Does sleep eventually improve?

[[sl...]]

Geek-  thanks for the links. It sucks that this shit takes so long to improve for many of us. I've heard from enough people and most with tough insomnia are reporting 18-36 months.  My eye twitches thinking about another 1+ years like this  . 

[[ve...]]

Hey Damien, I went through some of your old posts and a lot of your them resonated with me. Just wanted to say that you're pretty inspiring for enduring for so long to get your health back, it is a horribly long and tough process and I admire you for staying the course.

[[Bh...]]

My sleep is pretty much the same as g33k's.

 

On my bad nights I sleep 2-3 hours straight and wake up.  Then I wake up every 1-2 hours until I wake for work. My symptoms are pretty bad that day.  Cog fog/anxiety are much higher. I don't think I'm reaching slow wave sleep on these nights.

 

On my good nights I sleep 4-5 hours straigt and wake around 4-5am. Then I sleep anouther 1-2 hours.  On these days, I'm much better. My cog fog and anxiety is in check.

 

I've had a common sleep pattern throughout my withdrawal.  Usually it's one good night followed by one bad nights. I don't know why, but this is my life right now. You guys aren't alone 

[[ve...]]

Bhealthy, that's exactly my same pattern as well. I just can't sleep more than 4 hours straight, and I always feel better after more solid sleep. I do dislike it when it's light and choppy.  It's frustrating, but I guess if we all experiencing this, It must end when our brains heal.

[[wo...]]

.....wish i slept 4 or 5 hours a week , never mind a night ...

iam in a terrible state re insomnia , lucky if i get 1 or 2 hours a week with various antihistamines, so really its forced sleep

[[ve...]]

Hey Wolfsbane, I know the pain. Benzos totally wrecked my sleep. Try to stay off all GABA PAMs, even valerian, skull cap and passion flower acts on the GABA receptors, so you should be careful, and no alcohol! And yes I totally know that not sleepy feeling. I'm about 8 months out and finally starting to sometimes feel tired at night, it's rare though. You will eventually sleep again, not as much as you want and not of the right quality. I'd really recommend you to stay off all meds and force your brain to relearn sleep on its own. As much as not sleeping sucks, you will sleep again. Do you follow sleep hygiene? When i have trouble falling/staying asleep I just get out of the bed and sit in the dark. It sucks, I know.

 

 

[[wo...]]

Hi veggiebuddy ,  gabapentin or " a few magic cookies " help me to sleep - only an hour or so .

Ive tried no meds for many many days ,sometimes weeks without any help and i really do just stay awake , in the middle of a 12 to 14 day period i slept less than an hour -  plus the more iam sleep deprived i get extreme testicular pain so bad is the pain and the swelling ive been wanting to die/kill myself  , no one knows why this is happening to me ive been to countless Drs  with no help or advice really , this severe agony started just over 3 months ago , i am currently down to 4 mg per day .

I dont really have much option , get 1 or 2 hours a week with force via various meds or end up in severe agony being awake 200+ hours - close to to death  .

I wish someone could help me or had some answers.

[[ci...]]

damien, so glad to hear how well you are doing. And how is Jet?

 

At 31 months CT, insomnia is my worst remaining issue, But it is getting better. I agree with Aloha and can identify with his comments. So true, this WD insomnia is a beast and it is Not "normal insomnia" it is a chemically induced WD insomnia. Sleep hygiene and whatever the sleep experts say, throw it out the window. This insomnia is a totally different beast, you have to find what works best for you, Sleep when you can, nap when you can, I found for me my recliner chair in front of the TV worked the best for me during acute, it eliminated the anxiety I would feel trying to fall asleep in bed.

 

I still have broken sleep, usually 3-6 hours of broken sleep but I can sleep most nights now. And the really good news is I can take naps, w/o out waking up in a panic, no more toxic naps........I LOVE my naps now.......

[[ve...]]

Wolfsbane, I'm so sorry to hear that you're in so much pain. Doctors cannot really help, I know that first hand, you really don't want to hear this, but all sleep meds lose effectiveness over the long run. I wish I could be more help, if you can't sleep and if you don't get frustrated lying there, it might help, especially for your body to rest. But trust me, you will sleep again, without meds. It might be just a couple of hours here and there, but you will.

