The Anti Psychiatry Revolution

[[Al...]]

There is a growing anti-psychiatry movement led by prominent scientists, many of whom are psychiatrists themselves. And this movement challenges the foundation of classical psychiatry. They even go as far as calling it an oppressive pseudoscience. According to this scientists, the chemical imbalance theory as the cause of most mental illnesses is not supported by scientific evidence. They also challenge the whole idea of mental illness, which, according to them, is not validated by biological criteria, as most medical diseases are.

I believe in science and I sought help from psychiatry when I had emotional problems. But after many years of failed attempts to deal with my problems by following the treatments prescribed by psychiatrist, I couldn't agree more with this revolutionary movement.

 

 

[[Ca...]]

Seems to be a growing interest in the bodys microbiome in relation to neurochemistry these days..

-Thats where my focus is now too..

 

 

[[to...]]

Seems to be a growing interest in the bodys microbiome in relation to neurochemistry these days..

-Thats where my focus is now too..

 

 

Same.  Wish I would have gone down this path years ago. 

[[...]]

In total agreement!

This battle is hardest to win as lots ugly dark stuff behind the scene. I call it the biggest crime of entire medical community in human history

[[Ic...]]

I agree. I am angered and find it weird how both my therapist and psych were so quick to shove pills at me before working on a diet change and some therapy. I feel like the pills should have been the last resort and not the first. Jordan Peterson, a psychologist, experienced benzo withdrawal and is being mocked by other medical professionals as being a liar. Nope, benzo withdrawal is a real thing. It's not all in our head.

[[Al...]]

Hi IcyPeppermint112! I've gone through opioid detox too. While the opioids are far more likely to kill you because of the permanent need to up the dosage, I find benzo withdrawal far more difficult. I was free of any symptoms 2 months after I finished the 12 days opioid detox. I will be lucky if I will manage to finish my benzo tapering in 8 months. And only then the real recovery will began. And that could take years.

[[Ic...]]

Alin005, it's amazing benzos are even legal. I have heard that once someone comes off other drugs, it's done. But with benzos, the injury can take months or years to heal.

[[Al...]]

IcyPeppermint112, every new week in my opioid recovery was better than the previous one. There were no waves and windows. And I knew for sure that the next week I'll feel better. It was a continuous progress free of any waves. People relapse on opioids because they are extremely euphoric and tempting, not because of never ending withdrawal. On the contrary, we relapse on benzos because of unbearable and never ending withdrawal symptoms. We hate benzos and we are disgusted by them. But we have no choice, we are their prisoners.

[[Aj...]]

That’s been going on for decades.

You should see the hate spewed by psychiatrists on a Twitter at anyone who questions the orthodoxy.

I have been fighting their involvement in physical illnesses like ME/CFS for decades.

They are not going to give up any time soon.

 

 

[[Bi...]]

Psychiatrists know how to administer pills. So that what they do. They don’t get reimbursed for just talking. It takes too much time for them to go in depth. Some are excellent but the patient really has be aware and knowledgeable. Advancements in neuroscience are needed to move psychiatry into a more evidence based medicine. Until then use psychiatric medicine with extreme care.

[[Ic...]]

Psychiatrists know how to administer pills. So that what they do. They don’t get reimbursed for just talking. It takes too much time for them to go in depth. Some are excellent but the patient really has be aware and knowledgeable. Advancements in neuroscience are needed to move psychiatry into a more evidence based medicine. Until then use psychiatric medicine with extreme care.

 

BillyOff, the job of the psychiatrist, like you said, is to diagnose a patient and administer the pills. The issue comes in where they only know what they were taught in school and what the drug company tells them. These doctors have not actually looked into the drugs and the affects on the body. They also do not have much learning in how the nervous system or body works. Don't you think it is irresponsible to give someone a drug and then not know how to taper it or know that there truly are withdrawals associated with stopping it? I believe that most of us were given the drug without consent. By that, I mean if a doctor would have told me, "I can give you this and in three months it may change your life for the better, or it can go horribly wrong giving you permanent apathy, akathesia, and CNS issues." I would have definitely declined. However, after explaining my trepidation of taking the drug, the doctor assured me that the worst that can happen is that the drug doesn't agree with me and we take me off the drug and it leaves my system within a week. Doctors now are prescribing Xanax and Klonopin on a daily basis at like 3x a day. That is insane! The maker of Xanax knew the addiction associated with the drug and said that it should only be given in a hospital setting or prescribed with like 3 a month for extreme cases.

