Daily Micro-Tapering Support Group

[Guest [NM...]]

Hi Uni,

 

I think you should hold/slow down as you feel fit. Everyone is different so just listen to your body. Have you checked out the Long Hold Support Group? People there do long holds.

 

Personally, I push through and don't hold. I did do one hold for a month and it was the worst month of my taper. I started to feel better when I began to taper again.

 

The GOOD news: as I have gotten lower, tinnitus is GONE, brain fog is minimal and morning anxiety/chemical surges are pretty much finished. I have days I feel 90% normal. Waves are less and less. So things do get better at lower doses for some. I know others struggle. But I have just felt better and better as I get lower.

 

I haven’t held either, Pete. I’m just saying what I’ve done. I think the longest I went dry tapering was three weeks between cuts. I’ve pushed through even when things were awful. I’m glad my circumstances were what they were. I fired my prescribing psychologist after my former doctor lost his medical license. So I had enough Klonopin to taper, but no refills. I chose to push forward knowing it would be so hard to get another doctor/refill. I knew this was it for me. Done with this part of my life.

[[Co...]]

Cona -

 

Yes I had tinnitus - a ringing in my ears that was not pleasant and it did go away and now I never have it, even when in a wave (which are now less and less). Many symptoms left or lessened as I got lower in my dose doing the DLMT.

 

I bet you experience the same thing - as you get lower, symptoms will go away. We heal as we taper and I believe they left as I got lower because my brain is healing more and more.

 

You've got this!! 

 

 

Thanks so much Hope!

I am really happy to hear such positive news!!

 

[[So...]]

Good plan Sandia  - I think holds can help some people but I learned they didn't help me...I want OFF this damn drug so tapering is what I do...every day, without fail, I get lower.

 

The only way out is through as they say 

[Guest [NM...]]

Good plan Sandia  - I think holds can help some people but I learned they didn't help me...I want OFF this damn drug so tapering is what I do...every day, without fail, I get lower.

 

The only way out is through as they say 

 

Exactly the case for me too. I have healed so much throughout my taper!

[[Co...]]

Good plan Sandia  - I think holds can help some people but I learned they didn't help me...I want OFF this damn drug so tapering is what I do...every day, without fail, I get lower.

 

The only way out is through as they say 

 

 

I think the same way, just want to taper the thing out of my system.

Get scared when symptoms arise but I always continue.

 

Hopefully I will be able to

[[te...]]

Peace flower

Are you dry cutting ? I am micro tapering by dry cutting . I am nervous about liquid .

Lisa

[[So...]]

tech21 -

 

I am tapering using liquid RX Valium and didn't notice anything when I added it. I taper the liquid now and take 1mg in tablet. It is super easy to use.

 

I was nervous too but did not have any reaction to adding it.

 

And good news: so many symptoms have vanished since I got lower in dose...no tinnitus ever, no brain fog, no anxiety surges. Sleep is my main issue now (which sucks).

 

It does get better.

 

Healing happens every minute! 

[Guest [NM...]]

I also switched from dry cutting my pills to making them into a solution. I had zero trouble switching.

[[te...]]

Thank you for your reply’s

[[...]]

Thank you for your reply’s

I think Peaceflower is doing the dry cut method that I used-you can see a link to how to do it in my signature.

[[Co...]]

Thank you for your reply’s

 

 

 

Hi Lisa,

 

I am dry cutting too.

Difficult to measure exactly, unless you go by Bob’s method.

Still I manage.

 

[[te...]]

Hi conafetto,

Thanks I file and weigh and file and weigh until I get the exact dose I want , but it is not easy .

Thanks and wishing you well .

Lisa

[[Co...]]

Hi conafetto,

Thanks I file and weigh and file and weigh until I get the exact dose I want , but it is not easy .

Thanks and wishing you well .

Lisa

 

 

Hi Lisa,

 

Thanks for reacting!

I have discovered the same method...

File and weigh x100000000

the scale is always showing a different number.

Si the eyeball measurement is what I trust on.

I am told that it is not as much about accuracy as about trying to keep the daily ( two days for me) lowering of the dose.

Wishing you well too!

C

[[bu...]]

 

I am told that it is not as much about accuracy as about trying to keep the daily ( two days for me) lowering of the dose.

 

 

:thumbsup:

 

Consistency is much more important than accuracy!!

[[mo...]]

Thank you for your reply’s

I think Peaceflower is doing the dry cut method that I used-you can see a link to how to do it in my signature.

 

I’ve been doing Bob’s method maybe a few months now, I had aversion to the liquid method, not sure why. It’s been going very well. I’ve had to hold a few days when my brain wasn’t healing at the rate I was reducing but I like that this method is very flexible. I mix the powder for a month as Bob instructs  but I make the tablets nightly. That way if I need to hold for a day then I do or a few times I felt like a dare devil and jumped ahead .002 instead of .001. As of today I’m at .037.  I’m very appreciative of this method, at first it was scary at first but the transition was easier than expected.

 

MoTo

[[Ma...]]

