Horrible anxiety today

[[En...]]

It has been a week and a half since I cut 0.125mg clonazepam. I am down to 0.25mg left to go. I have had bad withdrawal symptoms for about a week now with feeling hot, very high anxiety, upset stomach, shaky hands, disturbed sleep, OCD, social avoidance, nervousness, tinnitus, headaches etc. I have been doing well with my taper until now. My symptoms are hard to bare. I think I either tapered too fast or too much or both. I was feeling good up till Wed last week. Should I ride this out until I feel better? I didn't feel too bad yesterday and now today extreme anxiety. I take 2mg nozinan which is an antipsychotic for anxiety and I took one already this morning but it doesn't seem to be helping much. 

I am crawling out of my skin this morning. I tried breathing exercises and positive thoughts. 

Any suggestions? 

[[Cr...]]

That was a pretty big cut, percentage-wise, going from .375 dowm to .25 (33%).  You have two choices. 

If you find the symptoms absolutely unbearable and you need to be functional for family, work, etc... then may want to go back to .375 and hold until stable. After that resume cutting again but at a smaller rate.

The other option is to hunker down and deal with these symptoms until your body has adjusted to your previous cut. These symptoms are just sensations produced by your body making adjustments to less klonopin in its system.

We will support you no matter what. Only you know when your threshold for dealing with these symptoms has been reached. 

Edited May 24 by [Cr...]
Grammar

[[En...]]

5 minutes ago, [[C...] said:

That was a pretty big cut, percentage-wise, going from .375 dowm to .25 (33%).  You have two choices. 

If you find the symptoms absolutely unbearable and you need to be functional for family, work, etc... then may want to go back to .375 and hold until stable. After that resume cutting again but at a smaller rate.

The other option is to hunker down and deal with these symptoms until your body has adjusted to your previous cut. These symptoms are just sensations produced by your body making adjustments to less klonopin in its system.

We will support you no matter what. Only you know when your threshold for dealing with these symptoms has been reached. 

Thank you for the reply. I have bought a scale and I will make smaller cuts from now on. My Dr told me no more than 25% cuts but you can only cut the pills with a pill cutter so small. What do you suggest for a % cut? I will hold this 0.25mg until I stablize I dont want to updose in fear of kindling and going backwards. The stress is much worse upon waking up in the morning and then subsides as the day goes on. I think it is what I am eating as well. I will start to watch that as well. I had a bag of Ariba taco chips yesterday maybe that revved up my symptoms. I also hear diary is not good as well. As I am getting lower in the dosage it is getting harder. 

[[Ja...]]

Big cuts will bring more severe withdrawals,.you need to find a semi comfortable level and work from there,.it’s like going CT cutting like that bud.

[[En...]]

Just now, [[J...] said:

Big cuts will bring more severe withdrawals,.you need to find a semi comfortable level and work from there,.it’s like going CT cutting like that bud.

I had bad physical symptoms all last week I was sick. Those seem to have got better. Now the anxiety is bad. I hear acute stage is about 2 weeks. Should I just hold this 0.25mg until I stabalize? It's only anxiety now. 

[[Ja...]]

I’m not to experienced on clonazepam  bud,I’ve only took diazepam,,I do know like %33 is a big drop,.I tried big drops early in my taper and had to adjust as it was overwhelming,.even at %10 I thought my recent drop was going ok,,but I’ve had an absolute shit day,.it’s hard to control the taper bud,.you get a coulple good days etc and it sneaks up on you,.there definitely be folk on here know a lot more about clonazepam than me bud

[[En...]]

18 minutes ago, [[J...] said:

I’m not to experienced on clonazepam  bud,I’ve only took diazepam,,I do know like %33 is a big drop,.I tried big drops early in my taper and had to adjust as it was overwhelming,.even at %10 I thought my recent drop was going ok,,but I’ve had an absolute shit day,.it’s hard to control the taper bud,.you get a coulple good days etc and it sneaks up on you,.there definitely be folk on here know a lot more about clonazepam than me bud

What do you use for measuring a scale? What % do you go down each cut and how often?

[[Ja...]]

