Help Needed - Titration/Direct Taper

[[SS...]]

Hi,

 

I've introduced myself in the New Member Section and wanted to get some help with a planned wean off .75mg (three halves of the .5mg pill), which I've been taking for about a year.

 

I've already tapered down to .625, by taking a 1/4 pill in the afternoons rather than half.  It seems that as I continue to cut I may have to use Titration as the cuts get more severe (and larger, percentage wise).  I can't cut more than a 1/4 pill at the time.

 

So I guess it's a "direct cut" at the beginning and a switchover to titration towards the end. 

 

Could you help with a specific plan for this?  I'm taking only the Klonopan and nothing else -- not much luck finding a Doctor to help with the Valium Taper, and if I can avoid it...plus it's expensive finding New Psychiatrists and I don't like any I've met so far!

 

thank you so much

 

Steven

New Mexico USA

[[...]]

Hi Steven

 

You live in one of my favorite states.

 

Anyhow, this whole process is easier using 0.5 mg pills. Generally MDs are happy to oblige.

 

As you can see I cut 0.25 mg a week for two weeks, and that was two severe. The 0.125 mg drop was fine. That's a quarter pill. I dosed twice a day, 12 hours apart. I didn't get fancy with titration. These pills dissolve readily in water. I'd put my daily dose in two cups of water, shake well, and drink one cup twice a day.

 

This is a challenging process symptom wise. I have not read your introduction so don't know the details but I send you strength and best wishes on your getting this stuff out of your body and life!

[[SS...]]

Okay kids, Now I really need help!  I've read elsewhere that I can cut a 1/4 tablet if I have the .5mg tablets.  That means a 1/4 tablet is .125mg.  And keep doing quarter pill cuts every two weeks.  But hold on!  It's also suggested to cut no more than 10% every two weeks.  If I cut a 1/4 tablet (.125mg) from a .75mg daily dose, that means the FIRST CUT is 16%, which is gonna' be harsh.  And it's going to get worse as I keep cutting.

 

So doesn't this mean I'm forced, really, into a titration schedule right from the very beginning, even though I have .5mg tablets?  Each possible cut is way above 10%, unless I'm calculating wrong!

 

Steven in New Mexico

[[SS...]]

I figured I better do the whole math for a "direct" taper regime based on cutting 1/4 pill each time.

 

This would consist of SIX CUTS.  Regardless of the spacing, here are the percentages for each cut:

 

1st Cut:  17%

2nd Cut:  20%

3rd Cut:  25%

4th Cut:  33%

5th Cut:  50%

6th Cut:  100%

 

I realize that the 10% figure recommended by Benzobuddies.Org is only a suggestion, but look at those numbers! 

 

This plan seems extremely aggressive and, if not dangerous, potentially intolerable.  Hence my feeling that titration may be the only way to keep this manageable....!

 

Steven in New Mexico

[[Be...]]

I responded to your identical post on the Titrations Taper board:

 

http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=33235.msg479060#msg479060

 

It's best to just to post a message in one place.  Less confusing and easier to keep track of responses. 

[[SS...]]

Beeper,

 

Yes, I"m new to the game and also since I was confused as to whether I was doing Direct or Titration (or Valium, for that matter!), I posted in more than one place.  I'll be tidier next time....

 

I don't want to get hung up on percentages, as you say, but nevertheless, does not the pill cutting regimen look a bit extreme to you? 

 

Best,

 

Steven

[[Pa...]]

Hi Steven,

 

I think I'd stay away from percentages as others have suggested, 10% is just a guideline that was extrapolated from Professor Ashtons schedules.  Since you have the .5 mg pills, I'd just keep cutting them into quarters and reduce by .125 every week or two until you're at .125.  Then crush that last little bit, put it into a cup of water and drink half, saving half for the next day, this will mean you can jump off the drug at .0625, a nice soft landing.

 

Of course, if this is too slow for you and you're feeling fine, you can speed it up.  This process is all about listening to your bodies signals, and adjusting your taper as necessary. 

 

Pam

[[Wi...]]

I've dry cut from 1mg down to .25mg.  It can be done.  I am uncomfortable for a couple of days, but then it gets better, and then time for another cut. 

[[SS...]]

Pamster,

 

I think the 1/4 pill thing is too fast for me!  I am down 1/4 pill to .625 for about a week and and felt very, very anxious this morning, quite bad.  Don't know if this is too aggressive.  Still considering the valium taper but having a heck of a time finding a doctor.

 

Steven

[[Be...]]

If a 1/4 of a pill is too big a cut, I think titration is a good option.  There are potential problems with crossing over to Valium.  Not everyone does well on it and some have crossed back to their original benzo.  It also has the potential to increase depression and fatigue and, of course, adds several weeks to the taper.  Are you no longer interested in titrating?

[[SS...]]

Beeper, I'm willing to do the titration, for sure.  Every time I've cut my dose (which has always been by 1/4 pill to start), I've gotten very depressed and filled with grief and sorrow and despair -- as my psychologist will affirm.  Just don't know.  In some ways it seems "great" if one can do it without adding another Benzo.  I did notice that in the Ashton manual (unless I missed it) there was no method/schedule for getting off Clonopan without Valium -- only a Valium taper plan.  Again, I'm willing to try pill cutting and/or titration without Valium -- you just wonder what works for "most people" and what doesn't.

 

Thank You

 

Steven

[[Pa...]]

Hi Steven,

 

I'd like to apologize, when I mentioned cutting by .125, I didn't realize that's what you'd already tried, we don't usually see folks here who are starting out their taper on such a low dose.  These drugs are powerful aren't they, they can bring pain and suffering in small or large doses, one for a few weeks or a few years. 

 

Yes, Professor Ashton only did Valium tapers, but here we see more dry cutting successes, because not many Dr's will cross their patients to Valium and titration scares some folks off.

 

We'll help you with whatever method you decide on, have you looked at the videos of the process?

[[SS...]]

Pamster,

 

Not to worry, thank you for your help and support.  Titration is looking like a definite possibility (necessity) so I'll watch that video asap.  Right now I'm down from my usual .75 to .625, and feeling low, hence the investigation of all possibilities.  Even the valium taper, so I posted a "call for doctors" there.  It isn't easy, either?  The post in the substitution section is new, I didn't post it anywhere else.

 

Of course there's a perception that titration is a big pain but maybe it's only a little pain....

 

Best to you all,

 

Steven