Our Concerns: The Witt-Doerring Youtube Channel

[[Co...]]

35 minutes ago, [[S...] said:

Here is my post again where I never suggested this site was secretly run by big pharma. 
anyway this is ridiculous and sorry for pointing out that there may be people who disagree with you Colin but definitely never said BB was secretly run by big pharma. No idea how you got that 

Yes. I did confuse your post with this:

[[Co...]]

11 minutes ago, [[S...] said:

No apology tho I see.

I apologise. I did write, right you are.

But you have been writing stuff like this:

23 hours ago, [[S...] said:

I am 100 percent anti big pharma, anti psychiatry and I’ve only ever watched one of his videos. I have a mind of my own so can make my own decisions. I think it’s up to the individual to decide who and what to believe. BB should remain a place for support only without agendas being pushed regardless which side or the argument you sit on. 

And this was an incorrect and strange claim:

21 hours ago, [[S...] said:

I don’t like the term “misinformation “ 

that’s a cover up term pharma uses to gaslight the injured.

if big pharma believed we here at BB were spreading misinformation they could shut this site down. 

Some people are greatly helped by Benzos so does that mean all of us here are spreading misinformation? 

There were a few hundred posts in the space of about 36 hours when I replied to you many others.

What concerns me is the small number of members here who are, apparently (transparently, actually), dismissive of the potential damage the videos (I exampled in the opining post) might do to our members and non-members too. BB has never been an antipsychiatry website, so our position on the content of JWD's Youtube channel should come as no surprise.

[[Sh...]]

A strange claim? We just witnessed how pharma and government can work together to control “misinformation” on a mass scale. 
that was my point. Strange? Realistic IMO.

my point was people who are helped by Benzos could say everyone on this site is spreading misinformation. 
because in their experience our opinion must be incorrect because it didn’t happen to them personally. Insert gaslighting here - “must be an undiagnosed mental disorder”. 
were the mothers of thalidomide babies spreading misinformation at first? “Surely it’s not the drugs, they just gave birth to a deformed baby.” Then more and more babies are deformed and finally there’s no denying it. 

That’s my point. Everything is misinformation until it becomes undeniable. Everyone on this site is hoping for the moment we become undeniable. 
In terms of the videos and perhaps I should have been more specific, I think we can differentiate total BS from something that might be helpful. Even at my sickest I could see the difference. 
but maybe that’s MY experience with those videos, the next person might find it helpful. Does the fact that I find it unhelpful mean that it’s unhelpful for all? No. 
anyway Colin I sure hope we’re still friends maybe I will take this moment to insert some emoji’s so you know I mean you no harm 🥰🤙🙌🏻
 

[[Co...]]

30 minutes ago, [[S...] said:

A strange claim? We just witnessed how pharma and government can work together to control “misinformation” on a mass scale. 
that was my point. Strange? Realistic IMO.

Well, you failed (again) to explain how 'Big Pharma' could have BB closed down. I expect no answer, because beyond blowing up all the Amazon data centres, I fail to see how this could be achieved. (I am not looking for debate about this - it was a nonsense claim).

30 minutes ago, [[S...] said:

my point was people who are helped by Benzos could say everyone on this site is spreading misinformation.

There is a huge difference between peers on a support forum expressing their opinions, and a psychiatrist disseminating antipsychiatry (and other terrible) content on his Youtube channel. Content which many of our members encounter, and when many of our members have serious mental health conditions, and rely upon psychiatry.

Your experiences are your own. I understand that you have been negatively affected by the medications you took (so was I), but you should not use your personal experiences to conclude how others have been affected and determine how they should be treated. Yours is a sample of one, and with no control group.

30 minutes ago, [[S...] said:

because in their experience our opinion must be incorrect because it didn’t happen to them personally. Insert gaslighting here - “must be an undiagnosed mental disorder”. 
were the mothers of thalidomide babies spreading misinformation at first? “Surely it’s not the drugs, they just gave birth to a deformed baby.” Then more and more babies are deformed and finally there’s no denying it.

I don't really understand your point. No one has ever claimed that medicine is exact or perfect. And this has nothing to do with thalidomide.

30 minutes ago, [[S...] said:

That’s my point. Everything is misinformation until it becomes undeniable. Everyone on this site is hoping for the moment we become undeniable. 
In terms of the videos and perhaps I should have been more specific, I think we can differentiate total BS from something that might be helpful. Even at my sickest I could see the difference. 
but maybe that’s MY experience with those videos, the next person might find it helpful. Does the fact that I find it unhelpful mean that it’s unhelpful for all? No. 
anyway Colin I sure hope we’re still friends maybe I will take this moment to insert some emoji’s so you know I mean you no harm 🥰🤙🙌🏻

No. Not everything is misinformation. Some things, most things, become better understood over time. But this does not mean what has gone before was 'wrong' - just 'not as right'. We model the universe - and it always will be like this. Further, if we take your position to it its natural conclusion, we can never 'know' anything, because there always will be something new to learn.

And no worries. We don't kick off members at BB simply because we disagree with them (or because they are wrong  ). But I do want this thread to return to the subject at hand: the content of and concerns expressed within the opening post.

