Reinstated!

[[Hu...]]

Unfortunately I had to reinstate today. Two years out, but the anxiety got so bad, and I was concerned about Serotonin Syndrome due to the symptoms and the intensity of the symptoms I had been having due to it for the past few days. Honestly, if acute was a 10/10 on the suffering scale, this wasn't far behind. Maybe a 7.5. 

So I was given two 10mg temazepam doses. I held off on taking them yesterday but couldn't take it much longer today, had to.

If it sets me back into acute... I guess I'll just demand to be given diazepam to taper. I refuse to go through acute again, I outright refuse. I think I'd rather be on diazepam for the rest of my life than go through acute again. Hopefully, it's neither!

[Guest [...]]

Hi HS

1) What medication had you been on two years ago? 

2) What was your highest dose?

3) Did you taper or c/t?

4) If you tapered, how fast did you taper? 

How long had you been experiencing that anxiety for lately? Are you sure it wasn’t just a wave that would’ve passed given time?

I don’t think two 10mg Temazepam tabs would warrant reinstating and tapering again, HS. 

Call it a blip on the radar and just move on with your recovery. 

 

[[Hu...]]

I binged on diazepam, xanax and zoplicone while also drinking for about 2-3 weeks. I couldn't say what my doses were, I just took them relentlessly. I had no idea about WD.

I cold turkeyed, hit acute, then after about 5-6 days I started feeling just a little bit better. I had also started taking citalopram, and I think the side effects of that hit me like a tonne of bricks and made things worse. 

The anxiety started about two weeks ago. I had two days of feeling terrible, then started to feel much better again. I had a few moments here and there of feeling anxious, and they would weirdly go away within like half an hour of taking a crumb of citalopram, probably less than 1mg. 

Yeah I sincerely doubt that will end up happening! I'm just naturally scared it will bring about acute again. Probably wont, but that is my fear.

 

[[gr...]]

Sorry you are suffering so much. You said that you feel like you have serotonin syndrome. An anti-histamine called cyproheptadine is used to treat serotonin syndrome. It might be better to ask your Dr. about cyrpo. instead of reinstating on the benzo. I am still tapering and I feel like my serotonin is way too high. I have read that when coming off of benzos our serotonin becomes very active. I've taken cypro. when I've felt my serotonin was too high and I immediately felt  so much better. I think serotonin is a huge problem for people coming off of benzos. I know it is for me.

[Guest [...]]

@[Hu...]

If you experience bouts of anxiety, try reminding yourself that what you are experiencing is simply a wave, not permanent. Remind yourself that the wave will pass on its own once it’s run its course. Think of it as healing pains. 

[[Es...]]

@[Hu...]

It is really dangerous to take various doses of citalopram. It will mess up your brain more than all those BZD. I have to take my final dose of fluoxetine for the day in seven minutes. I dread it, but I'll do it. Cause I know the consequences if I don't. These SSRIs have nasty sxs but believe me, I used to play with them just like you. And it turned out to be playing with fire. Please don't hurt yourself so badly, you don't deserve it.

Okay, took it. It knocks me out which I mostly hate, but I try to ride it out with caffeine and action. It was supposed to be "activating".

You have a brilliant mind, don't ruin it with improper self-medicating. As to booze, it acts as a solvent for your brain and internal organs. 

Taking a crumb of citalopram is utterly absurd. I used to do it too with fluoxetine, lost my job and my marriage. 

If you cannot cope with BZD WD, you could try reinstating citalopram and a BZD at a smallest dose, after consulting your doctor. It's just impossible to tough it out, I learnt the hard way.

Citalopram will reduce your self-destructive tendencies by numbing the emotions. I know the sxs suck.

I feel like a freaking vegetable on fluoxetine. But a benzo-wise pdoc once told me: "You need antidepressants like a diabetic needs insulin". And guess what. After all these years. Of rebellion and trying one hundred different approaches. Of admiring dr Peter Breggin. I conclude that pdoc years ago was right. 

[[Hu...]]

