Daily Micro-Tapering Support Group

[[de...]]

SG I have a big question..there is a mass thats been found in my esophagus so i only have 1/4 swallowing space now and have lost down to 116lbs..i go to the gi surgeon on friday..

 

my question now is i cant swallow my tablet so i have been crushing it and taking it in a big spoon of hot broth and then drinking broth to get rid of the taste this is day 3 of doing that..

would that be the same as liquid taper or just like people who crush their pills and take it that way cause i know when you switch to a liquid taper its like a cut..and tonight i dont feel quite right and thats what made me think about it..but with so much else going on right now its hard to know whats what..

 

 

thanks so much..

 

deep

[[do...]]

If you feel symptoms have gotten worse I'd either hold or reduce my cut size. I would not push through - these drugs do not work that way.

 

That's what I'm doing. Holding. Been holding for over 2 months. Very hard not to get discouraged when you're making no progress toward getting off. But I do think I have seen a slight improvement in my symptoms and my doctor wants me to keep holding. I'm with my primary now since my anti-benzo psychiatrist left. She is not anti-benzo.

 

Do you think there's anything to gain from holding so long? I did manage to start my hold at an even number of capsules, so that's one advantage, no dissolving. 

 

Gard

 

Yes, I do.  I believe the body is always working on the problem so time is not wasted during holds.  I think long holds are a very good thing and will pay off in time.

 

Thank you, SG. I always worry about being on the darn benzo for so long. I only took it as prescribed for 6 months before I started my taper. Thought I'd be off in 6 months. I tapered for a year to get to where I am and have been holding for over 2 months now. (Primary doctor has been messing with my gabapentin and Seroquel during this time. So not exactly a pure hold until this past week.)  Obviously I have over a year left to go. It seems so ridiculous. 6 months of a prescription and then years to get off?  But I will be patient for another month. Well, I will do my best imitation of being patient. 

 

Gard

 

Hi Gardener,

 

How are you?  I have not posted in months and stopped by to checked in on everyone.  I was reading your above post and noticed you mentioned gabapentin.  This was just prescribed  for me to FINALLY help me get off of this last bit of ativan.

 

I am leery of new meds but am still scared to finish my taper because of the withdrawal symptoms that I got last time: the sensitivity to lights and the sense of depersonalization.

 

Will gabapentin just be another med that I will have to taper off of?  Does it have lots of side effects.

 

Thanks so much.

doodle dog

 

Doodle! I've been thinking about you and wondering how you're doing. I'm sorry you're having a hard time. I have been, too, and have been holding for 2 months. I think it is paying off. Symptoms are improving.

 

Yes, gabapentin needs to be tapered. Some people say the taper is easy and some say it's hard. When I recently cut mine back (pretty aggressively), it was painful; but not as painful as a benzo cut.

 

Many years ago I was on a low dose of gabapentin (100mg 3 times/day) for autoimmune neuropathy and slowly tapered off of it with no symptoms at all.

 

Now I'm at 200+200+300 of gabapentin for Restless Leg Syndrome, neuropathy, and tapering symptoms. I found it very sedating at first, could hardly function, but I seem to be getting used to it. It's not as sedating as it used to be. I actually have been driving and running errands some days and have not yet crashed the car (but came close today ).

 

Years ago when I took it for neuropathy, the pain clinic doctor said they start people on gabapentin low and build up slowly to minimize side effects (first 100mg just at bedtime, then twice a day then 3 times a day, and then upping to 200mg, 300mg, until they get a dose that works).  This time, my primary just hit me with 300+300+300. Holy mackerel! Depressing, sedating, awful. So I would recommend starting low and building up if you decide to try it.

 

I will say gabapentin does have a short half-life and I'd probably feel better dosing it 4 times/ day, but I don't want to. I hate having my life revolve around taking meds. And I want to keep the doses as evenly spaced as possible to keep things as steady as possible. So I'm actually dosing both the Librium and the gabapentin together spaced very close to 8 hours apart as a compromise between the two for simplicity.

 

I would also say, to be safe, wait a good long time after your last benzo dose before you try to reduce your gabapentin. I think people have gotten into trouble by cutting another med too quickly after being off of their benzo. The brain needs healing time.

 

Hope that helps and it is so good to hear from you!

 

Gard

 

P.S. Should mention that the gabapentin does sometimes make me twitch, little tiny muscle jerks, but not often, not even every day. And I have a propensity toward that side effect from meds.

 

Hi Gardener,

 

You are such a patient person to stick with those long holds.  I suppose that's the best way to go.  It took me 3 years to get to this little amount of ativan.

