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Too big of a taper?


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After my life stabilizes (just had a broken engagement so I'm  just a mess regardless of my w/ds!), I plan to go from .25 mg K in am and .375 K in PM to .25 mg am and pm. Is this too big of a jump? I when I went from .25mg in am and .5 to .375 mg in pm, it was not horrible, just flu like symptoms, headaches, memory loss, but it wasn't a picnic either. After I get down to .25 mg in am and pm, it will be a total 50% reduction for me (but i've been tapering for a couple months) but I'm not sure of what the percentage reduction from my current dose is (as I'm pretty crappy at math). Also, after this reduction I think I'm just going to hold for a while because I'm going through a hugely stressful time with the loss of what I thought was my forever love.
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ETA: I just realized I posted this in the titration forum when I'm not doing titration. Yup, brain is not functioning at 100%! If someone could please move it to the proper spot..
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Hi Lonestar,

 

I'm lousy at percentages, I tried looking at our calculator located here, but it doesn't go that low.  You don't really need to worry about percentages though, whenever we talk about them, it's just a way of providing a starting point.  As you taper lower, your percentages will increase until you're tapering 100% of your dose, so you see, we can't really use this at the end of our tapers.

 

Your primary concern should be your symptoms and how tapering to .5 affects you.  If you've had a fairly mellow time tapering thus far, you would probably be okay to go to .5.  Just be flexible and listen to what your body is trying to tell you.

 

Pam

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Anyone know what a taper from 0.25mg in am and .375 mg in pm TO 0.25 mg both am and pm is percentage wise??

 

Hi LonestarRN,

 

I'm crappy at math too. I agree with Missy, if .125mg seems to be too much I would do a .0625mg cut. That's exactly what I did recently with Xanax and it worked well for me.

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I switched from K to V and am currently tapering at .5 mg a week which seems to be working so far for me.  But I hear that once you get down to under 5 mgs of V, some people have to slow their tapers down or lower the dosage amount between tapers.  I'm not sure, I haven't got to that point yet in my taper, so I don't know what my personal experience for me will be at that time. 

 

I'd say make the cuts as small as you can until you see how your body reacts.  If you are doing fine and want to try a bigger cut, try it then wait and see if intolerable WD comes back.  If it does, go back to the smaller cut.  If your body is acting ok with the bigger cut, then do that one. 

 

Best wishes to you!

Patches

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I thought it was about 19% prhiannon, regardless, it's pretty high. That's why I was wondering if it would be better to cut the .125mg in half and make it .0625mg which would be 9-10%, which would be within the suggested guidelines from the Ashton Manual, and it would probably help to go slower for a little while to see if that stabilizes your symptoms.
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I can't seem to dry cut it that small so I was going to dissolve it in a small amount of milk and take half, but I don't have any measuring spoons! (Don't cook, hehe!) So I am going to go ahead and order a graduated cylinder and crushing thingy and just make the cut whenever that comes in. Thanks!
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That sounds good LonestarRN, and if you run into any problems, the titration section would probably be a good one to ask how to do it.

:thumbsup:

Sounds good to me too.

 

Also, you might try and see if the tablet will just dissolve in water without needing to be crushed.  All of mine do.  But I still recommend getting the graduated cylinder and either syringe or pipette for precise measuring.

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Hi prhiannon, I've seen you on some Xanax threads and IMO, you give sound advice. I'm planning to do a water titration very soon, as I'm getting pretty far down in a dry-cut Xanax taper.

 

Can I ask what a pipette is? ...and are you talking about using a syringe because you are doing a micro-type taper? and not doing the toss? Thanks if you will answer my questions.

 

*not hijacking the thread  :)

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Hi prhiannon, I've seen you on some Xanax threads and IMO, you give sound advice. I'm planning to do a water titration very soon, as I'm getting pretty far down in a dry-cut Xanax taper.

 

Can I ask what a pipette is? ...and are you talking about using a syringe because you are doing a micro-type taper? and not doing the toss? Thanks if you will answer my questions.

 

*not hijacking the thread  :)

 

A pipette (or pipet) is what's used in labs for measuring out precise quantities of liquids.  Here's a picture of some (ignore the rest of the website, it's for lab or industrial use, there are other places to get them)

http://utahbiodieselsupply.com/pipettes.php

 

They're actually very easy to use and I find them much easier for measuring out small quantities than syringes.

 

I don't use the "toss" method, I measure out my total daily dose from the suspension (that is, the "drug water.")  Then I divide it into small glass bottles which I use to take my doses throughout the day, to prevent interdose withdrawal.

 

I thought the toss method used a syringe to measure out the amount you're removing...? If not, how do you do it?

 

A pipette does what a syringe does--that is, measures liquid--only more exactly and with more precision, that is, you can easily measure smaller amounts like a tenth of a mL.  I use a 10 mL pipette (a pipette that measures up to 10 mL but can go down to 0) which has lines marking every tenth of a mL.

 

They come in all sizes.

 

I do use a sort of "microtaper" method.  I do frequent cuts with intermittent holds for as long as necessary.

 

Does that answer your questions?

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Hi prhiannon, I've seen you on some Xanax threads and IMO, you give sound advice. I'm planning to do a water titration very soon, as I'm getting pretty far down in a dry-cut Xanax taper.

