Daily Micro-Tapering Support Group

[[El...]]

Hi all,

Thought I saw previously that people on this thread had used a compounded liquid from a pharmacy? I was told by the compounding pharmacy last week that the shelf life of my compounded benzo would only be 14 days. (Compounded in almond oil or olive oil). This will require me to pick it up every 13 days and will be double the cost (not covered by insurance) Wonder if anyone else had this same experience?

Additionally my decision to go with a compounded medication over a self done water/alcohol taper  was confirmed as I landed in the hospital last week with a serious infection secondary to having lost a great deal of lymph nodes from my cancer surgery. Had to get IV antibiotics. Am at risk for these infections the rest of my life......that darn cancer, the gift that keeps on giving! Anyway, there would have been no way for me to make my own medication doses while I was in the hospital, not to mention they would have thought I was nuts. Just being on the benzos alone caused questioning of things like....why I was on such a regimented dose schedule as they said that's not how benzos are typically supposed to be used. ......sigh~no kidding?

[[bu...]]

Hi all,

Thought I saw previously that people on this thread had used a compounded liquid from a pharmacy? I was told by the compounding pharmacy last week that the shelf life of my compounded benzo would only be 14 days. (Compounded in almond oil or olive oil). This will require me to pick it up every 13 days and will be double the cost (not covered by insurance) Wonder if anyone else had this same experience?

Additionally my decision to go with a compounded medication over a self done water/alcohol taper  was confirmed as I landed in the hospital last week with a serious infection secondary to having lost a great deal of lymph nodes from my cancer surgery. Had to get IV antibiotics. Am at risk for these infections the rest of my life......that darn cancer, the gift that keeps on giving! Anyway, there would have been no way for me to make my own medication doses while I was in the hospital, not to mention they would have thought I was nuts. Just being on the benzos alone caused questioning of things like....why I was on such a regimented dose schedule as they said that's not how benzos are typically supposed to be used. ......sigh~no kidding?

 

Just FYI, homebrew alcohol/water solutions would have a shelf life at least as long as you compounded liquid.  It can be readily stored at room temp and conveniently transported.

 

I'm not trying to convince you to follow a different path, just clarifying that alcohol/water solutions do not have to be mixed daily.

[[ga...]]

Hi all,

Thought I saw previously that people on this thread had used a compounded liquid from a pharmacy? I was told by the compounding pharmacy last week that the shelf life of my compounded benzo would only be 14 days. (Compounded in almond oil or olive oil). This will require me to pick it up every 13 days and will be double the cost (not covered by insurance) Wonder if anyone else had this same experience?

Additionally my decision to go with a compounded medication over a self done water/alcohol taper  was confirmed as I landed in the hospital last week with a serious infection secondary to having lost a great deal of lymph nodes from my cancer surgery. Had to get IV antibiotics. Am at risk for these infections the rest of my life......that darn cancer, the gift that keeps on giving! Anyway, there would have been no way for me to make my own medication doses while I was in the hospital, not to mention they would have thought I was nuts. Just being on the benzos alone caused questioning of things like....why I was on such a regimented dose schedule as they said that's not how benzos are typically supposed to be used. ......sigh~no kidding?

 

I've not been medically hospitalized while tapering, but I've often worried about what would happen if I did have to go to a hospital for something. Could I just carry my benzos with me and take them myself or would they not allow that? That's one thing that makes me uneasy about being half on L and half on diluted X. Surely, the hospital would think I was nuts or abusing or both! 

 

 

[[El...]]

Hi all,

Thought I saw previously that people on this thread had used a compounded liquid from a pharmacy? I was told by the compounding pharmacy last week that the shelf life of my compounded benzo would only be 14 days. (Compounded in almond oil or olive oil). This will require me to pick it up every 13 days and will be double the cost (not covered by insurance) Wonder if anyone else had this same experience?

Additionally my decision to go with a compounded medication over a self done water/alcohol taper  was confirmed as I landed in the hospital last week with a serious infection secondary to having lost a great deal of lymph nodes from my cancer surgery. Had to get IV antibiotics. Am at risk for these infections the rest of my life......that darn cancer, the gift that keeps on giving! Anyway, there would have been no way for me to make my own medication doses while I was in the hospital, not to mention they would have thought I was nuts. Just being on the benzos alone caused questioning of things like....why I was on such a regimented dose schedule as they said that's not how benzos are typically supposed to be used. ......sigh~no kidding?

 

Just FYI, homebrew alcohol/water solutions would have a shelf life at least as long as you compounded liquid.  It can be readily stored at room temp and conveniently transported.

 

I'm not trying to convince you to follow a different path, just clarifying that alcohol/water solutions do not have to be mixed daily.

