Valium/Diazepam Support Group

[[Ki...]]

Can do,

so how do they treat it? I still don't know anything because my doctor is on vacation and

she will treat me when she is back. I started to have big issues since January. Really bad,

but doctors were telling me it's all in my head I got it mostly under control with

natural supplements because doctors didn't want to help.  It's better now but still not normal.

Do you think we got this from benzos?

And I guess I can't even take any supplements now because I am doing crossover

[[ca...]]

Can do,

so how do they treat it? I still don't know anything because my doctor is on vacation and

she will treat me when she is back. I started to have big issues since January. Really bad,

but doctors were telling me it's all in my head I got it mostly under control with

natural supplements because doctors didn't want to help.  It's better now but still not normal.

Do you think we got this from benzos?

And I guess I can't even take any supplements now because I am doing crossover

kitten, depends on what it is but you know docs they throw antibiotics at every thing. I don`t really help myself with my diet because i have trouble keeping my weight up. So i guess you will have to wait to here from your doc but cant be crazy bad he would have called at least you would think right? And yes benzo`s cause havoc with the colon for alot, as far as infection i have no idea!

[[or...]]

WeCanDo:

 

am new here, but wondering if you all have some input about doing an Ativan to valium switch. I'd love your input. I know Ashton recommends it and I'm not sure if I should stick to tapering Ativan or do the switch. so any input would be greatly appreciated. do you guys recommend it based on your experiences? has it been easier to taper with valium than a shorter acting benzo like Ativan?

 

For me the switch was a no-brainer. I was having such horrible interdose w/ds on Ativan that I was glad to make the switch.

 

I followed Ashton's crossover schedule and had no problems. After the switch I was a little sedated on valium for about a week, but that passed.

 

Crossing from Ativan to valium really made this taper possible. I could not have tapered Ativan directly . . . although many of our buddies have. I think it all depends on whether you are having i/d w/ds or not.

 

Hope this has helped.

 

Okatz

[[Ki...]]

Can do,

I have same problem. Since I started to have these issues I lost soo much weight.

I ended up in hospital couple times on IV dehydrated and the doctors kept telling me

I need a colonoscopy but I will have to wait like 9 months Well we have social system

here so we are lucky we have free Healthcare but sometimes waiting is way too long.

But I think they got tired of my ER visits so they did it little faster. Here they don't really push

antibiotics so I don't know what they will do I just hope it can be cured somehow

I didn't know benzos can mess up colon. I thought maybe liver

How did they treat you? Antibiotics?

[[be...]]

cross: I agree. Try posting on the withdrawal section. It is a very popular one. Like others said here, there are many V-ers who do not visit this thread, Wishing you only the best!

 

Hi Kittensick: I read your reply first this this am (Moo's too) and then BB shut down before I could reply. Now it's back up, I guess. As long as I was on Clozaril (nasty drug btw), I slept way too much. Then when I tapered off it but before I began my K taper I could not sleep. I have a bad recollection of sleeping for only 2-3 hours per night for an entire year! I was a mess. Then one day I went to my pdoc and was pretty out of it in my head from lack of sleep, he said, Betsy, you are no longer making any sense to me. You have a bad case of sleep deprivation. Then I told him I had had it and was ready to jump off a cliff. So he told me that I needed the sleep to help to heal. So he gave be both Trazodone and Seroquel. The seroquel is great that it gets you to sleep right away but doesn't necessarily keep you asleep. The Traz do not make you go to sleep but keeps you from waking up. So that's why he gave me the combo. They also really help with anxiety as I have none, except for a bit of racing thoughts. But I give you fair warning: APs in general, especially the atypical ones, can be a beast to come off. I am not looking forward to my taper off Seroquel. Sorry about that infection. What does your doctor want you to do while he/she goes on vacation? Make it worse by not addressing it? Here in the US they throw ABs at you. Doctors, ugh. I really think the majority of them think their patients are just a paying number, and not a real person. Most don't give a s**t. Lucky for me I managed to pick out the good ones. I much prefer a singe doctor who puts up his shingle rather than a practice with a bunch of doctors. That bunch just is a money conveyer belt. I would avoid Seroquel if you can, and maybe try something like Remeron or Traz. You have a way to go and you don't want to be sleep deprived for that long.