[[Sh...]]

I think I need to clarify my comments on being anti pharma and anti psychiatry. 
I believe I am entitled to this stance based on the “care” I received while I was unwell. 
I am anti pharma because I believe they have lost sight of the reason they make medicine or why they should. 
The opioid crisis is a good example of this. Purdue pharma said there was no way OxyContin could be addictive. Yet it was found to be after the loss of many lives. They covered up the harm because of greed. Still lots of people were helped by this drug so that was their excuse to ignore the harm along with a massive financial windfall. 
I am an unfortunate victim of the greed of pharma.   I am unable to not be angry that there is evidence of harm out there that drs and pharmaceutical companies cover up and ignore for profit, and that I along with all of you are the unfortunate byproduct of that. 
 

I am anti psychiatry because of the level of “care” I received while I was unwell. 
I was told being ripped on and off antidepressants “feels like having the flu” and constantly told, “oh that one didn’t work, well we will keep going til we find one that works”. 
that isn’t care that is guesswork. Until my illness I had so much faith in medicine but now I think I might rather die than put my health in their hands again. 
 

am I not entitled to feel this way? Does this make me a conspiracy theorist? 
I prefer to consider myself a human being that has so much to offer and is deserving of better care than I received. So please don’t discredit my stance which is completely justified given my terrible experiences with pharma and pyschiatry harm. 

[[Sh...]]

6 minutes ago, [[C...] said:

Well, you failed (again) to explain how 'Big Pharma' could have BB closed down. I expect no answer, because beyond blowing up all the Amazon data centres, I fail to see how this could be achieved. (I am not looking for debate about this - it was a nonsense claim).

There is a huge difference between peers on a support forum expressing their opinions, and a psychiatrist disseminating antipsychiatry (and other terrible) content on his Youtube channel. Content which many of our members encounter, and when many of our members have serious mental health conditions, and rely upon psychiatry.

Your experiences are your own. I understand that you have been negatively affected by the medications you took (so was I), but you should not use your personal experiences to conclude how others have been affected and determine how they should be treated. Yours is a sample of one, and with no control group.

I don't really understand your point. No one has ever claimed that medicine is exact or perfect. And this has nothing to do with thalidomide.

No. Not everything is misinformation. Some things, most things, become better understood over time. But this does not mean what has gone before was 'wrong' - just 'not as right'. We model the universe - and it always will be like this. Further, if we take your position to it its natural conclusion, we can never 'know' anything, because there always will be something new to learn.

And no worries. We don't kick off members at BB simply because we disagree with them (or because they are wrong  ). But I do want this thread to return to the subject at hand: the content of and concerns expressed within the opening post.

Ok Colin. You are right of course. And I promise never to disagree with you again lest I be made out to be an imbecile. 
I will go back to not commenting on posts like a good girl now. 

[[Co...]]

12 minutes ago, [[S...] said:

Ok Colin. You are right of course. And I promise never to disagree with you again lest I be made out to be an imbecile. 
I will go back to not commenting on posts like a good girl now. 

Oh, com'on, now.

[[ap...]]

I found this young psychiatrists way absolutely terrifying. I am glad you have had a say 

[[Co...]]

1 hour ago, [[a...] said:

I found this young psychiatrists way absolutely terrifying. I am glad you have had a say 

Yes. And many other members have instead chosen to show their appreciation for this notice by using reactions to posts throughout the thread. Most members seem to understand and agree with our stance on this.

[[re...]]

Appleeater:

What is your reasoning behind this statement?

I mean ABSOLUTELY TERRIFYING????????????? 

What is so terrifying in comparison with the majority of doctors taking their patients off of a  5-15 year psych med prescription in 1-3 months. 

[[re...]]

I am just trying to understand this kind of bold statement. I don't get that at all from him. He seems that he is definitely in grifter territory. But TERRIFYING??

[[re...]]

I actually love this discussion and people's takes on it. It is so interesting to get other perspectives. 

 

[[Co...]]

Just now, [[r...] said:

I actually love this discussion and people's takes on it. It is so interesting to get other perspectives. 

Well, the discussion has rather drifted away from the specific concerns we raised in the opening post. After all, I think our concerns were detailed quite well, with examples, and internal referencing.

There are ancillary discussions arising out of this, but they would be better served by the creation of dedicated threads.

There have also been several instances of comments to this thread which example our concerns and how JWD's content serves to feed those views (and here at BB). This is why we advised members about this matter.

[[Ma...]]

Time to shut this down. 🙇‍♀️

[[Do...]]

56 minutes ago, [[C...] said:

Well, the discussion has rather drifted away from the specific concerns we raised in the opening post. After all, I think our concerns were detailed quite well, with examples, and internal referencing.

There are ancillary discussions arising out of this, but they would be better served by the creation of dedicated threads.

There have also been several instances of comments to this thread which example our concerns and how JWD's content serves to feed those views (and here at BB). This is why we advised members about this matter.