 

Please do not think I am being aggressive. I am not, and I appreciate your post. I just want to get out there that we can not keep putting the blame on the patient by saying "Doctors are human too, and you should have researched before putting something in your body." The human thing just doesn't fly with me. Because a doctor failed to see that I was withdrawing from Lamictal and then gave me benzos to cover up the symptoms, I have now been sick for a year during one of the most important career moves of my life. Yes, research what you put in your body. But, I am sure we can all relate to this after seeing how long it takes to finding BenzoBuddies, it takes knowing how to search for the repercussions before actually getting the right search results. When I researched Lamictal before taking it, I only found how awesome it worked. It wasn't until I knew how to type the keywords I was looking for that I found out some people are so sensitive to all psych medicines that a paradoxical reaction can occur. It literally took six months for me to understand what was happening to my GABA. I had my gallbladder taken out and it probably didn't even need to be removed!

 

Going back to the original poster and conversations that follow, I do believe that the psychiatry needs to be revamped or reevaluated. I have been reading a lot research that claims that people are not born with depression. Depression is either a gut-brain reaction or PTSD. I even read that Schizophrenia can be treated with a proper diet.

 

Again, I am not trying to be aggressive or get into a debate I just wanted to give my side of things, especially after being told by ER doctors and family members," You're an addict," "should have known better," and "Listen to your doctor." Towards the end, my doctor no longer had anymore answers for me. I think that happens to a lot of people; when the treatment goes wrong the doctor either drops them or in my case, charges me for suggestions and more drugs.

[[Co...]]

There is a growing anti-psychiatry movement led by prominent scientists, many of whom are psychiatrists themselves. And this movement challenges the foundation of classical psychiatry. They even go as far as calling it an oppressive pseudoscience. According to this scientists, the chemical imbalance theory as the cause of most mental illnesses is not supported by scientific evidence. They also challenge the whole idea of mental illness, which, according to them, is not validated by biological criteria, as most medical diseases are.

I believe in science and I sought help from psychiatry when I had emotional problems. But after many years of failed attempts to deal with my problems by following the treatments prescribed by psychiatrist, I couldn't agree more with this revolutionary movement.

 

Hi Alin005,

 

Please be specific - please provide some references. Otherwise, your post is mere general, non-specific, foundationless allegations and propaganda. Who, exactly, alleges what, exactly?

[[to...]]

 

Depression is either a gut-brain reaction or PTSD. I even read that Schizophrenia can be treated with a proper diet.

 

 

 

Here we have ventured from an aspect of psychiatry which we have experience in, the over-prescribing of medication to people who have transient or situation symptoms and the lack of disclosure as to the potential dangers of this medication, to something we have absolutely no business making statements about, which is regarding the severe psychiatric conditions which plague a small segment of our society such as schizophrenia, bipolar I disorder, as well as treatment resistant depression. 

 

To insinuate that a severe condition such as Schizophrenia, in which clear lesions in the brain can be seen on modern imaging technology, can be treated with something as trivial as a diet change is an absolute insult to both modern medicine as well as the sufferers of this condition.  It is on par with somebody with no experience in our condition telling us that a proper diet could treat benzo withdrawal.  It is simply not true and should not be perpetuated in this forum or any other as all it does is trivialize the experiences of a segment of our population who suffer one of the more severe mental anguishes known to man, lasting all of their existence.  Furthermore, it empowers the con-artists and profiteers who sell concocted pills and powders proclaiming to contain all the nutrients needed to treat these conditions, something which has affected our own condition as well.

