Are doctors and the USDA and FDA COMPLETELY wrong, about everything?

[[re...]]

In defense of doctors and medical practitioners. I am very convinced Covid decimated an already thinly stretched healthcare workforce extremely taxed the stress response of all the medical people. The constant strain  and political division and bureaucracy  during covid these people had to endure overwhelmed them and basically just burnt most of them out and possibly turned them bitter.  

[[WU...]]

1 hour ago, [[r...] said:

SOMEONE at least in authority calling the shots

I don't want to rely on an "authority"! I would be more radical and teach children about how the mind and the body works together. What use is it to learn about Kings and Queens or World Wars 1 & 2 in school and completely avoid anything about our own bodies and minds which would be much more useful. All we got in biology was tadpoles and dissection of a pig's ear and reproduction of rabbits.  Is it any better now I wonder? 

 

[[re...]]

I can see your point for sure WU. But I think a Hierarchy is good for society with leaders and authority you can actually TRUST which has become almost non existent. I have been on both sides as a rogue/sigma type going my own way and that is wonderful, and don't get me wrong there is definitely a place for that and some of the best art, writing, music comes from the lone wolves.  But I have also been in the housing building industry, have had many bands, etc and I can say this just from my experience. I think a team of people with different duties and leaders that CARE about the whole thing from top to bottom of the hierarchy is an incredible thing to behold and I love to be a part of that. It is such a powerful energy when people work together in this thing and set out to build something together and bigger than themselves and everyone understands their part.

I was a bit higher in this hierarchy, but certainly not at the top and I treated everyone with the utmost respect from the day laborers all the way to the owners/financers,  because I realize how important the structure is. When you think about it how could something like all these gorgeous structures in Europe could of been built without the proper hierarchy. When you think about it even Jesus had the Apostles or Ghandi had people under them and it is was an amazing feat they accomplished in their times on this planet. Of course those kind of leaders always have tragic endings. Or maybe not, as we can hopefully learn from their teachings.

Anyways unfortunately there is a darkness that preys on this earth's inhabitants and prefers the constant survival amygdala shit and hates the frontal lobe wonders. I think these poisons so mess with that part of us. This darkness that rules also hates love,   a benevolent hierarchy,  and the power of the human spirit. human condition and human connection. Power corrupts most people unfortunately, but I think too many rogues (but in the correct capacity, they are definitely needed) and you get lack of purpose and without a proper organization the powers that be will keep winning. 

 

Like Justintime talking about the native Americans. Well they certainly had a tribe and hierarchy with a chief and all that and it was wonderful cause the leaders were actually connected to it's tribe. Now unfortunately that is not the case. 

[[Ju...]]

I agree, a few years back when I first started going through cold turkey off of the clonazepam, I was speaking to a psychiatrist at a mental hospital about the taper. I was explaining why I was on the meds in the first place, neurological problems. I asked the psychiatrist, are you trained in neurology? He said yes, very well. I said well then why is your specialty psychiatry? He got upset at the question, and tried to act like it was one of his Specialties to practice neurology as well, but it wasn't.

And even if he had been a specialist in neurology, what the hell was he thinking putting me back on the clonazepam for 4 days while in the hospital, only to taper it off again within 72 hours? Have these supposedly trained doctors never heard of kindling or relapsing? And when is it appropriate to taper somebody off of 20 years worth of high-dose clonazepam, within 72 hours? And you know what he thought would be good as the solution for a neurological condition and 20 years worth of central nervous system depressants? A little bit of benadryl.

I remember going to the psychiatrist at another mental hospital once while going through alcohol and benzodiazepine withdrawal, and he asked me what my anxiety level was. I told him a severe 10, off the charts. You know what his response was? "Get over it and deal with it like a man."

We were driven around the state I was living in while being transported to these supposed detox facilities, in the back of a sheriff's prisoner van with shackles around our ankles and hands, that's how they treat and voluntary patients coming off of these neurological medicines. They claim to be experts, yet they're using barbaric Medieval Age tactics. Where's the science behind it? Where did they get the science that says treat 20 years of central nervous system depressant use with benadryl? Where does it say in the American Psychiatric association to tell your patient to deal with it like a man? I don't think that exists.

