Daily Micro-Tapering Support Group

[[ga...]]

tntd, sometimes people give advice who haven't had a chance to read your whole history, so be sure you take things with a grain of salt. I'm very glad you have your husband as a sounding board. He seems supportive. I think if you 1. gather opinions/information from various threads, 2. keep a symptoms diary, 3. use your husband as an ally, and 4. proceed with caution, you will come up with a plan that will work for you. You will get off of this stuff. It may take longer than you thought (like I thought I would be done over a year ago-ha!), but you will do it. And one day you will be one of the people writing a success story to encourage the people still tapering.

 

Gard

 

P.S. My favorite mantra is "I am safe. This will pass."

[[...]]

So, SG, how are you feeling these days?

 

Gard

 

Well, I'm past all the kidney stone stuff and back to my usual lousiness, lol.  I'm 46 months free and still struggling.  That was a rough period after the stone, but the anesthesia effects on benzo symptoms subsided in about four days.  I now think I was lucky it was not much worse.

 

As far as the stone goes, I have been fine.  It's like they vaporized...no sign of it and immediate total relief.  I recently had a follow-up doc appointment and he is not convinced the stone is totally gone, so I have to go get yet another dose of radiation, which I am not happy about.  Who is keeping track of all the times I've been irradiated over the years?  They tell me it is no big deal, but after this benzo fiasco I'm not so sure they know what they are doing.  But I think I'm clear on the kidney stone...I feel fine.

[[jr...]]

So, SG, how are you feeling these days?

 

Gard

 

Well, I'm past all the kidney stone stuff and back to my usual lousiness, lol.  I'm 46 months free and still struggling.  That was a rough period after the stone, but the anesthesia effects on benzo symptoms subsided in about four days.  I now think I was lucky it was not much worse.

 

As far as the stone goes, I have been fine.  It's like they vaporized...no sign of it and immediate total relief.  I recently had a follow-up doc appointment and he is not convinced the stone is totally gone, so I have to go get yet another dose of radiation, which I am not happy about.  Who is keeping track of all the times I've been irradiated over the years?  They tell me it is no big deal, but after this benzo fiasco I'm not so sure they know what they are doing.  But I think I'm clear on the kidney stone...I feel fine.

 

 

Glad to hear it SG. I had a stone a few years ago that put me on my knees. they let me suffer for a week and went in and got it. what an ordeal. good news for you and you deserve it.

[[...]]

SG, Thank you for your response too. I am in tolerance and I had been holding at this dose since July. The longer I held the worse I felt. I have noticed as Kgirl mentioned that there are times when I actually feel a little better after cutting. That's usually within the first day or two and then the withdrawal symptoms kick in. I seemed to do ok with a c/c/h/h/h pattern. I think I will go back to doing that after I stabilize from this last cut. Well, maybe after Christmas so there will be a bit of a built in hold. I do have a baseline withdrawal miserable and that is where I try to get to before I cut again. So at 12 cuts a month I will be cutting .0228mg a month. That's if I can stay at the same micro dose as I decrease and it become a bigger percentage of my dose.

 

I had planned on waiting until I was stable for a few month after my CT from the AD but when I developed tolerance that kind of went out the window. If holding made me feel better I would definitely do it but so far that has not been the case. I really appreciate your recommendations though. I will still check out the long hold thread to see what they have to say. You can never get to much information on how best to go through this.

 

It can be hard to discern what is going on.  Last spring you CTed buperone and also an AD, then cut 25% of your K.  Those things can be turbulent and all can have long-lasting effects.  You may be in tolerance withdrawal, but I would not be too quick to conclude that.  IMO TW is unusual and gets over-reported here.  I think the ebb and flow nature of symptoms tricks many people into thinking they are in TW when often it is just the nature of the healing process - we can feel worse before we feel better.  There are also other reasons symptoms might increase during a hold, such as beginning a new med that speeds up clearance of your K or ingesting something you are sensitive to, like MSG in processed foods.

 

I'm not saying you aren't in TW, just that I think the odds of that are low.  Then again, you know your own history way better than me.  Check out the long hold thread and try get a feel for the back and forth they go through, and see if that might apply to you.

[[...]]

