XANAX Support Blog: If you're tapering Xanax/alprazolam, join in the discussion!

[[mr...]]

I need advice with my xanax titration plan. I am doing it wrong and need feedback. Please...someone PM me...

 

Jeremy

 

Hi, there.  Please ask for tapering/titration help on the open forum.  Our pm system if for chat and moral support only!  When one wants this sort of advice it is best to get as many opinions as possible.

 

Megan

 

 

Ok, well I hope  someone can help.

 

I have no idea how much I've titrated. Here is what I've done

 

Have been titrating 3mg of my total 4mg dose (leaving the 1mg evening dose alone for now).

 

I thought I was at 2.90 mg total (or had titrated the morning/afternoong dose to 1.90). I clearly am not since I tried taking 3 1mg tablets and had withdrawal (actually felt awful even after taking 1mg pill in the AM)

 

I'm doing something wrong. Here's what I do: use 100ml cylinder. Crush 3 1mg tablets and mix them in a plastic container. Then I mix it with a spoon really good and remove whatever I've reduced for two doses and discard the rest.

 

My understanding is that using a 100ml cylinder and titrating 3mg, 1ml = .03mg.  I am drinking 63ml...again this should be below 2mg.......no idea what i'm doing wrong.

 

I asked if I should use milk. Was told no. Asked about water. Similar answer. Also unsure about the containers. They are plastic but they don't leak. So here I am.

 

Can someone please help? I'm desperate. I can't continue but I'm going to assume I've only reduced the morning/afternoon total dose to 2.15mg.......

 

If anyone can help me work in a spreadsheet too, I would be thankful.

 

Again, really desperate for help.

 

Hi Orpheus,

 

I will mention that I am not in a position to mentor at this time, but will answer a few questions for you as best I can.  I am a fellow titrater, so I will let you know of my experiences.

 

From what I can tell, you aren't doing anything "wrong".  Sometimes, when buddies try to updose, it no longer has a very helpful effect.  This can happen and is nothing to be alarmed by; it just means that you've reached tolerance and that your CNS is very sensitive from benzodiazepine use.  Imagine it as if taking a benzodiazepine was like you going outside and climbing up a flag pole.  And pretend that instead of growing stronger each time you did it, you grew a little weaker/wearier of the climb.  Over time, eventually you would not be able to make it up the flag pole anymore -- not all at once most likely, but gradually you would only make it up 3/4ths, and then only 1/2, then up 1/4th, etc...you get the idea.  I believe that benzodiazepine usage is similar in losing its efficacy over time like this.  I hope that makes sense. 

 

Also, switching from dissolved dosing to dry dosing, or vice versa, can absolutely have an impact on symptoms.  It almost acts like a "cut" for many -- I know it certainly did/does for me! I believe this is because your body may metabolize your dose differently when it is dissolved in water vs. a dry tablet.  So to compare how you felt at 1.89mg (63mL of 100mL drank) mixed in water, vs 3mg of dry-dosing is a little hard to do, IMO.

 

Also, depending on how quickly you tapered down from 100mL to 63mL could also have an impact on how you feel.  For instance, if you've been removing 1mL per day for the last 37 days without any breaks, this could be considered a rapidly paced taper for someone who is sensitive to their benzo (which it sounds like you might be).  This would be a 37% cut from your original dose, and it could be catching up to you. Benzodiazepine tapers should be symptom-driven, and based on the person's individual needs and comfort level, and not on a date on the calendar.  So unless your doctor has put a time limit on you (i.e. you'll run out of scrips for the drug), it may be in your best interest to take it easy and hold on cutting your dosage any further until you've regained some stability.  What I mean by "stability" does not mean feeling good and normal again; I mean "stability" as feeling consistent in symptoms, or establishing a "baseline" of symptoms. 