 

I am not feeling to comfortable about taking the gabapentin.  Why would she give me something that also has a short half-life? I still have the valium that was prescribed to me to try a cross over, perhaps I will try that.

 

I tried the daily liquid taper when I first started Sharkey's group and that did not work out too good.  Maybe, SG57 or builder will help me figure out a dry taper.  They are such great guys.  I see they are still here helping everyone out.  Guess, I will need a scale.

 

Gard, the info you provided is great.  You are such a kind person.  I looked for your blog but could not find it.

 

How is Sharkey?  Did Anne jump?

 

Sending lots of hugs your way.

doodle dog

[[ba...]]

Hi SG, Builder and any other daily taper role models, and fonts of helpful info  ! To update a bit (after scrambling a while back to find out if liquid valium was available in my part of Canada, Eh), I did manage to incorporate LV into my pill dose; a relief in itself.

 

I then stayed on my longtime hold of 16 mg valium for 2 weeks, as recommended, to allow for adjustment. After the 2 weeks, I was tempted to begin my daily taper at .03 (not a huge amount!), but recalled D-Pam's advice re: starting lower than you think you can, so settled for .02.

 

After 2 weeks of .02, I'm feeling okay, so was thinking of easing down to .03-and then sticking to that for a whole month; of course, everything is always subject to change , as we all know. Anyhow, I'm just wondering how this strategy sounds to any of you helpful veterans of the daily taper?

 

Any input/comments would be much appreciated; you've been great re: my adjustment to the LV  , and now my taper is crawling along again, so I guess thanks to y'all I'm now an official daily taper member (and at my pace, will be one for quite a while!)?? 

 

p.s. am glad my stomach hasn't seemed to mind the LV; I admit, the 100 ml water + LV isn't tasty, but it's not bad with a chaser of say, a tablespoon of ice cream!

[[...]]

SG I have a big question..there is a mass thats been found in my esophagus so i only have 1/4 swallowing space now and have lost down to 116lbs..i go to the gi surgeon on friday..

 

my question now is i cant swallow my tablet so i have been crushing it and taking it in a big spoon of hot broth and then drinking broth to get rid of the taste this is day 3 of doing that..

would that be the same as liquid taper or just like people who crush their pills and take it that way cause i know when you switch to a liquid taper its like a cut..and tonight i dont feel quite right and thats what made me think about it..but with so much else going on right now its hard to know whats what..

 

 

thanks so much..

 

deep

 

That happens a lot that people feel worse when they switch, although it doesn't always happen.  You've liquified your pill so I'd say it is the same thing.  You may not have to crush the pills.  Try just dropping them into the liquid and they should break apart on their own.

[[de...]]

SG thank you for getting back to me...so it is a difference and what i do is drop some of the powder on the spoon add broth and repeat four times til its gone so not alot of fluid..it has felt kinda burning on my tongue and throat sometimes do you know if thats normal?  also will it get into my system the same way as before being in the broth?  i really cant take anymore problems right now if i can help it.

 

thanks again

 

 

deep

[[an...]]

 

Hi Gardener,

 

You are such a patient person to stick with those long holds.  I suppose that's the best way to go.  It took me 3 years to get to this little amount of ativan.

 

I am not feeling to comfortable about taking the gabapentin.  Why would she give me something that also has a short half-life? I still have the valium that was prescribed to me to try a cross over, perhaps I will try that.

 

I tried the daily liquid taper when I first started Sharkey's group and that did not work out too good.  Maybe, SG57 or builder will help me figure out a dry taper.  They are such great guys.  I see they are still here helping everyone out.  Guess, I will need a scale.

 

Gard, the info you provided is great.  You are such a kind person.  I looked for your blog but could not find it.

 

How is Sharkey?  Did Anne jump?

 

Sending lots of hugs your way.

Linda

 

Hi Doodle,

 

It is nice to hear from you.  I wondered how you were doing.  I am still tapering, but down to 0.177 mg/day.  This has been a very slow process, and I do not think I will finish until next March.  This taper has been rough compared to my first one.  I honestly believe this is because I did not fully stabilize before starting my taper.  I think that is key to a successful taper. Things are much better now than they were even just a few months ago.  I am still doing the daily liquid taper, but I include long holds when I start to feel symptomatic.  It amazes me that such a small dosage can still cause so many problems. If I had to do it over again, I would have updosed until I felt completely stable--that is what I did the first time.  But, it is too late now, and I find the holds help tremendously. 

 

How are you feeling?  Are you thinking of tapering?

 

Enjoy the day,

Anne xoxox

 

 

[[...]]

