Tapering off Ativan Support Thread

[[Ma...]]

I think you may be better off getting the solution made for you.

[[co...]]

Thanks BDL, That was very helpful. Yes, I agree with Mairin, i will try to have it made up for me one way or the other.

 

Is 1/100 equal to 1% a day? What i would like to understand about micro tapering is if i go down 1% daily or 2% every 3 days...That is still equal to 20-30% a month.

 

If i am having difficulty with a 6 or 7% taper every 2 weeks, how does micro tapering make the symptoms easier as it ends up being even faster? Perhaps the premise is that small but frequent cuts bypass the GABA receptors or train them to adapt. I am really not sure why it would make such a big difference, however it seems to by your reporting as well as others.. Perhaps you can explain that to me if you know.

 

Also, when you transitioned to liquid and smaller more frequent cuts did you have an immediate smooth transition or did you go through a an adjustment process. What were your symptoms like using this approach?

 

I am trying to understand the premise behind it as well as to what to expect so i am prepared in case it turns out to be difficult at least initially. As i wan to try to avoid more symptoms as this last cut of 6% was rough, perhaps i should start with 2% every 3 day or even 1% every 2 or 3 days? Any suggestions? Is 1% a day the normal cut sin this process?

 

Your experience with this and suggestions are most appreciated.

[[be...]]

Well, it's really just common sense.

 

If you take 7% away all at once, then your body will feel it all at once.

 

If you take 1% away every day for 7 days, then your body adjusts gradually over that 7 days.

 

This is microtapering.

 

Make sense?

[[co...]]

Yes,  it does! It makes perfect sense.

 

From that i gather you had no adjustment period to the liquid micro tapering? Did you have any symptoms during the micro tapering? If not, it sounds wonderful. The idea that you can go quicker and feel well during this process appeals to me.

 

I have read that it is good to hold from time to time to avoid your body catching up to the cuts. Did that happen to you and did you do that?

 

Thanks for your help!

 

 

 

 

[[be...]]

I have had a bad day here and there but nothing like when I was cutting 10 to 15 % then holding.

The symptoms are mild and like I have said before most of them can be banished with a good mile run or a brisk walk.

 

I would / will hold if my symptoms get worse. But they haven't. They've only gotten better since I've started this. But I think it's important that I started from a fairly stable place. I had just held for 5 weeks prior to starting this and I was feeling ok. I've only felt better every day since then an I've lost 25 percent of my dose. So knock on wood, but this seems to be working for me.

 

I hope it does for you too.

[[Ti...]]

Tinca,

Congratulations on getting off of Ativan. You are are almost free from Valium as well.

 

As i am considering crossover to valium or micro tapering ativan or just reducing my cuts and using liquid ativan... so i wanted to ask you some questions to help me decide what route to take based on your experience.

 

I am hesitant to cross over to Valium as i know it makes me sleepy and i can't imagine being able to work and function normally on it. It sounds like it did not work for you?

 

Can you let me know how often you cut and at what percentages? Did you have strong withdrawal or milder withdrawal? How many times a day were you dosing? Did the formula you use take you all the way down to 0?

 

Although i am reducing the  amount i cut each time and holding for 2 weeks, it does not seem to be working as this last cut of only 6% has been very difficult and my anxiety symptoms are ongoing for the first time since i started this taper. It is my 5Th day today so i hope it will pass however i am looking into alternate and easier ways to go about this as i will be on this for another 6 months or more..

 

i am interested in learning from your journey. I also want to thank you for starting this thread as it has been very helpful to me...

