advice about dose drop! please help!

[[ch...]]

switched my taper plan from .5 mg valium every three weeks to one mg ever week. I am in day 5 of first one mg drop and feel like hell. Do I just go ahead on day 7 or 8 and drop the next mg regardless of how I feel? Please reply. I don't know what to do. When I was doing the longer waits I was still sick but somewhat stablized. I have never dropped a dose in the middle of feeling really sick but that's the point of a faster withdrawal sysytem right? My situation is complicated by opiate use due to spine surgery -- since they work synergistically I am essentially withdrwaing from both. HELP! I feel worse than ever..... I HATE THIS>

[[Pa...]]

You may need to change your plan Chrys.  You made this decision based on how you were reacting to your cuts in the past, it sounds like this isn't going to work out as you planned.  I don't know much about tapering since I didn't do it, but it seems like you may need to hold for a little while.  Then, when you're somewhat stabilized, try it again, perhaps you could cut .5, but not hold three weeks next time, what do you think?  Remember, the purpose of a taper is to hopefully remain functional , and it doesn't sound like you are.

[[ch...]]

You may need to change your plan Chrys.  You made this decision based on how you were reacting to your cuts in the past, it sounds like this isn't going to work out as you planned.  I don't know much about tapering since I didn't do it, but it seems like you may need to hold for a little while.  Then, when you're somewhat stabilized, try it again, perhaps you could cut .5, but not hold three weeks next time, what do you think?  Remember, the purpose of a taper is to hopefully remain functional , and it doesn't sound like you are.

  thank you for remembering my story.... I feel pretty alone with it sometimes. The reason I switched from the three week taper is because I felt like shit all the time anyway and I just want to get it over with. I was not that functional, really. My plan this time was to go for it in 4 weeks, realize I would be sick and not that functional and just accept that. So given that: do people who do a much faster process just drop their dose every 7 days regardless? I cannot go c/t but I NEED TO HAVE AN END! is there a drawback ==other than feeling like shit ==to just continue to drop? Basically I was going with about an 8 day cycle because I thought that was when the last of it left the body.  ALSO-- the interaction of the opana and valium makes me sick too so I am damned if I do and damned if I don't... I don't seem to get many replies to my postings here -- I had hoped for more interactions when I joined so Pamster I appreciate so much you stopping by to help me. Thanks!! I don't want to ultimately fail but I do want to just continue with the every week or so drop... I am just concerned if it may backfire and i need information about that

[[Pa...]]

I can tell you're miserable, and don't know what to do, there are no good options because they all suck.  You ask if people who do a rapid taper, drop their dose every 7 days regardless?  I've not seen many do a taper that fast, at least not when they have a choice, they only do that if they're running short of pills.  You can continue at this pace, but there will be consequences for it, the majority of your healing will have to be done after you're off of the drug.  At least when you taper slowly, you can somewhat control the symptoms, once off, you're at their mercy.

 

I'm sorry I can't be of more help, I know you're in pain. 

[[ch...]]

I can tell you're miserable, and don't know what to do, there are no good options because they all suck.  You ask if people who do a rapid taper, drop their dose every 7 days regardless?  I've not seen many do a taper that fast, at least not when they have a choice, they only do that if they're running short of pills.  You can continue at this pace, but there will be consequences for it, the majority of your healing will have to be done after you're off of the drug.  At least when you taper slowly, you can somewhat control the symptoms, once off, you're at their mercy.

 

I'm sorry I can't be of more help, I know you're in pain. 

This IS helpful because it is TRUTHFUL-- there are no easy answers and the reason why every way I try sucks is because as you said ALL options suck. OK I need to reevaluate. Could you please tell me what is a fairly reasonable taper for 4 mg of valium? the ashton manual seems to say 1 mg every 2 weeks towards the end. Would you say .5 mg every week would be considered reasonable? But again, I seem to be pretty sick that way too. ughhhhhhhh. That is why we eventually settled on .5 every 3 weeks which was uncomfortable... Then I did the math-- I would be sick for the next 5 months. Are you saying you either pay now or pay later? that all in all it still takes teh same amount of time??

[[Pa...]]

I'm glad you're thinking of reevaluating.  I've watched people for years, rush to be off of the drug, thinking that was the way to get better, it's not.  If you're having this much trouble while still on it, you can bet you'll have this much and more once off of it.  Typically the lower people get, the worse they feel and once off, it's more of the same.  There are very few who feel better as they get lower, but those are the ones who I know won't have many problems once off. 

 

It's not pay now or pay later, it's pay now and pay later, so trying to speed this process up and do it in less than 5 months means you'll suffer more now, and when you're done with the drug, you'll continue to suffer.  Your circumstances are different, you're dealing with more than just benzo's, so instead of trying to speed things up, you should be trying to accommodate your situation and make the right choices.  You gave this a shot and it's not working out like you hoped, so perhaps you should go back to what was working, it was bad, but not this bad. 