 

Can I ask what a pipette is? ...and are you talking about using a syringe because you are doing a micro-type taper? and not doing the toss? Thanks if you will answer my questions.

 

*not hijacking the thread  :)

 

A pipette (or pipet) is what's used in labs for measuring out precise quantities of liquids.  Here's a picture of some (ignore the rest of the website, it's for lab or industrial use, there are other places to get them)

http://utahbiodieselsupply.com/pipettes.php

 

They're actually very easy to use and I find them much easier for measuring out small quantities than syringes.

 

I don't use the "toss" method, I measure out my total daily dose from the suspension (that is, the "drug water.")  Then I divide it into small glass bottles which I use to take my doses throughout the day, to prevent interdose withdrawal.

 

I thought the toss method used a syringe to measure out the amount you're removing...? If not, how do you do it?

 

A pipette does what a syringe does--that is, measures liquid--only more exactly and with more precision, that is, you can easily measure smaller amounts like a tenth of a mL.  I use a 10 mL pipette (a pipette that measures up to 10 mL but can go down to 0) which has lines marking every tenth of a mL.

 

They come in all sizes.

 

I do use a sort of "microtaper" method.  I do frequent cuts with intermittent holds for as long as necessary.

 

Does that answer your questions?

 

Hi prhiannon,

 

I have not started my water titration yet. You've given me some very good ideas! I'm glad you said something about putting the drug water in bottles and taking it throughout the day--I know all about inter-dose withdrawal. I guess the suspension stays stable through the day, even if it's not refrigerated? And can you just use a regular measuring cup to measure your drug water?

 

Thanks for your advise.  :)

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For me, the drug itself doesn't appear to break down or lose its effectiveness in water, although I do refrigerate it whenever I can.  However the suspension does settle out and you do need to shake it up before taking it, and rinse the bottle well and drink the rinse water.

 

I use my pipette to measure the water.  A graduated cylinder would also give you adequate accuracy.  I don't think I would be able to get a consistent enough measurement using a measuring cup, personally; they're not designed for this level of accuracy.

 

Graduated cylinders aren't hard to get.  Here's a website about them (there are others, this is just the first one I came across): http://dl.clackamas.cc.or.us/ch104-01b/volume_meas.htm

 

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Thank you for your tips prhiannon, I think that's the way I will go. I know very few people taper straight off of Xanax. I couldn't find a doctor to cross me over to Valium and since I've gone this far down I don't want to c/o now. I really appreciate the help.

 

Nicolette

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Thank you for your tips prhiannon, I think that's the way I will go. I know very few people taper straight off of Xanax. I couldn't find a doctor to cross me over to Valium and since I've gone this far down I don't want to c/o now. I really appreciate the help.

 

Nicolette

Yep, tapering straight down off Xanax is tough.  The only people I know who've done it successfully have used liquid titration and multiple daily dosing.  Xanax is a very potent drug--0.25 mg of Xanax is equivalent to 5 mg of Valium.  Sounds like you're right on track, I think you'll do fine!

 

Oh, and p.s., there's no point in using milk for titrating Xanax.  It's not one of the drugs that suspends better in milk. 

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Thank you for your tips prhiannon, I think that's the way I will go. I know very few people taper straight off of Xanax. I couldn't find a doctor to cross me over to Valium and since I've gone this far down I don't want to c/o now. I really appreciate the help.

 

Nicolette

Yep, tapering straight down off Xanax is tough.  The only people I know who've done it successfully have used liquid titration and multiple daily dosing.  Xanax is a very potent drug--0.25 mg of Xanax is equivalent to 5 mg of Valium.  Sounds like you're right on track, I think you'll do fine!

 

Oh, and p.s., there's no point in using milk for titrating Xanax.  It's not one of the drugs that suspends better in milk. 

 

It is kind be a little tough with the potency and duration of action, I also read that it binds in different ways than other benzos do. When I c/t'd off of it before it was very tough.

 

Thanks for letting me know water will work, I don't want to be carrying a milk suspension around with me. ;)

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  • 3 weeks later...
Okay, I've had pretty much no sx since my last taper, which was about 10% (besides weird dreams and forgetfulness)..no pain or anything which I had a tolerable case of at first with other cuts. I am planning on going from .25 am & .3125 pm of klonopin to .25mg twice a day. Does anyone know what percentage of a cut that is? It will be nice to not have to cut a pill into quarters and then crush a quarter and eyeball half of the powder to make up part of my nighttime dose!! Also, when I make the cut after this, should I take it out of my morning or night dose? I work nights, but only twice a week. Thank y'all so much!
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Hi LonestarRN,

 

I didn't have paper handy, so I wrote it out on my hand. ::)

 

.25mg + .5125mg = .5625mg

 

Since .5 + .5 = 1

 

.5625 + .5625 = 1.125

 

I can't calculate the rest but you are definitely be doing under a 12.5% cut. I think if you've been fine with the last cut, you should probably do well with this one. It is nice when you don't have to mess with tiny fractions of a pill, isn't it?

 

Everyone is different as to whether they make their cut in the am or pm. Some people have morning anxiety and leave that dose. I don't, so I usually make my cuts in the morning. Some people rotate their different cuts around. Listen to your body and do what you feel works best for you. I'm glad you've been doing well with few sx's. That's great. :thumbsup:

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