Am I doing this the right way

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I was on ambien for insomnia for about one and a half years.  It stopped working and I went through a very stressful situation.  I tried to make the dosage higher, but it just make me crash.  My doctor was trying to put me on an antidepressant and other pills for sleep at the same time.  Restoril seemed to be the only medicine that worked (not lunesta or ambien CR).

Within just 2-3 weeks I developed tolerance to the restoril. 

 

I am still trying to work and after talking to some people I crossed over to diazepam and have been on it for about 15 days.  I was taking about 15-20mg of restoril at night and 7.5mg actually seemed to be okay.  I sleep about 3-4 hours per night and then lay there, so I was interested in what other people do.  It seems like getting up is a stupid idea and that resting is better. 

 

Some are of the opinion that since I was mostly on ambien and only on restoril for a short time that I should be able to taper the valium quickly.  I am down to about 4mg the last several days, but seemed to have much more muscle stiffness and a little bit more anxiety.  Maybe sleeping a little less.

 

So do I keep pushing the dose down, since I haven't been on benzos that long or do I go slower and let my body adjust.  Thanks, SC

[[el...]]

Hi SC!

You don't say how fast you are tapering or at what rate.

And yes, I believe it is better to stay in bed and just rest and relax rather than getting up. You are still getting some restoration.  that's what Deepak Chopra says!

Being on ambien or lunesta is almost like being on benzo. It affects the same receptors. So you dont want to taper too quickly. A safe taper is aprox. 10% every one to two weeks. For you that would amount to about .5mg of valium. As  for the rate, play that by ear. if you feel ok after a week, go ahead and make another cut. As you get lower, like down to 2mg, you can reduce your cut to a quarter mg. If you feel like you are having difficulty with the .5mg cuts.

You are doing the right thing!   

[[si...]]

welcome to benzo buddies SC - you are in good hands.

[[ru...]]

Hi SC,

 

Just wanted to welcome you to the forum!

 

rufus

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This is the course I have taken.  Ambien one and a half years.  Restoril 20mg or so for three weeks.  First night of valium seemed of 10mg seemed like too much.  Cut down to 7.5mg and down now to 4mg in about 16 days.  Started to get some cramping in my legs yesterday and some anxiety so I went back up to 5mg of valium and seem to feel better today.  Thanks for  your support.  I am trying to cut down quickly with the understanding that I haven't been on benzos so long as I was on ambien.  Thanks for all of your support.  SC

[[Co...]]

Hi SC,

 

Welcome to BenzoBuddies.

 

The idea behind getting up is that it distracts you from not feeling sleepy. If lie in bed for a long time not managing to sleep, we become fretful and more restless. Some distraction doing something relaxing, like watching some TV, can mean we start afresh when go to bed again, maybe an or so later. There are lot of things that have been show to help with sleep that seem counterintuitive - including sleep restriction! Sometimes the things that help us most make little sense, but they are worth investigating.

[[el...]]

Hi SC,

 

Welcome to BenzoBuddies.

 

The idea behind getting up is that it distracts you from not feeling sleepy. If lie in bed for a long time not managing to sleep, we become fretful and more restless. Some distraction doing something relaxing, like watching some TV, can mean we start afresh when go to bed again, maybe an or so later. There are lot of things that have been show to help with sleep that seem counterintuitive - including sleep restriction! Sometimes the things that help us most make little sense, but they are worth investigating.

 

Colin, for me personally those techniques do not work! I think everyone is different. If one can lie in bed and relax, not freak out, I think it is more restful than getting up with lights and all that. It's too stimulating for some.

But yes , they are worth investigating. Obviously they must help some people, as there are tons of books and studies on the subject. 

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So right now I am on about 4.5-5mg of valium.  I am getting some muscle aches, sleeping about 4 hours, and get a little anxiety towards evening.  I am only taking the valium at bedtime.  I have tapered rather quickly according to some.  So if I stay at my present dosage does my insomnia, muscle aches and anxiety stabilize or does it get worse as I grow more tolerant to valium.  If the symptoms stabilize and then I make a cut, won't I expect some worsening symptoms (insomnia, muscle aches, anxiety).  Is this for a few days.

 

Now I haven't really been on benzos that long, unless you count ambien as a benzo.  The low dose valium of 18 days is almost as long as I was on the restoril before that.  I do feel better than when I was on restoril or ambien.  So what happens if I go cold turkey or cut my dosage by half.  Would my withdrawal take a week, two weeks, a month.  I know it would hasten the return of gaba and such, but it sounds like at such a cost.  I would just like to get off of all of the pills as soon as possible, but I also am continuing to work.  Thanks for all of your knowledge, support and information.  SC

[[si...]]

did you get muscle aches when you came off the other drugs?

 

i don't know if you are having problems related to you present withdrawal or your past withdrawals.

 

sleep and muscle aches are par for the course when it comes to stopping many drugs or even taking many drugs.  i used a calcium/magnesium/zinc supplement (all i one) a.m. and p.m. - and applied heat to sore areas all during my withdrawal - cramping was not good.

