Daily Micro-Tapering Support Group

[[Ki...]]

Is anyone brave or bored enough to tackle another step in my prep to get stable enough to taper? Im on X .6125 daily- a whole .5 and half a .25. I had been taking it at night just to sleep but hit a wall and learned on here I needed to even out my dose somewhat. I have managed to move my .125 half pill to day dosing. Now its time to start moving some of my .5 to daytime. If I had all the same pills to work with I could handle it but this is a new kettle of fish...

My dose today will need to be dose 1- .017 mg (.03125g)

Dose 2- .017 mg (.03125g) dose 3  .025 mg  now heres where its weird for me - I need one more dose at around 2 AM of somewhere around .025 mg and the remainder is going to be my bedtime dose. Can anyone help me figure out how to start tearing into my .5 pill to accomplish this? The weight of the pill is .130 (.5 mg)

Gawd I hope I wrote that right. If I can get fairly stable on X I wont have to fight my doctor and I have loads of it left to work with. Thanks for any help. It is slow going transferring it to day dosing but at least its helping with the spasms and benadryl is helping me get a few hours of sleep.

(Im still on ambien 2.5 but Im not counting it Im just sticking it out till I get stable and I will just microtaper off it at the same time)

 

It looks like your .25mg pill is 1.85mg/g (.03125mg/.017g) and the .5mg pill is 3.85mg/g (.5mg/.130g).  You dose 4x and want to dose 5x?  Here is what I get...

 

new 2am - .025mg (.25mg pill, .014g)

d1 - .03125mg (.25mg pill, .017g)

d2 - .03125mg (.25mg pill, .017g)

d3 - .025mg (.25mg pill, .014g)

bed - .5125mg (2.5mg Am+full .5mg pill+.007g)

 

Thanks SG! I always sucked at math. I will try this for a week and see if Im stable on it then proceed from there. TY!

[[...]]

It looks like your .25mg pill is 1.85mg/g (.03125mg/.017g) and the .5mg pill is 3.85mg/g (.5mg/.130g).  You dose 4x and want to dose 5x?  Here is what I get...

 

new 2am - .025mg (.25mg pill, .014g)

d1 - .03125mg (.25mg pill, .017g)

d2 - .03125mg (.25mg pill, .017g)

d3 - .025mg (.25mg pill, .014g)

bed - .5125mg (2.5mg Am+full .5mg pill+.007g)

 

Thanks SG! This will hopefully keep me going for a week till my next appt. By then I will either need to break into my .5 pill or will be switching over to something else. So that keeps my total at .6125- I just picked that as a place to start as I just took whatever I felt like I needed at night before. Had to start somewhere.... After I get where its tolerable for a week should I just start to MT off the big night dose?

 

Yeah, if you feel okay with that dosing and are ready to cut I'd focus only on the night doses and bring them down while leaving the others alone.

[[Mo...]]

Hello everyone,

 

I've been on benzo's for 6 months. Crossed over to Diazepam in December 2015. I came from 10 mg to 4 mg already... I'm working with pills; Got 5, 2.5, 2, 1.5, 1, 0.5... To keep the symptoms as controlled as possible because i'm a sporty type (still want to run, dance, walk, bike) I'll start after 4 to liquid with vodka with a daily tapering. I already now about the 100 ml of water and 1 ml of vodka. But they told me 3.9 for a few days then 3.8 is too fast.

Is there anybody who can help me with a daily taper that is controlable ?

Thanks a lot !

Grtz x

  A daily taper means you cut each day, not every few days.  And yes, cutting .1 "...every few days" is too fast.

.

I suggest cutting .015mg each day, that's approx 5% in 2 weeks.  That's the rate I was at when I was at 4mg.

 

Builder, I've been trying to explain but I think we got lost on the ml and mgr.

 

If she cuts 5% each week and therefore has to cut 0.015 mgr daily, how much is that in ml?

 

I have explained the process but I think it's confusing her somehow.

 

 

[[Ki...]]

It looks like your .25mg pill is 1.85mg/g (.03125mg/.017g) and the .5mg pill is 3.85mg/g (.5mg/.130g).  You dose 4x and want to dose 5x?  Here is what I get...

 

new 2am - .025mg (.25mg pill, .014g)

d1 - .03125mg (.25mg pill, .017g)

d2 - .03125mg (.25mg pill, .017g)

d3 - .025mg (.25mg pill, .014g)

bed - .5125mg (2.5mg Am+full .5mg pill+.007g)

 

Thanks SG! This will hopefully keep me going for a week till my next appt. By then I will either need to break into my .5 pill or will be switching over to something else. So that keeps my total at .6125- I just picked that as a place to start as I just took whatever I felt like I needed at night before. Had to start somewhere.... After I get where its tolerable for a week should I just start to MT off the big night dose?