 

Thanks Builder, that's good information to have about the water/alcohol mixtures. Unfortunately I still can't go that route. Wish I could. I developed the infection while asleep overnight in my lymphatic system, and was taken to ER first thing in the morning where they admitted me because it was rapidly progressing. So it was very unexpected. Even if I would make large batches ahead of time, in the event of an unexpected hospitalization, it would be a big risk on many levels. They don't allow you to bring in outside meds unless it's a med they don't have in their pharmacy or its if its a compounded formula. And then those meds have to be sent to and verified by the hospital pharmacy. I obviously could not hand them mixtures I made myself. So that would put me in the position of having to lie. Not to mention I was at risk for sepis (reason I was hospitalized)which would have made me seriously ill and I may not have even been in the position to try and sneak my own premixed doses. It's all too risky to go the home made route unfortunately. At least it is for me because of my current medical status.

 

 

[[El...]]

Hi all,

Thought I saw previously that people on this thread had used a compounded liquid from a pharmacy? I was told by the compounding pharmacy last week that the shelf life of my compounded benzo would only be 14 days. (Compounded in almond oil or olive oil). This will require me to pick it up every 13 days and will be double the cost (not covered by insurance) Wonder if anyone else had this same experience?

Additionally my decision to go with a compounded medication over a self done water/alcohol taper  was confirmed as I landed in the hospital last week with a serious infection secondary to having lost a great deal of lymph nodes from my cancer surgery. Had to get IV antibiotics. Am at risk for these infections the rest of my life......that darn cancer, the gift that keeps on giving! Anyway, there would have been no way for me to make my own medication doses while I was in the hospital, not to mention they would have thought I was nuts. Just being on the benzos alone caused questioning of things like....why I was on such a regimented dose schedule as they said that's not how benzos are typically supposed to be used. ......sigh~no kidding?

 

I've not been medically hospitalized while tapering, but I've often worried about what would happen if I did have to go to a hospital for something. Could I just carry my benzos with me and take them myself or would they not allow that? That's one thing that makes me uneasy about being half on L and half on diluted X. Surely, the hospital would think I was nuts or abusing or both! 

 

Hey Gard, I have been hospitalized 6 times in the last two years. (3 different hospitals) they all have policies that they must provide you with meds from their pharmacy so they know you are getting accurate doses. So technically they don't "allow" outiside meds unless the meds are verified by their pharmacy(which means they send your bottle down and the pharmacy who verifies that it is indeed the med and dose you say it is). So you would have to, for lack of a better word, sneak in your meds and take them without their knowledge.

[[mo...]]

Hi all,

Thought I saw previously that people on this thread had used a compounded liquid from a pharmacy? I was told by the compounding pharmacy last week that the shelf life of my compounded benzo would only be 14 days. (Compounded in almond oil or olive oil). This will require me to pick it up every 13 days and will be double the cost (not covered by insurance) Wonder if anyone else had this same experience?

Additionally my decision to go with a compounded medication over a self done water/alcohol taper  was confirmed as I landed in the hospital last week with a serious infection secondary to having lost a great deal of lymph nodes from my cancer surgery. Had to get IV antibiotics. Am at risk for these infections the rest of my life......that darn cancer, the gift that keeps on giving! Anyway, there would have been no way for me to make my own medication doses while I was in the hospital, not to mention they would have thought I was nuts. Just being on the benzos alone caused questioning of things like....why I was on such a regimented dose schedule as they said that's not how benzos are typically supposed to be used. ......sigh~no kidding?

 

Hi Elizabeth,

 

Sorry for your challenges, but glad to see you are staying positive!

 

In re hospitalization while on Benzos and especially while tapering, for "safety" reasons they definitely want to control your meds and ideally want them to come from their pharmacy. While this is a major bummer, I can sort of understand it...on the other hand, without proper preparation it takes the taper out of our knowledgeable hands and can lead to problems since most medical personnel are not very Benzo savvy.

 

I was in hospital for a month for an emergency and in ICU for 10 days and because I hadn't written out any directives and my PCP doc was in a different town I ran into all sorts of issues and ended up in cold turkey w/d as well as dealing with all sorts of other health issues. This was exacerbated by them giving me Flouroquinilone antibiotics for a month, which, while it may have saved my life (I had a severe infection, too) it REALLY messed me up for a long time. It was such a major mess that I was determined to never have it happen again.

 

Because I have health issues that can land me in hospital suddenly, what I have done now is written out a complete record of my Benzo use and I keep it up to date with my (slowly) lowering doses. I also have a directive that includes requests that I NOT be given Benzos or drugs that are cross tolerant with Benzos unless absolutely necessary and both my husband and my PCP doc have copies of these. In addition, I have it in my record that Flouroquinilones are contraindicated for me -- again unless they are the only thing between me and serious consequences. Most docs have no idea about the issues of cross tolerance nor do they know what flouroquinilones antibiotics can do to those of us in Benzo w/d.