 

15 days is not a long time to be on a benzo - don't know as i would recommend just stoping but a fast withdrawal sounds lie it would be in or order - how fast i do not know - but i would guess 15 day withdrawal may be ok.

 

 

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When you are on a slow taper does your sleep and symptoms stabilize at a dosage and then worsen for a few days after the cut.  Then you get used to the new dosage and then you cut again getting the worsening symptoms.  Or are these slow tapers, just weeks and months of insomnia and some anxiety and that's just the way it is.  I have to say that I feel better on the valium and decreasing then I did with the ambien and restoril.  Thanks, SC

[[si...]]

you were on benzo's for 15 days - right?

 

ok withdrawal - for me the first cut would be hard for 3 days then i would adjust - but if you have been on 10 mg? for 15 days that is not a long time.  with some good sleep hygiene (no caffeine) decrease or eliminate sugar - keep bed room uncluttered and cool at time and start some serious calming down at 6 or 7 - maybe some sleep aids benadryl, melatonin for a few days - do not get hooked on sleep aids - that is another set of addiction.

 

it would help anyone trying to help you if you would put your drug use - drug amout - and when drug started in your footer for easy access - you can do this by clicking profile - go into change profile - enter information - then click finish at the bottom of the page.

 

you have been bounced all over the place by your doctor on different meds - so who knows what you are feeling is related to anything other then lots of drugs - BUT - the symptoms you mentioned are not unusual for a benzo withdrawal.

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I am 5mg of valium.  I am going to cut to 4.5 this weekend.  Do the withdrawal symptoms worsen for a few days and then they improve.  Then in another week you take another .5mg drop, the symptoms worsen and then they stabilize again.  Is this the pattern that I can expect?  Thanks, SC

[[el...]]

Hi SC, yes that's pretty much the typical pattern, though some cuts are easier, and some a bit more difficult. I found that as my taper continued down, a lot of my tolerence wd symptoms improved. I have  been benzo free for a couple of weeks now and I'm doing fine, sleep ok. Not great yet, but manageable.

[[s-...]]

SC.

 

In my view, the success or not of a benzo taper depends basically on two major aspects: physical characteristics and psychological conditions.

 

We have not much to do about the first one, it can varies very much from one person to another, maybe some appropriate food, supplements, vitamins etc can help, in my personall experience I know that physical exercises help very much. About psychological conditions, the best situation would be to have a complete stress free environment, considering that benzos are ansiolitic drugs and its reduction will consequently increase anxiety. But such environment is impossible, so what we have to do is to reduce stress situation as much as possible. So, the idea that a cut has to be performed only when we feel good to do is almost impossible because those stress situation can arise exactly when we plan a cut. For this reason, I made a schedule of my cuts and try to keep them, no matter how I'm feeling. Otherwise, I'd have not made any cut yet.

 

The windows, good days and moments come and go, and we have not much control on it. I think that one is tapering should consider not to get stabilised to make a cut but if the symptoms are bearable. If it´s, a cut is possible.

 

Well, that´s the way I´m doing.

 

Regards.

Sérgio.

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I cut down to 4.5 mg last Friday.  I have started sleeping less and had more anxiety.  I have been able to work despite only a few hours of sleep.  I have rested all night though. 

 

Should these withdrawal symptoms stabilize over the next few days.  It seems like they would only get worse because I am growing tolerant of the effects of the valium at the same time that I am trying to taper.  I have done better in some ways than I thought I would, especially with lack of sleep.  I am not sure that I can continue to do this, though.  I just want to sleep and be able to work and take care of my family.  Of course I know that taking pills is what got me here in the first place. 

 

If I am able to cut .5mg per week I have 9 more weeks, or if I can only cut .5mg every two weeks I have 18 more weeks of this hell.  I can't stop working or I will lose my business.  Have others done this while working.  Dr. Ashton says that tapering off of the valium can be relatively easy.  Am not necessarily finding it easy.  Thanks, SC

[[el...]]

SC, you've tapered pretty quickly so it's not surprising that you are  having some sleep difficulty. Try to slow the rate down a little. Or the reduce the cut.

usually sleep will get worse after a cut, then improve some before the next cut. Ideally at least! I would hold your cut for 2 weeks. Your taper may take longer, but it will probably be much more comfortable.

As you get below 3mg, you might consider reducing the size of your cut to .25mg., if you are still having difficulty.

Linda

[[Co...]]

Hi SC,

 

I'm inclined to agree with Eljay. Try making cuts less frequently, or even better (if you manage it), try reducing the size of your cuts instead. Would titration be an option? This would allow to make small, but frequent cuts.

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So the sleeping does often getter better before the next cut?  I can certainly slow down.  I was hoping that since I was on ambien for much longer than the benzos, that I would be able to taper more quickly.  If it is going to be hell whether you taper quickly or slowly, then I would like to get the hell over with more quickly.    It sounds like many other have tapered with valium slowly and had success and were relatively comfortable.  I have been discouraged the last day or two.  This is the hardest thing that I have ever done.

 

I have 2mg and 10mg tablets.  I could do a titration taper, right now I am just cutting the 2mg tablets.  How small of cuts and how often would you do them with a titration taper, starting at 4.5mg?  Thanks, SC