 

Yay for naps Cindys! I napped everyday before taking this garbage. Having naps back are huge! I hope they come back for me too...

[[La...]]

"My sleep is not perfect, though I don't know it ever was even before drugs, but I'm now at a place where I do not let it dictate my life. I have complete confidence that I will get enough sleep and it will not be something that destroys me."

 

Good to hear from you damien. At almost 3 YEARS off my last benzo dose, I would have to concur with your sentiment above. One minor difference I would point out is that while my sleep was not perfect pre benzo (whose is?), it was fucking amazing, as in, the alarm clock could buzz for hours and I wouldnt even notice it, back to back 8+ hr nights would come effortlessly. These days, not so much.

 

But I agree, that sleep no longer dictates my life, and I am confident I will get enough, even if one or two nights are a bit light (5-6 hours only). We've broken through the wall of fear (of insomnia) that no longer binds us. I'm still sensitive to stress, which can disrupt my sleep or bring on minor sxs, so I try like hell to keep a low stress life. Shouldn't we all?

 

Thanks for the update.

 

laser

[[wo...]]

Thanks veggiebuddy , was another bad night last night , lucky if it was ten to 15 sleep minutes before i went to GP this morning .

Exacerbating my problems is - i live in a 2nd floor  flat ( apartment ) and my neighbours below are to say the least undesirables , ive been here 17 years but 7 years ago we had neighbours playing music loudly up to 24 hours a day sometimes , eventually they were removed , then up until 2 months ago we had a heavy drinker/drunk smashing the floor with a sledge hammer sometimes up to 3 am saying he was going to kill every one in the building , then peace for a couple of months as it was empty , now we have a family move in 6 days ago whom are all weed addicts the whole building stinks now - and the young girl about 16 or 17 has that severe weed cough  coughing about every 40 seconds throughout all day and all the night ... i feel iam living a nightmare  life ..

[[Ce...]]

Thanks veggiebuddy , was another bad night last night , lucky if it was ten to 15 sleep minutes before i went to GP this morning .

Exacerbating my problems is - i live in a 2nd floor  flat ( apartment ) and my neighbours below are to say the least undesirables , ive been here 17 years but 7 years ago we had neighbours playing music loudly up to 24 hours a day sometimes , eventually they were removed , then up until 2 months ago we had a heavy drinker/drunk smashing the floor with a sledge hammer sometimes up to 3 am saying he was going to kill every one in the building , then peace for a couple of months as it was empty , now we have a family move in 6 days ago whom are all weed addicts the whole building stinks now - and the young girl about 16 or 17 has that severe weed cough  coughing about every 40 seconds throughout all day and all the night ... i feel iam living a nightmare  life ..

 

Holy buckets, wolfbane!  Maybe you need to consider moving?? This can't be helping you.

[[sl...]]

Wolf bane-  my life is hell right now too with sleep- pure, agonizing hell!  I couldn't even take my girls trick or treating.... Sat in the car and cried while my mother walked them door to door.  Reading your story makes me sad for you.  I would seriously consider living in a tent somewhere quiet vs your living situation.  I live on acreage in a quiet neighborhood and just the occasional sound of a cat outside is enough to keep me on edge for the night.

[[ci...]]

lazerjet, love those phrases, " I have complete confidence that I will get enough sleep and it will not be something that destroys me." and "we broken thru the wall of fear."................wow, yeah, we made it out of hell.......thanks for the reminder of the progress I have made!

[[ve...]]

 

Thanks veggiebuddy , was another bad night last night , lucky if it was ten to 15 sleep minutes before i went to GP this morning .

Exacerbating my problems is - i live in a 2nd floor  flat ( apartment ) and my neighbours below are to say the least undesirables , ive been here 17 years but 7 years ago we had neighbours playing music loudly up to 24 hours a day sometimes , eventually they were removed , then up until 2 months ago we had a heavy drinker/drunk smashing the floor with a sledge hammer sometimes up to 3 am saying he was going to kill every one in the building , then peace for a couple of months as it was empty , now we have a family move in 6 days ago whom are all weed addicts the whole building stinks now - and the young girl about 16 or 17 has that severe weed cough  coughing about every 40 seconds throughout all day and all the night ... i feel iam living a nightmare  life ..