 

In re your compounded liquid solution, I create my own using a water base with adequate alcohol content and, like Builder, I have found it has excllent shelf life and I can travel with it without issues, but it is "my own concoction" so I'm sure they would not let me take it into the hospital. I have requested in writing that if I am hospitalized again, they provide me with their brand of liquid V at the dose I am currently on...not ideal, but WAY better than my last fiasco with it all! It's possible that if you hand over your solution made by the compounding pharmacy, they would allow you to use that, especially if the bottle is labeled and they can check with the pharmacy that created it for you. Then, they can just give you your doses, but I suspect you will have to be clear about this and possibly need to advocate for yourself or get your prescribing doc to advocate for you.

 

Given the realities and complexities of benzo w/d, it is my experience that those of us with health issues really need to pre-plan, protect ourselves and educate our hospital staff care givers. Being CT'd by the people who were trying to save my life and then being basically CT'd by the medication that was saving my life nearly did me in since I started having all the usual crazy w/d sxs, PLUS my seizure sxs and they had no clue why...

 

Best wishes to you for a healthy taper!

 

Mo

[[bu...]]

 

 

 

I've not been medically hospitalized while tapering, but I've often worried about what would happen if I did have to go to a hospital for something. Could I just carry my benzos with me and take them myself or would they not allow that? That's one thing that makes me uneasy about being half on L and half on diluted X. Surely, the hospital would think I was nuts or abusing or both! 

  FYI, I was faced with a potential hospitalization several years ago, while still on my full dose of V.  The hospital said I could bring my own meds and self-administer them.

[[mo...]]

 

 

 

I've not been medically hospitalized while tapering, but I've often worried about what would happen if I did have to go to a hospital for something. Could I just carry my benzos with me and take them myself or would they not allow that? That's one thing that makes me uneasy about being half on L and half on diluted X. Surely, the hospital would think I was nuts or abusing or both! 

  FYI, I was faced with a potential hospitalization several years ago, while still on my full dose of V.  The hospital said I could bring my own meds and self-administer them.

 

That's great Builder! Makes a difficult situation so much easier and nice to know some hospitals are more open minded and able to work flexibly with patients. The hospitals I have been in have been quite strict so the whole Benzo thing just adds to the stress of any potential hospitalization for me, which is why I ended up with everything in writing...

[[de...]]

SG  sure hope you are around..I switched to the .5mgs on last Thursday and have been tapering as you suggested.. .002/.001/.001 ect. and i am a real mess..as the weights of the pills are so close to where i am cutting...170 and .169 now..then i take a whole pill which makes it a whole .5mg..with that being said then i have pills weighing .174 and have to cut off .004 to get to my dose..so i am having bad heart palps to the point i feel dizzy..have had a headache off and on since i started this and also have a bad pain in the back of my left calf..but the worse of all of this is the heart palps..it seems at times like its stopping and i cough and it starts again..and the eyes are back to being in a fish bowl again ..so i havent even been posting on the boards.

 

Would it be a good idea to go back to my 1mgs for a bit til i get lower and can cut these better without them throwing me like this..i am at a loss for what to do at the moment i cant keep on being like this i have a trailer to load and a auction to pull off on saturday but with this going on and no energy to speak of it worries me.

 

hope this made some kind of sense..

 

thanks in advance

 

deep

[[...]]

SG  sure hope you are around..I switched to the .5mgs on last Thursday and have been tapering as you suggested.. .002/.001/.001 ect. and i am a real mess..as the weights of the pills are so close to where i am cutting...170 and .169 now..then i take a whole pill which makes it a whole .5mg..with that being said then i have pills weighing .174 and have to cut off .004 to get to my dose..so i am having bad heart palps to the point i feel dizzy..have had a headache off and on since i started this and also have a bad pain in the back of my left calf..but the worse of all of this is the heart palps..it seems at times like its stopping and i cough and it starts again..and the eyes are back to being in a fish bowl again ..so i havent even been posting on the boards.

 

Would it be a good idea to go back to my 1mgs for a bit til i get lower and can cut these better without them throwing me like this..i am at a loss for what to do at the moment i cant keep on being like this i have a trailer to load and a auction to pull off on saturday but with this going on and no energy to speak of it worries me.

 

hope this made some kind of sense..

 

thanks in advance

 

deep

 

Hi Deep, Sorry to hear that the change to new pills did not go smoothly.  My guess is the new pills are not as potent as the old so what you need is to adjust to the new pills.  Once that happens things should be fine.  So I would either hold until things are right or you could try to updose to make it happen quicker.  I would not go back to the old pills if it were me.  You just need to adjust.

[[de...]]