SG thank you for getting back to me...so it is a difference and what i do is drop some of the powder on the spoon add broth and repeat four times til its gone so not alot of fluid..it has felt kinda burning on my tongue and throat sometimes do you know if thats normal?  also will it get into my system the same way as before being in the broth?  i really cant take anymore problems right now if i can help it.

 

thanks again

 

 

deep

 

When we take a dry pill it is washed down with water, or other liquid, and ends up in the stomach in liquid.  This all happens within a few seconds.  So why would putting it in liquid beforehand be any different?  We know a small cut of only a few percent is enough to send us.  If 5% of the liquid somehow never got to the stomach that would cause a 5% cut, right?  Is it possible that some small percentage of the liquid that coats the mouth and esophagus never gets to the stomach?  I'd think it would all eventually get there as we eat and swallow during the day.

[[...]]

Hi SG, Builder and any other daily taper role models, and fonts of helpful info  ! To update a bit (after scrambling a while back to find out if liquid valium was available in my part of Canada, Eh), I did manage to incorporate LV into my pill dose; a relief in itself.

 

I then stayed on my longtime hold of 16 mg valium for 2 weeks, as recommended, to allow for adjustment. After the 2 weeks, I was tempted to begin my daily taper at .03 (not a huge amount!), but recalled D-Pam's advice re: starting lower than you think you can, so settled for .02.

 

After 2 weeks of .02, I'm feeling okay, so was thinking of easing down to .03-and then sticking to that for a whole month; of course, everything is always subject to change , as we all know. Anyhow, I'm just wondering how this strategy sounds to any of you helpful veterans of the daily taper?

 

Any input/comments would be much appreciated; you've been great re: my adjustment to the LV  , and now my taper is crawling along again, so I guess thanks to y'all I'm now an official daily taper member (and at my pace, will be one for quite a while!)?? 

 

p.s. am glad my stomach hasn't seemed to mind the LV; I admit, the 100 ml water + LV isn't tasty, but it's not bad with a chaser of say, a tablespoon of ice cream!

 

That's a good way to begin a liquid taper.  Spend a few weeks or a month just going slow and getting your bearings.  A rate of .02mg at your dose is slow and it will hopefully give you immediate success and confidence in the new process.  Once that base is established you can build from there by nudging your rate higher, always with the rule that accepting a symptom increase is not allowed.

[[bu...]]

 

When we take a dry pill it is washed down with water, or other liquid, and ends up in the stomach in liquid.  This all happens within a few seconds.  So why would putting it in liquid beforehand be any different? 

 

:thumbsup:

[[jr...]]

SG thank you for getting back to me...so it is a difference and what i do is drop some of the powder on the spoon add broth and repeat four times til its gone so not alot of fluid..it has felt kinda burning on my tongue and throat sometimes do you know if thats normal?  also will it get into my system the same way as before being in the broth?  i really cant take anymore problems right now if i can help it.

 

thanks again

 

 

deep

 

If you can stand the taste, you can actually dissolve your pill under the tongue. The meds will be absorbed into your bloodstream.

[[ga...]]

 

Hi Gardener,

 

You are such a patient person to stick with those long holds.  I suppose that's the best way to go.  It took me 3 years to get to this little amount of ativan.

 

I am not feeling to comfortable about taking the gabapentin.  Why would she give me something that also has a short half-life? I still have the valium that was prescribed to me to try a cross over, perhaps I will try that.

 

I tried the daily liquid taper when I first started Sharkey's group and that did not work out too good.  Maybe, SG57 or builder will help me figure out a dry taper.  They are such great guys.  I see they are still here helping everyone out.  Guess, I will need a scale.

 

...I looked for your blog but could not find it.

 

...How is Sharkey?  Did Anne jump?

 

 

Hi Doods. 

 

Gabapentin's half life is 5-7 hours. It is cleared through kidneys, not the liver, so none of the worries about liver enzymes.

 

Crossing over can be rough. It was for me when it was time to get rid of that last little bit of Xanax. But I had no choice. I couldn't go any further on the Xanax. Some people do a small updose when they cross to make it smoother. Probably I should have waited longer after I crossed to try to taper. But I had this time table in my mind and that turned out to not be good thing.

 

I took down my blog because I couldn't keep up with it. Maybe when I'm better I'll put it back up. Sharkey seems to be busy being a daddy and hasn't been around in a long time.