If we are discussing something that isnt JWD himself is cause we are getting deeper in what you have accused him of doing in his channel. There is not posible argument if we only discuss the "criminal" but not the crime he is charged with.

We need to figure out if those accusations are right or wrong and we need to explain with arguments beyond his white coat or his recording quality, if he is really doing something unethical or exactly the opposite.

We are discussing here about what psychiatry does and that is what he does as well, IMO he is a defender and should be praised in this forum and he has proved his point, he quit a job at a big pharma with a million dollar wage cause he couldnt be a part of the harm pharmas are doing fo money and started a bussiness to help those affected by pharmas and psychiatry malpractice and at least in my humble opinion this is way more ethical than anyother thing i have seen in any other doctor.

Edited June 5 by [Do...]

[[Do...]]

25 minutes ago, [[M...] said:

Time to shut this down. 🙇‍♀️

If you shut this down youre shutting free speech here. You are sending a message that this is not a free space, is a place where you have to obey and not go against the mainstream.

@[Ma...] this is not Twitter or Facebook where thay have censored for years anything that goes against their mandatory thinking.

 

[[Le...]]

1 hour ago, [[C...] said:

Yes. And many other members have instead chosen to show their appreciation for this notice by using reactions to posts throughout the thread. Most members seem to understand and agree with our stance on this.

Nice attempt to use group inclusion as persuasion. I would say almost all members seem to disagree fairly strongly.  Some a little too enthusiastically  

 

Edited June 5 by [Le...]

[[pi...]]

1 hour ago, [[r...] said:

Appleeater:

What is your reasoning behind this statement?

I mean ABSOLUTELY TERRIFYING????????????? 

What is so terrifying in comparison with the majority of doctors taking their patients off of a  5-15 year psych med prescription in 1-3 months. 

This comment is rude and uncalled for. Everyone is entitled to their opinions on this subject. By ‘shouting’ at @[ap...], which by the way is not allowed, you are discouraging others from posting their opinions about the videos. Those of you with the loudest voices are very intimidating to those who wish to offer views that might be contradictory to yours and some of the other more vocal contributors.

I’m sorry @[ap...], you did not deserve this response. Thank for for posting your opinion. 

 

[[Ma...]]

@[Do...] and others:

You apparently don’t understand that Collin is the founder and proprietor of this site. And has been for decades. Not the few months you have been using this free public forum for support. He decides what the rules of this forum are and was kind enough to open HIS policy change to discussion. He has also been extremely patient answering every concern and question.

A lot of responders are using aggression and vitriol to make some personal claim.

If any of you support JWD, good on you. Watch his videos. Hire him. Honestly, who cares?

As Collin has made clear for 14 PAGES, don’t bring them here.

Move on. Heal yourself and for the love of god, stop. Just stop the arguing and negativity.

Move.On.

[[Do...]]

3 minutes ago, [[M...] said:

Collin is the founder and proprietor of this site

and you are?

[[Br...]]

1 minute ago, [[D...] said:

and you are?

@Dolvian - this is rude.  Please review our Guidelines which include the following: 

Be polite towards, and respectful of, your fellow Buddies.

[[Le...]]

34 minutes ago, [[M...] said:

@[Do...] and others:

You apparently don’t understand that Collin is the founder and proprietor of this site. And has been for decades. Not the few months you have been using this free public forum for support. He decides what the rules of this forum are and was kind enough to open HIS policy change to discussion. He has also been extremely patient answering every concern and question.

A lot of responders are using aggression and vitriol to make some personal claim.

If any of you support JWD, good on you. Watch his videos. Hire him. Honestly, who cares?

As Collin has made clear for 14 PAGES, don’t bring them here.

Move on. Heal yourself and for the love of god, stop. Just stop the arguing and negativity.

Move.On.

Very negative. Almost everyone supports these videos and the few that dont are getting very upset now that they arent getting support. I am sorry you cant win here. Opening it up for discussion to seem diplomatic then ignoring the response and dictating isnt very mature. Every response like this really harms your credibility guys.  

The fact that Colin is the founder is not an argument.  He has done something great making this site yes.  That is irrelevant here.  People attracted to authority often use authority as an argument when threatened and this is a good example  

Maybe respond with a cooler head when you feel less threatened.  or move on  

 

Edited June 5 by [Le...]

[[Do...]]

4 minutes ago, [[B...] said:

@Dolvian - this is rude.  Please review our Guidelines which include the following: 

Be polite towards, and respectful of, your fellow Buddies.

Thanks for pointing this at me and not noticing how rude was what i have been told just before. You guys really think "this is his site and you have no right to argue" isnt rude?

Edited June 5 by [Do...]

[[Co...]]

53 minutes ago, [[D...] said:

We need to figure out if those accusations are right or wrong and we need to explain with arguments beyond his white coat or his recording quality, if he is really doing something unethical or exactly the opposite.

The subject was outlined quite well by the thread title and in the opening post. It is not a discussion about psychiatric practice in general - it is not even a discussion about JWD in general. It is a discussion regarding the content outlined in the opening post.

[[re...]]

Colin I do appreciate your calmness in all of this.

You are very unemotional and I commend it.