Well, I'm past all the kidney stone stuff and back to my usual lousiness, lol.  I'm 46 months free and still struggling.  That was a rough period after the stone, but the anesthesia effects on benzo symptoms subsided in about four days.  I now think I was lucky it was not much worse.

 

As far as the stone goes, I have been fine.  It's like they vaporized...no sign of it and immediate total relief.  I recently had a follow-up doc appointment and he is not convinced the stone is totally gone, so I have to go get yet another dose of radiation, which I am not happy about.  Who is keeping track of all the times I've been irradiated over the years?  They tell me it is no big deal, but after this benzo fiasco I'm not so sure they know what they are doing.  But I think I'm clear on the kidney stone...I feel fine.

Glad to hear it SG. I had a stone a few years ago that put me on my knees. they let me suffer for a week and went in and got it. what an ordeal. good news for you and you deserve it.

 

Geesh, I really don't get why they treat it so casually and let people suffer for days on end.  That seems inhumane to me.

[[...]]

Builder or SG,

Would liquefy ing more than 1 mg of v possibly reduce morning nausea?  I thought it was a stomach bug but not going away. Is there any info on less nausea if you drink your valium.  I take 1/2 dose at 11pm and the other half when I wake up around 3.

 

I would not think it mattered either way whether you liquify or not as far as nausea goes.  Have you tried ginger?  I used it a few years ago and found it to be extremely effective at getting rid of nausea.

[[bu...]]

Builder or SG,

Would liquefy ing more than 1 mg of v possibly reduce morning nausea?  I thought it was a stomach bug but not going away. Is there any info on less nausea if you drink your valium.  I take 1/2 dose at 11pm and the other half when I wake up around 3.

 

Liquid is not causing your nausea, but WD could be.

[[ga...]]

So, SG, how are you feeling these days?

 

Gard

 

Well, I'm past all the kidney stone stuff and back to my usual lousiness, lol.  I'm 46 months free and still struggling.  That was a rough period after the stone, but the anesthesia effects on benzo symptoms subsided in about four days.  I now think I was lucky it was not much worse.

 

As far as the stone goes, I have been fine.  It's like they vaporized...no sign of it and immediate total relief.  I recently had a follow-up doc appointment and he is not convinced the stone is totally gone, so I have to go get yet another dose of radiation, which I am not happy about.  Who is keeping track of all the times I've been irradiated over the years?  They tell me it is no big deal, but after this benzo fiasco I'm not so sure they know what they are doing.  But I think I'm clear on the kidney stone...I feel fine.

 

I'm glad your pain is gone, but how annoying they want you to get irradiated again. Any thoughts to just saying no?

 

Gard

[[...]]

Well, I'm past all the kidney stone stuff and back to my usual lousiness, lol.  I'm 46 months free and still struggling.  That was a rough period after the stone, but the anesthesia effects on benzo symptoms subsided in about four days.  I now think I was lucky it was not much worse.

 

As far as the stone goes, I have been fine.  It's like they vaporized...no sign of it and immediate total relief.  I recently had a follow-up doc appointment and he is not convinced the stone is totally gone, so I have to go get yet another dose of radiation, which I am not happy about.  Who is keeping track of all the times I've been irradiated over the years?  They tell me it is no big deal, but after this benzo fiasco I'm not so sure they know what they are doing.  But I think I'm clear on the kidney stone...I feel fine.

I'm glad your pain is gone, but how annoying they want you to get irradiated again. Any thoughts to just saying no?

 

Gard

 

I suppose I could.  What is gained by knowing it is there?  I wish I had thought quick enough to question him on the spot yesterday.  What's weird is he had me get a standard x-ray and it was clean, and then he follows that with a CT scan anyway.  Why didn't I just get a CT to begin with and skip the standard?  I need to discuss this with my wife.  I might skip it.

[[bu...]]

 

I suppose I could.  What is gained by knowing it is there?  I wish I had thought quick enough to question him on the spot yesterday.  What's weird is he had me get a standard x-ray and it was clean, and then he follows that with a CT scan anyway.  Why didn't I just get a CT to begin with and skip the standard?  I need to discuss this with my wife.  I might skip it.

 

If the (lower dose) X-ray had found the stone, then a (higher dose) CT scan would not have been necessary.  He gambled on the "safest" alternative first, but since that was negative (inconclusive) you wound up with a higher cumulative exposure. 

