

 

Even took more of my pain meds 2.5 pills vers 1.5 pills.  Still so anxious I cannot function.

 

Want to start over with a new taper schedule and one that I will more than willingly follow and not get ahead of myself again.  Only took 20 mg of valium for 5 days. 

 

Can you please come up with another schedule for me?  I promise I will follow it to the letter.  Really need help.  Thank you.

[[Co...]]

Hi,

 

According to Ashton, an equivalent dose to 4mg of Xanax is about 80mg of Valium. Very few doctors will prescribe this amount of Valium though. If I recall correctly, I devised a schedule for you that would switch just a small dose at a time with at least a week between each switch), so that by the end you would be on 40ml of Valium (the dose prescribed by your doctor). If done slowly enough, this should work - you would be, in effect, tapering at the same time as substituting. For some reason, you switched far more quickly than I suggested as a minimum, and for only half the dose of Valium (20mg). It is not surprising you feel so ill.

 

This is a topsy-turvy way of going about things (cutting too quickly and then upping your dose to stabilise), and can cause great problems; it can be very difficult to correct. I would not recommend that you double your dose to 40mg all in one go, even if you have been 20mg for just 5 or 6 days. However, since you have been on this low dose for such a short time, and have reduced from an equivalent dose 2-4 times greater in a short period of time, correcting your dose is perfectly reasonable. In your shoes, I think I'd try an increase of 5mg for a few days ans see if noticed any improvement. If you do begin to feel better (and are continuing to feel more better each day), then stay at that dose, as it will take some time for the Valium to build up to stable dose (probably up to 2 weeks). However, if you notice no improvement after a few days, then add another 5mg to your dose. Same as before, if you notice improvements, stabilise at that dose for a while to see just how much improvement can be gained from this dose. If no improvement is noticed, then yet another increase could be tried.

 

You should be aiming to feel relatively OK - not to feel great! Keep writing to the forum about your progress, so that you can gain some feedback. I really cannot recommend that you increase your dose from 20mg to 40mg all in one go, but you are probably correct in trying to correct your recent overzealous substitution/taper.

[[bo...]]

Hi

Getting off this drug is counter intuitive, you really have to be disciplined to taper off, You have to take X amoiunt daily, preferably at the same time and consistently, its not something that can be forced.

Its like taking an anti biotic if you dont finish the prescribed dose, it does more harm than good, I know you want off fast,but forcing your taper will do more harm than good.

Take Care

Bobers

[[Su...]]

Thanks so much Colin and Bobers,

 

Yes, I figured that out cause I am so sick.  I don't know why I did it and didn't listen. 

 

I will try the 5 mg increase and see how I feel.  I cannot do anything at all.  I have been ready to put myself in a hospital except for I am finally listening to THAT advice about not going into a rehab place.

 

Since I have not been on the xanex for 2 weeks with the exception of the 1 pill I took yesterday, should I just leave the xanex alone and go to the 25 mg of valium?  I had used 20 mg of valium for 5 days (without the xanex) with disasterous results before yesterday going up to the 25 mg of valium and adding the 1 xanex which did absolutely no good.

 

Thanks so much for answering me right away.  I really, really, really appreciate it.

 

I will leave the percocet dose alone until I am off of the benzs.  I am in so much pain anyway, I could not tolerate any more.

 

Love you guys.  Thanks for putting up with me after I didn't take anybody's advice and tried to do things MY way which is so contrary to Ashton. 

[[bo...]]

Hi

Well I'm confused, since you should have started at 80mg of Valiun then started at 40mg but are now at 25? I should let Colin answer, but what have you done for the last 2 weeks exactly?

Bobers

[[Co...]]

Hi Bob,

 

I'm not entirely sure, but it seems that Summer decided to switch far faster than the plan I put together for her, and for only 20mg instead of the 40mg that her doctor was willing to prescribe. I think it was yet another case of a member being too impatient to get off benzos. This is so common; it seems that we cannot get through to so many that they need to go slowly. In my opinion, it's all part of the benzo-fog.

 

Summer has already realised her mistake, and has made several posts to other members advising that they take it slowly when substituting. Summer is now having to repair the damage.

 

I hope you feel better soon, Summer.

[[Su...]]

Thanks Colin.  I do so hope that the new members will learn from my mistake.  It is so important.  I cannot emphasize that enough.  It's like the story of the turtle and the hare.  I want to be a turtle taperer from now on.

 

Bobers, started the valium/xanex crossover 8/27 and completed it by 9/19 vs. the 8 weeks or so proposed by Colin.  When I finished the crossover on 9/19 was on 30 mg of valium for two days, then 25 mg for 4 days and then 20 mg for 5 days until I could no longer stand it and then went and took 35 mg of valium and 1 xanex before begging for help.  Now I did as Colin suggested yesterday and went to 25 mg of valium (no xanex).  I plan to do exactly what Colin suggested and stay here for a few days or a couple weeks if I feel better and then take it slow from here.

 

Thanks so much for your help.

[[bo...]]

Hey

Thats good you need to latch on to a consistant dose that doesnt devastate you, then begin to taper.

TC

Bobers