 

Hey my noodle: I'm sorry that you are freezing. If you just stopped by my house I have a bunch of winter coats that can keep you warm even in the Arctic Circle. That's what LL Bean says, anyway. Never been there myself. I know from your reports that the weather there is terrible. But nobody on CNN mentions this. Or maybe I missed it. They mostly are now a lobbying group for The Donald. Right now I am at .32 mg o K. I should be lower, actually, but I was having bad fatigue days that pretty much kept me home bound and bedridden so pdoc told me to hold for two days. I actually think the K backfired on me. It began revving me up. Now that I am on a lower dose, my sleep has gotten much better. I can now usually count on about 7.5 hours per night. As I lower my dose, my sleep gets better, weird. So I still have a ways to go. But hopefully not that much longer. I am thinking fall. I'm glad you have that heating pad. I know what it feels like to be freezing, as that is what I was when my thyroid was out of check. It could be 95 degrees outside and I would feel comfortable. But when winter hit, Oyo! Other than freezing, how are you doing, my friend. Did you hold? I hope your vacation will last forever!

 

can do: Good you stopped by. I'm sorry about the K kicking your butt. You are on what, .43 mg now? Just a guess on my part. You are doing micro, right? If so, better hold for more days instead of micro cutting every day. That's what I did when my fatigue set in. Yes, it's a major drag t slow it up but I don't want to be housebound during the rest of it. See, I'm afraid I will fall asleep at the wheel. Now I only get a bad fatigue day about every two weeks Yesterday was one. Luckily, I can nap my life away. Other than that nasty fatigue, I am doing well. My sleep has returned. Yippee! I get you about the Valium not working. Mine is still working but I suspect any day now that it will stop. Then I guess the both of us will be in trouble. I think if you can manage to get through the K, maybe the Val won't be as bad. At least that is what I am hoping. I don't know if sleep or anxiety are your problems. I  suspect so since K in such a beast in those regards. I also don't know if you are willing to take another med. Make Remeron or Traz? I know Traz not only helps me sleep but also help with anxiety, as I have none except for racing thoughts. Off they go!

 

You can also try an SSRI but I personally hate them. But they seem to work for others. I was just reading an article about SSRis (Dr. Madill was quoted), and they concluded that SSRis, for the most part, don't help with anxiety and can in fact, make it worse.They also said that they are not a really good drug to treat depression. So it's up to you, can do.

 

hamm: Only when I got lower on my dose of K did I feel better. I had a bad case of insomnia that was nearly making me take to drink but now I am sleeping much better. I think my micro taper helped this. I did get the symptoms of fatigue days but I began holding for a few days and now it has lessened and not so often anymore. For me, at least, the lower I got in my dose, the better I feel. But this might perhaps be that the K no longer worked for me so less, was better, in my case.

 

It's hotter than heck here, with terrible humidity but off to the Y again! I hope everybody has a great day!

 

:smitten:

Bets

[[Ki...]]

benzogirl,

I do understand you very well. I didn't know what was insomnia until 29 when I got sick

and doctors tested over 50 different ADs,APs on me and I don't know what else

Nothing worked and actually made me much worse and like you said doctors didn't care

I don't tolerate any AD not even Trazodone. Doesn't make me sleep at all I guess we are

all different. I was actually happy when I found something that worked and it was Klonopin

and Seroquel for sleeping. I am on Seroquel 3,5year no problem. But I was very surprised

when I got generic Seroquel in US and it made me brutally sick-didn't expect that so I asked

my doctor for brand-very sick too I had to contact my doctor here that I need the pills from

here and I paid for them but it took 6 weeks to get them so I was 6 weeks on Seroquel that was

making me very sick. Yes I slept but the nausea never went away until I got my pills. They have

EXACTLY same ingredients but my body just like only the ones from here so I stick to them and

like I said I went down to 75mg from 200mg I think in 2 weeks and just little tired I think but

I am not down to zero yet.

And I wasn't sleeping like you before,almost at all until I got shot of Klonopin but then I didn't sleep again. I was at loony bin sitting there for 5 days with zero sleep and my organs hurt,my muscles

and I made no sense-brain just didn't function anymore. The doctor told me no sleeping pills for me

because they are addicting. I just didn't care back then. I was hoping they will give me something.