 

Yes, if you do MT dry cutting you will need a scale. I did a dry cut of trazodone in the past. It's doable. You need a very stable, level surface, a thin, sharp knife, and lots of patience. I cut a week's worth at a time and put them in tiny plastic bags labeled for when to take each pill. Really tiny bags, the kind you wold put tiny beads in. Think I got them at a craft store. Librium only comes in capsules, so I liquify it when I taper.

 

I think holding is not a bad thing. Sorry, I can't remember if you've tried that? Or have you been tapering this whole time? If it weren't for my Restless Leg Syndrome, I would have tried a hold before I added the gabapentin. Check out the Long Hold thread under support groups. The main guy over there is Valley. He has gathered up lots of quotes about long holds. I'm sure he can point you to them if you ask. They are somewhere on the thread.

 

Don't worry. You will get through this. You've made it this far, you have the will and ability to do whatever it takes! 

 

Hugs!

 

Gard

[[Fi...]]

I mean I felt absolutely terrible the entire time I was in tolerance withdrawal so this is only slightly worse therefore I don't know why I would hold. It's going to be unpleasant no matter how long I hold and even during that hold my symptoms are going to be terrible. It's absolutely ridiculous how long it takes to get off this drug. It just took me 80 days to get down .5 off of my 2.5 total and that isn't slow enough? I mean isn't it pretty much a given that symptoms are going to get at least somewhat worse during a taper? I honestly can't take this process you need the patience of a saint. It's absolute torture. And all of this to STILL maybe end up with protracted withdrawal syndrome? It's truly unbelievable.

 

Yep, it can be quite unbelievable.  I went through the mill so I know what you mean.  All I can tell you is to focus on feeling better rather than getting lower.  The process is too long to push through and these drugs can push back awfully hard and long term.

 

Unbelievable is an understatement!!! SG is absolutely right about feeling better. We can reduce our drug total and still feel reasonably well if we will just go very very slow. This is not a race but a taper to freedom. Do not worry about the future or protracted. Just keep telling your self that "I will taper slowly to zero and walk away." Many have done it and so will we!!!

 

Fuzzy - Congratulations on reducing .5 mg!  I would like to comment on my slow but steady taper rate - it took me 3 months and 1 week to taper my first .5mg; and 7 months to reduce the next .5mg.  At the beginning of June I will start tapering off my last .5 mg.  I took the advice and experience of the wise people on this site and adjusted my taper to fit how I was feeling, and have the least amount of symptoms so I was functional on a daily basis.  Rarely ever 100% functional, but enough so I could continue to work a full-time job with modifications, and have some participation in my family life, again with many modifications.  Not only has this sometimes painfully slow taper allowed me to participate and show up for life, but I'm very hopeful that going slow will reduce or eliminate symptoms when I jump.

 

As you've probably read many times, try not to future trip, and find some distracting and coping mechanisms to get you through one day at a time.  I always appreciate reading about other's tapers, I hope mine has provided you with another perspective.  All the best.

 

[[ba...]]

Hi SG, Builder and any other daily taper role models, and fonts of helpful info  ! To update a bit (after scrambling a while back to find out if liquid valium was available in my part of Canada, Eh), I did manage to incorporate LV into my pill dose; a relief in itself.

 

I then stayed on my longtime hold of 16 mg valium for 2 weeks, as recommended, to allow for adjustment. After the 2 weeks, I was tempted to begin my daily taper at .03 (not a huge amount!), but recalled D-Pam's advice re: starting lower than you think you can, so settled for .02.

 

After 2 weeks of .02, I'm feeling okay, so was thinking of easing down to .03-and then sticking to that for a whole month; of course, everything is always subject to change , as we all know. Anyhow, I'm just wondering how this strategy sounds to any of you helpful veterans of the daily taper?

 

Any input/comments would be much appreciated; you've been great re: my adjustment to the LV  , and now my taper is crawling along again, so I guess thanks to y'all I'm now an official daily taper member (and at my pace, will be one for quite a while!)?? 

 

p.s. am glad my stomach hasn't seemed to mind the LV; I admit, the 100 ml water + LV isn't tasty, but it's not bad with a chaser of say, a tablespoon of ice cream!

 

 

 

 

That's a good way to begin a liquid taper.  Spend a few weeks or a month just going slow and getting your bearings.  A rate of .02mg at your dose is slow and it will hopefully give you immediate success and confidence in the new process.  Once that base is established you can build from there by nudging your rate higher, always with the rule that accepting a symptom increase is not allowed.

 

 

...oops, gotta do the quote thingy-not cut & paste. Anyhow, SG kindly gave me some feedback to my question, so thanks again SG57 . I feel optimistic my tiny move to a still modest rate of tapering will go alright (fingers crossed), since the LV transition didn't involve/require an updose, and the .02 daily taper has not increased sxs.

