Daily Micro-Tapering Support Group

[[Ul...]]

Im not sure if this is where I should post this question.

 

I have my Daily Liquid Micro Taper planned out.  I ordered some supplies. 

 

HOWEVER, After a bad cut at the end of April with symptoms worsening I updosed 8 days ago from 4.5 V to 5mg V.  Thats where I was when I reinstated and felt good.  So Day 8 after updose and still symptomatic...inner tremors, high anxiety throughout day, just general sense of dread and loud tinnitus.  Day 6 I was good but now back to more anxiety.

 

My QUESTION for all you micro taperers...Should I be more stable than this before I begin the taper?  Or should I just begin when I get my supplies?  I know no one can give me an answer for certain.  Am I panicking thinking this up dose won't work because its only day 8 or should it have worked by now?  I just want to know how a lot of you felt when you began your taper and if you think I should wait a little more.

Thank you

 

Personally, I'd say to stabilize and feel better before continuing. And I'd say that applies at any point along the journey. I'm still waiting for that stabilization

 

Jeff

 

:thumbsup:

Hoping that day comes for you soon, Jeff.

 

You too, sweet lady!

 

Jeff

[[ga...]]

I am ready to start a daily liquid micro taper of valium.  I tapered down really quickly due to a chemical black depression brought on when I crossed from Ativan to Valium.  I'm now down to 5 mg Valium.  Starting late Feb when I was at 13 mg Valium, I tapered 1 mg per week until I hit the wall at 5 mg.  I have been holding for about 6 weeks & will do so a bit longer.  When I resume the taper, what is a good percentage taper for being at this level?

 

I stupidly tried to taper from Cymbalta while holding the valium taper and that turned out to be REAL ugly.  I made 2 10% Cymbalta cuts from 60 mg down to 54 mg and then down to 48 mg before I realized what a huge mistake it is to taper an AD while in the throes of benzo taper and withdrawal.  So, I'm holding the Cymbalta taper until I'm off of the valium and stable enough to resume the Cymbalta taper.  Meanwhile, I need to figure out how to do the DLMT of valium.  I've no experience with it and have done only dry cut up to this point.  Any advice is appreciated!

 

Sorry, I don't have experience with this sort of thing (AD and benzo combo). Have you checked the Long Hold thread under support groups? There are people on there who have been in similar situations.

 

If builder or other titration expert comes on, he can explain how to liquefy your valium. It does come as a liquid, if your doctor will prescribe it. Then all you have to do is dilute it. builder can explain. There is also a titration sub-forum that has lots of info about making liquids. You might want to look at the stickies over there.

 

Good luck!

 

Gard

[[jr...]]

You can Mix 5mgV with 10ml vodka and add 40ml water.That will give you a solution that is .1mg/ml.to reduce 10% a month reduce your daily dose by .16ml. IMO, I would make a weeks worth at a time.

 

I am ready to start a daily liquid micro taper of valium.  I tapered down really quickly due to a chemical black depression brought on when I crossed from Ativan to Valium.  I'm now down to 5 mg Valium.  Starting late Feb when I was at 13 mg Valium, I tapered 1 mg per week until I hit the wall at 5 mg.  I have been holding for about 6 weeks & will do so a bit longer.  When I resume the taper, what is a good percentage taper for being at this level?

 

I stupidly tried to taper from Cymbalta while holding the valium taper and that turned out to be REAL ugly.  I made 2 10% Cymbalta cuts from 60 mg down to 54 mg and then down to 48 mg before I realized what a huge mistake it is to taper an AD while in the throes of benzo taper and withdrawal.  So, I'm holding the Cymbalta taper until I'm off of the valium and stable enough to resume the Cymbalta taper.  Meanwhile, I need to figure out how to do the DLMT of valium.  I've no experience with it and have done only dry cut up to this point.  Any advice is appreciated!

[[ga...]]