Well then I collapsed there,got Klonopin,went to sleep and woke up normal

Well the infection-I will deal with it when stable on Valium. I think it's happening. I am not that

sedated just some anxiety but I guess that's normal....

Oh yeah and some doctors are just legal drug dealers but they are some good ones. Not so many

 

[[dp...]]

Hi kitten - you can be a fast or slow metabolized of drugs based in the genetics of your liver enzymes. That is why some people can get away with dosing Valium once per day while others have to dose several. You are not alone cans I also think while we taper these enzymes get turned off and on so things can change.

Also when you are taking more than one drug at a time - they can interact and cause a virtual "updose" of the drugs in your body because they are competing for similar enzymes in the liver to be netabolized by.

Selah

 

This is very interesting, and after reading up on it a bit last week, it made total sense. I remember reading up on how some drugs take up more enzyme pathways than others... making tapering the ones taking up the least pathways up first. IE: Valium takes up a smaller number of enzyme pathways than say, Prozac... which takes up 5 I believe... so it'd be best to taper the Valium first, because if you cut out Prozac first, it would be freeing up the liver to metabolize Valium more quickly, putting you into w/d without cutting yet. Interesting stuff, but I try not to overthink too much. I wonder how much of these 'on paper' numbers translate into people actually feeling noticeable differences.

[[We...]]

Hi Valium Buddies,

 

I am new here, but wondering if you all have some input about doing an Ativan to valium switch. I'd love your input. I know Ashton recommends it and I'm not sure if I should stick to tapering Ativan or do the switch. so any input would be greatly appreciated. do you guys recommend it based on your experiences? has it been easier to taper with valium than a shorter acting benzo like Ativan?

 

thanks

shan

 

It really depends Shan. Some people find the switch a life-saver but for others it doesn't work.

It depends how badly interdose wd is biting

And then it depends on whether valium agrees with you, which you'll only know the answer to once you are switched over sadly.

 

How bad is the interdose wd?

 

Thanks Smiff. It's hard to tell about interdose withdrawl because I sort of always feel bad. I just seem to hit a wall when getting down to 1.5mg of A. and everytime I seem to go lower, it doesn't work. I was wondering of switching to valium would help this. But again, I guess it's trial and error, eh? thanks for the input

 

Shan

[[ar...]]

Hi all,

 

Still in my wave.  It seems once I hit 1.8 this bugger decided to remind me he is still there.  I am still holding until this passes.  It started out as the pesky cortisol surge that lasted until noonish all last week and weekend.  Now it's the annoying low level anxiety all morning and then passes around noon.  The anxiety is deep in the core of my stomach.  I rarely had anxiety before benzo w/d.  I tell it to F off and go about my day the best I can...

 

I also just feel sick all around in the morning and it eases up as the day goes on.  Some minor head pressure today too.  I haven't had this long of a wave in months.  Am I in tolerance possibly?

 

My goal is to stabilize and resume cutting.  This long wave has me concerned.

 

[[or...]]

arcade I do not think you are in tolerance. Here is the Merck Manual's definition of tolerance. :

 

Tolerance is a person's diminished response to a drug, which occurs when the drug is used repeatedly and the body adapts to the continued presence of the drug.

 

You would reach tolerance with valium if, for example, you took 10 or 15 or however many mgs of it for quite a while and the anxiety or whatever it was prescribed for, gradually came creeping back.

 

IMO these are just a bunch of nasty s/x. It's very distressing when they hang around, even when we are holding. I had to do two pretty long holds earlier in my taper to get rid of rotten s/x.

 

I think all you can do is hold until things get better. (Well, there's uppdosing . . . but that's iffy. And what goes up will have to come down). Hope your s/x pass soon! 

 

Okatz

 

 

[[Mo...]]

Hi kitten - you can be a fast or slow metabolized of drugs based in the genetics of your liver enzymes. That is why some people can get away with dosing Valium once per day while others have to dose several. You are not alone cans I also think while we taper these enzymes get turned off and on so things can change.