SG  sure hope you are around..I switched to the .5mgs on last Thursday and have been tapering as you suggested.. .002/.001/.001 ect. and i am a real mess..as the weights of the pills are so close to where i am cutting...170 and .169 now..then i take a whole pill which makes it a whole .5mg..with that being said then i have pills weighing .174 and have to cut off .004 to get to my dose..so i am having bad heart palps to the point i feel dizzy..have had a headache off and on since i started this and also have a bad pain in the back of my left calf..but the worse of all of this is the heart palps..it seems at times like its stopping and i cough and it starts again..and the eyes are back to being in a fish bowl again ..so i havent even been posting on the boards.

 

Would it be a good idea to go back to my 1mgs for a bit til i get lower and can cut these better without them throwing me like this..i am at a loss for what to do at the moment i cant keep on being like this i have a trailer to load and a auction to pull off on saturday but with this going on and no energy to speak of it worries me.

 

hope this made some kind of sense..

 

thanks in advance

 

deep

 

Hi Deep, Sorry to hear that the change to new pills did not go smoothly.  My guess is the new pills are not as potent as the old so what you need is to adjust to the new pills.  Once that happens things should be fine.  So I would either hold until things are right or you could try to updose to make it happen quicker.  I would not go back to the old pills if it were me.  You just need to adjust.

 

how do i hold when the weight of the pills are either making me take a whole .5 or less than i should be..??..also how could i updose? When i take a pill that weighs where my cut is..i am taking a whole .5 which means that would be an updose wouldnt it? thanks for your help and hope you can help me figure something out.

 

deep

[[...]]

Hi Deep, Sorry to hear that the change to new pills did not go smoothly.  My guess is the new pills are not as potent as the old so what you need is to adjust to the new pills.  Once that happens things should be fine.  So I would either hold until things are right or you could try to updose to make it happen quicker.  I would not go back to the old pills if it were me.  You just need to adjust.

 

how do i hold when the weight of the pills are either making me take a whole .5 or less than i should be..??..also how could i updose? When i take a pill that weighs where my cut is..i am taking a whole .5 which means that would be an updose wouldnt it? thanks for your help and hope you can help me figure something out.

 

deep

 

Holding is holding.  You can just sit at your current weight until things come right.  But I see what you mean about updosing.  You'd figure the weight you needed and use a fifth pill to get it.

[[ga...]]

SG  sure hope you are around..I switched to the .5mgs on last Thursday and have been tapering as you suggested.. .002/.001/.001 ect. and i am a real mess..as the weights of the pills are so close to where i am cutting...170 and .169 now..then i take a whole pill which makes it a whole .5mg..with that being said then i have pills weighing .174 and have to cut off .004 to get to my dose..so i am having bad heart palps to the point i feel dizzy..have had a headache off and on since i started this and also have a bad pain in the back of my left calf..but the worse of all of this is the heart palps..it seems at times like its stopping and i cough and it starts again..and the eyes are back to being in a fish bowl again ..so i havent even been posting on the boards.

 

Would it be a good idea to go back to my 1mgs for a bit til i get lower and can cut these better without them throwing me like this..i am at a loss for what to do at the moment i cant keep on being like this i have a trailer to load and a auction to pull off on saturday but with this going on and no energy to speak of it worries me.

 

hope this made some kind of sense..

 

thanks in advance

 

deep

 

Hi Deep, Sorry to hear that the change to new pills did not go smoothly.  My guess is the new pills are not as potent as the old so what you need is to adjust to the new pills.  Once that happens things should be fine.  So I would either hold until things are right or you could try to updose to make it happen quicker.  I would not go back to the old pills if it were me.  You just need to adjust.

 

how do i hold when the weight of the pills are either making me take a whole .5 or less than i should be..??..also how could i updose? When i take a pill that weighs where my cut is..i am taking a whole .5 which means that would be an updose wouldnt it? thanks for your help and hope you can help me figure something out.

 

deep

 

So sorry about the trouble with the pills. Can't say my foggy brain can get around the math, though. What SG says is correct. Holding is holding. Don't go back to the old pills. Don't make cuts. Whatever you did yesterday, do it again today and the next day and the next day until you adjust to using the new pills. After you adjust, you can resume your taper with the new pills. You're in a tough spot but it's temporary. You'll pick up your taper again after the adjustment and you'll be fine.

 

I don't understand the math with the up-dose, but if you make an accidental tiny up dose, it won't have much effect on your taper. I did an on-purpose tiny up-dose once and picked up my taper again when I was able. Still heading toward ZERO! Really, really slowly, but at least moving in the right direction.

 

Gard

[[be...]]

builder: I know this is off topic but I made a mistake and posted this as an OP on support by mistake. I have some questions I hope you can answer.