You can Mix 5mgV with 10ml vodka and add 40ml water.That will give you a solution that is .1mg/ml.to reduce 10% a month reduce your daily dose by .16ml. IMO, I would make a weeks worth at a time.

 

 

:thumbsup:

(Not that I did the math. I just know jr can do the math! )

[[Ki...]]

Oooh when I switch over to LMT yall are going to either have the best time laughing at my stupid questions or throttle me. Or both lol

[[po...]]

jr50898

I see you did a really slow micro taper from your sig.  How was it going down?  Did you ever have to hold and how was it when you finished?

Thanks

[[ga...]]

Oooh when I switch over to LMT yall are going to either have the best time laughing at my stupid questions or throttle me. Or both lol

 

Nobody gets throttled on this thread or I would've been dead long ago! 

[[ga...]]

You can Mix 5mgV with 10ml vodka and add 40ml water.That will give you a solution that is .1mg/ml.to reduce 10% a month reduce your daily dose by .16ml. IMO, I would make a weeks worth at a time.

 

I am ready to start a daily liquid micro taper of valium.  I tapered down really quickly due to a chemical black depression brought on when I crossed from Ativan to Valium.  I'm now down to 5 mg Valium.  Starting late Feb when I was at 13 mg Valium, I tapered 1 mg per week until I hit the wall at 5 mg.  I have been holding for about 6 weeks & will do so a bit longer.  When I resume the taper, what is a good percentage taper for being at this level?

 

I stupidly tried to taper from Cymbalta while holding the valium taper and that turned out to be REAL ugly.  I made 2 10% Cymbalta cuts from 60 mg down to 54 mg and then down to 48 mg before I realized what a huge mistake it is to taper an AD while in the throes of benzo taper and withdrawal.  So, I'm holding the Cymbalta taper until I'm off of the valium and stable enough to resume the Cymbalta taper.  Meanwhile, I need to figure out how to do the DLMT of valium.  I've no experience with it and have done only dry cut up to this point.  Any advice is appreciated!

Is 10% a month considered a normal taper rate if one is at 5 mg Valium?  I don't want to go too fast nor too slowly. 

[[ga...]]

Are there any daily micro taper spreadsheet template links available on the site anywhere that anyone knows of?  Would like to avoid reinventing the wheel, if possible.

[[ga...]]

You can Mix 5mgV with 10ml vodka and add 40ml water.That will give you a solution that is .1mg/ml.to reduce 10% a month reduce your daily dose by .16ml. IMO, I would make a weeks worth at a time.

 

I am ready to start a daily liquid micro taper of valium.  I tapered down really quickly due to a chemical black depression brought on when I crossed from Ativan to Valium.  I'm now down to 5 mg Valium.  Starting late Feb when I was at 13 mg Valium, I tapered 1 mg per week until I hit the wall at 5 mg.  I have been holding for about 6 weeks & will do so a bit longer.  When I resume the taper, what is a good percentage taper for being at this level?

 

I stupidly tried to taper from Cymbalta while holding the valium taper and that turned out to be REAL ugly.  I made 2 10% Cymbalta cuts from 60 mg down to 54 mg and then down to 48 mg before I realized what a huge mistake it is to taper an AD while in the throes of benzo taper and withdrawal.  So, I'm holding the Cymbalta taper until I'm off of the valium and stable enough to resume the Cymbalta taper.  Meanwhile, I need to figure out how to do the DLMT of valium.  I've no experience with it and have done only dry cut up to this point.  Any advice is appreciated!

Is 10% a month considered a normal taper rate if one is at 5 mg Valium?  I don't want to go too fast nor too slowly.

 

10% is sort of standard operating procedure, but I think there's a Valium group that could give you more insight on that.

[[ka...]]

Oooh when I switch over to LMT yall are going to either have the best time laughing at my stupid questions or throttle me. Or both lol

 

Nobody gets throttled on this thread or I would've been dead long ago! 