Also when you are taking more than one drug at a time - they can interact and cause a virtual "updose" of the drugs in your body because they are competing for similar enzymes in the liver to be netabolized by.

Selah

 

This is very interesting, and after reading up on it a bit last week, it made total sense. I remember reading up on how some drugs take up more enzyme pathways than others... making tapering the ones taking up the least pathways up first. IE: Valium takes up a smaller number of enzyme pathways than say, Prozac... which takes up 5 I believe... so it'd be best to taper the Valium first, because if you cut out Prozac first, it would be freeing up the liver to metabolize Valium more quickly, putting you into w/d without cutting yet. Interesting stuff, but I try not to overthink too much. I wonder how much of these 'on paper' numbers translate into people actually feeling noticeable differences.

 

Hey there !

Wow, just saw you're almost 2/3 done.. 

I'm not even pretending I understand what you wrote here but I just wanted to say hello and hope you're doing ok.

[[Mo...]]

arcade I do not think you are in tolerance. Here is the Merck Manual's definition of tolerance. :

 

Tolerance is a person's diminished response to a drug, which occurs when the drug is used repeatedly and the body adapts to the continued presence of the drug.

 

You would reach tolerance with valium if, for example, you took 10 or 15 or however many mgs of it for quite a while and the anxiety or whatever it was prescribed for, gradually came creeping back.

 

IMO these are just a bunch of nasty s/x. It's very distressing when they hang around, even when we are holding. I had to do two pretty long holds earlier in my taper to get rid of rotten s/x.

 

I think all you can do is hold until things get better. (Well, there's uppdosing . . . but that's iffy. And what goes up will have to come down). Hope your s/x pass soon! 

 

Okatz

 

I was thinking the same thing.

I'm still holding Katz. Like I said, I was so done this morning but I'm keeping the taper 

 

Hugs

[[ar...]]

arcade I do not think you are in tolerance. Here is the Merck Manual's definition of tolerance. :

 

Tolerance is a person's diminished response to a drug, which occurs when the drug is used repeatedly and the body adapts to the continued presence of the drug.

 

You would reach tolerance with valium if, for example, you took 10 or 15 or however many mgs of it for quite a while and the anxiety or whatever it was prescribed for, gradually came creeping back.

 

IMO these are just a bunch of nasty s/x. It's very distressing when they hang around, even when we are holding. I had to do two pretty long holds earlier in my taper to get rid of rotten s/x.

 

I think all you can do is hold until things get better. (Well, there's uppdosing . . . but that's iffy. And what goes up will have to come down). Hope your s/x pass soon! 

 

Okatz

 

Thanks Okatz.  I'll continue to hold.  I will not updose.

 

Random bouts of fight or flight mode out of nowhere.  I just have to hang in there and distract.  I am pissed because I haven't had this since my Ashton cuts back in Feb.  Instead of being pissed and fighting it, I just need to roll with it.

[[dp...]]

Hi kitten - you can be a fast or slow metabolized of drugs based in the genetics of your liver enzymes. That is why some people can get away with dosing Valium once per day while others have to dose several. You are not alone cans I also think while we taper these enzymes get turned off and on so things can change.

Also when you are taking more than one drug at a time - they can interact and cause a virtual "updose" of the drugs in your body because they are competing for similar enzymes in the liver to be netabolized by.

Selah

 

This is very interesting, and after reading up on it a bit last week, it made total sense. I remember reading up on how some drugs take up more enzyme pathways than others... making tapering the ones taking up the least pathways up first. IE: Valium takes up a smaller number of enzyme pathways than say, Prozac... which takes up 5 I believe... so it'd be best to taper the Valium first, because if you cut out Prozac first, it would be freeing up the liver to metabolize Valium more quickly, putting you into w/d without cutting yet. Interesting stuff, but I try not to overthink too much. I wonder how much of these 'on paper' numbers translate into people actually feeling noticeable differences.

 

Hey there !

Wow, just saw you're almost 2/3 done.. 

I'm not even pretending I understand what you wrote here but I just wanted to say hello and hope you're doing ok.

 

Hey Moo.

Hi back!

 

Your post made my day. First time I smiled all day. This has been such a lonely few months, and I am looking forward to some respite.. as much of the past 2 months has been in bed.