 

Hi:

Hi:

 

I should finally finished with my klonopin taper in three weeks or so. Phew! But the folks on survivingantidepressants.org. said I should taper Seroquel before I taper my Valium. The reasons given is that I have not been on Seroquel as long as I have been on benzos. Also, the Valium should cushion the blow, and the fact that I know all too well: It's a nasty drug. Some suggested I taper all of my meds at once. I earlier tried dropping 25 mg at one time. It was a nightmare. I couldn't sleep for 10 days straight so I caved in and reinstated. I know I have to get off it sooner or later. Perhaps sooner as I won't have my Valium to back me up. I think tapering Seroquel will one one of the biggest challenges in my life. I was put on it after sleeping no more than two hours a night for over a year. I started to become insane and the pain was so great that I just wanted to end it all. Seroquel only works well with a combo of trazodone. I am very scared. I think I would need to micro taper off this drug, and I don't have a clue as how to do this. Also, how long should I wait until I start my MT after I am finished with kpin? I am just super scared of going back to sleeping just two hours a night. Are the SA folks right about tapering all of my meds at once? Does anyone have any ideas on how to MT Seroquel? Pls. help!

Bets

[[bu...]]

1) Seroquel should have therapeutic value on its own.  It doesn't need to be an  adjunct drug.

 

2)  Although I stopped Remeron before I started my V taper (Remeron was a quick taper, 2 weeks, zero WD sxs) I would think an AD/AP might ease the WD from benzos.  Ashton suggests AP can be helpful.

 

 

[[be...]]

1) Seroquel should have therapeutic value on its own.  It doesn't need to be an  adjunct drug.

 

2)  Although I stopped Remeron before I started my V taper (Remeron was a quick taper, 2 weeks, zero WD sxs) I would think an AD/AP might ease the WD from benzos.  Ashton suggests AP can be helpful.

 

Thank you builder:

 

You are my hero.  :smitten:

[[my...]]

Hi Bets,

Just reading these last few posts.  Yes, I have heard the same about Seroquel.  That it can help with benzo withdrawal.  It was suggested to me but as my only reference to it was as an anti-psychotic (my mother had to take it once she had a serious stroke - probably in much larger doses), I had my doubts.  In fact, I think I mentioned it on one of these threads several months ago and you told me it was a good idea not to go on it.  However, especially b/c you have a good doctor who is helping you taper off of these psych meds, wouldn't it be wise to ask him?  The idea of going off everything at once seems unnecessarily harsh and would undoubtedly be harder to do than one at a time.  Also, it would be almost impossible to tease out which taper was causing what sxs making it difficult to decide how much or how fast to go. 

 

Just my two cents.  I agree with builder but also think it would be good to check with your doc.

 

Have a good night. 

 

mana

[[be...]]

Hi Bets,

Just reading these last few posts.  Yes, I have heard the same about Seroquel.  That it can help with benzo withdrawal.  It was suggested to me but as my only reference to it was as an anti-psychotic (my mother had to take it once she had a serious stroke - probably in much larger doses), I had my doubts.  In fact, I think I mentioned it on one of these threads several months ago and you told me it was a good idea not to go on it.  However, especially b/c you have a good doctor who is helping you taper off of these psych meds, wouldn't it be wise to ask him?  The idea of going off everything at once seems unnecessarily harsh and would undoubtedly be harder to do than one at a time.  Also, it would be almost impossible to tease out which taper was causing what sxs making it difficult to decide how much or how fast to go. 

 

Just my two cents.  I agree with builder but also think it would be good to check with your doc.

 

Have a good night. 

 

mana

 

Hi Mana: Yes, I do recall saying to you that you would not be advised to take Seroquel. I replied to you after I tried dropping by too much at a time and had many sleepless nights. That scared me. But I truly believe it helps with my w/d as I don't have much to complain about. But before I took it, I went over a year with only 2 hours of sleep per night. It made me batty and I thought I was developing psychosis. I always ask my pdoc what I should do. I'm assuming he will say stay with the Seroquel until you are off Valium and then wait and then we can taper off it. I think I might have to go the MT route. To me, Seroquel is a ball buster compared to benzos, so far..........at least. But it sure does make me sleep just fine. But I expect I'll have to go the insomnia routine at some point. Not looking forward to that. Yes I agree. I just don't know why people on SA.org wanted me to get off all drugs at the same time, including both K and V. It's a good site, but I have to wonder if there are any Scientologists there.

Bets

[[la...]]

benzogirl,

 

here is my take on this since I just came off 15yrs of using Zoloft..SA says to look at it as the AD is the "gas pedal" and the benzos are the "brake pedal" 

 

so if you come off the Seroquel 1st you have the V to help with sleep and anxiety

 

I have done just that but I came off the Zoloft very fast and I do not suggest that unless you have been on the S for a very short time

 

Since you have such a large amount of V to taper from I would go with getting off the S 1st

 

my own opinion

[[Ma...]]

