Valium/Diazepam Support Group

[[Mo...]]

    Just wanted an opinion, my last cut of valium was 5mg,and symptoms became awful ,and now have horrible depression and crying all day for no reason.So the mental health team came to visit ,and said they would back me up with my G.P for doing the slowest taper possible ,which will be 2mg per fortnight.Anyway that would mean my taper would be over a year,but what I'm scared of is having the depression every day for a year or more.Do u think going slower will help the depression?.

  So Bets if I do it ,looks like u &I will be posting on here forever!

  Also nightmares.Since dropping the valium ,I'm waking up three or four times a night remembering my nightmares.Is this normal!!

In fact the other night my husband woke me up because I was sobbing in my sleep.You'll never guess what about_ my mother_in_law shouting at me telling me I was causing the family stress!!.

 

fairport, 2mg every two weeks is not the slowest taper, the slowest taper is however slow you choose to go. I tapered 12mg over 17 months for example and even that was pretty quick compared to some others. Don't think that you have to follow some rigid schedule, it's better to cut slower and feel better than spending months or even years in severe withdrawal.

 

I so agree with this, Fairport.

I tapered 0.5 mgr every two weeks and for some that would have been too much.

Sometimes it's best to throw out the calendar and go with how you feel best.

[[be...]]

Ok builder:

 

I found your earlier posts to me. I can't find your original posts so I can't copy and paste them. I will just type it in.

 

drop by 5%=cut by 3.5 mg down to 66.6 mg, then cut every two weeks until you reach 10 mg.

 

Eating 70 mg to start..then

 

2 weeks later take 66.6 (ml or mg or are they the same?)

Then 63.3

60.1

57.1

54.9

52.1

49.5

47.0

44.7 etc.

 

For example, you say to cut to 66.6 the first 14 days. That equals 3.5 mg, like you said, so that make sense to me. This is about a 5% cut every 14 days. So doing the math on my own, that would be a .25 mg the first day. So the first day, to me, it seems like I should be taking out .25 mg the first day .5 mg the 2nd day, .75 the 3rd day etc. And the 69 mg in pill form. To me, in order to cut by this amount, I would have to take out those mgs, throw that amount out, and drink the rest of the solution. If I just drink the .25 from the syringe and the liquid is diluted with a 99:1 ratio, then I would be taking out virtually nothing the 100 ml of the drug. To me, taking and drinking .25 mg with such a diluted ratio means I would be dropping by nearly 1 mg each day. And do mg equal the same as ml? And I add in 1 mg of the liquid right? And then add in 99 ml of water? I'm sooo confused................. :'(

 

 

One more time...just look t the chart.  You will be taking .25mg less each day (".25mg daily cut rate")  And that means in 14 days you will have cut 3.5mg (.25x14=3.54) or 5% (3.5/70=.05) 

 

And forget "...take out"! You don't "take out" anything.  This is not a milk taper, and you don't make a fresh batch each day.  You take most of your dose from tablets, and ADD some liquid to make your total dose.  And you will ADD LESS liquid each day...that's w how you make your daily cuts. 

 

Look at the chart  Day 1 you take 69mg from tablets and .75mg from liquid  That's a total dose of 69.75.  Day 2 you take 69mg from tablets, and .5mg from liquid.  That's a total dose of 69.5mg, or .25 less than day 1.

 

And at your dose (70mg) and taper rate (.25mg/day) you don't even need to dilute.  You can measure out .75, .5, and .25 on  a 1ml syringe just fine.  Just take 69mg from tablets, and take .75ml/mg from your full strength Rx liquid.  Then day2, take 69 mg tablets and take .5ml/mg from your full strength liquid. 

 

Obviously, you won't throw away the rest of the bottle after you take your dose.  

 

IMO, at any level/dose, dilution increases accuracy, makes measurement easier, and helps with consistency.  But dilution obviously causes you some confusion.  And at your dose and doing .25 daily cuts, it really is not necessary.  So if it makes thing simpler, just use your Rx liquid (1ml=1mg) full strength.  Pretend that your liquid is a bottle of .25mg pills. 