 

Can't wait until next year when we're both off this stuff and it's summer again!

[[Sm...]]

Hi Valium Buddies,

 

I am new here, but wondering if you all have some input about doing an Ativan to valium switch. I'd love your input. I know Ashton recommends it and I'm not sure if I should stick to tapering Ativan or do the switch. so any input would be greatly appreciated. do you guys recommend it based on your experiences? has it been easier to taper with valium than a shorter acting benzo like Ativan?

 

thanks

shan

 

It really depends Shan. Some people find the switch a life-saver but for others it doesn't work.

It depends how badly interdose wd is biting

And then it depends on whether valium agrees with you, which you'll only know the answer to once you are switched over sadly.

 

How bad is the interdose wd?

 

Thanks Smiff. It's hard to tell about interdose withdrawl because I sort of always feel bad. I just seem to hit a wall when getting down to 1.5mg of A. and everytime I seem to go lower, it doesn't work. I was wondering of switching to valium would help this. But again, I guess it's trial and error, eh? thanks for the input

 

Shan

 

If it were me..

It sounds like it might be worth trying, if you really are feeling stuck at 1.5 mg.

[[or...]]

WeCanDo . . .

 

I agree with Smiff.

 

If you have hit the wall and can't get any lower with Ativan, why not try the switch?

 

I crossed from 1.5 mgs of Ativan to 15 mgs of valium for two reasons: one, the i/d w/ds were killing me, and two, I couldn't taper Ativan directly. It was certainly more doable tapering valium. 

[[ar...]]

I walked around the block tonight but so dizzy.  I take it the dizziness is rebound mild vertigo? 

[[or...]]

arcade I have had dizziness as a rotten s/x off and on throughout my taper. When my taper is going well . . . little dizziness. When it isn't . . . more dizziness. I have had a whole lot less under 1 mg . .  but I still have it, darn it anyhow!!!  This may just be one of the things that doesn't go away until you are off the drug completely. I am sure hoping this will not be a lasting gift from benzos for me. 

[[ar...]]

Thanks Okatz.  I agree the dizziness is no fun at all.  I have a question about kindling.

 

I think I kindled the low dose Xanax when I stopped taking it and started again.  As you can see in my sig I was given Versed 1 dose for procedure and 1 dose Ativan.  Do those count as kindling also?  I hope not.

[[mr...]]

Thanks Okatz.  I agree the dizziness is no fun at all.  I have a question about kindling.

 

I think I kindled the low dose Xanax when I stopped taking it and started again.  As you can see in my sig I was given Versed 1 dose for procedure and 1 dose Ativan.  Do those count as kindling also?  I hope not.

Hi Arcade,

MrsAlw took xanax randomly for a long time and thinks she was doing mini ct's and that is why she had such a hard taper.

I think that sounds like what happened to my mom.

My mom recovered from a fast ativan taper and then went back to the drug randomly and this caused her respiratory center in the brain to malfunction. My mom was definitely kindled, but during her taper, she had versed 3 times within a month and suffered no ill effects that I noticed.

I really think kindling is the on and off for a long time, such as months or years.

It doesn't sound like you did this from your sig?

[[or...]]

arcade I think you'll heal just fine. I was given 1 dose of Versed for a colonoscopy with no ill effects. I believe Ashton tells us that a one-off dose of a benzo for a surgical procedure will not do us any harm.

[[mr...]]

Thanks Okatz.  I agree the dizziness is no fun at all.  I have a question about kindling.

 

I think I kindled the low dose Xanax when I stopped taking it and started again.  As you can see in my sig I was given Versed 1 dose for procedure and 1 dose Ativan.  Do those count as kindling also?  I hope not.

Hi Arcade,

MrsAlw took xanax randomly for a long time and thinks she was doing mini ct's and that is why she had such a hard taper.

I think that sounds like what happened to my mom.

My mom recovered from a fast ativan taper and then went back to the drug randomly and this caused her respiratory center in the brain to malfunction. My mom was definitely kindled, but during her taper, she had versed 3 times within a month and suffered no ill effects that I noticed.

I really think kindling is the on and off for a long time, such as months or years.

It doesn't sound like you did this from your sig?