But yes by all means, they think the medical license they got from college equates to "I'm God and you will respect my authority and believe the pharmaceutical commercials on tv, and you will ask for those pills, and you will take them the way I want you to, or you're not being compliant". I had another incident around the same time frame, where I had police knocking on my door saying that I was non-medication compliant according to my doctor. I said what's compliant and what's not? Since when do medical doctors control the police force? Apparently since now, they can tell the police station that you're not being compliant, and the police can come to your door with handcuffs and throw you in the back of a police cruiser, and transport you to the hospital just because you didn't listen to your doctor. Overkill? I think so.

I had another incident about a decade ago, where I was feeling horrible because of the neurological meds I was prescribed. I started drinking a bunch of alcohol because it was the only thing that got rid of the symptoms from the meds. Eventually I went to detox because of both, and you know what the doctor did? Put me in mental hospital court with a judge, labeled me mentally ill, labeled me non-compliance, took my state driver's license, took my gun rights, and put me on a supervised Medical probation. Because the doctors didn't like my lifestyle, essentially.

Yeah I don't know what to say about the medical profession at this point, I'm not anti doctor. I'm just anti-bureaucracy and anti having my right stripped. I Am pro having a choice and pro controlling my own body, I don't need some government officials telling me how to utilize my natural born biology. Luckily all of the medical legal stuff is in the past, but it never should have happened in the first place.

[[An...]]

10 minutes ago, [[J...] said:

I agree, a few years back when I first started going through cold turkey off of the clonazepam, I was speaking to a psychiatrist at a mental hospital about the taper. I was explaining why I was on the meds in the first place, neurological problems. I asked the psychiatrist, are you trained in neurology? He said yes, very well. I said well then why is your specialty psychiatry? He got upset at the question, and tried to act like it was one of his Specialties to practice neurology as well, but it wasn't.

And even if he had been a specialist in neurology, what the hell was he thinking putting me back on the clonazepam for 4 days while in the hospital, only to taper it off again within 72 hours? Have these supposedly trained doctors never heard of kindling or relapsing? And when is it appropriate to taper somebody off of 20 years worth of high-dose clonazepam, within 72 hours? And you know what he thought would be good as the solution for a neurological condition and 20 years worth of central nervous system depressants? A little bit of benadryl.

I remember going to the psychiatrist at another mental hospital once while going through alcohol and benzodiazepine withdrawal, and he asked me what my anxiety level was. I told him a severe 10, off the charts. You know what his response was? "Get over it and deal with it like a man."

We were driven around the state I was living in while being transported to these supposed detox facilities, in the back of a sheriff's prisoner van with shackles around our ankles and hands, that's how they treat and voluntary patients coming off of these neurological medicines. They claim to be experts, yet they're using barbaric Medieval Age tactics. Where's the science behind it? Where did they get the science that says treat 20 years of central nervous system depressant use with benadryl? Where does it say in the American Psychiatric association to tell your patient to deal with it like a man? I don't think that exists.

But yes by all means, they think the medical license they got from college equates to "I'm God and you will respect my authority and believe the pharmaceutical commercials on tv, and you will ask for those pills, and you will take them the way I want you to, or you're not being compliant". I had another incident around the same time frame, where I had police knocking on my door saying that I was non-medication compliant according to my doctor. I said what's compliant and what's not? Since when do medical doctors control the police force? Apparently since now, they can tell the police station that you're not being compliant, and the police can come to your door with handcuffs and throw you in the back of a police cruiser, and transport you to the hospital just because you didn't listen to your doctor. Overkill? I think so.

I had another incident about a decade ago, where I was feeling horrible because of the neurological meds I was prescribed. I started drinking a bunch of alcohol because it was the only thing that got rid of the symptoms from the meds. Eventually I went to detox because of both, and you know what the doctor did? Put me in mental hospital court with a judge, labeled me mentally ill, labeled me non-compliance, took my state driver's license, took my gun rights, and put me on a supervised Medical probation. Because the doctors didn't like my lifestyle, essentially.

Yeah I don't know what to say about the medical profession at this point, I'm not anti doctor. I'm just anti-bureaucracy and anti having my right stripped. I Am pro having a choice and pro controlling my own body, I don't need some government officials telling me how to utilize my natural born biology. Luckily all of the medical legal stuff is in the past, but it never should have happened in the first place.

Remember, it is your body. A doctor can only suggest. You can refuse any treatment you wish that is suggested by the doctor. Do your due diligence, educate yourself, and then decide. Ignorance and blame-shifting are no longer an excuse with all the modern information technology all of us now have available to us. That is the bottom line in a nutshell.