 

Hi Concerned,

 

I will try to help as much as I can.  First off, please note I have always been on a low dose so I am very, very sensitive to all of this.  I have never been above .25 mg. Ativan!  I tried crossing over to Valium and it did not work for me.  This is what happened:  I took a drop in Ativan last January.  I was very unstable and not sleeping.  So the doctor gave me some Valium to ADD to the Ativan.  It helped and I did stabilize somewhat.  Well, a week later, he told me to pull all this Ativan away very quickly.  I did that and went into acute w/d!  Yikes.  I added some more Valium in (thought maybe I didn't substitute enough?) and it helped a little, but I never truly stabilized again.  At that point, I had been on the Valium for over 3 weeks and didn't want to go back on all Ativan because I was scared I would get w/d from the Valium!  I was also too scared to continue crossing over to the Ativan b/c the Ativan w/d were just soooooo bad.  So there I was, stuck on the 2 meds.

 

So I waited another 3 weeks and then began tapering the Ativan.  My suspension was .25 mg/5 mL.  The pharmacist used Fixed Oil, Stevia and crushed pills.  I kept it in the fridge and it lasted about a month.  I drew out the suspension using a 1 mL syringe.  I found syringes that were marked with 100 lines so I could go down by 1/100 of a mL.  This way I could go down by about .0015 mg of Ativan/day or every other day (I think??)  Anyways, I had to hold here and there over the last 4 months, but basically went down at about .001 mg. Ativan/day on average.  I just drew out a TINY bit less Ativan every day or other day.  I used this formula to get all the way down to zero!  My last dose was .0015 mg of Ativan--it was just a drop in the dropper.  Such a tiny amount, but I am so glad I went to the end.  I am totally off Ativan now and don't feel any increased w/d symptoms--just the same yuckiness I have felt all along.  I believe my body really took a beating from the previous quick taper/quick crossover attempts and I am still recovering from those.  If only I had gone slowly alllllll the way down from day 1, I believe I would have had very mininal w/d symptoms.  Oh well, that is water under the bridge.  At least I finally got off the Ativan!!  Now I just have the Valium taper...and I will have to give my body time to recover from what it has gone through.

 

Oh, and I dosed the Ativan 3 times a day.

 

Let me know if you want me to clarify anything or have any other questions!!

 

Hugs,

Tina

[[Ti...]]

Congratulations Tina!  Try to relax and take it slow on the V.

 

Thank you Mairin!

[[Ti...]]

Just wanted to let you guys know that today I am officially Ativan free--but NOT benzo free.  I am still on 1.25 mg. Valium.  I could only crossover halfway from Ativan to Valium last February--I could not complete the cross over since the Ativan w/d were too strong.  Ativan had dug its claws in deep.

 

It took me 4 months to taper from .09 to 0 mg. Ativan.  I wish I was benzo free-but at least I am Ativan free.  Now I have to taper the 1.25 mg. of Valium that I have been on since February.  Ugh. 

 

If I had only tapered the Ativan slowly from day 1 and not tried going to fast, doing abrupt cross-overs, etc., I would be Ativan free today.  I hope others can learn from my mistake (well, I listened to "advice" from 3 doctors--so actually not my mistake).  If I had only listened to my body and not doctors, I would be benzo free today.

 

I tapered Ativan using a compounded suspension .25 mg/5 mL.  The pharmacist used fixed oil, stevia and the crushed Ativan pills.  I drew out directly from the bottle.  Shake it well!

 

Good luck to all of you.  I am now going to begin leg 2 of this journey and begin tapering using liquid Valium in the next week or so.  I hope to be off of everything in about 6 months.  Slow, slow, excruciatingly slow--but for me, it has been the only way...

 

Tina

 

 

Tina! So awesome that you are off of the Ativan! that's such a big deal. I have a feeling things will gradually get easier for you from here on out. Are you microtapering the v now? Good luck and great job on you perserviernce.

 

Thank you BDL   I am happy to hear that you are doing well with your taper as well!

 

Tina

[[aw...]]

TINA    TINA      TINA  !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Hi, y'all:

Welcome to another manic Monday. Reading through some of the recent posts on our thread, I get the impression that even though the thread is called "Tapering off Ativan..." many people here don't wan't to taper from A (or are having/have had problems with that taper) and really want to taper off Valium or Klonopin. I suspect this is a dumb question, in the sense that I could probably find the answer by paying closer attention to the posts. Maybe if I had that much focus I'd be on the outside looking in.    Anyway, what do you think?