 

I had the same experience with my stone.

[[ga...]]

Well, I'm past all the kidney stone stuff and back to my usual lousiness, lol.  I'm 46 months free and still struggling.  That was a rough period after the stone, but the anesthesia effects on benzo symptoms subsided in about four days.  I now think I was lucky it was not much worse.

 

As far as the stone goes, I have been fine.  It's like they vaporized...no sign of it and immediate total relief.  I recently had a follow-up doc appointment and he is not convinced the stone is totally gone, so I have to go get yet another dose of radiation, which I am not happy about.  Who is keeping track of all the times I've been irradiated over the years?  They tell me it is no big deal, but after this benzo fiasco I'm not so sure they know what they are doing.  But I think I'm clear on the kidney stone...I feel fine.

I'm glad your pain is gone, but how annoying they want you to get irradiated again. Any thoughts to just saying no?

 

Gard

 

I suppose I could.  What is gained by knowing it is there?  I wish I had thought quick enough to question him on the spot yesterday.  What's weird is he had me get a standard x-ray and it was clean, and then he follows that with a CT scan anyway.  Why didn't I just get a CT to begin with and skip the standard?  I need to discuss this with my wife.  I might skip it.

 

Sorry you have to go through all this junk.    Sure do hope it's all over soon!

[[...]]

Thank you everyone for your support and your informative replies. I can't even begin to tell you how much it means to me that you have been here for me.

 

kgirl, Thank you for the reccomendation of looking into Recovery Road. It sounds interesting but kind of scary too. Sometimes with my agoraphobia I don't want anyone to see me and I don't want to talk with anyone. Other times I'm desperate for a conversation.

 

I've been having a hard time convincing myself to exercise but I got on the treadmill this morning. I went very slow and walked for 15minutes. Now I just need to make a habit of it. I used to exercise daily before this so I really want to get back into it. There are days when the thought of exercising gives me anxiety so I just need to do it and that should go away.

 

sg, I was talking with my husband last night about all of wonderful replies. We were talking about how as I was getting better and better and then I started to get worse and the longer I held the worse it got. I wanted to double check with him that this truly was the case as I have a lot of cog fog and was concerned that I was miss remembering. He emphatically said that I was getting worse. That and the fact that when I was going really slow c/c/h/h/h I often felt better the second day of cutting and the fact that I have been on this medicine years ago so I believe I kindled as soon as I went back on it lead me to believe I have TW.

 

I do know that it is rare, there are other factors that have led me to this conclusion as well. I had tolerance withdrawal back in Novemeber last year when I first went on it. When I increased my meds for the CT from the AD the increased dose did almost nothing and then after ten days there was no effect from it. I did that twice. I was making great strides in recoverying from the CT. I had really long windows that got longer each time I had one. My waves were so light that I would have called them windows when I was in acute and then everything went backwards. In fact I don't know the last time I had a window. Actually I do, it was when I started moving my meds around. The first couple of days I felt great and then it has been awful since then. That was the begining of October. I know with my history it can be hard to ascertain if it truly is TW and I have been reading the long hold thread. So far it seems that many of them do get better. I held for four months at the dose I'm on and progressively got worse. How would I know for sure??

 

tntd, sometimes people give advice who haven't had a chance to read your whole history, so be sure you take things with a grain of salt. I'm very glad you have your husband as a sounding board. He seems supportive. I think if you 1. gather opinions/information from various threads, 2. keep a symptoms diary, 3. use your husband as an ally, and 4. proceed with caution, you will come up with a plan that will work for you. You will get off of this stuff. It may take longer than you thought (like I thought I would be done over a year ago-ha!), but you will do it. And one day you will be one of the people writing a success story to encourage the people still tapering.

 

Gard

 

P.S. My favorite mantra is "I am safe. This will pass."

 

Hi Gard, I really like your mantra. I've been trying to figure one out since you suggested it. I've been using "The Best is Yet to Come" so far.

 

I do all the things that you recommend. I'm also a member of Surviving Antidepressants and the first thing they told me to do was to keep a medications and symptoms journal. I have done that everyday since June 4. That's a lot of information I don't know what I would do without my husband. He has been my rock through all of this. We have pretty much decided to hold through the holidays to try to get me back to my baseline and also see if anything improves as I had been holding for four months prior to starting my taper. Then the taper that seemed to work the best was the c/c/h/h/h. I stayed mostly functional and the symptoms were minimal. I even often had a bit of relief on one of the days of the cuts, which I thought was weird until I saw that Kgirl also experienced that.