I use a ACCT milligram scale ,£27 of Amazon,.I carnt fault it yet bud,.it’s good tapering pills,.I’ve been dropping 1mg per 10 days as it is,sometimes a bit longer,.but I’ll adjust it to .05 g at some point,.my last drop from 10mg to 9mg was smoothing out near the 10 day mark,.now down to 8mg this week started ok to crap now,.but it was the same last time to,.it can be hard going on the rough days 

[[En...]]

3 minutes ago, [[J...] said:

I use a ACCT milligram scale ,£27 of Amazon,.I carnt fault it yet bud,.it’s good tapering pills,.I’ve been dropping 1mg per 10 days as it is,sometimes a bit longer,.but I’ll adjust it to .05 g at some point,.my last drop from 10mg to 9mg was smoothing out near the 10 day mark,.now down to 8mg this week started ok to crap now,.but it was the same last time to,.it can be hard going on the rough days 

This had been going ok for me until now. My Dr is no help for tapering. I asked the pharmacist how to taper this and he sold me a pill cutter. The clonazepam tablets come in 0.50mg size that have a score down the middle for cutting. I haven't been using a scale until now I bought one on Amazon. I was going to reduce 0.125mg every 2 weeks which was working for me until now. I will need to figure out how to proceed from 0.25mg. I know I will suffer withdrawal any way I do this I just want the effects to be manageable as well as still move forward with my taper and get off successfully. I do not really want to reinstate as that is going backwards and I dont want to kindle my brain. My Dr told me I was going to suffer. I think he wants me to taper 0.125mg at a time and jump at 0.125mg. Maybe this is too fast and I will suffer but at the same time I want to be off this stuff. I am off work on disability and want my life back and know and accept there will be withdrawal. 

[[Ja...]]

I wouldn’t take a docs word for it anyway bud that’s for sure,.it’s your health,coming of to quick has a lot of risks and long term health risks,.the tapering is a total pain and slow,but it’s the way to do it bud

[[En...]]

Just now, [[J...] said:

I wouldn’t take a docs word for it anyway bud that’s for sure,.it’s your health,coming of to quick has a lot of risks and long term health risks,.the tapering is a total pain and slow,but it’s the way to do it bud

Do you think I should hunker down and wait until I am stable or reinstate to 0.5mg? I dont want long term issues 

[[Ja...]]

If your symptoms are so full bud on I’d consider reinstate,.I know I had to,.I bought the scales and starting again,.it was still rough to start but the last 6 odd weeks I’ve got a bit more control over it,.it’s still hard bud but I get window that are really good and I can go about my day,..the big drops are brutal compared to a more controlled taper

 

[[En...]]

11 minutes ago, [[J...] said:

If your symptoms are so full bud on I’d consider reinstate,.I know I had to,.I bought the scales and starting again,.it was still rough to start but the last 6 odd weeks I’ve got a bit more control over it,.it’s still hard bud but I get window that are really good and I can go about my day,..the big drops are brutal compared to a more controlled taper

How long do you think until I feel better if the physical symptoms have let up and only anxiety now as well i had a decent day yesterday? Another week?

[[Ja...]]

Possibly pal,.the windows are a good sign,.the anxiety can stay around anyway,usually in the mornings,I had it today as I was busy most the day around a lot of folk,I think just not feeling yourself going through this can make you generally anxious through the day,.mine subsides at night,a lot of folk say that to.

[[jo...]]

Anxiety is one of the main symptoms of this for most people. I had it worst for the first couple of months and it felt like it was never going to end. It was intense and long lasting but now at 4 months out I am getting decent windows and breaks from it. Things can trigger anxiety pretty easily such as alcohol and sugar for me so after learning the hard way I avoid these things. Particularly alcohol.

Like Jay75 when I am experiencing a bad wave of anxiety it tends to let up about 12 hours after waking. I can almost set my watch to it! This is a blessing as it's something to look forward to and a source of respite after a tough day. It seems like it's never going to get better and I was close to re-instating at times but people on here talked me out of it. I'm glad they did because it really does get better and more manageable.

[[En...]]