 

[/quote

 

That's horrible wolfbane :'( Insomnia during your tapering and after jumping is extremely common. Just about everyone gets it, whether they took benzos for sleep or not. I went for two nights without sleep after jumping and it was one night on one night off for months and then broken hours here and there. Even 8 months out my sleep is still pretty horrid, but I get anything from 3-7 hours (always broken), and prior to this I slept like a baby. The only way is really to ride it out. I'm really sorry to hear about your horrible neighbours. These drugs are pure poison, but you're not alone. Stay on the forum, we know what you're going through, and hang in there. It's the hardest thing I ever had to do, but we must hang in there.

 

 

 

[[wo...]]

Hi , - thanks people , i have considered living in a tent , wish i had a small acreage . My finances are extremely stretched/crippled to move elsewhere, as of May 2016 i had to stop work re sleeplessness and severe pain , ( managed to do a few days in June , but was'n't really of much help so stopped ) i am self employed so get nothing now , just hope i start to turn a corner soon , been on 4 mg per day now 10 days , using professor Ashton's tables .

I had 4  magic cookies last night and managed to get an hour or so max , they have been a life saver using once or twice a week.

My GP is a good Dr but really has limited knowledge re Diazepam and tapering as with every specialist ive seen , recently got offered an in house detox -  to last  3 weeks  , as i knew full well that is to fast and would  not work so i declined .

Ive never smoked do not drink,or consume caffeine or chocolate, and up until May was in the gym 3 or 4 times a week ...  everything has gone/stopped re my current situation ...

[[ve...]]

Really sorry to hear that... that shite is true poison. I would tough out the insomnia and stop taking anything, our CNS'es are really sensitive right now and adding more medication or even supplements may delay healing. I still sleep like crap at 8 months out, but am fully functional and I work 12 hours. A good distraction and helps the day pass by faster. How do you feel now? You sound like someone responsible, it'll be uncomfortable but trust me, in WD we can can function on very low sleep.

[[wo...]]

The longer I am awake the more pain I get  in to , I've tried nothing several times and ended up in A and E a few times re severe pain and extreme sleep deprivation to the point of not knowing whom my girlfriend is or barely whom I was and stuttering really bad , I don't stutter at all ever normally , I have been that bad  I asked the ambulancentre crew to kill me.

I need to be able to function most days of the week , if I try to get by without absolutely nothing I won't be able to function ...walk talk etc and end up back at hospital again ... where they can't really help.

 

 

[[wo...]]

....ive had so much wrong while tapering , with my endocrine system , my immune system re severe sleep deprivation my lymph nodes under armpits and all over groin area , my heart and my abdomen.

all the usual sweats tremors , loose bowel movements being sick etc and much more .

The testicular pain - directly related to the extreme sleep deprivation being the worse by far , no help other than antihistamines , and "cookies" , in the middle of 12 to 14 days i slept less than an hour , and my testis were so  swollen and in severe agony i thought they were going to explode .

I keep a daily log of everything , and since July 19th when things got really bad re pain and sleep , that is about 104 days ago i have slept less than 40 hours in total - theres no way i can stay awake for more hours and days and put up with more pain . 

[[sl...]]

Geez wolf bane.  Can you create a signature so we know more about you?  It would be helpful to know how long on meds (and which ones), when you got off of them, and possibly what you took them for.  Did you take them for insomnia?  How is your heart acting?  How old?  My insomnia has never been as bad as yours, though it would have been for up to 6 months off the drug as I would go up to 4 days with zero sleep before I caved and took something.  I don't think it would have been possible for me to sleep even a minute without mirtazipine at that time.  I know your despair. 

[[wo...]]

Not sure method of create a signature , but i will have a look after this message .