 

badsocref, Thank you for your reassurance and recommendations. I'm pretty sure I'm in tolerance withdrawal but SG has made me question and I will be looking at the long hold thread to hopefully get more answers. I seem to be more like Kgirl so far though so I still believe I am in TW.

 

I can't begin to express my thankfullness to all of you for taking the time to help me with this dilemma I'm in. I hope that all of you find some enjoyment from your day today. 

 

 

 

[[sh...]]

Hey guys!

 

Tntd,  I would vote to keep tapering for you,  maybe hold through Christmas and once the holidays are over and you get a window of feeling good start your taper back up.

 

For all, I personally believe that our bodies and emotions go through natural cycles of ups and downs.  That being said I feel your sensitivity to these moves up and down are magified tremendously by benzos.  This to me means that sometimes what you are feeling may be natural waves of emotions and will go away naturally in a few days and may not always be caused by a daily cut.  Just something to keep in mind if you are doing daily tapering.  This was very helpful for me to remember during my taper.  I paid very close attention to when my moods went south and it was usually about every 2 weeks,  I would have 3 or 4 very bad days of anxiety and depression then it would go away.  Again I feel this is natural and magnified by a reduction in benzos.

 

I hoped I explained that right...  please let me know if that made sense.

 

Stay strong!

sharkey

[[Ma...]]

Builder or SG,

 

I assume dmt reduces withdrawal symptoms. But this nausea could be that? I thought valium causes gastro/nausea. It goes away after 12. Pm. So i think it's the valium. 

[[Kg...]]

Magnolis: One thing I learned is that I had to take Valium on a full stomach.  I was nauseous every morning until I stopped taking my dose before breakfast.  I also swear by ginger. 

 

Tntd: When I went back up on Klonopin (prepared to take it forever) I felt great for about 3 months and then I got all of the s/x and worse as if I was tapering - but I wasn't.  So I had 2 choices - either get off or go up -hold and feel awful again. I obviously made the 1st choice - get off as safely as I could. Glad to see you also know your rhythm.  My buddy Clona told me that our bodies get used to a pace -and to stick with the pace since just like taking the drug our bodies get used to the small cuts of a micro taper.  That is what happened to me- keeping up the pace at times was difficult but as I said I realized due to keeping my log that the lower I got the better I felt.  So we do heal on the way down. 

[[ed...]]

Magnolis: One thing I learned is that I had to take Valium on a full stomach.  I was nauseous every morning until I stopped taking my dose before breakfast.  I also swear by ginger. 

 

Tntd: When I went back up on Klonopin (prepared to take it forever) I felt great for about 3 months and then I got all of the s/x and worse as if I was tapering - but I wasn't.  So I had 2 choices - either get off or go up -hold and feel awful again. I obviously made the 1st choice - get off as safely as I could. Glad to see you also know your rhythm.  My buddy Clona told me that our bodies get used to a pace -and to stick with the pace since just like taking the drug our bodies get used to the small cuts of a micro taper.  That is what happened to me- keeping up the pace at times was difficult but as I said I realized due to keeping my log that the lower I got the better I felt.  So we do heal on the way down.

 

Did you keep a consistent reduction, as well as pace, the whole way down. For example, if you were reducing by say, .02mg per day while at 2mg, would you still reduce by .02mg per day at .5mg?  I obviously don't know your actual numbers, but just setting up an example.

[[...]]

sg, I was talking with my husband last night about all of wonderful replies. We were talking about how as I was getting better and better and then I started to get worse and the longer I held the worse it got. I wanted to double check with him that this truly was the case as I have a lot of cog fog and was concerned that I was miss remembering. He emphatically said that I was getting worse. That and the fact that when I was going really slow c/c/h/h/h I often felt better the second day of cutting and the fact that I have been on this medicine years ago so I believe I kindled as soon as I went back on it lead me to believe I have TW.