 

Aweigh

[[co...]]

Thanks BDL and Tina for sharing your experience and wisdom.

 

I for one want to taper off of ativan, as switching to valium would be yet another unpredictable factor and i doubt i will be able to work while transitioning as valium tends to sedate one much more at least during an extended crossover. i will try the micro tapering of ativan as that seems to work well  for many.

 

Tina, What percentage did you cut down a month with your tiny daily cuts? It seems like it might have been about 2% every other day? Were you less symptomatic doing it that way all the way down?

 

Also, where did you get the syringe? Did it come from the pharmacy? as i am starting at a much higher dose i may need a different syringe?

 

i will be traveling in a car for a few days over the next few weeks so i may stick to capsules as refrigeration may be impractical with a liquid. How many hours can it be held without any refrigeration before it goes bad? After that i will try to transition to liquid at the same dose or no more then 2% less so i begin at a stable place, stay thee fro a few weeks on the liquid s i get used to it and then begin tapering at 2% every few days... to be determined.

[[Ho...]]

Yeah, Tina....I know it's been a long hard journey for you.  You go girl!!!!   

 

Can't remember who asked me about whether I was microtapering and also about the Klonopin, but no, I did not microtaper.  I took all my cuts as they are stated in my signature, and lived with the results.  (not fun).  I cut all my doses on one day, on the first day of the date range I note.  When I started I would feel the w/d for 3-4 days and then it would even out, so I thought it was the best approach v. microtapering.  Plus, my experience with my body has been that I do best when I don't change meds.  My thought process was that microtapering would be so many more changes, that my body and brain just wouldn't tolerate it.    Who knows, but it may have been a lot easier given BDL's experience, which I think is very common!

 

I didn't cross over to Valium or K.  I tried Valium early on -- one dose of 5 mg sent me into bed crying for 2 1/2 days.  So, that was a no go.  I did shortly consider crossing over to K, but I had gotten off of Klonopin in late March, so it was late April and I didn't want to go "back."  Looking back on it now, I should have used Klonopin for why I was taking the Ativan, in that I could have taken it for a couple of weeks at a low dose and then tapered fairly quickly (in March I was only using .0612 mg!!).  But, lesson learned.  If I had to do it over again, and given that my body tolerated the K pretty well, I would have crossed over / used the Klonopin and then just tapered of that. 

 

Happy healing to everyone!!! 

[[aw...]]

Thanks, Hoosierfans, that's just what I am looking for. "Here's what I did, here's what happened, here's how I'd do it now." If I just had a time machine I'd go forward a year and skip the suffering  But then, I could go backwards 9 years and simply not refill that 3rd Rx.

"Plus, my experience with my body has been that I do best when I don't change meds.  My thought process was that microtapering would be so many more changes, that my body and brain just wouldn't tolerate it."

Your subsequent experience has changed your opinion, right? Now, you'd cross over. Just double checking, my DSAR (data storage and retrieval) system has become benzo-reliable.

 

Thanks very much for your continuing help,

Aweigh

[[Ho...]]

Yep, I would either cross over to K or I would have used K in the first place.  I think when it comes to benzos, it all comes down to a few things: (1) knowing your body and (2) knowing when / how a medication works for you.    Klonopin "worked" for me, so I shouldn't have changed to using Ativan.

 

I can't say that the microtapering would have worked for me, because it may have been too much change for me.  But from everything I've seen it does work for a lot of folks and with a lot of success.  So, again, it comes back to knowing your body and listening to it!

[[be...]]

Hey Hoosier. I'm curious as to what you mean when you say a micro taper would have been too much change. It's just a slower method of withdrawl.

When I say micro taper I'm talking about micro tapering ativan. The only change was going from big cuts to tiny cuts.

[[Ma...]]

Aweigh, I was on Ativan for 10 years and then switched to K.    It feels a lot more potent than ativan, and the first doses I took just knocked me for a loop, but I soon grew used to it.