 

I am told that it is not as much about accuracy as about trying to keep the daily ( two days for me) lowering of the dose.

 

 

:thumbsup:

 

Consistency is much more important than accuracy!!

 

Since I have had a lot of trouble in the past tapering, that really stood out to me and I will remember in case of any problems in the future  .

[[Co...]]

 

I am told that it is not as much about accuracy as about trying to keep the daily ( two days for me) lowering of the dose.

 

 

:thumbsup:

 

Consistency[e/i] is much more important than accuracy!!

 

 

Thank you so much!!

This a very meaningful message for me

[[Un...]]

How many of you still have to hold while doing this method? 

 

I’ve had to hold quite a bit and I’m discouraged.  I know it’s best not to rush and listen to your body, which is what I’m doing.  I’ve tried slowing my rate down, as well.  But still have had to hold a fair bit.  And that kind of goes against the purpose of a daily micro taper. 

 

Anyone else find you need breaks from micro tapering?  Do you taper through terror and akathisia?  Those are the ones that make me hold.  Like does our brian just need a break sometimes to catch up?

 

So confused and frustrated.

 

Love to you all ❤️

 

Uni

 

Hi Uni!

I've had to hold at  least 3 times since starting my DMT. I'm doing the dry method. I could not tolerate liquid.

Are you doing partial liquid still? Are you doing both liquid and dry?

I'm a bit unclear from reading your signature.

 

Peace 

 

Hi Peace,

 

Thank you for your feedback.  Yes, I am doing both dry and liquid.  My dose is mostly pill (as much as possible) and the partial liquid in milk.  It’s good to know others have had to hold during a DMT as well.  I’m trying a longer hold this time, as I’ve only done 4 days here, 2 days there, 7 days once.  This time I’m on day 8 so far and will continue to hold for possibly a few weeks.  It’s so hard for me to hold because I feel I’m not getting anywhere, but that’s not true.  Helping is happening underneath.  Just trying to let my brain catch up.  My taper has been pretty symptomatic in its entirety, so I’m not expecting miracles.  He long did you hold for and did it help?

 

Thank you! 

 

Uni ❤️

[[Un...]]

Hi Uni,

 

I think you should hold/slow down as you feel fit. Everyone is different so just listen to your body. Have you checked out the Long Hold Support Group? People there do long holds.

 

Personally, I push through and don't hold. I did do one hold for a month and it was the worst month of my taper. I started to feel better when I began to taper again.

 

The GOOD news: as I have gotten lower, tinnitus is GONE, brain fog is minimal and morning anxiety/chemical surges are pretty much finished. I have days I feel 90% normal. Waves are less and less. So things do get better at lower doses for some. I know others struggle. But I have just felt better and better as I get lower.

 

Hi Sober Hope,

 

That’s such great news that things are lifting for you as you get lower!  It always gives me hope hearing from those of you who feel better on the way down.  I was very hopeful of the same, but hit a rough patch in my taper.  Way to push through! 

 

When I was tapering Klonopin last year, I had a similar experience with holding close to a month making me feel worse.  Valium is not my “home drug” so it’s been a bit tricky for me to taper.  I think with my history, it’s probably a lot going on from different things (debilitating CT, reinstatement, crossover, length of time on K..)

 

I recently hit a patch where I got intense terror and akathisia that wouldn’t stop and kept getting worse, so decided a hold would do no harm.  But continuing to taper may...?  The combo of those two symptoms are too dangerous for me.  Was so hopeful to be able to daily taper Valium without holding, but we all have to listen to our bodies and do what is safest    Either way, we are moving forward and will eventually be off the drug.  Freedom here we come!  It’s really so great to hear you are able to handle the daily micro and will be off sooner than later! 

 

Thank you for your feedback and sharing what’s happening for you  :smitten:

 

Hope all is well! 

 

Love, Uni❤️

 

 

 

 

[[So...]]

Hi Uni,

 

I also hit a rough patch from going too fast (following the Ashton speed). I held for a month at 3mgs but honestly never felt stable and then felt better as I tapered again...and I do have many improvements as I get lower. The tinnitus has gone completely, the brain fog is pretty much gone and I no longer have chemical anxiety surges when I wake up. Sleep is still broken but I get some good nights.

 

I actually sped up my DLMT taper, and have been fine. If I get hit with symptoms, I will slow down again.

 

So sorry you got hit - I always think slowing down helps and a hold can give you the time to figure out what the best speed to go at is.

 

Wishing you loads of healing and recovery! PM me if you ever need anything. 

[[mo...]]

How many of you still have to hold while doing this method? 

 

I’ve had to hold quite a bit and I’m discouraged.  I know it’s best not to rush and listen to your body, which is what I’m doing.  I’ve tried slowing my rate down, as well.  But still have had to hold a fair bit.  And that kind of goes against the purpose of a daily micro taper. 

 

Anyone else find you need breaks from micro tapering?  Do you taper through terror and akathisia?  Those are the ones that make me hold.  Like does our brian just need a break sometimes to catch up?

 

So confused and frustrated.

 

Love to you all ❤️

 

Uni

 

Hi Uni!