 

Yeah, if you feel okay with that dosing and are ready to cut I'd focus only on the night doses and bring them down while leaving the others alone.

If I need more in the daytime which I think I will I will just borrow from the .5 pill- I guess just in the smallest increments possible. Ive been so erratic with my dosing trying to switch Im sure I have accidentally updosed a few times.

[[bu...]]

Hello everyone,

 

I've been on benzo's for 6 months. Crossed over to Diazepam in December 2015. I came from 10 mg to 4 mg already... I'm working with pills; Got 5, 2.5, 2, 1.5, 1, 0.5... To keep the symptoms as controlled as possible because i'm a sporty type (still want to run, dance, walk, bike) I'll start after 4 to liquid with vodka with a daily tapering. I already now about the 100 ml of water and 1 ml of vodka. But they told me 3.9 for a few days then 3.8 is too fast.

Is there anybody who can help me with a daily taper that is controlable ?

Thanks a lot !

Grtz x

  A daily taper means you cut each day, not every few days.  And yes, cutting .1 "...every few days" is too fast.

.

I suggest cutting .015mg each day, that's approx 5% in 2 weeks.  That's the rate I was at when I was at 4mg.

 

Builder, I've been trying to explain but I think we got lost on the ml and mgr.

 

If she cuts 5% each week and therefore has to cut 0.015 mgr daily, how much is that in ml?

 

I have explained the process but I think it's confusing her somehow.

  If she's doing 1mg per 100ml solution, then .015mg=1.5ml.

 

Just multiply Xs 100, or just move  the decimal 2 places to the left.

 

BTW, .015/day is 5% every 2 weeks.

[[Sh...]]

Ok ! Thank you very much... so .015/day  every 2 weeks. Is it possible to go over 10 proc till i'm @ 3 mg ? And then go 0.015 from 3 on ? My symptoms till now are headaches in the morning, some sleepless nights, muscle aches, some nausea... When i start 10 proc how much will this be ? Still sticking on my 4 mg now and starting in 7 days... maybe I can risk the 10 proc till 3 mg.... Any suggestions ?

Grtz x

 

[[Mo...]]

Ok ! Thank you very much... so .015/day  every 2 weeks. Is it possible to go over 10 proc till i'm @ 3 mg ? And then go 0.015 from 3 on ? My symptoms till now are headaches in the morning, some sleepless nights, muscle aches, some nausea... When i start 10 proc how much will this be ? Still sticking on my 4 mg now and starting in 7 days... maybe I can risk the 10 proc till 3 mg.... Any suggestions ?

Grtz x

 

I guess you'd just double the 5 % amount, so you'll be at 0.30 ml a day, which would be 0.03 mgr then.

 

But my suggestion would be to not jinx it. It's not that easy to go back from too quick cutting. You'll have to hold again and it'll actually take you longer to get lower that way.

That's just my two cents. Hoping others chime in on that idea.

[[Sh...]]

Thanks for the quick answer.. Ok .. maybe i'll stay on .015 then... as long as I can do most of the things I love (especially sports) I'm happy but been missing this for such a long time !

[[Ki...]]

Stick with the safe plan. You are very lucky to be able to do what you are doing- count your blessings and stay the safe course Shake.

[[Mo...]]

Thanks for the quick answer.. Ok .. maybe i'll stay on .015 then... as long as I can do most of the things I love (especially sports) I'm happy but been missing this for such a long time !

 

If you want to keep doing what you're doing, then that is the safest plan, IMO.

 

Fwiw, most people do not have a symptom free taper and have to put life as we knew it on hold.

Quicker cutting isn't better or faster healing, during tapering. Contrary.

No need to prolong it IF you can go quicker.

The best bet I think would be to start slow and if you can tolerate it well, you can always adjust.

 

I don't mean to be a bummer or anything, or put worries in anyone's head. But this is just the nature of the withdrawal for most of us. And when we see people going off at a too fast start, we'd like to prevent them from feeling the way we did,

You have nothing to gain by saving some time and going quick but feeling awful during.

 

[[Sh...]]

You guys/girlz,... have been a great help and support ! Thanks so much ! My hubby made a schedule... and my taper will normally end at the end of September if everything goes well ! I also have my bad days.. this morning i was a bit depressed... and headachy.... but I went running with my son .. and felt much better afterwards... days that go not so well I still try to walk or cycling on my home trainer. I know now where to go for any questions ! What you're doing for everyone of us is great ! xxx

 

[[Mo...]]