 

I do know that it is rare, there are other factors that have led me to this conclusion as well. I had tolerance withdrawal back in Novemeber last year when I first went on it. When I increased my meds for the CT from the AD the increased dose did almost nothing and then after ten days there was no effect from it. I did that twice. I was making great strides in recoverying from the CT. I had really long windows that got longer each time I had one. My waves were so light that I would have called them windows when I was in acute and then everything went backwards. In fact I don't know the last time I had a window. Actually I do, it was when I started moving my meds around. The first couple of days I felt great and then it has been awful since then. That was the begining of October. I know with my history it can be hard to ascertain if it truly is TW and I have been reading the long hold thread. So far it seems that many of them do get better. I held for four months at the dose I'm on and progressively got worse. How would I know for sure??

 

You worked your way up to feeling good in September, and then it went south.  To me that's suspicious.  If you were in TW prior to this time and after this time, why weren't you in it in September?  A thing to rule out would be anything different since September.  Did you begin a new med or stop an old one?  Change eating habits?  What is different since September, if anything?  One thing that can happen and often gets overlooked is ingesting things that enhance the effect of the liver enzyme that clears K out of your body (3A4).  These can be checked pretty easily with google.

 

I'm just trying to give you a different view.  I think people default to thinking they are in TW too quickly when there are other possible explanations, but this might not be the case with you.  Sometimes all we can do is keep talking through it until something makes sense...or we get tired of chasing our tails, lol.

[[...]]

Builder or SG,

 

I assume dmt reduces withdrawal symptoms. But this nausea could be that? I thought valium causes gastro/nausea. It goes away after 12. Pm. So i think it's the valium.

 

Nausea can definitely be a withdrawal symptom.  I'd say it is a common one.  I also would not be shocked to find the drug itself can cause nausea, although I can't recall anyone else offhand who felt it did.

[[bu...]]

 

Nausea can definitely be a withdrawal symptom.  I'd say it is a common one.  I also would not be shocked to find the drug itself can cause nausea, although I can't recall anyone else offhand who felt it did.

 

:thumbsup:

[Guest [Fu...]]

I was feeling so awful on 1.5 mg's of Klonopin during my taper that I updosed to 2.0 mg's. I was only on it for 6 days before I went to see my new psychiatrist. He told me to substitute the Klonopin I was on with Valium right away without any crossover. However I tried a very quick crossover per Dr. Peart's schedule which was not going well so I called my psychiatrist and updosed from 20 mg's of Valium to 30. Just yesterday I called him back and told him I wanted to switch back to the Klonopin. I have been in the ER like 6 times in the past month and a half and I'm feeling so lost and scared.

 

Yesterday I just took 1.5 mg's Klonopin but I don't know whether I should go to 2.0 for my taper or what. I worry that I've messed with my sensitive system even more and made things much more difficult than they already were. I was hoping Valium would help as it has others who have been on Klonopin for many years like myself but it didn't and I'm feeling very despondent and like I will never be able to get off of benzos. I also just recently added Neurontin which has calmed me down a little but at the same time made me feel even more spaced out/dissociated so I don't know whether to keep taking it or not. I don't know how anybody does this, I truly don't.

[[Ul...]]

Hey Jeff,

 

Thanks for your wonderful reply.

 

Right now I go to the hospital once a week. I have a DBT group that I go to and I try to make all of my appointments on that day. The next day my symptoms are usually a lot worse. I look forward to and dread the weekly DBT group as that is when I get to socialize but it is so hard to make myself go. The anxiety goes through the roof. I'm often trembling by the time I get there but it is so nice to see everyone.

 

I also have a dog that I have to take out a few times a day so that helps me get out. Other than that I can make plans but the terror of walking out that door keeps me from following through.

 

I'm really confused that everyone keeps telling me to hold. I have tolerance withdrawal and the symptoms just keep getting worse as I hold. The windows and light waves that I used to have are gone and now it's just waves of various intensity. I don't know how holding would make that better. Am I missing something?

 

I need to find a mantra and write it down and stick it to something I see every day. I think I will get my husband to help me with that. I really like that idea. I used to have postitive affirmations all over the place but I got so used to them I stopped using them. I think if I had just one mantra it might work better 

 

I try to eat a healthy diet. We mostly eat paleo and have for years but we have our moments when we give ourselves treats. I have not been able to exercise. Every time I do I end with an anxiety attack. Even gentle walking outside did it. I've been trying to persuade myself for days to get on the treadmill and just walk at the slowest speed. I even did yoga and ended up with an anxiety attack   

 

I'm planning on getting a light box as we don't have much sun currently. I tend to get a little down this time of year even when I wasn't on any meds. I'm also planning on holding through the holidays as the stress is not helping the symptoms.