[[re...]]

Oh man JIT that is such a horror story. I just really have a hard time hearing that and it doesn't register, but I know it's true. and I don't wanna believe it.

Those freaking barbaric bastards. They all hide behind a guise of modern psychiatry as humane treatment. How dare those liars!!!!!!!!! May they burn in hell. I just cannot believe the dark age shit they do. To me THEY are the ones with true mental illness end of story. Talk about a power trip. I think since the advent of prescribing especially SSRI's and not to far behind Stims for ADD and Benzos the school shootings are without a doubt the consequence of that and you NEVER hear that!!!!!! A bit maybe, but not to the extent we should be hearing it. It's always guns guns guns. It's such bullshit!!!!!!! Young people in rural America in the 60's and 70's had tons of guns and there wasn't the epidemic of school shooting until the power of the drug psychiatry cartel got their hooks into our young men. 

On a brighter note: YOU WON!!!!!!! YOU GOT TO THE OTHER SIDE AND STILL HAVE THIS BRILLIANT POST YOU STARTED!!!!!!!!!!!

Very well written and intelligently expressed. They didn't take that from ya at least. I look at your story like Shawshank and Andy Dufresne. 

[[re...]]

Antibenzo:

Come on!!!! No way!!!!!!!!! I respectfully disagree and it's not fair to call ignorance especially on many newbies who have NO IDEA what they are getting into. Dr. google or no dr. google. 

Most times  when people are in crisis (spiritual/emotional/medical) they are not thinking with their rational brain and don't understand the dangers of these meds and the informed consent which is supposed to be  a DOCTOR'S responsibility goes out the window. This seems to be changing a bit with people like Mr. Horowitz, Mr Witt Doering, and the like. 

A side effect insert is just not adequate for someone in crisis. We are told since youth to trust our medical pros and listen to what they say. We may know the dangers NOW, but it is the medical institutions who turn a blind eye to the power and danger these meds can cause for so many. I feel you lack empathy on this topic. Sorry if that sounds judgmental as I don't know you. But you are lashing out here on members trying to have a critical discussion and I think it is counter productive and unfair. 

I don't understand if you are listening to JustinTime here. But they(the state, judge) DOES have the power to force feed you these poisons non voluntarily if you meet some silly criteria from the DSM. 

 

I feel you are being contrarian on purpose and if that is not your intention I definitely apologize. But this site would not even exist  if the doctor's would try monitored other methods first instead of pills pills pills. Sometimes there maybe is no other option but pharmacologic intervention. But I strongly think that other less invasive methods will also work in many situations and should be tried first. 

 

 

[[re...]]

I just want everyone to know that this is not a bashing on doctors post only and we are trying not to have a victim mentality, but just looking in hindsight and very upset at how much has been taken from us due to lack of knowledge on the people that are supposed to have knowledge and training and still  practice psych med deprescribing like you would a street drug. It's 2024 and it is baffling my mind that these cold turkies and rapid tapers still go on as it is very barbaric and damages lots of people. Story after story I keep hearing this and we need to move ahead for better health if we are to survive as a society.

  I just want change and to evolve into a place where people that are doing individual outpatient tapers with their doctors or even some their own way have a place to go to an in person group where they can talk about their progress and get the support they need and that reality is still so far away it seems. I wanna be the new Bill Wilson of Head Meds. 

[[An...]]

1 hour ago, [[r...] said:

Antibenzo:

Come on!!!! No way!!!!!!!!! I respectfully disagree and it's not fair to call ignorance especially on many newbies who have NO IDEA what they are getting into. Dr. google or no dr. google. 

Most times  when people are in crisis (spiritual/emotional/medical) they are not thinking with their rational brain and don't understand the dangers of these meds and the informed consent which is supposed to be  a DOCTOR'S responsibility goes out the window. This seems to be changing a bit with people like Mr. Horowitz, Mr Witt Doering, and the like. 

A side effect insert is just not adequate for someone in crisis. We are told since youth to trust our medical pros and listen to what they say. We may know the dangers NOW, but it is the medical institutions who turn a blind eye to the power and danger these meds can cause for so many. I feel you lack empathy on this topic. Sorry if that sounds judgmental as I don't know you. But you are lashing out here on members trying to have a critical discussion and I think it is counter productive and unfair. 