 

All this being said, if you've established that you've, in fact, moved a little too quickly to begin with here, it may be a little late to completely "undo" the ouchie by simply updosing (which seems to be somewhat true based on how you're reacting to updosing to 3mg).  This does not mean that you will always feel this ouchie, LOL, so don't get worried about that   It just means that time will need to pass and healing to take place a little bit to undo some of the ouch   This is completely normal, as I am just coming out of a "mega ouchy" couple of cuts in November and December that I shouldn't have done   Happens to the best of us!

 

That is all I'll be able to offer in the way of advice for now, friend.  Again, please understand that I am not in a position to mentor anyone for a taper schedule currently.  You are smart and capable, and can research, read, and study how you should handle your taper with no troubles   Just trust your instinct on what is right for you, and you will be fine   On my personal blog, I've detailed my own water titration and you're welcome to read through that information if it can be of help to you; it is found here: http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=79163.msg1049215#msg1049215

 

Hope this helps you, Orph.  You're doing fine, IMO -- tapering Xanax can be a toughie, is all!  Keep on keepin' on

 

Mrs.

[[ba...]]

From what I can tell, you aren't doing anything "wrong".  Sometimes, when buddies try to updose, it no longer has a very helpful effect.  This can happen and is nothing to be alarmed by; it just means that you've reached tolerance and that your CNS is very sensitive from benzodiazepine use.  Imagine it as if taking a benzodiazepine was like you going outside and climbing up a flag pole.  And pretend that instead of growing stronger each time you did it, you grew a little weaker/wearier of the climb.  Over time, eventually you would not be able to make it up the flag pole anymore -- not all at once most likely, but gradually you would only make it up 3/4ths, and then only 1/2, then up 1/4th, etc...you get the idea.  I believe that benzodiazepine usage is similar in losing its efficacy over time like this.  I hope that makes sense

. 

 

Makes sense to me mrsalw!  Good job!

[[mr...]]

Well, its quiet here on Walton's mountain today.

 

 

Hope y'all are doing well! Enjoy your weekend

 

Mrs. 

[[Ra...]]

Hi Mrs, I'm here, how are you feeling today?

 

Hugs,

 

Rabbit

[[mr...]]

Hi Mrs, I'm here, how are you feeling today?

 

Hugs,

 

Rabbit

 

A window of a morning thus far, hooray!

 

Just chillaxing now. How's you?

[[Ra...]]

Hi Mrs, I'm doing really good other than anticipating the start of my taper.  I finally made the doc appt for 3/7 where we will discuss the pill dosages I will need.  Probably 1mg and also .25mg pills.  I currently take the 2mg bars which will be next to impossible to taper from as I want to dry cut to start with. 

 

My plan is to reduce by .0625mg every 2 weeks like Juliea did.  I just hope I'm able to keep that pace.  It will take 2 years.  But my doc and I agreed my goal is to stay work functional, so the plan is flexible.  Not looking forward to starting this beast, but I may be surprised.  A couple of members have said that my Seroquel may help cover up some of the w/d symptoms.  Not ideal, I know, but I'm stuck with Seroquel for now and I can't imagine tapering Xanax and Seroquel at the same time.

 

I'm so glad to hear you are in a WINDOW!!!  YAY!!!!

 

Hugs,

 

Rabbit

[[Ra...]]

Where is everyone 

[[VC...]]

Where is everyone 

 

Hi Rabbit, I was wondering the same thing! Maybe everyone's out in the sunshine today. It was gorgeous here.

 

I think it's great that you've got plans in place to start your taper soon. Hope I can join you in March. Sounds like your doctor is onboard with you, realizing the importance of keeping functional throughout your taper so you can work, etc. Nice to have a doctor who understands this. As long as you go at your own body's pace, not having to hurry anything, you'll do fine, Rabbit. Btw, I heard the same thing about Seroquel - that it's helped others through their w/d SX's. Since you're already taking it, it'll help you sleep. I made the mistake of tapering both medications the same time last year, didn't know any better, didn't think the tiny doses mattered that much. Wish I'd been smart like you and prepared myself better. Remember, you don't have to stick by any calendar date for tapering...our bodies are the boss of tapering!...hehe... I'm excited for you and wish you well!

 

Keep us posted on your start date and progress, my friend. 