 

I meditate every day. I feel like I should do it more often then I do but I do it at least once a day. Usually two times a day.

 

I'm really looking forward to my son coming home. I'm trying to concentrate on that more than the anxiety of having another person in the house. You are so right we have to cherish them while we can.

 

I'm still feeling frustrated by the amount of time this is going to take. I do feel better when I cut twice and hold for three days so that is probably what I'm going to end up doing. I have no idea how long that will take, years at the least. It's hard to imagine feeling like this for years so I try to focus on one day at a time and accept that this is the way it is for me. I also know that I'm not feeling my baseline withdrawal normal right now so everything seems a little worse. Though that normal as I mentioned earlier is mostly a wave that varies in intensity. I don't remember the last time I had a window but I know I got out of the house for as long as I could. The agoraphobia always lifts in a window.

 

Thanks for all your good ideas and support,

 

So, you're at about 1.2mg/day, right? That's close to where I am, and I can tell you that everything went out the window for me when I hit 1.25mg/day. Not sure why, but I know that a lot of people said that things got tougher as their doses got lower...many said, "the lower you go, the slower you go". At the same time, I was reading somewhere yesterday that some people actually felt better on the lower doses. Who knows. I do know that things change along the way, so I wouldn't expect you to be the same now as you will at 1mg/day, for example. We just don't know, but if you "heal faster than you taper", then odds are that you'll improve as the journey continues. You'll find your sweet spot. If you do better when you cut twice and hold for three days, then just go with it for a while. To me, it's just a big experiment with adjustments made on the fly.

 

As far as DBT goes, I know more than a few people that had adverse reactions from it. It's not for everyone. Maybe DBT isn't a positive for you, but I bet that SOMETHING out there is. Just keep fishing until you catch it. You'll find something that's social, but yet doesn't bring on all the anxiety. And if making plans for something brings on horrendous anxiety, then maybe make NO plans. How about just doing something (no matter how small) when you truly feel like it without all of the buildup? Spontaneous. That alone has helped me a great deal. Planning ahead scares the snot out of me, but doing something on MY time sets me up for success. I live here on the South Carolina coast near Hilton Head Island, and there's an incredibly quiet beach that almost nobody goes to. Talk about a healing place!! If I feel like it, then I go when I want. Many times I've seen a person or two out there and I talked with them, but only if I felt like it. Small successes like that do add up.

 

Light box. Got one. Helps a lot, but I have to be consistent with it. If not, then I pay a big price. Get that thing rockin' for you and maybe read something that calms you while sitting there. A bunch of studies came out that I read yesterday that said the light box is more effective than any kind of antidepressant. I like natural. I highly recommend a light box.

 

Following Kelly Brogan might be beneficial to you too. I love her! She's a psychiatrist in the NY area who treats patients with NO medication and has had amazing success. I truly recommend her book "A Mind of Your Own". I bet you'd relate to it. http://kellybroganmd.com/  We've communicated on her FB page even though her niche is females. Great lady!

 

Do you get worse by holding, you ask? I obviously can't answer that for sure. For what it's worth, I personally found that holding for a while consistently helps, BUT moving along with the taper very slowly tends to move me a little further down the road which leads to changes. Sometimes the changes are for the better, sometimes not, but progress is usually made in some area. If I go too fast, then my body screams...that's when I hold maybe a little longer. I just try to listen to my body. It desperately wants me to listen to it. Keep tinkering and you'll find that niche.

 

As many on here have told me, don't get frustrated with how long this whole process will take. It really doesn't matter, and it is what it is. You'd much rather have it take longer with less recovery time at the end as opposed to moving along quickly and get to the finish line only to have another year or two to recover from the recovery Do whatever you can to find a way to take this taper off your mind somewhat. If we obsess over it and fight it, then it just tends to make things worse. I know it can be hard, but at least try to "do life" while going through this rather than doing this while going through life. Hope that makes some sense. Don't let it control every single second of your existence. Like they say, if you're in hell, keep going!!!