I don't understand if you are listening to JustinTime here. But they(the state, judge) DOES have the power to force feed you these poisons non voluntarily if you meet some silly criteria from the DSM. 

I feel you are being contrarian on purpose and if that is not your intention I definitely apologize. But this site would not even exist  if the doctor's would try monitored other methods first instead of pills pills pills. Sometimes there maybe is no other option but pharmacologic intervention. But I strongly think that other less invasive methods will also work in many situations and should be tried first. 

It is not my intention to be an antagonist or play devil's advocate. I don't do that period. What I wrote is simply what I truly believe just as what you wrote.  I will no longer reply to this thread and unsubscribe. What was said about Type I diabetes is simply untrue. Take care my friend. I am personally into lifestyle medicine big time (healthy food nutrition, exercise, meditation, good sleep hygiene mostly). I will not take any drug unless I feel it is absolutely necessary and also after I have researched it to death.

You said>>

Quote

DOES have the power to force feed you these poisons non voluntarily if you meet some silly criteria from the DSM. 

 

Please note>>>>

Quote

5150 is the number of the section of the Welfare and Institutions Code, which allows an adult who is experiencing a mental health crisis to be involuntarily detained for a 72- hour psychiatric hospitalization when evaluated to be a danger to others, or to himself or herself, or gravely disabled.

 

Edited March 5 by [An...]
addition

[[Ju...]]

6 hours ago, [[A...] said:

It is not my intention to be an antagonist or play devil's advocate. I don't do that period. What I wrote is simply what I truly believe just as what you wrote.  I will no longer reply to this thread and unsubscribe. What was said about Type I diabetes is simply untrue. Take care my friend. I am personally into lifestyle medicine big time (healthy food nutrition, exercise, meditation, good sleep hygiene mostly). I will not take any drug unless I feel it is absolutely necessary and also after I have researched it to death.

You said>>

Please note>>>>

Antibenzo,

You need to do a little more research. Everyone's aware of the 72 hour involuntary hold rule, I'm pretty sure all of us have experienced that. What I was referring to, is something completely different. Let me explain:

In the southern hospitals I was in, they were state mandated psychiatric facilities. I was involuntarily held because of substance abuse, for drinking and taking controlled benzodiazepines together. Both legal, but apparently basically illegal when combined according to doctors. What do I mean by basically illegal? Because it was enough to give them the medical authority to place me on extended involuntary hold, enforced by the state psychiatric facilities' judge and court. Yes, they had an actual judge and an actual courtroom within the State Behavioral hospital.

After going to my court proceeding with the state appointed attorney, who I also received covered under my medical care, the judge took my gun rights first. Secondly, they issued notice to the State Department of Motor Vehicle License Office at the state capitol. My driver's license was immediately revoked, and was not reinstated until after completing mandatory Medical substance abuse classes. I was required to go to a State Certified licensed therapist for licensed mental health counselor, to get diagnosis that I was no longer abusing substances according to DSM-5 criteria. Once that was completed, I was entitled to reinstatement of my driver's license. The state informed me, the driver's license is a privilege, not a right. Therefore they had the right to take it.

Next, I meant what I said about the sheriff's van and being driven around with shackles on my ankles and wrists. There was no crime committed, that was the state protocol when there was no ambulance available. They were transporting me from regular behavioral hospital, to State Behavioral hospital. They are required to secure you, and the sheriff's prisoner van had no windows and no comfortable seating, I was thrown on a hard metal bench in the back of the van, and bounced up and down the highway for a 2-hour drive. 2 hours worth of bouncing up and down on a damaged back, while going through severe benzo withdrawal that was cut after 72 hours. I had no choice, the sheriff threw me in there and transported me.

Once I received my next hospitalization after being transported in the sheriff van, I was injected against my will with halifredol and benadryl, with eight police officers defending nurse practitioner with a syringe. They informed me, either you take it voluntarily, or we force you to have it. They got the medical Authority right to inject me, due to two different medical doctors saying that it was medically necessary. I had no choice, it was not voluntary whatsoever.

There was another occasion where I was abusing alcohol when I was in my late twenties, I needed a detox really bad at the time. The doctors thought that I was a harm to myself because of the substances, because of how much I had been drinking and for how long. They required me to go to a state facility at the time, and would not let me leave my involuntary status until 21 days later. This was not Court ordered, this was medical doctor ordered. Again, completely involuntary, against my will, had no say in the matter. Absolutely zero consent on this time again.