Hugs,

VC

[[Ra...]]

Thank you V for being such a compassionate friend.  I'm not sure what's happened to everyone on this thread, but it's pretty lonely here today.

[[or...]]

I'm doing liquid titration and it's not accurate. I was told it doesn't bind to lipids the same way K and V do.

 

This probably explains water water titration of xanax is simply not accurate. There's no accurate way to get an even suspension. I'm still hoping for feedback...this website is a lot slower than it was a year ago when I first inquired about benzo tapering.

[[Ju...]]

I'm doing liquid titration and it's not accurate. I was told it doesn't bind to lipids the same way K and V do.

 

This probably explains water water titration of xanax is simply not accurate. There's no accurate way to get an even suspension. I'm still hoping for feedback...this website is a lot slower than it was a year ago when I first inquired about benzo tapering.

MrsALW, is having great success water titrating Xanax and so did HopefulGirl and Carita.  It can be done, Orpheus.  Otherwise, we'd have no buddies who have had success with the method.  Hopefully MrsALW will pop in and give you some pointers.

[[mr...]]

Orph, I assume you missed my response to you on the previous page. It is reposted below, for your convenience.

 

Also to note, I too was told that a water titration was impossible with Xanax. It is correct that it does not "dissolve" in water. But it does create a nice suspension, if mixed well I give suggestions below (in the link to my blog) on how to work around the imperfections of water titration. Another option is to purchase one of those protein drink cups that have the battery operated stirrer in the bottom, and just leave it mixing while withdraw along your dose.

 

Something I realized along the way, after hearing many different opinions and advice in tapering: there is no "perfect" taper plan, as they all have pros and cons, faults and freedoms. AND -- they ALL work, IF you work them Its just a matter of deciding for YOU which one will work best, and which one you're most comfortable with For me, that was water titration. For Juliea, it was dry-cutting. Just in case you're concerned about whether or not water titration works, I am now 14 months into tapering and 78% free of my original dose, and my two buddies Carita and Hopefulgirl both are successfully Xanax free using water titration Pick for you what you feel is best for you

 

Hope this helps you, friend You're gonna do awesome!

 

Mrs.

 

I need advice with my xanax titration plan. I am doing it wrong and need feedback. Please...someone PM me...

 

Jeremy

 

Hi, there.  Please ask for tapering/titration help on the open forum.  Our pm system if for chat and moral support only!  When one wants this sort of advice it is best to get as many opinions as possible.

 

Megan

 

 

Ok, well I hope  someone can help.

 

I have no idea how much I've titrated. Here is what I've done

 

Have been titrating 3mg of my total 4mg dose (leaving the 1mg evening dose alone for now).

 

I thought I was at 2.90 mg total (or had titrated the morning/afternoong dose to 1.90). I clearly am not since I tried taking 3 1mg tablets and had withdrawal (actually felt awful even after taking 1mg pill in the AM)

 

I'm doing something wrong. Here's what I do: use 100ml cylinder. Crush 3 1mg tablets and mix them in a plastic container. Then I mix it with a spoon really good and remove whatever I've reduced for two doses and discard the rest.

 

My understanding is that using a 100ml cylinder and titrating 3mg, 1ml = .03mg.  I am drinking 63ml...again this should be below 2mg.......no idea what i'm doing wrong.

 

I asked if I should use milk. Was told no. Asked about water. Similar answer. Also unsure about the containers. They are plastic but they don't leak. So here I am.

 

Can someone please help? I'm desperate. I can't continue but I'm going to assume I've only reduced the morning/afternoon total dose to 2.15mg.......

 

If anyone can help me work in a spreadsheet too, I would be thankful.

 

Again, really desperate for help.

 

Hi Orpheus,

 

I will mention that I am not in a position to mentor at this time, but will answer a few questions for you as best I can.  I am a fellow titrater, so I will let you know of my experiences.