SG,

Today is my first day with no more K (hopefully ever again). This cross and the one before it, I crossed 5mg of V for .25mg of K because the week of 4mg every other day went so well. This is the first cross where I feel it a little. It's not bad. My body is just used to having more benzo in it by this time. I can tell it's a very little bit agitated, but adjusting. I took my last dose yesterday at 12am and then didn't take today's first dose until 12pm. I ended up going to bed really late. I will take my second dose of V at 6 and third at 12am. Does that make sense? It's the same way I was dosing V when dosing K, every 6 hours and K was every 3, besides at night. I am not sure yet if I will need to add a 4th dose of V. I am sure my body will adjust by Sat and I will know then. I am taking 19mg, then 18mg, and then another 18mgs. I plan to hold for a week and then unless I am not feeling good, do a 3.5% cut. To see how long it take me to feel the cut, adjust etc. My pdoc, unfortunately, would not give me 2mg pills yet. I have 10mg and 5mg pills now and plenty of them. I will use the scale. I was hoping for your input. I also wanted to once again thank you so much for helping me have such an easy cross! I am feeling much better and the interdose wd is a lot better! You really helped me and I really appreciate it!

 

XO Maya

[[...]]

SG,

Today is my first day with no more K (hopefully ever again). This cross and the one before it, I crossed 5mg of V for .25mg of K because the week of 4mg every other day went so well. This is the first cross where I feel it a little. It's not bad. My body is just used to having more benzo in it by this time. I can tell it's a very little bit agitated, but adjusting. I took my last dose yesterday at 12am and then didn't take today's first dose until 12pm. I ended up going to bed really late. I will take my second dose of V at 6 and third at 12am. Does that make sense? It's the same way I was dosing V when dosing K, every 6 hours and K was every 3, besides at night. I am not sure yet if I will need to add a 4th dose of V. I am sure my body will adjust by Sat and I will know then. I am taking 19mg, then 18mg, and then another 18mgs. I plan to hold for a week and then unless I am not feeling good, do a 3.5% cut. To see how long it take me to feel the cut, adjust etc. My pdoc, unfortunately, would not give me 2mg pills yet. I have 10mg and 5mg pills now and plenty of them. I will use the scale. I was hoping for your input. I also wanted to once again thank you so much for helping me have such an easy cross! I am feeling much better and the interdose wd is a lot better! You really helped me and I really appreciate it!

 

XO Maya

 

Cool.  I'm glad it went so good and that you were able to fully cross. From your sig it looks like you did it in 35 days.  55mg in 35 days is 1.6mg/day or 2.9%/day.  Apparently you can cross at that rate and feel well.  That's useful for others to see.  You did a good job keeping it all straight.

 

It sounds like you pushed it at the end so I am glad you plan to hold a little.  The V probably needs a little more time to catch up.  I'd get on an eight hour dosing schedule with the V, if possible.  As you know, I don't think bigger cuts are the best thing to do.  Better to cut small and adjust the hold time shorter instead, but it is your taper so you can do what you want.

 

5mg pills are an improvement over .5mg K as the .5mg K was equivalent to 10mg V, so you have doubled your accuracy with the 5mg pills.  2mg would have been great but 5mg is not the end of the world and at your dose it is very workable and will remain that way for a while.

 

I'd get on three even eight-hour doses and see how you like it so you can decide if you might need a fourth dose.

[[Ma...]]

SG,

Today is my first day with no more K (hopefully ever again). This cross and the one before it, I crossed 5mg of V for .25mg of K because the week of 4mg every other day went so well. This is the first cross where I feel it a little. It's not bad. My body is just used to having more benzo in it by this time. I can tell it's a very little bit agitated, but adjusting. I took my last dose yesterday at 12am and then didn't take today's first dose until 12pm. I ended up going to bed really late. I will take my second dose of V at 6 and third at 12am. Does that make sense? It's the same way I was dosing V when dosing K, every 6 hours and K was every 3, besides at night. I am not sure yet if I will need to add a 4th dose of V. I am sure my body will adjust by Sat and I will know then. I am taking 19mg, then 18mg, and then another 18mgs. I plan to hold for a week and then unless I am not feeling good, do a 3.5% cut. To see how long it take me to feel the cut, adjust etc. My pdoc, unfortunately, would not give me 2mg pills yet. I have 10mg and 5mg pills now and plenty of them. I will use the scale. I was hoping for your input. I also wanted to once again thank you so much for helping me have such an easy cross! I am feeling much better and the interdose wd is a lot better! You really helped me and I really appreciate it!

 

XO Maya

 

Cool.  I'm glad it went so good and that you were able to fully cross. From your sig it looks like you did it in 35 days.  55mg in 35 days is 1.6mg/day or 2.9%/day.  Apparently you can cross at that rate and feel well.  That's useful for others to see.  You did a good job keeping it all straight.