 

 

 

 

[[ch...]]

I'm glad you're thinking of reevaluating.  I've watched people for years, rush to be off of the drug, thinking that was the way to get better, it's not.  If you're having this much trouble while still on it, you can bet you'll have this much and more once off of it.  Typically the lower people get, the worse they feel and once off, it's more of the same.  There are very few who feel better as they get lower, but those are the ones who I know won't have many problems once off. 

 

It's not pay now or pay later, it's pay now and pay later, so trying to speed this process up and do it in less than 5 months means you'll suffer more now, and when you're done with the drug, you'll continue to suffer.  Your circumstances are different, you're dealing with more than just benzo's, so instead of trying to speed things up, you should be trying to accommodate your situation and make the right choices.  You gave this a shot and it's not working out like you hoped, so perhaps you should go back to what was working, it was bad, but not this bad. 

 

 

 

 

I am going to think about it a lot. You words mean a lot and I HEAR you. I am going to mull it over and see how the next three days go. Will you help guide and support me? I can't do it alone anymore. I have a great supportive psychiatric nurse practitioner who is flexible and understanding BUT she has never had to go THROUGH it. I just cannot believe this small of a dose makes such a difference

[[Pa...]]

I'll be here, and waiting to hear how the next few days treat you.  Who knows, this might be the worst, and you'll get better from here and be ready to drop another mg soon, I hope so. 

[[ch...]]

I'll be here, and waiting to hear how the next few days treat you.  Who knows, this might be the worst, and you'll get better from here and be ready to drop another mg soon, I hope so. 

you are an opimistic, hopeful person: at the end of the day I am too. I'll check back with you in a few days and SHRUG, who knows maybe I can do another drop!! Thank you

[[ch...]]

I'll be here, and waiting to hear how the next few days treat you.  Who knows, this might be the worst, and you'll get better from here and be ready to drop another mg soon, I hope so. 

ME again! My worst day was Friday-- simply hellish. Yesterday I did a 3.5 hour cleaning project with my son AND made a simple dinner AND drove my other kid to his friends house and picked him up at 1 AM. SOOOO-- although I am nauseous and tired and still not sleeping great, I think I am going to go for it! It is 7 days... I have been slowly tapering for a lonnnnng time-- maybe 18 months, I can't even remember bc I took breaks... and my gut tells me : go for it. The worst that happens is I hold longer on this one. I am trying to get a few dose reductions under my belt before October 10 when my baby turns 16 and wants to learn to drive-- Then I am going to take a few weeks break to get him started. So, any thoughts? Think I'm crazy? Basically as I read the Ashton approach it is a you MAY want to slow down to 1 mg every 2 weeks towards the end. I am not working. I can clear my schedule. The combination of opiates and benzo are toxic and I think I can do it! But I am going to need support and encouragement. I would love to hear from people who are successfully finishing their taper! To review: Last week I went from 5 mg of Valium to 4 mg of Valium and now I am going to 3 mg tonight.

[[Pa...]]

Hi Chrys,

 

I can see you're doing your best to stick to your plan, and I admire your determination.  You know, if this process wasn't accompanied by so much fear, we would be able to see past the waves of pain, but the fear takes over and we can't see through it.

 

If you'd like to hear from people who have tapered, I'd like to suggest you start a thread in Withdrawal and Recovery Support, you'll probably get more responses that way.

 

 

[[Pa...]]

Hi Chrys,

 

I can't really give you an opinion but just want you to know that I am essentially in the same place you are.  I just want the medication out of my system and am having a hard time slowing my taper.  I'm slowing it down because so many posters have recommended a slow taper when you get to the lower doses.

 

I will watch for your posts to see have you are doing.

 

Best wishes for your taper plan.

 

Pacey

[[ch...]]

Hi Chrys,

 

I can't really give you an opinion but just want you to know that I am essentially in the same place you are.  I just want the medication out of my system and am having a hard time slowing my taper.  I'm slowing it down because so many posters have recommended a slow taper when you get to the lower doses.

 

I will watch for your posts to see have you are doing.

 

Best wishes for your taper plan.

 

Pacey

 

Yes  I realized I kept reevaluating based on what others were saying and for this whole process I have just done it the way I wanted to so I didn't want to back off now. You did a BIG klonopin drop in a short period of time! WOW. How did that go? Man, if you were able to do it that quickly I wouldn't slow down *too* much! best wishes for good health!

[[ch...]]

Hi Chrys,

 

I can see you're doing your best to stick to your plan, and I admire your determination.  You know, if this process wasn't accompanied by so much fear, we would be able to see past the waves of pain, but the fear takes over and we can't see through it.