Oh Kitty you are too funny and cute!! 

Hey ya gard!! how is my dear friend doing these days??? Thanks for taking care of everyone so nicely!

[[ga...]]

Oooh when I switch over to LMT yall are going to either have the best time laughing at my stupid questions or throttle me. Or both lol

 

Nobody gets throttled on this thread or I would've been dead long ago! 

Oh Kitty you are too funny and cute!! 

Hey ya gard!! how is my dear friend doing these days??? Thanks for taking care of everyone so nicely!

 

Hi Kasey. Good to see you! My doctor made me taper faster so I'm now pushing the edges of tolerable. I think if I tell her I want to slow down, she will let me. We'll see. I wouldn't mind getting lower on this junk sooner. I feel like my brain is turning into mashed potatoes! This taper is taking way too long. How are you these days? Good, I hope.

 

Gard

[[ga...]]

If I'm going to start a daily liquid micro taper of 5 mg Valium, would it be too aggressive to try for 10% every 2 weeks?  I don't think it matters whether it's Valium or some other benzo....just asking if this rate sounds ok knowing that I'm at the latter end of the taper.

 

If so, should I take part of the dose in pill form and part in liquid?  I need help on specifics and the logistics of how to do this.  How much do I cut daily?  I'm completely new at the daily liquid thing as I've been only dry cutting up till now, so really would appreciate some input from those with experience.  I'm intimidated by all the detail and minutiae involved. 

[[ga...]]

If I'm going to start a daily liquid micro taper of 5 mg Valium, would it be too aggressive to try for 10% every 2 weeks?  I don't think it matters whether it's Valium or some other benzo....just asking if this rate sounds ok knowing that I'm at the latter end of the taper.

 

If so, should I take part of the dose in pill form and part in liquid?  I need help on specifics and the logistics of how to do this.  How much do I cut daily?  I'm completely new at the daily liquid thing as I've been only dry cutting up till now, so really would appreciate some input from those with experience.  I'm intimidated by all the detail and minutiae involved.

 

Personally, I wouldn't start with 10% every 2 weeks. I would start with 10%/month and if that feels OK, try a little more the next month and a little more the next month. You might be one of the lucky ones who can taper faster, but if you're not, you don't want to find out the hard way.

 

Sorry, I'm so math guru, but what I would do is figure 10% of your total and then divide that by 30. Make that cut every day. At the end of the month, figure out what your new total is and take 10% of that and do the next month. If you're feeling really good, you could try taking 12% of your new total for the next month. And so on.

 

As for me, I take half my dose in capsule form and half in liquid form.

 

If you need math help, a math guru should come along. Or you could ask on the titration forum. They hang out there, too.

 

Good luck!

 

Gard

 

P.S. Remember, my brain is mashed potatoes, so if somebody comes on and corrects my method, go with them!

[[jr...]]

jr50898

I see you did a really slow micro taper from your sig.  How was it going down?  Did you ever have to hold and how was it when you finished?

Thanks

 

It is a lot easier tapering  in my opinion. At least if you have sxs  you can updose when tapering. I am 5 months out and have good days and bad. But it is better being off instead of being dependant on a pill.

[[ka...]]

Oooh when I switch over to LMT yall are going to either have the best time laughing at my stupid questions or throttle me. Or both lol

 

Nobody gets throttled on this thread or I would've been dead long ago! 

Oh Kitty you are too funny and cute!! 

Hey ya gard!! how is my dear friend doing these days??? Thanks for taking care of everyone so nicely!

 

Hi Kasey. Good to see you! My doctor made me taper faster so I'm now pushing the edges of tolerable. I think if I tell her I want to slow down, she will let me. We'll see. I wouldn't mind getting lower on this junk sooner. I feel like my brain is turning into mashed potatoes! This taper is taking way too long. How are you these days? Good, I hope.