 

It sounds like you pushed it at the end so I am glad you plan to hold a little.  The V probably needs a little more time to catch up.  I'd get on an eight hour dosing schedule with the V, if possible.  As you know, I don't think bigger cuts are the best thing to do.  Better to cut small and adjust the hold time shorter instead, but it is your taper so you can do what you want.

 

5mg pills are an improvement over .5mg K as the .5mg K was equivalent to 10mg V, so you have doubled your accuracy with the 5mg pills.  2mg would have been great but 5mg is not the end of the world and at your dose it is very workable and will remain that way for a while.

 

I'd get on three even eight-hour doses and see how you like it so you can decide if you might need a fourth dose.

Thank you so much! I did do it 35 days. I probably could have gone faster, but I choose to be cautious and I wanted my cross to be sxs free. I am so happy that I did a complete C/O!!! I think it is useful for others to see. It would have taken me longer Ashton's way and I might have felt sxs. I am so greatful you helped me plan my cross so that I wasn't just crossing a bigger amount once a week. I also am glad I didn't cut like Ashton does in her schedule from 3mg K to V. I think that I would have suffered and had to hold longer and that I will start cutting much sooner anyway. Also, of course, everyone is different.

 

I pushed a little more because I wasn't having any issues. Also I felt the K wasn't doing anything positive. I also was taking .04mg and .03mg pills. SO small! Earlier my body felt a little confused, but now I feel much more adjusted. I took my second V dose 20 min late because I didn't notice. I think V doesn't kick in fully as soon as K with me. I am not sure if that makes sense. Also I am sure there are still some active metabolites building, since I switched today. Even if I feel amazing with no issues tomorrow, I am holding for a week. It doesn't hurt anything. I am not sure how to do an 8 hour dosing schedule because of the fact that I won't wake up to dose and I am now sleeping much better. Like today I am taking it at 12pm, 6pm, and 12am. What would you suggest? I am a bit foggy. I think I may not need the 4th dose, but I will see.

 

I don't think of 3.5% as a bigger cut. I am afraid if I cut smaller I may not feel it because when I cut 2.5-3% off of my K dose I didn't feel it. I know I will feel 5-6% and that it is very tolerable with K and I stabilize in a couple days, but I wanted to be cautious at first. What would you suggest I cut?

 

You are right. Thank you for putting it into perspective for me about how much better 5mg V pills are than .5mg K pills. I just wished he had given me 2mg. I know he will give them in the future. Not sure what dose. He also knows absolutely nothing about tapering. He doesn't agree that I should taper or that I definitely will be able to. I know that I should and I will get off Benzos.

 

I do want to get on a correct schedule with V and then see what I need dose wise. I am not sure exactly how to dose. Thanks again for always helping me so much!

 

XO Maya

 

 

 

[[...]]

Thank you so much! I did do it 35 days. I probably could have gone faster, but I choose to be cautious and I wanted my cross to be sxs free. I am so happy that I did a complete C/O!!! I think it is useful for others to see. It would have taken me longer Ashton's way and I might have felt sxs. I am so greatful you helped me plan my cross so that I wasn't just crossing a bigger amount once a week. I also am glad I didn't cut like Ashton does in her schedule from 3mg K to V. I think that I would have suffered and had to hold longer and that I will start cutting much sooner anyway. Also, of course, everyone is different.

 

I pushed a little more because I wasn't having any issues. Also I felt the K wasn't doing anything positive. I also was taking .04mg and .03mg pills. SO small! Earlier my body felt a little confused, but now I feel much more adjusted. I took my second V dose 20 min late because I didn't notice. I think V doesn't kick in fully as soon as K with me. I am not sure if that makes sense. Also I am sure there are still some active metabolites building, since I switched today. Even if I feel amazing with no issues tomorrow, I am holding for a week. It doesn't hurt anything. I am not sure how to do an 8 hour dosing schedule because of the fact that I won't wake up to dose and I am now sleeping much better. Like today I am taking it at 12pm, 6pm, and 12am. What would you suggest? I am a bit foggy. I think I may not need the 4th dose, but I will see.

 

I don't think of 3.5% as a bigger cut. I am afraid if I cut smaller I may not feel it because when I cut 2.5-3% off of my K dose I didn't feel it. I know I will feel 5-6% and that it is very tolerable with K and I stabilize in a couple days, but I wanted to be cautious at first. What would you suggest I cut?

 

You are right. Thank you for putting it into perspective for me about how much better 5mg V pills are than .5mg K pills. I just wished he had given me 2mg. I know he will give them in the future. Not sure what dose. He also knows absolutely nothing about tapering. He doesn't agree that I should taper or that I definitely will be able to. I know that I should and I will get off Benzos.

 

I do want to get on a correct schedule with V and then see what I need dose wise. I am not sure exactly how to dose. Thanks again for always helping me so much!