Iam 50 years old now , i have taken - very very intermittently zopiclone for about 10 years , and diazepam for about 15 years very very intermittently , as i would go many many months without being able to get hold of any and i would be totally fine , just my usual 3 or 4 days a week of no sleep but the other days i slept for around 4 hours a night , so my usual sleep pattern throughout most of my adult life is/was  15  - 20 hours per week. I  have had sleep problems for over 30 years BUT about 3 years ago i was able to get these meds on regular basis , i would very rarely take them daily usually every other day and this would be 5 mg of diazepam in the morning and 15 - 20 mg in the evening - so 25 mg every other day , if i had no diazepam i would take 15 mg of zopiclone in the evening. Early this year is when i must have built up a tolerance and started getting side effects , so in May i stopped abruptly and ended at A and E after 5 days of no sleep in quite a mess, they gave me a maintenance dose of 30 mg so i started to taper from there , in less than 3 weeks id got to 10 mg per day ( fast i know now ) then went in 5 day cycles ie 10 mg for 5 days, 9 mg for five etc till i got to 3 mg - then i suddenly stopped sleeping completely and was in so much pain it was unbearable, i was then put back up to 10 mg per day which didnt make any difference at all really , still no sleep and severe pain - but now only reducing by 1 mg every 14 days , eventually i found one or two sleep aids which get me maybe an hour here and there , but that is rare  ( not a minutes sleep last night ), so i am lucky to get 1 or 2 hours a week . Currently on 4 mg per day , my heart was in so much pain and burning i was taken to A and E again in an ambulance - but they said my heart was okay . I am taking 7.5 mg of mirtazapine in the evening - it does not help at all .

[[ve...]]

It seems like you've built tolerance to the drugs which explains why you're not sleeping even on them. I would advise you to taper it off slowly, find a benzo wise doctor if you can, or visit the taper section of the forum for advice. Looking at your history, you might also have kindled, which means that you've came off z--drugs more than once. You can find out more by searching "kindling" on the forums. After you taper, it is important that you stay away from all GABA PAMs let your brain and CNS heal. Again, do visit the taper section of the forum to get advice, because you will get more symptoms than just insomnia and pain if you get off too quickly.

 

Like I've mentioned, the acute stage (usually the first two months after your jump) will be pretty hellish. Things will slowly get better once you give it lots of time and take good care of yourself. The sleeplessness is pretty horrible, personally I wouldn't recommend sleep aids, but I've used Trazodone myself and it was pretty good at putting me to sleep and letting me stay asleep. But any psych meds will give you a laundry list of side effects and they all lose effectiveness over time. I see that the mirtazipine is not really working for you either...I haven't tried any antihistamines, but some members occasionally use them to get some hours to recharge, because insomnia from benzos can be really brutal. If you can, just let your body rest in bed, even if you're not sleeping. You might slip in and out of light sleep when in bed.

 

Take care wolfbane, things will be tough for a while, but you're not alone here.

 

(Damien, sorry for hijacking your thread)

 

 

[[Ru...]]

wolfsbane,

I dont know how you survive. You are amazingly strong.

I completely understand how you feel.

INsomnia is torture.

Pure, unadaulterated hell.

I hope things improve for you.

[[wo...]]

Thank you Rubikscube.

I have just been looking at my logs , ive slept 60 minutes in the last 8 days, 6 days of them nil minutes , not in good place today .

But in the not too distant past i have been physically and mentally strong , re my work and the gym , at the moment iam getting quite a bit of amnesia possibly the insomnia , my girlfriend is having a hard time of this to seeing me almost slipping away 6ft 4 and 230 lbs, was ,  now i carnt make the gym , my work , or even drive .

You are right - i am living in hell , i have an 18 year old son also - i must try and hang on , but my heart aches so much and i am often shaking/trembling .

I just wish it would all end , i only took the meds for sleep , now WOW what  a mess i am in .

[[sl...]]

Your history with insomnia sounds awful wolf bane!  Did the insomnia come out of nowhere, 30 years ago?  Or do you think a drug or something else triggered it?  Hopefully you will regain some normal sleep once off of everything.  Sounds to me though that you are one of those rare people who can live decades with little to no sleep, much like that Chinese guy who cannot sleep at all.