[[be...]]

builder:

 

Ok. This is what I will do because I am obviously insane at the moment.

 

And at your dose (70mg) and taper rate (.25mg/day) you don't even need to dilute.  You can measure out .75, .5, and .25 on  a 1ml syringe just fine.  Just take 69mg from tablets, and take .75ml/mg from your full strength Rx liquid.  Then day2, take 69 mg tablets and take .5ml/mg from your full strength liquid. I suppose later on in my taper I will do it the other way................Thanks. Now I know why my pdoc said to be listen to builder. He is giving you advice pro bono.... :smitten:

 

[[Ba...]]

Builder,

 

So very appreciated.

[[Ki...]]

Ok I am back on 25mg Valium and 0.25 mg Klonopin and I guess I am ok. Lethargic but thats kind of normal and that's how it was on Klonopin only So I guess. i should stay on both drugs??

 

[[Mo...]]

Ok I am back on 25mg Valium and 0.25 mg Klonopin and I guess I am ok. Lethargic but thats kind of normal and that's how it was on Klonopin only So I guess. i should stay on both drugs??

 

If I were you, I'd sit tight now for a while and calm down from that switching, cutting , going back up and changing benzo.

Then I'd say to taper off the K first, slowly. Like Bets does.

Then you'll only have the Valium left. Work out a good taper plan and stick with it...

[[Ki...]]

Moodle,

thanks

I guess that Diazepam has to work somehow or I would be dead

[[ca...]]

Moodle,

thanks

I guess that Diazepam has to work somehow or I would be dead

Kitten, i dropped over 3 1/2 mgs of k and am now on ~ 45mg of v and .375 of k ~ drop the k real slow and then when ready drop the v slow !You will be fine a bit funky but fine !~CD

[[Ki...]]

Can do,

funky? Everybody thinks I already got permanently insane

So how slow that 0.25mg? Why Klonopin first?

[[ca...]]

Can do,

funky? Everybody thinks I already got permanently insane

So how slow that 0.25mg? Why Klonopin first?

Kitten, klonopin has a shorter life and some may disagree but it seems harder to come off ! And we are both Loca right ?

[[Ki...]]

Can do,

Thanks. But 0.25mg should be easy right?

[[ca...]]

Can do,

Thanks. But 0.25mg should be easy right?

  Kitten yes but go slow MT IT!Not going to be fun but should be ok but again go slow! K folks can tell you how to drop slow !

[[Fa...]]

Moodle & jjrosk,

                    Thanks for replies _have decide to ask to start at 2mg fortnight ,and see what happens,and if I need to go even slower will ask for that.G.P & Physchiatrist have already written their plan out for me( way way too fast plan!) so seem to think it's a bit of rigid thing.They're not making it very patient led.

.But hopefully the mental health team will back me up ,even if I need to take it even slower.It's just that thought of doing it for more than a year_horrid!! .

And like I said it frightens me that I'll be really depressed for the whole taper.But hopefully if I slow it down I'll feel a bit better in myself.

 

[[...]]

Hi Fair

Benzo tapering really has to be patient led. Unfortunately, a lot of folks in the medical community don't understand this and want to put you on a fixed schedule. We all heal at such different rates and we need to hold at times like during a stressful time or if the taper has been too fast, etc. You would be far better off working with a practitioner who would let you be the "doctor" as to your taper rate. None of my doctors grasped this either so I was "artful" with them (alright I lied) as to my dose. I ended up getting my Valium prescribed by my family doc, cardiologist and dentist. Actually, I got the most from my dentist by claiming I had anxiety for dental procedures.

Whatever works. If you can taper at a rate that is close to your healing rate you will be a whole better off than blasting along feeling miserable and still having a lot of healing to do after you hit 0.

Bart

 

[[bu...]]

Builder,

 

So very appreciated.

  ...and you are very welcome.  Good luck.

[[Mo...]]