 

Have a great positive day on Thursday!! You're one day closer to where you want to be 

 

Faith!

 

Jeff

[[ga...]]

tntd, if you have been keeping a diary and your husband agrees with your analysis, then it seems your pattern of c/c/h/h/h is what will work best for you. I've heard of other people on K who could not hold. I'm glad you have your diary and your husband to help you figure this out. But do heed SG's advice and make sure there isn't some other factor in there messing with your taper.

 

No matter what, you will get through this!

 

Gard

[[...]]

Thanks again everyone for your wonderful replies,

 

SG, I think I must have miss typed or something. I was feeling better and better and then in September everything went south. I have had a window or two but not like I was before September. I didn't change anything that I was doing, eating, or taking in August or September. I believe that TW started in September. Before that my withdrawal symptoms from my CT from the AD were steadily getting better. So September is when the holding stopped working and the waves started being almost continual with a one day window that would pop up here and there or when I would do a cut I would get a window sometimes. I know that moving my meds was like a cut so I'm assuming that's why I got a window then. Other than that it just got worse and worse. I stopped eating cruciferous vegetables months ago sadly, as I really like them. I really appreciate your input on this and if there is anything else you can think of that might have caused me issues I am definitely all ears.

 

Sharkey, Thanks for your vote. I believe that is what I am going to do but at a very slow pace. I think I understand what you are saying about our emotions changing. I will try to remember that and stick to the pace my body normally likes. For women we have the hormonal issues too and that can wreak it's own havoc with the tapering.

 

kgirl, My body seemed to like c/c/h/h/h so I guess that's what I will go back to. It's slow but at least it is moving forward. I need to stabilize first as I think my body did not like all the changes, stops, and starts and even though I'm three days into a hold I still feel pretty bad. I'm planning on holding for at least two more days and then I will re-evaluate. Did you find you had issues sticking to your pace during your cycle?

 

I'm only on page 17 of your log, maybe I will skip forward past your hold and updose as I already know what happens with that. I'm so glad you were able to get off these meds. I hope that as I get lower I will feel better too.

 

Jeff, You have such wonderful ideas. When it was warmer out there was one day that even though I was feeling agoraphobic I spontaneously took my dog for a walk in the middle of the day. She was so excited!! I did end up feeling really anxious by the end of the walk but I wouldn't have gone at all if I had planned it.

 

I really like the people in my DBT group which is why I keep going. I actually learned between DBT and some posts on here, maybe even this thread, how to use acceptance. I have to re-accept every day and when I'm feeling really awful I don't always make it to acceptance but I was so excited when I figured it out. It has made such a big difference. While talking with all the wonderful people on this thread I have had to learn to accept that this taper is not going to go the way that I wanted it to and that's ok, at least I will still be tapering and working towards my goal of getting off of this poison. Other than that DBT really hasn't taught me anything so I go for the socialization. We often end up laughing and chatting so I find it worth it to fight my way out the door to get there. I'm not sure if this will remain true as the group of people is starting to change and not for the better. 

 

I have seen a few things by Kelly Brogan and I liked them. Thank you for recommending her book. I didn't realize she has a Facebook page, I will definitely look that up 

 

I am at 1.2 but I started at 1.25 on Nov 1 so I don't know think that would really be considered lower 

 

I will try to do what you suggest and live life while going through this. Instead of the other way around. By the way, I managed to get on the treadmill for fifteen minutes today  I am also crocheting things for people and that helps me feel like I'm doing something. I'm planning on making some for shelters.

 

Gard, Thanks for your input. My hubby is a great resource for me, especially with all the cog fog. We have both tried to figure out what else might have happened as per SG's thoughts but we can think of nothing else. If I run into more problems I will definitly be pulling my journal out and talking with my husband again but hopefully the c/c/h/h/h will do the trick.

 

Thanks again to everyone for all your input it has all helped me as I am trying to figure all of this out. You guys are the best 

 

[[ga...]]

tntd, I'm really glad to hear you're in a good DBT group. I think the group dynamics and the skill of the therapist matter tremendously with both CBT and DBT. I've tried pulling some DBT tools out of a book I read. The group near me with openings has a dreadful leader, so I hear. That's why I went with the book! I use the tools I find helpful and ignore the rest.

 

Gard

[[Ma...]]

What is the difference between dbt and cbt?