On 25/08/2023 at 14:17, [[g...] said:

Sorry you are suffering so much. You said that you feel like you have serotonin syndrome. An anti-histamine called cyproheptadine is used to treat serotonin syndrome. It might be better to ask your Dr. about cyrpo. instead of reinstating on the benzo. I am still tapering and I feel like my serotonin is way too high. I have read that when coming off of benzos our serotonin becomes very active. I've taken cypro. when I've felt my serotonin was too high and I immediately felt  so much better. I think serotonin is a huge problem for people coming off of benzos. I know it is for me.

Thanks. Things got a little better the past couple of days, though I've felt a wee bit anxious on waking this morning. Well it's been a week without the Citalopram, so IF I've got mild serotonin toxicity it would be from the dose of Mirtazapine I was already on, which is surprising. I'm gonna continue for another couple of weeks without it, and if these symptoms don't go away then I may have to consider lowering my dose of mirtazapine too? It's quite difficult to get prescribed anything in the UK. I love our healthcare system, but because the healthcare isn't private, the Dr's aren't incentivised to prescribe as much.
 

On 25/08/2023 at 18:06, [[W...] said:

@[Hu...]

If you experience bouts of anxiety, try reminding yourself that what you are experiencing is simply a wave, not permanent. Remind yourself that the wave will pass on its own once it’s run its course. Think of it as healing pains. 

It's been two years since I got clean from benzo's... I remember the windows and waves well, and you're right, they always run their course. It's still an intimidating thought, however. It seems to be going fine though.

14 hours ago, [[E...] said:

@[Hu...]

It is really dangerous to take various doses of citalopram. It will mess up your brain more than all those BZD. I have to take my final dose of fluoxetine for the day in seven minutes. I dread it, but I'll do it. Cause I know the consequences if I don't. These SSRIs have nasty sxs but believe me, I used to play with them just like you. And it turned out to be playing with fire. Please don't hurt yourself so badly, you don't deserve it.

Okay, took it. It knocks me out which I mostly hate, but I try to ride it out with caffeine and action. It was supposed to be "activating".

You have a brilliant mind, don't ruin it with improper self-medicating. As to booze, it acts as a solvent for your brain and internal organs. 

Taking a crumb of citalopram is utterly absurd. I used to do it too with fluoxetine, lost my job and my marriage. 

If you cannot cope with BZD WD, you could try reinstating citalopram and a BZD at a smallest dose, after consulting your doctor. It's just impossible to tough it out, I learnt the hard way.

Citalopram will reduce your self-destructive tendencies by numbing the emotions. I know the sxs suck.

I feel like a freaking vegetable on fluoxetine. But a benzo-wise pdoc once told me: "You need antidepressants like a diabetic needs insulin". And guess what. After all these years. Of rebellion and trying one hundred different approaches. Of admiring dr Peter Breggin. I conclude that pdoc years ago was right. 

Oh I agree entirely Estee. Well it's been a week since I've taken any Citalopram, but I am on 45mg of Mirtazapine, which had been doing the job for the past year. What I really don't understand is, for about six months at the end of last year/start of this year, I was on this dose of Citalopram and Mirtazapine together and felt great. Then I tapered off the Citalopram very slowly, and walked off no problem, for months.

Then when I started trying to take citalopram again, even at a low dose, the SX's absolutely hammered me, which is what has made me come off them again. Because they feel so much like what I felt when I went through benzo WD. And it got me thinking that I started Citalopram (at 10mg, whereas I started at 2.5 then 5 mg this time) a week into Benzo WD. And I remember, I started feeling a little better, then BOOM, world came crashing down. Could have been the beginning of windows and waves for sure, but it is when certain symptoms - muscle twitching, constant yawning - hit me, which have also hit me this time. Which is kind of what has happened this time too. So I'm wondering if a lot of what I THOUGHT was benzo WD was actually Citalopram side effects.