1 minute ago, [[j...] said:

Anxiety is one of the main symptoms of this for most people. I had it worst for the first couple of months and it felt like it was never going to end. It was intense and long lasting but now at 4 months out I am getting decent windows and breaks from it. Things can trigger anxiety pretty easily such as alcohol and sugar for me so after learning the hard way I avoid these things. Particularly alcohol.

Like Jay75 when I am experiencing a bad wave of anxiety it tends to let up about 12 hours after waking. I can almost set my watch to it! This is a blessing as it's something to look forward to and a source of respite after a tough day. It seems like it's never going to get better and I was close to re-instating at times but people on here talked me out of it. I'm glad they did because it really does get better and more manageable.

Yes I read a lot of not reinstating if you can. I would look at it as a failure and going backwards and a waste of the suffering I have already been through. It is tempting to reinstate and drug craving is one of the acute stage symptoms. My sleep is ok just having nightmares that wake me up. Disturbed sleep I guess you could call it. I am lucky to get any sleep at all. The anxiety can be overwhelming when I first wake up then eases through the day. You are right it is something to look forward to after a horrible day of anxiety. I look at what I went through last week I was pretty sick physically to now only feeling anxiety and having 2 decent days as healing. I would hate to screw that up by changing what I am doing and reinstate only to regret it later. I have read reinstating can cause further problems and prolong the taper. The anxiety right now is overwhelming but only in the waking hours until about 3 or 4pm as it eases up. In the evening it gets much more manageable. My symptoms are not getting worse day by day but I am having window days. Today is a wave day for sure. It could be what I ate yesterday too I didn't eat that healthy as I was feeling decent. I am going to try to eat better today and drink lots of water and see how I feel tomorrow. If I feel decent then I will eat healthier from the rest of my taper. Like I said I am down to the last bit 0.25mg left to go and I cant taper by 0.125mg as that would be a 50% taper. I am going to try a slower taper and see if I can handle the withdrawal. 

[[En...]]

16 minutes ago, [[j...] said:

Anxiety is one of the main symptoms of this for most people. I had it worst for the first couple of months and it felt like it was never going to end. It was intense and long lasting but now at 4 months out I am getting decent windows and breaks from it. Things can trigger anxiety pretty easily such as alcohol and sugar for me so after learning the hard way I avoid these things. Particularly alcohol.

Like Jay75 when I am experiencing a bad wave of anxiety it tends to let up about 12 hours after waking. I can almost set my watch to it! This is a blessing as it's something to look forward to and a source of respite after a tough day. It seems like it's never going to get better and I was close to re-instating at times but people on here talked me out of it. I'm glad they did because it really does get better and more manageable.

Are you off the meds already or are you tapering still? 

[[jo...]]

Just now, [[E...] said:

Are you off the meds already or are you tapering still? 

I'm 4 months off CT. Doing better, still get waves of mainly mental stuff anxiety depression etc but getting windows as well. It actually sounds like your doing pretty good. I know it doesn't feel like it when your in a wave but the fact that your getting windows is a really good sign. Some don't get them for a long time. It's a sign that your brain is sorting itself out and remembering how to get back to a normal balance. There are many ups and downs but keep going and things will keep getting better. 

[[En...]]

1 minute ago, [[j...] said:

I'm 4 months off CT. Doing better, still get waves of mainly mental stuff anxiety depression etc but getting windows as well. It actually sounds like your doing pretty good. I know it doesn't feel like it when your in a wave but the fact that your getting windows is a really good sign. Some don't get them for a long time. It's a sign that your brain is sorting itself out and remembering how to get back to a normal balance. There are many ups and downs but keep going and things will keep getting better. 

I feel I am getting better with the physical symptoms yes after one week. I am hoping one week from now the psychological symptoms will subside. I look at it as progress in healing. When I am in a wave yes reinstating is very tempting. 

[[jo...]]

Yeah reinstating is very tempting when your in the thick of it. I would avoid it though as it is setting you back in recovery and potentially making the next attempt worse. It's a personal decision though. All I can say is that I'm glad I didn't. Improvement comes. Your already getting windows which is a good sign. My physical symptoms completely vanished for a couple of weeks only to come back. I think this was because I drank alcohol though and brought on a bad wave. That's when they returned. Now they come and go. Looking after yourself is a big thing I think. Be careful what you consume, dont over do things physically, avoid to much stress etc. imo this will speed your recovery.