 

I know after 2 weeks, V can still bite you in the butt, but at my snail's pace, I'm hoping not . When I was doing the first 10 mg. cut and hold taper, I did .5 every 12 days for about 6-7 mos. with no real problems (till I hit 16-17 mg, from 26ish), so fingers crossed I can trundle along on the daily taper for a while.

 

Yeah, even .03 at my dose ain't exactly a sprint, but after getting slammed by my Ativan titration taper and losing ALL my progress over 8 mos. -grrr-slow but steady is my mantra. As long as I'm going in the right direction, and making progress!  Once again, thanks SG . 

[[do...]]

 

Hi Gardener,

 

You are such a patient person to stick with those long holds.  I suppose that's the best way to go.  It took me 3 years to get to this little amount of ativan.

 

I am not feeling to comfortable about taking the gabapentin.  Why would she give me something that also has a short half-life? I still have the valium that was prescribed to me to try a cross over, perhaps I will try that.

 

I tried the daily liquid taper when I first started Sharkey's group and that did not work out too good.  Maybe, SG57 or builder will help me figure out a dry taper.  They are such great guys.  I see they are still here helping everyone out.  Guess, I will need a scale.

 

...I looked for your blog but could not find it.

 

...How is Sharkey?  Did Anne jump?

 

 

Hi Doods. 

 

Gabapentin's half life is 5-7 hours. It is cleared through kidneys, not the liver, so none of the worries about liver enzymes.

 

Crossing over can be rough. It was for me when it was time to get rid of that last little bit of Xanax. But I had no choice. I couldn't go any further on the Xanax. Some people do a small updose when they cross to make it smoother. Probably I should have waited longer after I crossed to try to taper. But I had this time table in my mind and that turned out to not be good thing.

 

I took down my blog because I couldn't keep up with it. Maybe when I'm better I'll put it back up. Sharkey seems to be busy being a daddy and hasn't been around in a long time.

 

Yes, if you do MT dry cutting you will need a scale. I did a dry cut of trazodone in the past. It's doable. You need a very stable, level surface, a thin, sharp knife, and lots of patience. I cut a week's worth at a time and put them in tiny plastic bags labeled for when to take each pill. Really tiny bags, the kind you wold put tiny beads in. Think I got them at a craft store. Librium only comes in capsules, so I liquify it when I taper.

 

I think holding is not a bad thing. Sorry, I can't remember if you've tried that? Or have you been tapering this whole time? If it weren't for my Restless Leg Syndrome, I would have tried a hold before I added the gabapentin. Check out the Long Hold thread under support groups. The main guy over there is Valley. He has gathered up lots of quotes about long holds. I'm sure he can point you to them if you ask. They are somewhere on the thread.

 

Don't worry. You will get through this. You've made it this far, you have the will and ability to do whatever it takes! 

 

Hugs!

 

Gard

 

Hi Gard,

 

I was just reading your signature line.  You have come very far.  Good for you.

 

Yes, I have actually been holding for one year.  I am down to a rather small amount of ativan.  When I joined Sharkey's group I tried the liquid daily micro taper but that did not work out for me.  So I decided just to stay as is these last few months.

 

I will check out the long hold support group quotes.  Thanks for the recommendation.

 

I hope that the restless leg syndrome eases up for you.  It can be rather annoying.  I have a friend who struggles with that too.

 

I hope that your son & daughter are doing good  It is always so nice to chat with you.

 

Hugs,

doodle dog

[[do...]]

 

Hi Gardener,

 

You are such a patient person to stick with those long holds.  I suppose that's the best way to go.  It took me 3 years to get to this little amount of ativan.

 

I am not feeling to comfortable about taking the gabapentin.  Why would she give me something that also has a short half-life? I still have the valium that was prescribed to me to try a cross over, perhaps I will try that.

 

I tried the daily liquid taper when I first started Sharkey's group and that did not work out too good.  Maybe, SG57 or builder will help me figure out a dry taper.  They are such great guys.  I see they are still here helping everyone out.  Guess, I will need a scale.

 

Gard, the info you provided is great.  You are such a kind person.  I looked for your blog but could not find it.

 

How is Sharkey?  Did Anne jump?

 

Sending lots of hugs your way.