The generic 5150 rule that you're referring to, I believe is a state rule in California anyways. This wasn't california, this was a conservative Southern state. And yes there's also a 72-hour involuntary rule Across the Nation that's regular involuntary status, which usually applies to psychotic or suicidal people. Those are not usually Court ordered, those holes usually don't go beyond that, unless the patient requests it.

And like others said above, even if people put themselves in that predicament when they're younger, most are not thinking of the legal aspects, they're only thinking of the medical treatment and feeling better. Not everyone is a lawyer, not everyone knows the laws. Sort of like a civil trial, hardly anybody knows how to defend themself, should they just try to defend themselves without knowing the law? Of course not, that would be ridiculous, although I've done that too.

[[WU...]]

13 hours ago, [[r...] said:

When you think about it how could something like all these gorgeous structures in Europe could of been built without the proper hierarchy.

Well yes hierarchy and also no machine tools and large trucks, it boggles the mind how on earth they did it. There is a natural hierarchy, even watching the wood pidgeons here every day I can see the boss and the lower orders and they are clearly all working together for the benefit of the flock.  

Reading you were in construction made me think of that film The Fountainhead with Gary Cooper, great film. Then I look around and see the monstrosities of buildings going up and wonder why ascetics has gone out of fashion.  Its as though the spirit is missing and just the basic structure is considered sufficient these days, and that's why everything looks so ugly. So even medicine has gone the same way, they do not consider the spirit at all. The spirit is everything and is being ignored!

[[WU...]]

@[Ju...] your story is worthy of a novel or a film, you recount an incredible series of events, to use the cliche true life is greater than any fiction  How is life for you now? Do you have some contentment and peace in your life after going through all of that horror ? 

[[re...]]

JIT:

I have been 5150'd in Ventura County in  Cali when I was young due to a domestic dispute so I completely understand the power of the system to ruin a person based on another's testimony so the fact you had to go through all that to understand the power of psychiatry is a tragedy. I had a record from that and could not get a gun for years because of it.  My blessing was they only held me without forced drugging thank god.

That would be saved for later when I had an actual medical emergency called hyponatremia (low salt in blood due to over drinking water due to working outside in a Phoenix summer) when they did force drug me with tons of IV Haldol, Ativan, Keppra due to a misdiagnosis of a brain infection and gave me many different kinds of antibiotics/antiviral and nausea meds and I had a bad reaction to them. What a disaster!!!!!!! And i am going to lawyer up I think.  All I needed was an electrolyte fluid bag ASAP, but they waited and waited and I went into a long Status Epilepticus due to the delay and it is why I am here again. So my time with doctors and my observations/opinions of them IS quite critical at this point. And especially the post care after I left the ER when I started developing these jerky limb movements and all these head pressures/twitches in my face and weird cns issues and completely lost the ability to sleep. Every last one of the bastards turned their heads and didn't even look at the monstrosity of drugs (10 different ones in a 24 hour period) I was given in my chart. It is not like they didn't have my records, but as always, protect big pharma at ANY cost. Many are criminals by omission as they figuratively  put their hands over their ears like a two year old and go la la la la. 

 

Antibenzo:

I enjoy the different takes on things and not everyone has to be right or wrong absolute. So of course it is your choice not to stay on here. I wish you wouldn't, but that is your choice.  Everyone is welcome and we can agree to disagree. This is the critical part of debate and I enjoy all different perspectives. You just seemed to come in hot and had a kind of immediate defense of the docs and did what they all do which is BLAME THE PATIENT!!!!!!!!!  Say for instance you are onto something valid with patient responsibility to research before ingesting a drug IF the patient is not in crisis and might have some mild insomnia or whatever. What happens if and when that drug has an adverse effect/tolerance. The majority in the medical field seem to always protect the drug at any cost and won't recognize say a histamine problem. or rebound, with it or cns problems AT ALL. They love to use that word "relapse" as this takes the responsibility off of big pharma and onto the patient.  They many times say it is your anxiety coming back or whatever diagnosis they choose to give. I am sorry freaking brain zaps are NOT anxiety. No freaking way!!!!!!!!  I can even somewhat understand where you are coming from as long as you are not being contrarian. No problem. I know you are on this site so you certainly understand the damage these can do, but also probably feel like we are whining and don't wanna hear it, but that is really not the OP's intention with this post. I just think OP seems to have major clarity after having gone thru hell as most of us have and we can't believe how duped we were by the whole damn system.  