 

If you'd like to hear from people who have tapered, I'd like to suggest you start a thread in Withdrawal and Recovery Support, you'll probably get more responses that way.

 

 

You always hit the nail on the head! I was all of a sudden indecisive based on some couldn't put my finger on it fear. I am going to do this dose drop and if it doesn't go well-- I'll hold. At the end of the day-- what's the big deal? 

[[Pa...]]

I know what you mean, anyone on the outside looking in would say, simply taper off the drug and be done with it, what's the big deal?  For me, the fear was my greatest symptom, it was part of every waking moment.  I had no idea what I was afraid of, it was simply there, in the pit of my stomach, turning me into someone I didn't know.  You know how I knew I had my first window?  I felt the absence of the fear, as I was walking up my stairs one day, I realized I wasn't afraid, it was wonderful.  It lasted only moments, but it was such a relief. 

 

Do what you need to do, it might be tough, but wondering if you should, the indecisiveness is almost worse than the symptoms you may experience.  You're right, if it's bad, you can hold before you cut again. 

[[Pa...]]

You did a BIG klonopin drop in a short period of time! WOW. How did that go?

 

Chrys,

 

It went ok but I am taking something for sleep and that was why I was put on the K.  Also I listen to my body.  When I was getting groggy during the day I knew it was time to cut and that seemed to work out. 

 

Pam's comment: 

You know, if this process wasn't accompanied by so much fear, we would be able to see past the waves of pain, but the fear takes over and we can't see through it.

 

I agree with Pam. 

 

Am going to cut again tonight so will see how that goes.

 

Thanks for your good wishes.

 

Hope your dose drop goes well.

 

Pacey

[[Pa...]]

I know what you mean, anyone on the outside looking in would say, simply taper off the drug and be done with it, what's the big deal?  For me, the fear was my greatest symptom, it was part of every waking moment.  I had no idea what I was afraid of, it was simply there, in the pit of my stomach, turning me into someone I didn't know.  You know how I knew I had my first window?  I felt the absence of the fear, as I was walking up my stairs one day, I realized I wasn't afraid, it was wonderful.  It lasted only moments, but it was such a relief. 

 

Do what you need to do, it might be tough, but wondering if you should, the indecisiveness is almost worse than the symptoms you may experience.  You're right, if it's bad, you can hold before you cut again.

 

Pam,

 

Your post above helped me also.

 

Thanks very much.

 

Pacey

[[ch...]]

I know what you mean, anyone on the outside looking in would say, simply taper off the drug and be done with it, what's the big deal?  For me, the fear was my greatest symptom, it was part of every waking moment.  I had no idea what I was afraid of, it was simply there, in the pit of my stomach, turning me into someone I didn't know.  You know how I knew I had my first window?  I felt the absence of the fear, as I was walking up my stairs one day, I realized I wasn't afraid, it was wonderful.  It lasted only moments, but it was such a relief.   

 

Do what you need to do, it might be tough, but wondering if you should, the indecisiveness is almost worse than the symptoms you may experience.  You're right, if it's bad, you can hold before you cut again. 

It's funny. My 18 year old has been observing this whole process from surgery to relearning to walk to the residual drug issues and all week he is like you just seem different-- like you look like hell, and you look unhappy, but there is something about it. and now I know: it's the absence to fear and indecision. It sucks, but so what? I am just focused and if it doesn't work, I'll adjust. I AM DONE with the slow taper. At least in my mind! Thank you a lot !You seem to really know exactly what to say! xx

[[ch...]]

You did a BIG klonopin drop in a short period of time! WOW. How did that go?

 

Chrys,

 

It went ok but I am taking something for sleep and that was why I was put on the K.  Also I listen to my body.  When I was getting groggy during the day I knew it was time to cut and that seemed to work out. 

 

Pam's comment: 

You know, if this process wasn't accompanied by so much fear, we would be able to see past the waves of pain, but the fear takes over and we can't see through it.

 

I agree with Pam. 

 

Am going to cut again tonight so will see how that goes.

 

Thanks for your good wishes.

 

Hope your dose drop goes well.

 

Pacey

YOU TOO! let's keep in touch! I am astounded that you went from 5 mg to 1.5 in a few weeks. A S T O U N D E D 

[[Pa...]]

"But so what!"  Those are the perfect words to help give you some perspective, you may feel like crap, but so what, it's not going to kill you.  You may feel worse than you have before, but so what, this is what has to happen for you to get better.  You may have to face some healing once you're done with the drug, but so what, at least you don't have to make any more decisions about your taper.  

 

I'm glad your 18 year old could see something different and I'm glad you got a glimpse of the real you in there, fighting to come back.

[[Pa...]]

let's keep in touch!

 

Chrys,

 

Yes, definitely let's keep in touch.

 

Pacey