Hi Fair

Benzo tapering really has to be patient led. Unfortunately, a lot of folks in the medical community don't understand this and want to put you on a fixed schedule. We all heal at such different rates and we need to hold at times like during a stressful time or if the taper has been too fast, etc. You would be far better off working with a practitioner who would let you be the "doctor" as to your taper rate. None of my doctors grasped this either so I was "artful" with them (alright I lied) as to my dose. I ended up getting my Valium prescribed by my family doc, cardiologist and dentist. Actually, I got the most from my dentist by claiming I had anxiety for dental procedures.

Whatever works. If you can taper at a rate that is close to your healing rate you will be a whole better off than blasting along feeling miserable and still having a lot of healing to do after you hit 0.

Bart

 

I so agree , Fair ( hi Bart, hope you're well ).

Took me a while to find a doctor who was willing to give it a go. People have good luck with a nurse practitioner too., myself included.

I was alway afraid she'd put me on a fixed schedule and she did there for a little bit at the start.

But once she saw I kept spreadsheets and was so proud to have reduced another mgr, I was good to go.

I kind of always wrote a mgr higher than what I was on. So that I could stash some .

And when my oral surgeon gave me a script, I took that, too. I never abused it, never took more than my taper dose. But hey...

As long as you can keep the script coming, I'd say people here know multiple ways of tapering.

There isn't a problem getting this stuff: it gets hard to find help when you DONT want it. Then suddenly we are monitored. 

[[Fa...]]

  Moodle,

              I so get u when u talk about it being easy to get the stuff,and difficult when ur coming off.My G.P prescribed me Lorazepam with little thought,and then left me on it for months.In the end it was me who phoned a different consultant because of severe insomnia,who said I needed to be weaned off.

    And with regards to her regime for withdrawal,I wish she could go through it herself,preferably with the 5mg drops she had planned for me!!

    I'm finding anger is good for the depression!!!!!.

  And Bart,I'm so thrilled you're off and doing so well.It gives us hope!

[[mr...]]

In my next life, I will become a BenzoWise Dr....

[[Ki...]]

Mrtmeo,

in my next life I want to find a cure for anxiety with no side effects and addiction

I feel bad today-depressed Yesterday my mood was good. I dont get it

[[jj...]]

Mrtmeo,

in my next life I want to find a cure for anxiety with no side effects and addiction

I feel bad today-depressed Yesterday my mood was good. I dont get it

 

The cure has already been found. CBT is just as effective as benzos in working with anxiety with no side effects and no addiction.

 

[[Ki...]]

Jjrosk,

but it doesnt help when you completely collapse That's how I got on Klonopin.

I dont think CBT works for everyone. Like when you lose a child no talking helped me

[[jj...]]

Jjrosk,

but it doesnt help when you completely collapse That's how I got on Klonopin.

I dont think CBT works for everyone. Like when you lose a child no talking helped me

 

Well, benzos are remarkably effective for short term therapy but as far as long term therapy, I don't think that we'll ever have a "chemical cure" for natural human responses to life events, and regardless, CBT is a set of learned and practiced skills, not talk therapy.

 

Very sorry to hear about the events that lead you to benzos.

[[Ki...]]

jjrosk,

but what if no other pill worked before?

My doctor told me if nothing else wors then I have to take low dose benzo forever that many people do But I am bedridden since age 29 and was productive before :'(

 

[[Mo...]]

Kitten...even IF you'd chose to stay on a " low dose" of benzo... Eventually you'll hit tolerance .

Which means the amount your taking isn't longer working for you. Then you'd either have to updose or taper off. It's kind of fruitless.

 

There just isn't a pill that will make use deal better with life events that won't eventually bite you in the behind, IMO.

We need to develop coping tools through other ways. Cbt is a good thing for many.

Yoga, being creative, meditation, talk therapy...whatever is the one someone picks and works for them.

 

 

[[Ki...]]

Moodle,

oh well but every time I got off benzos I was just mess I would have to live on life support

I don't know what is wrong with me,maybe doctor is right and I became bipolar but I didn't know

you can just become bipolar. I was kind of ok for 29 years and now bedridden for 4 years

I just lost interest about life and I used to be pretty positive before.. But yeah a lot of stress,trauma.

But can this make me bipolar?