 

So it did work, to just change from ativan to k, but after a few months on K it started really affecting me.  Its a powerful muscle relaxant, and I started having trouble with peeing every five minutes.  Other people have mentioned this affect of K.

 

Then when I went back to ativan, I went into withdrawal blah blah.  But I started sleeping better at least, K kept me awake a lot.

 

Then, I did a stupid thing and decided to try K again to avoid interdose withdrawal.  But it was quite a nightmare, I could not sleep or eat.  I only went back to it for one week.

 

Not trying to discourage you from switching to something that might be easier to taper due to its longer half life, but you would have to switch to 3 mgs K, not 1 or less.

 

Just sharing what happened to me.  It might be better for you, but you are always taking a chance when you change from one benzo to another.  They don't have the same properties or effects, there are differences.

[[aw...]]

Thank y'all for the replies:

Mairin: It looks like you've been cutting 0.5 mg A every 2 weeks. I'm assuming that's a dry cut of one 0.5 mg tablet. How is that going? Do you have a lot of sx at cut time which disappear as the days go by? Also, did you taper your switches (from A to K and back--sounds like a novel...a horror story)? It sounds like you're saying don't change over without a good reason, as c/o has its own set of new problems. And the good reason might be given below in my Q to HF. Make sense?

 

HF: And you'd cross over to K because its longer half life would make the taper easier, fewer doseas and fewer sx?

 

A working class hero is something to be,

Aweigh

 

 

[[co...]]

Tina,

How are you doing off the Ativan?

 

You mentioned that you found a syringe that has 100 lines and you were able to taper down at .001 daily. Where can I find such a syringe?

 

I think the syringe I will get from my pharmacist will be 10 marks so I would be able to reduce by .01 a dose, which may be too much at a time for Micro tapering?

How did you do on .001 daily? Were you less symptomatic? Was it an easier taper?

 

Hope all is well with you!

[[Ma...]]

Yeah Aweigh I was just throwing that in there.  I think the less changes or switches you make, the better off you'll be.  I made too many.  I know you are thinking of making one.

 

Don't want to confuse you.  K is a rough drug but hey, so is ativan.

 

Yes I've been making cuts of .5 down to 6 now.  I wouldn't say I had severe side effects but I did feel the cuts.  They weren't severe but often times people say its easier to cut from a high dose.

 

However after all the changes, I am trying to stabelize on this dose for a while, how long I don't know.  I want to see if I can get more stable.  Sometimes its hard to tell if you're stable when you are in the middle of it.  I think a break from cutting is called for for me, but you don't have the same huge drop as i did.

[[Ho...]]

Hi all -- checking in and hoping everyone is having a good week.

 

BDL,  yes you are right about the microtaper.  My concern was changing my dose everyday.  For some reason I had it in my mind that my body just wouldn't adjust b/c it would always be getting a different dose.  But, in retrospect it may have made the taper much easier on me given your experience.  Live and learn!

 

Aweigh, yes, I would have switched over to K because I had previous experience with it, knew how it made me feel and knew what tapering would look like.  Also, I tend to do better with the longer half life stuff.  Ativan has been a nightmare for me!!

 

10 days out and I'm still feeling pretty punky (dizzy, fatigue, muscle aches and nausea), but that is no surprise given that I never stabilized with my last 3-4 cuts.  And, Aunt Flo is due over the weekend, and while I've been on the Ativan both my Ativan s/x and the w/d s/x have been so much worse the week prior to her visit.  So, it's probably a combo of w/d being exacerbated by her visit.  Grrrrr.....  The real progress should start to come mid next week.  Always knew it was going to take me a few weeks to a month to get my body stabilized...... just swimming, swimming, swimming.   

[[be...]]

Wow. I know you aren't feeling all better Hoosier but you must be so relived to not be taking Ativan any more. I feel pretty good right now but I might honestly take feeling a little worse if it meant I could stop being a slave to this crap.

Nice work. I hope you plan to stay away from this stuff forever. I know I will.