 

Gard

Thanks for asking!! I am plugging along with my MT off 2 medications. They interact with each other and must be tapered together. It makes things a bit difficult, complicating the taper and much slower to get to my 0 mark. But all in all I am managing to continue to decrease. I take it one day at a time and no long set goals in my taper as i find it overwhelming & very disappointing when I am unable to meet that goal. I keep my eyes on the overall goal of no more benzo's and healing.  Have a blessed weekend dear!

[[ga...]]

Oooh when I switch over to LMT yall are going to either have the best time laughing at my stupid questions or throttle me. Or both lol

 

Nobody gets throttled on this thread or I would've been dead long ago! 

Oh Kitty you are too funny and cute!! 

Hey ya gard!! how is my dear friend doing these days??? Thanks for taking care of everyone so nicely!

 

Hi Kasey. Good to see you! My doctor made me taper faster so I'm now pushing the edges of tolerable. I think if I tell her I want to slow down, she will let me. We'll see. I wouldn't mind getting lower on this junk sooner. I feel like my brain is turning into mashed potatoes! This taper is taking way too long. How are you these days? Good, I hope.

 

Gard

Thanks for asking!! I am plugging along with my MT off 2 medications. They interact with each other and must be tapered together. It makes things a bit difficult, complicating the taper and much slower to get to my 0 mark. But all in all I am managing to continue to decrease. I take it one day at a time and no long set goals in my taper as i find it overwhelming & very disappointing when I am unable to meet that goal. I keep my eyes on the overall goal of no more benzo's and healing.  Have a blessed weekend dear!

 

That is a very sensible approach, Kasey. Tapering 2 meds must be very difficult. I think I read of one other person who did that and she got completely off. You will do it, too!

 

Gard

[[ka...]]

Awe - thanks for encouraging me!!! We will make it together

[[po...]]

I was hoping to not post on here until I had been into my daily micro taper and have good news.  BUT I'm still holding from my updose.  Day 12 still not feeling well enough to start.

I'm SO confused.  I thought daily micro tapering meant tapering a tiny amount everyday and it "should" go smooth.  But i keep reading that people can't even lower .02 one time without feeling a big hit.  Is the key to micro tapering to start off feeling great or should I just start going back down?  So I guess I'm terrified to even start my daily micro taper.  What has been some of your experiences?  Im so lost.

[[ga...]]

I was hoping to not post on here until I had been into my daily micro taper and have good news.  BUT I'm still holding from my updose.  Day 12 still not feeling well enough to start.

I'm SO confused.  I thought daily micro tapering meant tapering a tiny amount everyday and it "should" go smooth.  But i keep reading that people can't even lower .02 one time without feeling a big hit.  Is the key to micro tapering to start off feeling great or should I just start going back down?  So I guess I'm terrified to even start my daily micro taper.  What has been some of your experiences?  Im so lost.

 

I'm very sorry you're in a bad place. My experience was I tapered too fast and crashed. I did not hold but impatiently switched to daily micro taper. I felt awful all the time. I did not know about holding. I crossed over to Librium, which helped some. Then my doctor suggested I hold. So I did. I held for nearly a year.

 

I would not say it is a long hold until you've held 4 months or more. Ask on Long Hold how long it took people to notice improvement. I think you will hear people were in waves for months and then had slow improvement until they were stable enough to taper.

 

At some point, each person decides their symptoms are tolerable enough that they can taper again. That's what I did. I had enough of my functioning back and had improved my coping skills so I started my taper again. It's rocky. I miss the stability of my hold. But I cannot hold forever and get off of these drugs.

 

This I know now, if I hit a really bad patch again, I will not keep pushing forward, I will hold again.

 

Gard

[[Ki...]]