[[En...]]

2 minutes ago, [[j...] said:

Yeah reinstating is very tempting when your in the thick of it. I would avoid it though as it is setting you back in recovery and potentially making the next attempt worse. It's a personal decision though. All I can say is that I'm glad I didn't. Improvement comes. Your already getting windows which is a good sign. My physical symptoms completely vanished for a couple of weeks only to come back. I think this was because I drank alcohol though and brought on a bad wave. That's when they returned. Now they come and go. Looking after yourself is a big thing I think. Be careful what you consume, dont over do things physically, avoid to much stress etc. imo this will speed your recovery.

I am not out of the woods yet with my taper. I think this is a new phase of it as I was tapering before without a scale but as I am down to only half pill left every cut is more than my last cut. I dont think I can use the pill cutter anymore at this point. I will need to shave the half pills from this point and go no more than 25% reduction each cut and hold. It's either that or do a water taper but I think that might be inconsistent. I just hope my Dr goes along with what i want to do and keeps prescribing me the clonazepam. 

[[jo...]]

1 minute ago, [[E...] said:

I am not out of the woods yet with my taper. I think this is a new phase of it as I was tapering before without a scale but as I am down to only half pill left every cut is more than my last cut. I dont think I can use the pill cutter anymore at this point. I will need to shave the half pills from this point and go no more than 25% reduction each cut and hold. It's either that or do a water taper but I think that might be inconsistent. I just hope my Dr goes along with what i want to do and keeps prescribing me the clonazepam. 

yeah I think it's not a lot of medication to prescribe at this point and if your tolerating the cuts well enough your doctor should be fine with it. It would be crazy if he wasn't.

[[En...]]

7 minutes ago, [[j...] said:

yeah I think it's not a lot of medication to prescribe at this point and if your tolerating the cuts well enough your doctor should be fine with it. It would be crazy if he wasn't.

How are you feeling today? 

[[jo...]]

Just now, [[E...] said:

How are you feeling today? 

I've been pretty good for over a week now. Not much anxiety and sleeping better. Still some depression which comes and goes and muscle stuff but I would call it a window as I'm pretty functional and not overwhelmed by anything. I had a bad wave just before this though and seemed to come out of it over night. Thats how quick it can change. Crazy syndrome. hard to make sense of. I'm feeling quite positive but aprehensive. One wrong move and it can cause you problems so I'm just being as careful as I can. Thanks for asking! keep going a window will open soon.

[[Cr...]]

2 hours ago, [[E...] said:

Do you think I should hunker down and wait until I am stable or reinstate to 0.5mg? I dont want long term issues 

That is up to what your constitution is as far as dealing with withdrawal symptoms. Also wouldn't you only need to reinstate to .375, not .5 since you currently cut from .375 down to .125.

On higher doses of klonopin like 3 mgs, you could easily get away with making .125 cuts since that would be sub 10%. But each successive .125 cut becomes a bigger percentage cut as you get lower, so it will get more difficult to maintain the exact same amount (.125) in cuts. Once .25 is reached, you are literally cutting out 50% of the medication out of your body. While not as bad as cutting 2mgs from a 4mg dose, your body will still be reeling.

This is why many people switch to Valium because it is easier to cut with 1mg of Klon = 20 mg of Valium. So in your case .25mg K = 5mg of V. Making Valium easier to taper offer do to lower potency per mg. 

If a crossover is not an option you can get a jewelers scale and get the weight of a full .5 mg pill and then use that weight to determine the weight of a 10% cut.

Another option is liquid titration where you crush a full pill in an evenly suspended liquid and use a dropper to subtract millilters over time.

If all this sounds complicated to you there are plenty other members and BB crew that will help you figure it out in the Tapering section of the forum.

A direct taper off of klonopin is still very possible doing dry cuts and just eyeballing it, but it may be far rougher than the other aforementioned methods.