I've had to hold at  least 3 times since starting my DMT. I'm doing the dry method. I could not tolerate liquid.

Are you doing partial liquid still? Are you doing both liquid and dry?

I'm a bit unclear from reading your signature.

 

Peace 

 

Hi Peace,

 

Thank you for your feedback.  Yes, I am doing both dry and liquid.  My dose is mostly pill (as much as possible) and the partial liquid in milk.  It’s good to know others have had to hold during a DMT as well.  I’m trying a longer hold this time, as I’ve only done 4 days here, 2 days there, 7 days once.  This time I’m on day 8 so far and will continue to hold for possibly a few weeks.  It’s so hard for me to hold because I feel I’m not getting anywhere, but that’s not true.  Helping is happening underneath.  Just trying to let my brain catch up.  My taper has been pretty symptomatic in its entirety, so I’m not expecting miracles.  He long did you hold for and did it help?

 

Thank you! 

 

Uni ❤️

 

Hi Uni,

 

I’m on the DMT (Bob’s method) abd I’ve had to hold a few times over the past few months. It is highly frustrating because we want this to be overwith. But the way I look at it is, we have to tailor the taper to our healing rate. I could choose to taper at a slower rate such as .0005 but I’m doing .001 per day. Sometimes my brain is not healing at this pace and I have to hold for a day or two. If I wasn’t working I might push through and not hold  but I have to be able to do my job and be a mom so I just have to hold sometimes. I held for a day or two last week and for about 10 days a few weeks ago when I just wasn’t functional and had a job interview coming up. Bob and a few others had to talk me into it. I’m really glad I did as that hold allowed me to kind of “reset” and start again. I had to throw my jump date out of the window and tell myself if I’m truly completing a symptom based taper I’ll need to hold sometimes. In my view, a micro taper is not something I’m doing so I won’t have to hold. I’m doing a DMT so that I can reduce at a smaller daily rate than I was able to by dry cutting. And also I wanted to try something different from the cut and hold method that resulted in days where I couldn’t do anything but heal. I still have symptoms of course but I feel like I can live my life a bit more and go through a gentler process. I actually chose this method because I only have to mix it once per month and I can hold whenever I want. (Bob is not paying me to say this I promise!) Hope this makes sense. Whatever method you use I think it’s best to just listen to your body and it’s ok to hold. You can always reduce the taper rate but personally I’d rather do the largest daily reduction I can for me and just hold when it becomes to much. What works for one person may be totally different for others based on their body and circumstances but this is my view. Hope this helps.

[[te...]]

Any one have any ideas about filing and weighing? Wondering if in fact we never know how much medication we are getting even though

we are lowering daily .. Are we getting more filler than medication one day and more medication than filler the next day?

I am now getting ready to decided on going to liquid because of my concern about how much medication i am really getting by the above method.

I could you any suggestions.

Thanks

[[bu...]]

The active ingredient in tablets is NOT uniformly distributed, so any taper that requires the use of partial tablets will not be accurate, or precise.  (And the actual active ingredient content varies 10% or more, tablet-to-tablet, anyway)

 

OTOH, Rx liquid or liquid made with a solvent like vodka or PG will be uniformly distributed, and the dose will be as accurate an precise as you instrument will measure.  If you make a .1mg per ml solution, and measure out cuts of, say, .1ml each day, you will definitely be cutting .01mg each day.

 

Now, having said that, everyone believes that because a daily taper (liquid or dry) has all those doses in 2 or 3 decimal places (.01, or .001) that a daily taper has to be very precise and accurate. It doesn't!!

 

A daily taper only needs to be gradual, because that's how your body adjusts to the declining dose, gradually.  Any taper plan that allows you to gradually lower your dose, can work.

 

Now everyone here knows that I am an advocate of liquid tapers.  And I suppose because I'm an engineer, I like the greater precision.  But the real reason I recommend liquid is because it so easy. You make a 10-14 day supply of liquid, and just drink a little less each day. 

 

And dilution dramatically lowers the error factor.  If you make, for example, a .02ml measurement error, that's only .002mg.

[[te...]]

Thanks builder it has taken me quite a while to decide what to do . I am going to start my liquid this weekend . I have decided to make just enough for one day until I get used to it or see if it works for me .

My current dose of Ativan is 0.286

So 4 ml vodka 46 ml water and one 0.5 Ativan

Then I drink 28.6 ml  then I just take 00.1 less every day .

Wish me luck

Everyone here have been kind and patient with my trying to understand this method I think I have it now . Thank you all for your help .

[[mo...]]

Thanks builder it has taken me quite a while to decide what to do . I am going to start my liquid this weekend . I have decided to make just enough for one day until I get used to it or see if it works for me .

My current dose of Ativan is 0.286

So 4 ml vodka 46 ml water and one 0.5 Ativan

Then I drink 28.6 ml  then I just take 00.1 less every day .

Wish me luck

Everyone here have been kind and patient with my trying to understand this method I think I have it now . Thank you all for your help .

 

Good luck Tech! Glad you are trying this method.