 

From what I can tell, you aren't doing anything "wrong".  Sometimes, when buddies try to updose, it no longer has a very helpful effect.  This can happen and is nothing to be alarmed by; it just means that you've reached tolerance and that your CNS is very sensitive from benzodiazepine use.  Imagine it as if taking a benzodiazepine was like you going outside and climbing up a flag pole.  And pretend that instead of growing stronger each time you did it, you grew a little weaker/wearier of the climb.  Over time, eventually you would not be able to make it up the flag pole anymore -- not all at once most likely, but gradually you would only make it up 3/4ths, and then only 1/2, then up 1/4th, etc...you get the idea.  I believe that benzodiazepine usage is similar in losing its efficacy over time like this.  I hope that makes sense. 

 

Also, switching from dissolved dosing to dry dosing, or vice versa, can absolutely have an impact on symptoms.  It almost acts like a "cut" for many -- I know it certainly did/does for me! I believe this is because your body may metabolize your dose differently when it is dissolved in water vs. a dry tablet.  So to compare how you felt at 1.89mg (63mL of 100mL drank) mixed in water, vs 3mg of dry-dosing is a little hard to do, IMO.

 

Also, depending on how quickly you tapered down from 100mL to 63mL could also have an impact on how you feel.  For instance, if you've been removing 1mL per day for the last 37 days without any breaks, this could be considered a rapidly paced taper for someone who is sensitive to their benzo (which it sounds like you might be).  This would be a 37% cut from your original dose, and it could be catching up to you. Benzodiazepine tapers should be symptom-driven, and based on the person's individual needs and comfort level, and not on a date on the calendar.  So unless your doctor has put a time limit on you (i.e. you'll run out of scrips for the drug), it may be in your best interest to take it easy and hold on cutting your dosage any further until you've regained some stability.  What I mean by "stability" does not mean feeling good and normal again; I mean "stability" as feeling consistent in symptoms, or establishing a "baseline" of symptoms. 

 

All this being said, if you've established that you've, in fact, moved a little too quickly to begin with here, it may be a little late to completely "undo" the ouchie by simply updosing (which seems to be somewhat true based on how you're reacting to updosing to 3mg).  This does not mean that you will always feel this ouchie, LOL, so don't get worried about that   It just means that time will need to pass and healing to take place a little bit to undo some of the ouch   This is completely normal, as I am just coming out of a "mega ouchy" couple of cuts in November and December that I shouldn't have done   Happens to the best of us!

 

That is all I'll be able to offer in the way of advice for now, friend.  Again, please understand that I am not in a position to mentor anyone for a taper schedule currently.  You are smart and capable, and can research, read, and study how you should handle your taper with no troubles   Just trust your instinct on what is right for you, and you will be fine   On my personal blog, I've detailed my own water titration and you're welcome to read through that information if it can be of help to you; it is found here: http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=79163.msg1049215#msg1049215

 

Hope this helps you, Orph.  You're doing fine, IMO -- tapering Xanax can be a toughie, is all!  Keep on keepin' on

 

Mrs.

[[or...]]

THanks. Yes, I did miss this post. Thanks for the thoughtful reply.

 

I actually titrated from 4mg and am leaving the evening 1mg dose alone.

 

So it's actually comparing 1.80mg to 2mg, rather than 3mg.

 

I've started shaking my batches and letting the pills disintegrate in water instead of crushing. I don't know if this will make a difference.

 

I taper conservatively, actually 3ml per week, or on paper .09mg of the dose I'm reducing.

 

I'm going to try again next week with just the 2 1mg pills in the AM/midday and see how I feel. Trial and error is frustrating. I have to hunker down and just wait...

 

Thanks for the tip about the protein cups . May tryi it

[[mi...]]

How often are you dosing your Xanax it in a day to feel an even ride.. please?

[[Ca...]]

Mike...I dosed four times a day: 6 AM, noon, 6 PM and midnight. I have been off for 8 months. This worked well for me.

Good luck. Warmly,

Carita

[[ho...]]