 

WU: I feel the same way about the ugly buildings everywhere in the states. I think architecture is such an important part of the spirit of a culture and the current ones are a sign of a dying one as there is no beauty and with the ugly burbs it is a intentional push to make us feel hopeless and isolated. And it is cheaper!!!!!!! Ha ha.  

[[WU...]]

 @[re...] Blimey you could also write a novel with your story, incredible events in your life.

Yeah, ugly buildings wherever you go in the world. It has a direct impact on how you feel. I live a few miles away from the most perfectly intact sweeping Georgian terraced buildings curving along the sandy beach. It is quite unique and yet people call the town a dump because the shopping area is crap. 

[[re...]]

WU:

Let me tell ya I have some stories alright enough to cover a novel for real. For some reason when I first moved to Los Angeles. There was constant action (and tons of cool stuff too) and crazy stuff from being in the middle of gang gunfights where people were dropping by me from the bullets to a time at a Jack in the box..... a fast food place where in the drive through I was waiting behind this truck minding my own business I swear. Then assaulted by these meth heads that were paranoid and looking at me in their rear view mirror and decided I was Satan with their come down tweaker paranoia and went on to smash my windows with full beer cans in the the parking lot and then continue to chase me at about 65 mph on a normal road in their tweaker truck and go right in front of me and just stop and throw beer cans at my truck. It something like a John Wick movie I swear. So so surreal. I was so lucky as i only got a few cuts from the shattered glass in my face and when I called the cops and they said "what do you want us to do about it?" That is when I knew something was vastly wrong with the system in general. Yet they do things to people like OP that just had an issue with the cold turkey and didn't inflict violence on anyone.   

 

If you get some time check out my initial benzo story that brought me here a long time ago I think you will get a kick out of it. 

 

[[WU...]]

51 minutes ago, [[r...] said:

That is when I knew something was vastly wrong with the system in general

It would be quicker to make a list of things that are done right, a very short list no doubt. 

Had a couple of trips to L.A and I hardly got out of the car, too scared! And after your story it shows I was correct. Thanks for the link to your initial post. Crikey, you don't do things by halves do you? Had to go all the way to France to get a prescription.  How is it the French manage to drink such strong coffee? Do they have a problem? Well yes they do, they take a lot of benzos, along with the Spanish, Norwegians, Swedish, basically the whole of Europe has a problem. Drug companies must be laughing themselves silly. No doubt they will be prescribed other drugs to get off the benzos and the circus goes on and on.

Have you ever posted a success story? I am assuming you are fully healed. Do you still sing or did it all stop after the benzo years?

[[re...]]

HA HA HA!!!!!!!!!! You got me dyin over here with that coffee statement. So funny, but true. I wouldn't think Europe at this point would be such a mess like the USA is with these medicines. The reach of the pharmaceutical companies is so unforgiving like a monster devouring any and all that get in it's way. 

I have had one great success story from my first experience with head meds and benzos years ago. It was a fairly uneventful taper. Like from 1mg K to 0 in only 9 months. But this time WOW what a difference as many have said. Very difficult. I have taken about 10 months to get from 5 mg of Diazepam to the 1.5 mg I am on at the moment. I have been exercising regularly and really on my diet game and just introduced some plantarum and rhamnoses probiotics along with MCT oil with some success it seems. But wow do I have to crawl off this last bit I think. My singing is actually real good thank god thank you for asking. But I think with the medical malpractice chemical lobotomy they gave me in the summer of 2022 in the hospital and the seizures have really made my cns so sensitive, but  i do feel healing as I get lower thus far. 

 

You said you reside by a sandy beach in Europe. Man that sounds so amazing. When I did my brief stint in France (Laval) I one time visited Vendee, a beach town and was blown away with how clean it was compared to the beaches of Cali. I loved it there. 

 

How are you doin right now with your benzo stuff? Are you off?

[[WU...]]

Oh  @[re...]I didn't realise you were still on the poison. What a shame, (using conservative language) . Sounds like you are doing things correctly and going slowly.  I went CT off 5mg last March and things are pretty bad still. Head symptoms are the worst with no sign of letting up. Can't do much except wait it seems. I feel pretty stupid going CT but when I realised what this drug was doing I was in shock and it was impossible to take any more, just couldn't do it.  