You guys/girlz,... have been a great help and support ! Thanks so much ! My hubby made a schedule... and my taper will normally end at the end of September if everything goes well ! I also have my bad days.. this morning i was a bit depressed... and headachy.... but I went running with my son .. and felt much better afterwards... days that go not so well I still try to walk or cycling on my home trainer. I know now where to go for any questions ! What you're doing for everyone of us is great ! xxx

 

Like everyone here always says .... Throw out the calendar and go with how you feel. Listen to your body and don't keep cutting if you feel worse. It'll only take longer.

Your body isn't going to do what you want, it's going to just take all the time it needs to heal and we just have to accept that, as hard as it is.

You can't escape it but you can make it more tolerable by going with what you need, be gentle on yourself, don't expect anything and eat well and exercise IF you can tolerate it.

Whatever is happening...it will pass and won't be forever, your only job is to try and get through it.

 

 

Ps. I'm glad your husband is of much support, that's worth a lot.

[[Di...]]

Thanks Diaz pam, so it means i need to drop everyday, because what i was doing before was to stay in my dose for a week and cut every week.

microtaping means i need to cut everyday?  still confused cause dont know how to do it.

thanks. mcm

 

Yes when you do a liquid taper you usually cut daily. That's why I prefer to call it a daily taper (rather than a micro taper or liquid taper) because it says exactly what it is.

 

I see you have posted on the thread I suggested so I will answer your questions over there. Try not to overthink the process. It is actually very easy once you get the hang of it. I have never had anyone not get the hang of very quickly. Think of it as being no harder than dropping a tablet in some liquid and then measuring out some of the liquid with a syringe. That's as hard as it gets.

[[Di...]]

I'm currently at 4.1 MG of Valium. What's a sane daily micro taper look like from this? 0.02 a day? More to start with?

 

No I wouldn't do more. That would be the maximum I would go with. A bit less would probably be better, (eg 0.012 to 0.015mg) because it's much easier to start lower than you need to and work up if you can.

[[Di...]]

I'm currently at 4.1 MG of Valium. What's a sane daily micro taper look like from this? 0.02 a day? More to start with?

 

I'd begin more carefully at .015mg per day and see how that goes first, then think about moving up.

 

How would I accurately do 0.015 cuts? Right now I'm using a 1ML syringe with liquid Valium.

 

You need to dilute your LV with something. Have a look at the first two links in my signature to give you some options.

 

Once you've decided on the total amount of liquid you want to use you just multiply your dose by that amount to work out the mls.... example....

 

0.015mg x 100 = 1.5ml (for a 100ml solution)

0.015mg x 10 = 0.15ml (for a 10ml solution)

[[Di...]]

Ok ! Thank you very much... so .015/day  every 2 weeks. Is it possible to go over 10 proc till i'm @ 3 mg ? And then go 0.015 from 3 on ? My symptoms till now are headaches in the morning, some sleepless nights, muscle aches, some nausea... When i start 10 proc how much will this be ? Still sticking on my 4 mg now and starting in 7 days... maybe I can risk the 10 proc till 3 mg.... Any suggestions ?

Grtz x

 

 

My suggestion is don't risk it. You won't really gain anything, and in fact you could just lose a lot of time, because what happens when you try to go too fast is that your body goes "NUH!!" and then you'll just have to hold. Meanwhile if you were doing a nice conservative daily taper you would be slowly chipping away, but you probably won't need to hold.

 

Think of it as the tortoise and the hare. The tortoise is the one who wins.

[[ta...]]

I am currently taking 2mg liquid Ativan per day...in 4 doses of 2.5mg each. I am finally stable and ready to start my taper.

 

How much should I cut per day?? I am taking liquid, so I am able to make very small and accurate cuts.

 

Thank so much....Tango

[[...]]

I am currently taking 2mg liquid Ativan per day...in 4 doses of 2.5mg each. I am finally stable and ready to start my taper.

 

How much should I cut per day?? I am taking liquid, so I am able to make very small and accurate cuts.

 

Thank so much....Tango

 

As a starting point, I recommend trying 8% a month at first to get going.  Your post is confusing.  Yo said your dose is 2mg, but also said you take four 2.5mg doses?  If your dose is 2mg, 8% a month would be .005mg per day.

[[ta...]]

I am currently taking 2mg liquid Ativan per day...in 4 doses of 2.5mg each. I am finally stable and ready to start my taper.

 

How much should I cut per day?? I am taking liquid, so I am able to make very small and accurate cuts.

 

Thank so much....Tango

 

As a starting point, I recommend trying 8% a month at first to get going.  Your post is confusing.  Yo said your dose is 2mg, but also said you take four 2.5mg doses?  If your dose is 2mg, 8% a month would be .005mg per day.