[[Ho...]]

Thanks for the kind words, BDL.  You have been a great source of support for me through this.  Yes, I am so glad to not be a slave to this stuff....it just occurred to me this morning when I planned on running errands that I didn't need to have my cooler bag of Ativan in tow! 

 

But, yes, it's a little scary to feel this bad 10 days out even though I've been telling myself to not prejudge anything until at least a month out (about at which time I'll be celebrating your Ativan free birthday with you!!!).

 

And, here's proof of recovery that everyone can hang onto:  the reason I was given Ativan in the first place was that I needed an updose in my Effexor to help my blood pressure, and that increase gave me severe anxiety (ya know that "I've been hit by lightening feeling"?), and my husband and I were scheduled to take a vacation to the Bahamas.  So PDoc, in all her wisdom, told me to take Ativan to control the anxiety for a couple of weeks, and to dose several times a day (should have stuck to "as needed" but hey).  So, a vacation landed me in all this mess.

 

Now I'm staring down taking a family vacation tomorrow and even though I am feeling pretty punky -- enough to send non-benzo wise folks to the ER, I AM NOT TAKING ANY DRUGS TO COMBAT IT.  Instead, I am working with how I feel, resting when I need to, relying on my hubby, and taking along my mediation tapes, yoga mat, green juice and protein shakes.  I am committed to getting through this withdrawal and WITH NO MORE MEDS.    Can I get a "Hallelujah, praise God?!!!!"

 

Hopefully I'll be able to report back in a couple of weeks that I've turned the corner.  Until then, I just hang with each day as best I can.

 

Oh, almost forgot.....to all those folks with questions about A v. K v. V, I got some really good info from my integrative medicine doc about the various benzos and ssris and how your body processes them.  If you are not familiar, there are some genetic markers that can tell you if you may or may not tolerate a certain medication (based on your body's ability to detoxify it).  My doc ran this testing on me, and it revealed that all of my genes that result in the processing of Ativan, Klonopin are normal, but, for example, the ones that would process Prozac are not.  And, the secondary processing for Ativan was not normal.  Ergo, my previous bad experience with Prozac and maybe why I've gotten such bad s/x from Ativan.    If you are interested in these tests, which I think are so useful as opposed to "let's test this and see" approach, PM  me and I can give you more info. 

[[Ma...]]

BZD, I would really like to talk to you about the method you are using.  I will PM you.

[[Bi...]]

Forgot my morning dose this AM, and decided to drop it permanently as I did the midday dose on July 4th.  Ears ringing a bit and slight anxiety, but nothing like it has been with earlier cuts.  Todays' cut amounts to 50%!  I guess I'm lucky, but these are really tiny doses anyway.  I'm sorry of course for those of you who suffer worse at low doses, but I've been feeling better and better.  I have some bad hours, some bad days, but I'm not climbing the walls like I was.

 

I'm so glad to know that if all goes well, I'll be off in a week or three!  It's been a miserable year.  6 months on plus six month taper.  I am thankful to BB, but will write more in my celebratory post (very soon).

 

Bilbo

[[aw...]]

"I AM NOT TAKING ANY DRUGS TO COMBAT IT" I just wanted to comment that I see so many posts like this from people who have been so badly burned so many times that they'e done with the Standard Medicine. Boy, can I relate...I'll see you 'the doc refilled that Ativan Rx 46 times' and raise you 'that same doc Rx Cipro for me TWICE'.

The problem is that my anger only hurts me and makes it harder for me to get what I need (yes, there are things they have that I need). The other problem is that I'd better not get meningitis, or an MI, or hep C. For me, the answer is to learn how to deal with docs...those egos point both ways, ya know!

 

Aweigh

[[ma...]]

thought you might want to hear from a very long term user who got off the ativan in 8 days and is now 21 months benzo free.  it was very difficult, but no more difficult than the stories i read on this forum.  i would say that i'm now 80% normal, sleeping much better and have energy that i thought i had lost forever.  see my history below.