Remember too a lot of folks took high doses for a long time and a lot took small doses for a short time. Anyone who has " kindled" too might have bigger problems. So while microtapering in theory gives your brain time to adjust to tiny cuts, it does not mean daily cuts are right for everyone. Its just an average. I can only take .001 off my scale every 3 days. I tried briefly cutting every day and even that tiny amount threw me for a loop. And even with these tiny cuts I still have to do holds in there. But I took benzos for 16 years and crashed a few years ago, went into a bad wd from tapering too fast. I had no idea that could happen. Now I know, thanks to this forum, and Im listening to what I need to hear, which is go slow and make a lot of stops along the way. That seems to be the best way.

[[ga...]]

Are there any daily micro taper spreadsheet template links available on the site anywhere that anyone knows of?  Would like to avoid reinventing the wheel, if possible.

Can anyone chime in here?  Would really appreciate some guidance on liquid micro tapering.  Doesn't this thread support both dry cut and liquid micro tapers?  I can't find a thread limited to liquid micro taper, only.  Thanks!!

[[ga...]]

Are there any daily micro taper spreadsheet template links available on the site anywhere that anyone knows of?  Would like to avoid reinventing the wheel, if possible.

Can anyone chime in here?  Would really appreciate some guidance on liquid micro tapering.  Doesn't this thread support both dry cut and liquid micro tapers?  I can't find a thread limited to liquid micro taper, only.  Thanks!!

 

Hi. I'm sorry to tell you that this thread is not very active since Sharkey and SG left and Anne moved over to Long Hold. You might try the titration forum. I'm sure there are MT people on there.

 

I don't use a spreadsheet. I just figure out what 10% of my dose is and divide that by 30 to figure my daily cut. I do that same cut every day for one month. At the end of the month I refigure from my new total dose. Same thing, 10% of total and then divide it by 30 and then make that cut every day. And so on, month after month. I think it is typical for people to adjust their cuts once/month.

 

If your symptoms get bad and you think you are going too fast, you can either make smaller cuts or make them less often, such as every other day. It's really important to listen to your body as you do this rather than stick rigidly to a spreadsheet. I did not listen when my body said "too fast!" and that's how I ended up over on the Long Hold thread.

 

I hope that was helpful.

 

Gard

[[bu...]]

Are there any daily micro taper spreadsheet template links available on the site anywhere that anyone knows of?  Would like to avoid reinventing the wheel, if possible.

Can anyone chime in here?  Would really appreciate some guidance on liquid micro tapering.  Doesn't this thread support both dry cut and liquid micro tapers?  I can't find a thread limited to liquid micro taper, only.  Thanks!!

 

Since tapers are unique to individuals, you really need to create your own personal "spreadsheet"  Its really pretty simple.

 

1)  Choose a taper rate and time frame...

ex 5% per 10 days

 

2)  Multiply taper rate to current dose...

ex 5% X 5mg= .25mg

 

3) Divide the total cut by the days...

ex  .25mg/10 days= .025mg per day.

 

4) Make a schedule ("spreadsheet") based on the  daily cut...

 

ex  5mg, 4.975mg, 4.95mg, 4.925mg, 4.900mg, etc.

 

 

 

[[ga...]]

Are there any daily micro taper spreadsheet template links available on the site anywhere that anyone knows of?  Would like to avoid reinventing the wheel, if possible.

Can anyone chime in here?  Would really appreciate some guidance on liquid micro tapering.  Doesn't this thread support both dry cut and liquid micro tapers?  I can't find a thread limited to liquid micro taper, only.  Thanks!!

 

Since tapers are unique to individuals, you really need to create your own personal "spreadsheet"  Its really pretty simple.

 

1)  Choose a taper rate and time frame...

ex 5% per 10 days

 

2)  Multiply taper rate to current dose...

ex 5% X 5mg= .25mg

 

3) Divide the total cut by the days...

ex  .25mg/10 days= .025mg per day.

 

4) Make a schedule ("spreadsheet") based on the  daily cut...

 

ex  5mg, 4.975mg, 4.95mg, 4.925mg, 4.900mg, etc.

 

There's our math man!