 

OOPS!! Typo....and a bit of bezo brain!! Thanks for pointing it out.

 

I am taking Ativan,  4 doses of .5 per day .....and I have liquid made up by a compounding pharmacy.

 

My question is: What percent per day is the recommended decrease??...or what % per week??? I am looking for a slow and steady taper.

 

Thanks....Tango

 

Thanks so much

[[...]]

As a starting point, I recommend trying 8% a month at first to get going.  Your post is confusing.  Yo said your dose is 2mg, but also said you take four 2.5mg doses?  If your dose is 2mg, 8% a month would be .005mg per day.

 

OOPS!! Typo....and a bit of bezo brain!! Thanks for pointing it out.

 

I am taking Ativan,  4 doses of .5 per day .....and I have liquid made up by a compounding pharmacy.

 

My question is: What percent per day is the recommended decrease??...or what % per week??? I am looking for a slow and steady taper.

 

Thanks....Tango

 

Thanks so much

 

It's easier to just think of it monthly.  As I said, 8% a month is a conservative place to jump in.  That is .005mg a day.

[[my...]]

Good morning all and especially SG,

 

Today is a milestone for me.....  .5 mg.  But it has been so hard.  I would like to try crossing over to Valium at this point.  I can have my pdoc Rx the 2 mg tabs and have them within a few days (I prefer a specific generic brand which takes a couple days for CVS to order).  I'm very familiar with Valium and have used it sparingly (2.5 mg on occasion when the sxs were unbearable - say once or twice each cut).

 

What I want to know is how to cross at this point.  Not a MT.  But am just not sure how to smoothly cross .5 mg of K to 10 mg of V and go from there.  Since today will be my first day at .5 I could begin adding V today to help with the 5% cut. 

 

Any thoughts?  I checked Ashton and by the time she has you on 10 mg of V, there is no more K in the equation.  I know just switching without a gradual cross wouldn't work but I can't figure the equivalencies at this dose.

 

What do you suggest, my friends?

 

Thank you.

 

Mana. 

[[My...]]

Just looking for some advice on this dry cut micro taper.  Using a cut, cut, hold cadence to start with.  Wondering if anyone has gone this route.  If my math is right, this is around .015 mg every 15 days or .03 per month.  Thoughts?  Has me being done in May / June.  I know to be flexible and listen to my body, etc...

 

Thanks!

 

 

 

Date             MG Dose    Weight    Weight Cut    % Cut

 

2/8/2016         0.1570 0.053 0.0030       1.9%

2/11/2016 0.1540 0.052 0.0030       1.9%

2/14/2016 0.1510 0.051 0.0030       1.9%

2/17/2016 0.1480 0.050 0.0030       2.0%

2/20/2016 0.1450 0.049 0.0030       2.0%

2/23/2016 0.1420 0.048 0.0030       2.1%

2/26/2016 0.1390 0.047 0.0030       2.1%

 

 

 

[[...]]

Good morning all and especially SG,

 

Today is a milestone for me.....  .5 mg.  But it has been so hard.  I would like to try crossing over to Valium at this point.  I can have my pdoc Rx the 2 mg tabs and have them within a few days (I prefer a specific generic brand which takes a couple days for CVS to order).  I'm very familiar with Valium and have used it sparingly (2.5 mg on occasion when the sxs were unbearable - say once or twice each cut).

 

What I want to know is how to cross at this point.  Not a MT.  But am just not sure how to smoothly cross .5 mg of K to 10 mg of V and go from there.  Since today will be my first day at .5 I could begin adding V today to help with the 5% cut. 

 

Any thoughts?  I checked Ashton and by the time she has you on 10 mg of V, there is no more K in the equation.  I know just switching without a gradual cross wouldn't work but I can't figure the equivalencies at this dose.

 

What do you suggest, my friends?

 

Thank you.

 

Mana. 

 

Hi Mana,

 

I cross people in small increments.  I think this is the easiest way to cross.  If you replace 2-4% of the K at a time and feel your way, waiting a day or two or three between swaps, it should be smooth.

[[my...]]

Oh thank goodness you came back on!  Thanks, SG 

 

So, I'm good with figuring percentages for my c/h of k..... Could you please explain the method - perhaps by giving an example - I would use to do a gradual cross?  What would such a small amount of V look like? Again, just hit .5 mg k today so any further cutting should maybe happen in another ten days?  On the other hand I would really like to get going with this now.  It may not work for me.  But I think it's worth a try. 

 

Will wait to read...

 

 

[[my...]]

BTW, I have 5 mg tabs of V here at the house but will be able to get a Rx for the 2 mg tabs in a few days.  If I began today I would need to weigh the V, I guess.  Of course I was hoping for something simple for a change.....