With your singing I wonder if you consider using your voice as a healing tool. There is quite a lot on the subject of humming, chanting and generally getting the right vibes going. Unfortunately everything sounds out of tune to me while my head is bad.  I've tried the odd one note La La La  but my ears are also ringing and screeching so it doesn't feel right to carry on but it kind of makes sense to produce good clear vibrations in the body. I have a tuning fork but even that sounds out of tune! and my Burmese Temple gong which is a bit overpowering to say the least though I do love the sound. 

Sorry to JIT for going off on a tangent

[[re...]]

Oh yikes WU so sorry bout the CT. Those are nasty. Oh those head symptoms make you wanna bang it against a wall. I hate how out of the blue the ringing tinnitus just starts. It is like metal on metal buzzing. I hate it so much. 

What the hell are in these small pills!!!!! I just cannot figure it out. I have heard SSRI's and Benzos without a doubt are the worst things to get off of and seems why the main two forums are "surviving antidepressants" and "benzo buddies" I am doing a micro liquid suspension style taper bout .20 per month with 5 day cuts at .01-.02 per day M-F then hold weekends then start again. I had to slow it down as I get lower. 

 

You are right about the singing. I have been bringing my headphones on my long walks/hikes in the woods here in Massachusetts and singing a bit more and more and something about it DOES help. Vagus Nerve stuff I would have to say from what I have read. 

May we all heal and figure out how to change this for future generations at the hands of aloof doctors. 

[[Pa...]]

I'd like to remind the members contributing to this thread to keep it on topic.   

[[Ju...]]

I'm enjoying the stories and posters. I agree about the architecture, I just got done watching the most expensive house in the world on youtube, someone put in an offer for 1 billion dollars and it was turned down. French Revolution house out in france. Reminds me of the house I used to visit as a child where I grew up, the Biltmore Estate in North carolina owned by the vanderbilts. Four acres span house, 180,000 square feet.

Back in those days there weren't any empty spaces on the walls, everything was furnished and decorated to the max. Everything was hand built and symmetrical, without new electronics and lasers and guidance from machinery. It was all slave built for the most part, slave quarters and servants and it took a lifetime to build. It wasn't just a thing where they put up some architecture within a couple years and sold it on Sotheby's, this was literally whole entire communities full of people working in conjunction with each other to build an Empire for the hierarchy leaders.

I live in downtown Seattle washington, on the waterfront. Everything around here is modern and new, mostly glass and steel and concrete. The occasional marble or quartz or granite countertops, bamboo or wooden floors, etc. They're bringing the nature in conjunction with modern architecture. But if you look around the older parts of seattle, there are old Gardens built by The Olmsted Brothers, the same gardeners that did the Landscaping on the Biltmore Estate and French Revolution era homes.

Most of the Old English tudors and French style homes are out of style for the new generations. These days everybody wants something that looks like their Apple phone packaging, or like their Samsung tv, or like the logos they see on TV for their marketing of their favorite restaurants. They incorporate LED lights like it's a nightclub, and now they're building Porsche and Aston Martin and Bentley Towers in miami.

If you watch the Sotheby's Estates in Beverly Hills and Pacific Palisades and those areas of Los angeles, much of the Interior Design is furniture made by Gucci and Louis vuitton, like it's a rap video. Or you'll see an empty box house with 16-car garages underneath with Lamborghinis and Ferraris, when they don't even go to the racetrack. It's just for eye candy. And mostly everybody has a jaguar or a T-Rex to show off in their main living space, to impress guests. Stuff like that.

I'm like you guys, I've been through the ringer. Many years spent living in florida, North carolina, colorado, massachusetts, Washington state, etc. Seems the doctors are similar no matter where you go, it's all marketing, they all say they're trying to make you feel better within 5 minutes, they tell you to come back within a few months. Even if you don't need meds, they still want you to come back anyways. And even when you do need meds, they still take months to see you regardless. It seems it's more about their schedule than it is the medical care. It's about the quick visit for the insurance reimbursement.

I also went cold turkey like one of you, off of 20 years worth of high dose Valium and Klonopin and several other legal and illegal substances. It was no fun to say the least, it was really stupid at minimum. Either way, almost 5 years out and still kicking and almost healed. Eating healthy, not taking a single thing. Basically the opposite of what the medical professional advised and said was possible, but now I'll never need their opinion again.

[[Pa...]]

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