Linda

 

Hi Doodle,

 

It is nice to hear from you.  I wondered how you were doing.  I am still tapering, but down to 0.177 mg/day.  This has been a very slow process, and I do not think I will finish until next March.  This taper has been rough compared to my first one.  I honestly believe this is because I did not fully stabilize before starting my taper.  I think that is key to a successful taper. Things are much better now than they were even just a few months ago.  I am still doing the daily liquid taper, but I include long holds when I start to feel symptomatic.  It amazes me that such a small dosage can still cause so many problems. If I had to do it over again, I would have updosed until I felt completely stable--that is what I did the first time.  But, it is too late now, and I find the holds help tremendously. 

 

How are you feeling?  Are you thinking of tapering?

 

Enjoy the day,

Anne xoxox

 

Hey Anne,

 

There you are.  So sorry to hear that this taper has been so difficult for you.  All I know for sure is that the lower you get the harder it is.....for me anyway.

 

I have been holding since I left the group but am thinking of trying to taper again.  Such a stinkin' little amount!  You are right, I am amazed too that this tiny amount of ativan does not want to let go.  I almost feel like I am being held prisoner.

 

So you actually think that it will take to next March to complete your taper?  Wow.  But, if that's what it is going to take.  I wish for you all the success with very few symptoms.

 

Think I will check out the long hold group as Gardener suggested.

 

Best of luck to you Anne.

doodle dog

[[ed...]]

 

After 2 weeks of .02, I'm feeling okay, so was thinking of easing down to .03-and then sticking to that for a whole month; of course, everything is always subject to change , as we all know. Anyhow, I'm just wondering how this strategy sounds to any of you helpful veterans of the daily taper?

 

Any input/comments would be much appreciated; you've been great re: my adjustment to the LV  , and now my taper is crawling along again, so I guess thanks to y'all I'm now an official daily taper member (and at my pace, will be one for quite a while!)?? 

 

p.s. am glad my stomach hasn't seemed to mind the LV; I admit, the 100 ml water + LV isn't tasty, but it's not bad with a chaser of say, a tablespoon of ice cream!

 

 

 

 

 

 

...oops, gotta do the quote thingy-not cut & paste. Anyhow, SG kindly gave me some feedback to my question, so thanks again SG57 . I feel optimistic my tiny move to a still modest rate of tapering will go alright (fingers crossed), since the LV transition didn't involve/require an updose, and the .02 daily taper has not increased sxs.

 

I know after 2 weeks, V can still bite you in the butt, but at my snail's pace, I'm hoping not . When I was doing the first 10 mg. cut and hold taper, I did .5 every 12 days for about 6-7 mos. with no real problems (till I hit 16-17 mg, from 26ish), so fingers crossed I can trundle along on the daily taper for a while.

 

Yeah, even .03 at my dose ain't exactly a sprint, but after getting slammed by my Ativan titration taper and losing ALL my progress over 8 mos. -grrr-slow but steady is my mantra. As long as I'm going in the right direction, and making progress!  Once again, thanks SG .

 

Hi bablatrice!

 

I'm really happy that LV is not bothering your system. That's definitely a small victory in and of itself. I think there is nothing wrong with going as slow as you need to go to get off this stuff. Hopefully you'll be able to maintain .02/.03 reductions for a nice, long while.  Congratulations again!

 

--Ed

[[ru...]]

Hi all. I am a newbie here and very scared. I posted in the KK group and someone suggested I speak with y'all. Right now, I think I need to stabilize bc I am having a hell of a lot of problems....Mostly in the morning, but it's lasting all day long. Intense fear, restlessness, lack of appetite, weak, sweating,....but, it's the morning fear of doom and gloom that is getting to me. As you can see in my signature, I've had a rocky road with Zoloft pooping out and slowly titrating me up to Lexapro 20mg. Since December 18, 2015, I've taken anywhere from .125 per day to .375 per day of Klonopin. The last two months have been .25 am and .125 pm of Klonopin. When we increased the Lexapro to 20mg I felt great at two weeks so we took out the evening dose of .125 (as Dr. said there is a dose in my system so I shouldn't have any effects whatsoever). I was great for about 8/9 days. Day 10/11 -- I felt like my world fell out from under me. Intense doom and gloom in the am that isn't going away. We decided to decrease Lex to 15mg as it may also be agitating. That was two days ago. We added BuSpar and it's the second day today. I've taken .0625 at night and .25 in the am for the last two nights, but still having horrific anxiety. Should I hold steady or go back to .125 at night and restabilize? It's day 16 since I attempted 0 at night. Where should I go on here to get a taper plan? Does this sound like K withdrawal or something loopy with the Lex or even Zoloft withdrawal (but, that's day 29 without it. Sorry, I am rambling, I am just so so scared. Thanks for your thoughts and advice.

[[...]]