 

MrT,

 

I took Xanax on and off for two months.  Possible mini c/t's and not knowing it.  Towards the end of September I could feel something was wrong and couldn't sleep.  My GP told me to go back on in October.  So yeah I think I kindled the Xanax low dose possibly.  The one dose Ativan was the icing on the cake that sent me into a tailspin that hurt really bad after it left my body.  I figured all this out by myself and my first pdoc started my taper at 8mgV and then I felt fine.  I am just paranoid about my healing because of kindling.

 

My taper was fairly easy until I hit 4mg.

I wouldn't worry too much about 2 months of kindling.

As long as you are tapering at a rate that your receptors are healing, things will work out for the best.

My mom has had moments where her normal respiration came back and this is what tells me that it is only temporary.

[[We...]]

WeCanDo . . .

 

I agree with Smiff.

 

If you have hit the wall and can't get any lower with Ativan, why not try the switch?

 

I crossed from 1.5 mgs of Ativan to 15 mgs of valium for two reasons: one, the i/d w/ds were killing me, and two, I couldn't taper Ativan directly. It was certainly more doable tapering valium.

 

Thanks Okatz,

 

I'll talk to my doc and see if she is open to the valium switch. I really appreciate your input. Good luck on the rest of your taper.

 

Shan

[[Mo...]]

WeCanDo . . .

 

I agree with Smiff.

 

If you have hit the wall and can't get any lower with Ativan, why not try the switch?

 

I crossed from 1.5 mgs of Ativan to 15 mgs of valium for two reasons: one, the i/d w/ds were killing me, and two, I couldn't taper Ativan directly. It was certainly more doable tapering valium.

 

Shan, I agree as well. For the same reasons as Katz posted. 

[[be...]]

Hi: I am late in the game as my computer crashed and my iPhone got corrupted. So here are just repeats.

 

San: Agree with all of the others here. I think a C/O will do you good. I know mine has done wonders for me. So has my micro taper, or daily taper, which you might want to consider. But what Smiff said is right. You won't know how it will affect you until you do the C/O. I hate Ativan~~never taken it~~but I see people here suffer so much on it, I/D being the worst. I wonder why some people don't think it is as bad as kpin or Xanax? From what I have read here, it seems to be near the top.

 

((((My Noodle?))))

 

Kittensick: I don't know where you live so I don't know where you are getting your Seroquel from. I forgot who the maker is but I am getting Teva. I find it a bit odd if it has the same fillers and you got sick from it. Teva is based in Israel. So you know what it is like to have bad insomnia? Isn't it one of the worst symptoms out there? I tell ya, when I had a long bout of it I really thought I was going insane. I think perhaps that since you were ploydrugged (wow~~50 different meds), the brain naturally becomes hyper sensitive. Were you always this way? Or did it happen after you took so many drugs? Or even before? I hope you can continue to get the right med. You don't want to be sick, after all. I'm wishing you good healing.

 

arcade: You were given a lot of good advice here. But now I wonder. Are you still in a wave? I wouldn't worry too much about it, tho I know it must be a bummer. But things like this can happen when you are at a low dose~~like 1.8 mg. Just remember you are only 1.8 mg short of being benzo free! You'll get rid of it in no time. While I'll be on this board until I retire. :'( Katz is right again. I think you will heal just fine. Tho Mrtmeo mad a good point. I think that sporadic dosing over months or years can cause mini C/Ts. I've always been of the opinion that is you stay on benzos, you must keep to a schedule every day. But you don't seem to be the case, in this respect.

 

WCD: I also agree with the others here. Like okatz said, the I/D was killing me while I was on Xanax. It was the worst anxiety I had the non pleasure of experiencing. I think the Valium saved my sanity. But Valium is not for everybody. It just happens to be my cup of tea. So is my micro taper. Wishing you only the best.

 

My Tex: Where are you? Can do: same? can do? How are your symptoms today? As bad as before? I hope not. Don't worry, you are now past the .5 mg mark. I think you will get rid of it sooner than me because now I began holding for a few days. To get rid of that darned fatigue, which kept me housebound. I hate being stuck inside the house.  I just hate it. No matter how many Netflix I watch.

 

:smitten:

Bets