Hi All,

 

You all have been on my heart and mind everyday lately. I have been away for a few weeks. Nothing I planned and certainly at times something I felt guilty about...I tried to figure out why I had some resistance to coming on and helping and being helped but couldn't quite place it. I think now that I am through my Xanax taper (I'm just 5.5 months off today) I just needed a break from thinking about benzos. For one, I ran out of money and have been going full throttle ahead on launching my business. I hired 6 new part time employees and took a huge leap of faith and rented a new office-it has two suites and a great waiting room for my clients. Anyway, it has been hard. I wish I could say I was healed but today is a pretty bad day. I'm in bed on an ice pack after going to the chiropractor because I can hardly walk due to some debilitating back pain. However, I can say I am healing. I do get some partially opened windows and I have days now when I truly believe I will make a full recovery. Man, is this a rough and long journey! I am still shocked by it at times. It still scares the you know what out of me and I am done with the taper! However, so much is improved. This is the worst I've been in a while so I do feel afraid today but believe it will pass like all the other awful symptoms. I think I'm rambling...sorry about that. Just want to encourage everyone to keep going-it is worth it! I have one more drug to taper and I am planning on starting a month from today! I'll be around much more I'm sure as I begin the difficult and long process for the second time. Anyway, lots of hugs and love to everyone!

Warmly,

Hopeful Girl 

[[Ra...]]

Hi Hopeful, it sounds as though your time away has been very productive.  My hubby keeps telling me I need to take a break from BB as it keeps the benzo thing fresh on my brain.  Yes it does, but I feel I'm learning and helping where I can.

 

I'm SO sorry to hear you're feeling poorly this far out from your jump, but from what I've read, what you describe is pretty common.  Certainly NOT fun, but not unusual.  You have a great 'can do' attitude.  Especially mentioning another taper after how you've felt recently.  That takes great courage.  Good for you!  I will be praying for you 

[[ho...]]

Hi Hopeful, it sounds as though your time away has been very productive.  My hubby keeps telling me I need to take a break from BB as it keeps the benzo thing fresh on my brain.  Yes it does, but I feel I'm learning and helping where I can.

 

I'm SO sorry to hear you're feeling poorly this far out from your jump, but from what I've read, what you describe is pretty common.  Certainly NOT fun, but not unusual.  You have a great 'can do' attitude.  Especially mentioning another taper after how you've felt recently.  That takes great courage.  Good for you!  I will be praying for you 

 

Thanks, Rabbit. I sure appreciate the kind words and the prayers. I can sure use them. I pray for all going through this everyday. Yes, I believe that what I am experiencing is common. I wish it weren't and it is hard to believe after all of this, it is still so bad, but it is what it is! We will persevere!

 

Love,

Hopeful Girl

[[mi...]]

thanks Carita, so every 6 hours.. so only 6 hours of sleep and you had to wake up?

[[Ca...]]

thanks Carita, so every 6 hours.. so only 6 hours of sleep and you had to wake up?

 

A 6 hour block of sleep was rare for me so that dosing schedule worked well.  I kept my titrated dose by my bedside so all I had to do was open the little jar and swig it, rinse it with a little clean water and lay back down!

Carita

[[Ka...]]

Hi mikeoaks,

 

I was also sent into abrupt withdrawal due to antibiotics.  Was going through life just fine, but woke up one day with profuse sweating, after taking an antibiotic.  Was on Xanax perhaps 2 years and took it as needed (not good, as I have now found out).  At least you know it is Xanax that is affecting you and can do a slow taper.  Are you having major problems by taking it 3 times daily? What are your symptoms?

 

I dose 5 times daily.  Was dosing 6 times until two weeks ago, but sleep returned, and am now dosing 5 times (6am, 10am, 2 pm, 6pm and 10 pm).  Have you researched into liquid titration as one of your taper option?

 

Kantu   

 

[[VC...]]

Question for your water-titraters. Another site I've visited thinks the LT method discussed here is not accurate, that even the graduated cylinders aren't accurate. They seem to endorse a type of liquid taper where you mix your daily dosage and just pull out with a syringe exactly what you need, instead of throwing out solution. I'm thoroughly confused but not ready to taper yet anyway. My nervous system has calmed since holding to 3 regular doses for weeks now. I hope it continues because frankly I don't want to keep adding doses around the clock when I wasn't taking that much to begin with.