Hi all. I am a newbie here and very scared. I posted in the KK group and someone suggested I speak with y'all. Right now, I think I need to stabilize bc I am having a hell of a lot of problems....Mostly in the morning, but it's lasting all day long. Intense fear, restlessness, lack of appetite, weak, sweating,....but, it's the morning fear of doom and gloom that is getting to me. As you can see in my signature, I've had a rocky road with Zoloft pooping out and slowly titrating me up to Lexapro 20mg. Since December 18, 2015, I've taken anywhere from .125 per day to .375 per day of Klonopin. The last two months have been .25 am and .125 pm of Klonopin. When we increased the Lexapro to 20mg I felt great at two weeks so we took out the evening dose of .125 (as Dr. said there is a dose in my system so I shouldn't have any effects whatsoever). I was great for about 8/9 days. Day 10/11 -- I felt like my world fell out from under me. Intense doom and gloom in the am that isn't going away. We decided to decrease Lex to 15mg as it may also be agitating. That was two days ago. We added BuSpar and it's the second day today. I've taken .0625 at night and .25 in the am for the last two nights, but still having horrific anxiety. Should I hold steady or go back to .125 at night and restabilize? It's day 16 since I attempted 0 at night. Where should I go on here to get a taper plan? Does this sound like K withdrawal or something loopy with the Lex or even Zoloft withdrawal (but, that's day 29 without it. Sorry, I am rambling, I am just so so scared. Thanks for your thoughts and advice.

 

You've got a lot going on there.  The first thing to realize is that all those drugs have the potential to cause benzo-like symptoms.  If I followed your story, you recently went up on the lexapro and cut 33% of your K.  Then you decreased lexapro by 25% soon after and added in Buspar.  What you might do is put all the K back and put the lexapro back too, and get rid of the Buspar.  Then just hold steady until it all comes right.  Hopefully these changes are recent enough that they can be easily reversed.  Then you can think about tapering.  That's my opinion anyway.

[[ru...]]

Hi all. I am a newbie here and very scared. I posted in the KK group and someone suggested I speak with y'all. Right now, I think I need to stabilize bc I am having a hell of a lot of problems....Mostly in the morning, but it's lasting all day long. Intense fear, restlessness, lack of appetite, weak, sweating,....but, it's the morning fear of doom and gloom that is getting to me. As you can see in my signature, I've had a rocky road with Zoloft pooping out and slowly titrating me up to Lexapro 20mg. Since December 18, 2015, I've taken anywhere from .125 per day to .375 per day of Klonopin. The last two months have been .25 am and .125 pm of Klonopin. When we increased the Lexapro to 20mg I felt great at two weeks so we took out the evening dose of .125 (as Dr. said there is a dose in my system so I shouldn't have any effects whatsoever). I was great for about 8/9 days. Day 10/11 -- I felt like my world fell out from under me. Intense doom and gloom in the am that isn't going away. We decided to decrease Lex to 15mg as it may also be agitating. That was two days ago. We added BuSpar and it's the second day today. I've taken .0625 at night and .25 in the am for the last two nights, but still having horrific anxiety. Should I hold steady or go back to .125 at night and restabilize? It's day 16 since I attempted 0 at night. Where should I go on here to get a taper plan? Does this sound like K withdrawal or something loopy with the Lex or even Zoloft withdrawal (but, that's day 29 without it. Sorry, I am rambling, I am just so so scared. Thanks for your thoughts and advice.

 

You've got a lot going on there.  The first thing to realize is that all those drugs have the potential to cause benzo-like symptoms.  If I followed your story, you recently went up on the lexapro and cut 33% of your K.  Then you decreased lexapro by 25% soon after and added in Buspar.  What you might do is put all the K back and put the lexapro back too, and get rid of the Buspar.  Then just hold steady until it all comes right.  Hopefully these changes are recent enough that they can be easily reversed.  Then you can think about tapering.  That's my opinion anyway.

 

 

Thank you, I agree. It's only day 2 of the Lex decrease. She thought it may be too stimuilating for me because my Genesight test said that it's in the "yellow" caution zone and that I might do better at lower dosages.  (Zoloft was in yellow for me also, but I was on it twice for a total of 17 years with no problem).  I think I will just start taking the "real" .125 dose at night again and pray I restabilize. She keeps telling me it's not withdrawals. Then why was I doing so well for 3 weeks until day 9,10,11 of decreased Klonopin??? Ugh...grr. I hope I haven't built up a tolerance in just a short time on the Klonopin, either. This whole thing sucks. I want my life back. Thanks again for your thoughts!

[[...]]