I admire you Estee. You're very strong, and a battler, and I appreciate your advice. I think I will not taker Citalopram, and persist on my Mirtazapine again for a few weeks to give my brain a chance to adjust to things, and if I keep having windows and waves and I really can't figure out why, I will do as you say- reinstate BZD at a super super low dose (I'm thinking 2.5 diazepam twice daily or as needed). I won't stop taking Mirtazapine completely, but I will taper it to a dose that it low enough to allow me to pair it with another AD, perhaps Duloxetine, I know some people who take both of those meds together.

[[Es...]]

@[Hu...]

Just talk it all over with your pdoc, please. I'm not qualified to give medical advice. The only thing I noticed that works with psych meds is CONSISTENCY. You could set up a journal. Write down dates and hours of your doses and fill it every day. This is what I've been doing for the last 24 yrs and it has helped me a lot.

Meds need to be taken at the same hour. Especially stuff like citalopram and mirt. Your brain craves homeostasis. You're a creative type, like me, so you have difficulties complying. I mark different meds with different colors (markers) so that I can check the previous day.

If you crave a psych med out of the blue, try to get outside yourself and see the situation. What was your trigger? Write it down. You need to avoid people and situations that trigger you to take meds. This is called self-care.

Duloxetine is an SNRI. Using mirt with duloxetine can increase the risk of serotonin syndrome. I personally know ppl who are on an SSRI and mirt for sleep, but it's risky. Here is the link on interactions between duloxetine and mirt:

Rx Interaction Checker: duloxetine & mirt

Same goes for mirtazapine and citalopram, but pdocs tend to prescribe this stuff together: 

Rx interaction checker: citalopram & mirt

My idea is the less psych meds the better. I used to take mirt alone. It was excellent for sleep. But I gained weight on it and stopped CT. 

I mean, pdocs tend to prescribe two serotoninergic meds in small doses. I never used two at a time. 

Maybe you could stay on mirt alone? Why do you take these crumbs of citalopram?

SNRI should work better for sleep than an SSRI, at least it's my experience. I never took duloxetine. I took venlafaxine twice a day and my sleep was really good.

Wow, it's so complicated. It's def for a pdoc. Mirt gave me a terrible brain fog, I remember. But it was so calming. If it weren't for the weight gain, maybe I would have stayed on it.

Take care. Be kind to yourself

[[or...]]

On 24/08/2023 at 08:20, [[H...] said:

Unfortunately I had to reinstate today. Two years out, but the anxiety got so bad, and I was concerned about Serotonin Syndrome due to the symptoms and the intensity of the symptoms I had been having due to it for the past few days. Honestly, if acute was a 10/10 on the suffering scale, this wasn't far behind. Maybe a 7.5. 

So I was given two 10mg temazepam doses. I held off on taking them yesterday but couldn't take it much longer today, had to.

If it sets me back into acute... I guess I'll just demand to be given diazepam to taper. I refuse to go through acute again, I outright refuse. I think I'd rather be on diazepam for the rest of my life than go through acute again. Hopefully, it's neither!

I just want to say that I have no idea how much I could handle of anxiety, or any wd sxs.  I went back on my C twice in my 35 years of 1mg a day.  I don't know how much (of my ailments) was Tolerance Wd, I only learned about that when I got to BB 5 months ago.  But after 3 or so days of just not refilling my prescription, I was so slayed that my friend took me to my doctor and he refilled the prescription.  Then years later, before BB, my MD where I live now tapered me, but it was too fast (.25 per month) and I had some sort of siezure or TIA, no tests ever showed what it was, but now I know it was too fast a taper.  I was in agreement with MD that I should have my 1 mg back. 

I'm not sorry I had to do that, I've learned a lot since coming to BB, but I still don't know how much I could take of wd sxs.  I'm just very glad you are still with us, as I imagine there are plenty of folks in the same boat, or at least similar experiences, Denise ❤️

[[gr...]]

Hurricane, Cyproheptadine might be over the counter in the UK.  It used to be over the counter in the US but for some reason they changed it to prescription only. I know in Canada it is over the counter. It is an antihistamine.

[[wi...]]

Hurricane-you are always in my thoughts.  Thank you for having been part of my recovery over the past few years. Big hugs, and sending you nothing but healing.  Message me anytime you need to vent or whatever.