 

[[Gl...]]

Hi everyone, I would like to pop my head in a say Hi. I have been a heavy xanax user for over 6 years, when i first started taking xanax i was taking up 4mg daily and now I'm taking 3mgs about 3-4 tomes a week, usage has cut back a little due to my New AD helping and also being on 2 mg of klonopin daily. Recently xanax has gone up to a schedule 8 in Australia and they are trying to wipe it completely in Australia. My Dr wants me off the xanax and wants me to transition over to a higher dose of klonopin so that i ay not touch xanax! I have severe Panic disorder and GAD 24hours a day it is very deliberating  So I'm just wondering if anyone here has been transitioned to klonopin from heavy xanax usage? Has it worked? has it helped you stop taking xanax? Does anyone here suffer from Severe panic disorder and GAD? Thank you in advance for taking the time to read this and i look forward to being active in this thread.   

[[Ju...]]

It's the same principle used here VC.  The liquid for the day is measured with a large volume syringe rather than the cylinder in the method you are reading about.  By using the syringe rather than the cylinder, one bulky piece of equipment is eliminated.  That's all.  The draw is still tossed with a small volume syringe and the dose is drawn out via a syringe.  Lot's of buddies do that here too.  Whether we use a syringe or cylinder to measure the liquid, the key is to be consistent in our method of titration.  As long as the person is consistent in their method, the accuracy necessary for a taper will be there.

[[Ju...]]

Hi everyone, I would like to pop my head in a say Hi. I have been a heavy xanax user for over 6 years, when i first started taking xanax i was taking up 4mg daily and now I'm taking 3mgs about 3-4 tomes a week, usage has cut back a little due to my New AD helping and also being on 2 mg of klonopin daily. Recently xanax has gone up to a schedule 8 in Australia and they are trying to wipe it completely in Australia. My Dr wants me off the xanax and wants me to transition over to a higher dose of klonopin so that i ay not touch xanax! I have severe Panic disorder and GAD 24hours a day it is very deliberating  So I'm just wondering if anyone here has been transitioned to klonopin from heavy xanax usage? Has it worked? has it helped you stop taking xanax? Does anyone here suffer from Severe panic disorder and GAD? Thank you in advance for taking the time to read this and i look forward to being active in this thread. 

Yes, we have one member who formerly posted on this thread who transitioned to Klonopin.  She is holding her taper now, while she gets stable on the Klonopin.  She had a difficult time with the crossover, but her situation is totally different than yours.  She had never taken Klonopin and you are currently taking Klonopin, so since you're already taking Klonopin, the process may be easier for you.

 

The people on this thread decided to taper Xanax without a crossover to another benzo.  If I were in your shoes, especially given that Xanax is going to be more difficult to obtain, I would consider replacing my Xanax with Klonopin in a step-wise fashion.

 

1mg of Xanax equals 1mg of Klonopin according to the Ashton Manual.

 

If I were in your shoes, I would very slowly reduce my Xanax and replace it with Klonopin, without reducing my equivalent dose during the crossover.

 

I'd do this in .5mg chunks.  So, I'd replace .5mg of Xanax with .5mg of Klonopin and hold that substitution for 10 to 14 days.  Then I'd replace another .5mg of Xanax with Klonopin and hold that substitution for 10 to 14 days and so forth and so forth until I was on all Klonopin at an equivalent dose.  As you get lower in Mgs, you may find that it will be easier to replace .25mg of Xanax with .25mg of Klonopin, rather than .50mg.  This would be something I would play by ear.

 

I've got to leave for a while, but I will return.  If you have additional questions, feel free to post.

 

Edit:  You can also taper your Xanax, while holding your Klonopin dose, but if there was a possibility that my doctor might cut me off of Xanax, I'd wish to go ahead and bite the bullet and fully crossover to Klonopin.