You've got a lot going on there.  The first thing to realize is that all those drugs have the potential to cause benzo-like symptoms.  If I followed your story, you recently went up on the lexapro and cut 33% of your K.  Then you decreased lexapro by 25% soon after and added in Buspar.  What you might do is put all the K back and put the lexapro back too, and get rid of the Buspar.  Then just hold steady until it all comes right.  Hopefully these changes are recent enough that they can be easily reversed.  Then you can think about tapering.  That's my opinion anyway.

 

 

Thank you, I agree. It's only day 2 of the Lex decrease. She thought it may be too stimuilating for me because my Genesight test said that it's in the "yellow" caution zone and that I might do better at lower dosages.  (Zoloft was in yellow for me also, but I was on it twice for a total of 17 years with no problem).  I think I will just start taking the "real" .125 dose at night again and pray I restabilize. She keeps telling me it's not withdrawals. Then why was I doing so well for 3 weeks until day 9,10,11 of decreased Klonopin??? Ugh...grr. I hope I haven't built up a tolerance in just a short time on the Klonopin, either. This whole thing sucks. I want my life back. Thanks again for your thoughts!

 

Trust your instincts and be very skeptical about what the doctors says.  It is my experience that they usually do not know much about these drugs and do a lot of ill-advised things.  I'd also join the survivingantidepressants.org forum too.  They are used to handling polydrugging and can fill you in on the lexapro and buspar, as well as the benzo.  We're really not equipped here beyond benzos.

[[ga...]]

You've got a lot going on there.  The first thing to realize is that all those drugs have the potential to cause benzo-like symptoms.  If I followed your story, you recently went up on the lexapro and cut 33% of your K.  Then you decreased lexapro by 25% soon after and added in Buspar.  What you might do is put all the K back and put the lexapro back too, and get rid of the Buspar.  Then just hold steady until it all comes right.  Hopefully these changes are recent enough that they can be easily reversed.  Then you can think about tapering.  That's my opinion anyway.

 

 

Thank you, I agree. It's only day 2 of the Lex decrease. She thought it may be too stimuilating for me because my Genesight test said that it's in the "yellow" caution zone and that I might do better at lower dosages.  (Zoloft was in yellow for me also, but I was on it twice for a total of 17 years with no problem).  I think I will just start taking the "real" .125 dose at night again and pray I restabilize. She keeps telling me it's not withdrawals. Then why was I doing so well for 3 weeks until day 9,10,11 of decreased Klonopin??? Ugh...grr. I hope I haven't built up a tolerance in just a short time on the Klonopin, either. This whole thing sucks. I want my life back. Thanks again for your thoughts!

 

Trust your instincts and be very skeptical about what the doctors says.  It is my experience that they usually do not know much about these drugs and do a lot of ill-advised things.  I'd also join the survivingantidepressants.org forum too.  They are used to handling polydrugging and can fill you in on the lexapro and buspar, as well as the benzo.  We're really not equipped here beyond benzos.

 

:thumbsup: You can say that again!!

[[ba...]]

Thanks, Edzo, for the encouragement re: my slow liquid taper I've finally got going; hope your exercise and protein combo are still working well for you  !

[[ed...]]

Thanks, Edzo, for the encouragement re: my slow liquid taper I've finally got going; hope your exercise and protein combo are still working well for you  !

 

My pleasure!  Yes, they seem to help me out. They definitely don't make me asymptomatic, but do make things somewhat bearable. 

[[He...]]

hello,

 

So have been on adivan for about 5 weeks only taking .5 mg. i want to start to micro taper because i am very sensitive and still have ridiculous amount of anxiety. Reading all these horror stories has not helped me at all and i want take these meds much longer    i really don't understand how to micro taper, if someone could explain it and maybe help me set up a schedule to get off the adivan with the least amount of w/d symptoms. it would be greatly appreciated thankssss

[[St...]]

SG, I am considering rolling over the ambien into my Ativan taper like you mentioned before, and then continuing to LT taper off them together....is this something you could draw up for me?  My dose of Ativan is .646 and Ambien is .315 (6.25),  Wondering what that would look like step wise.....

 

I am also wondering what it would look like if I was able to cross both over to valium,  something I could "show" my doctor, to see if she would consider that...and that would be a great big IF for sure,  I'm thinking she will push Klonopin, which is not something I want to take....but, will cross that bridge when and if it comes to that. 

 

Would you mind letting me know how this will work?  I'm still suffering interdose wd, even after six dosings a day, and have been holding, but finding myself not improving at all....wondering, if it could be the Ambien, like you mentioned...worth a try I guess.  Thanks for your thoughts and time....