 

XO Maya

 

If you sleep more than eight hours just take dose 1 when you wake and dose 3 at bedtime.  Take dose 2 eight hours after dose 1.  Each dose should be 1/3rd of your total daily weight.

 

Why are you afraid of not feeling the cut - that's the goal.  What you might do is look back on your recent tapering and figure a daily rate.  That number will give you a good idea of what you can handle.  My suggestion is to cut that amount daily, but I know you are averse to that from your previous experience.  But you can still use it to figure your hold days.  For example, if you want to cut every three days just multiply the daily rate by three.  If you want to cut every two days multiply it by two.  For four days multiply it by four.

[[Ma...]]

Thank you so much! I did do it 35 days. I probably could have gone faster, but I choose to be cautious and I wanted my cross to be sxs free. I am so happy that I did a complete C/O!!! I think it is useful for others to see. It would have taken me longer Ashton's way and I might have felt sxs. I am so greatful you helped me plan my cross so that I wasn't just crossing a bigger amount once a week. I also am glad I didn't cut like Ashton does in her schedule from 3mg K to V. I think that I would have suffered and had to hold longer and that I will start cutting much sooner anyway. Also, of course, everyone is different.

 

I pushed a little more because I wasn't having any issues. Also I felt the K wasn't doing anything positive. I also was taking .04mg and .03mg pills. SO small! Earlier my body felt a little confused, but now I feel much more adjusted. I took my second V dose 20 min late because I didn't notice. I think V doesn't kick in fully as soon as K with me. I am not sure if that makes sense. Also I am sure there are still some active metabolites building, since I switched today. Even if I feel amazing with no issues tomorrow, I am holding for a week. It doesn't hurt anything. I am not sure how to do an 8 hour dosing schedule because of the fact that I won't wake up to dose and I am now sleeping much better. Like today I am taking it at 12pm, 6pm, and 12am. What would you suggest? I am a bit foggy. I think I may not need the 4th dose, but I will see.

 

I don't think of 3.5% as a bigger cut. I am afraid if I cut smaller I may not feel it because when I cut 2.5-3% off of my K dose I didn't feel it. I know I will feel 5-6% and that it is very tolerable with K and I stabilize in a couple days, but I wanted to be cautious at first. What would you suggest I cut?

 

You are right. Thank you for putting it into perspective for me about how much better 5mg V pills are than .5mg K pills. I just wished he had given me 2mg. I know he will give them in the future. Not sure what dose. He also knows absolutely nothing about tapering. He doesn't agree that I should taper or that I definitely will be able to. I know that I should and I will get off Benzos.

 

I do want to get on a correct schedule with V and then see what I need dose wise. I am not sure exactly how to dose. Thanks again for always helping me so much!

 

XO Maya

 

If you sleep more than eight hours just take dose 1 when you wake and dose 3 at bedtime.  Take dose 2 eight hours after dose 1.  Each dose should be 1/3rd of your total daily weight.

 

Why are you afraid of not feeling the cut - that's the goal.  What you might do is look back on your recent tapering and figure a daily rate.  That number will give you a good idea of what you can handle.  My suggestion is to cut that amount daily, but I know you are averse to that from your previous experience.  But you can still use it to figure your hold days.  For example, if you want to cut every three days just multiply the daily rate by three.  If you want to cut every two days multiply it by two.  For four days multiply it by four.

I have been back to mostly sleeping my usual 8-9 hours, thank god! Also a lot less interrupted sleep. Sleep is so healing for me. I also take my last meds around 30-45 min before I actually go to sleep. It is usually around 10 hours without dosing, which I know is a lot, especially with my rapid metabolizing. I just can't wake up to dose and lose sleep. Tomorrow, I will try to wait 8 hours to take dose 2. My body is used to me taking it 6 hours after. I was taking it 9 hours after the first dose in the beginning of my C/O, but that caused interdose wd. My doses are 19mg, 18mg, and 18mgs. I am keeping them even.

 

I am not afraid of not feeling the cut. Usually, that is ideal. If I don't feel the cut I won't know how long my body takes to notice a cut and if stables the same way as with K. I am not sure if do to the possible lag time of V, I might need a little more time to stabilize. That's why I thought I should try to make my first cut one that I would probably feel. If I look back on my recent tapering of K I can handle 5-6% a week or 2.5-3% every 3rd day. I am willing to cut every third day and probably I would try every other day. I appreciate your suggestion and I see where that makes sense for many. Every day is not something I am willing to try at this time. So you don't think I should try to make a cut that I will probably feel a little? Just this one time

[[ta...]]

Got the reply in the Ativan taper group. Thanks so much for your encouragement and good advice.

 

I really feel that BB is helping me make good, sensible decisons...and I feel so grateful to have found you all.