 

Black and white thinking is seductive but it is equally destructive.  We cannot allow ourselves to fall victim to the types of propaganda which plague the less informed and less-willing-to-be-informed segments of our society.  Doing so only diminishes the credibility of our own condition, something which sufferers have been fighting for since the 1960s. 

[[Ic...]]

Tooktoolong, thank you for pointing out my ignorance in making a claim without evidence. I apologize for speaking on something I do not know anything about.

[[to...]]

Tooktoolong, thank you for pointing out my ignorance in making a claim without evidence. I apologize for speaking on something I do not know anything about.

 

We all do this Peppermint.  The difference is that very few posses the awareness, humbleness, and grace that you do.  I'm in complete awe of your comment and wish you nothing but happiness in your life. 

[[Aj...]]

https://www.psychologytoday.com/gb/blog/advancing-psychiatry/201904/chronic-schizophrenia-put-remission-without-medication

 

[[to...]]

https://www.psychologytoday.com/gb/blog/advancing-psychiatry/201904/chronic-schizophrenia-put-remission-without-medication

 

As someone who has benefited greatly from the keto diet throughout my withdrawal and who recommends it to others, I do hope more clinical research is done on this.  I would very much be happy to be proven wrong.  This study has 3 patients though. 

[Guest [bl...]]

There is a growing anti-psychiatry movement led by prominent scientists, many of whom are psychiatrists themselves. And this movement challenges the foundation of classical psychiatry. They even go as far as calling it an oppressive pseudoscience. According to this scientists, the chemical imbalance theory as the cause of most mental illnesses is not supported by scientific evidence. They also challenge the whole idea of mental illness, which, according to them, is not validated by biological criteria, as most medical diseases are.

I believe in science and I sought help from psychiatry when I had emotional problems. But after many years of failed attempts to deal with my problems by following the treatments prescribed by psychiatrist, I couldn't agree more with this revolutionary movement.

 

ADs work for lot a of people.

 

I am sorry they did not work for you.

 

But the damage from the negativity that ADs have received can now not be undone. Pharmaceutical companies have not invented a single new AD for the last 40+ years 'cos

 

1. That they might cause suicide has hurt their sales,

2. They take 2 - 3 months to work leads to poor patient compliance and hurts sales,

3. Researching new ADs is prohibitively expensive and not worth it because of waning interest in public for ADs,

4. Most popular ADs are past their patent and the parent company has moved on to non-AD drugs 

[[to...]]

There is a growing anti-psychiatry movement led by prominent scientists, many of whom are psychiatrists themselves. And this movement challenges the foundation of classical psychiatry. They even go as far as calling it an oppressive pseudoscience. According to this scientists, the chemical imbalance theory as the cause of most mental illnesses is not supported by scientific evidence. They also challenge the whole idea of mental illness, which, according to them, is not validated by biological criteria, as most medical diseases are.

I believe in science and I sought help from psychiatry when I had emotional problems. But after many years of failed attempts to deal with my problems by following the treatments prescribed by psychiatrist, I couldn't agree more with this revolutionary movement.

 

ADs work for lot a of people.

 

I am sorry they did not work for you.

 

But the damage from the negativity that ADs have received can now not be undone. Pharmaceutical companies have not invented a single new AD for the last 40+ years 'cos

 

1. That they might cause suicide has hurt their sales,

2. They take 2 - 3 months to work leads to poor patient compliance and hurts sales,

3. Researching new ADs is prohibitively expensive and not worth it because of waning interest in public for ADs,

4. Most popular ADs are past their patent and the parent company has moved on to non-AD drugs

 

 

Sure but the goal of medicine and science should always be to move forward.  ADs, while I know they work for many people, they also have caused harm to many others.  Depression is a major health issue and it's not going away any time soon.  The fact that there is disincentive to develop new and safer treatments for it is simply a sign of a failing health care and pharmaceutical system. 

 

 

[[Gr...]]

Ajusta, that is so interesting.  I have heard that schizophrenia used to be a trash can diagnosis, meaning when the doctor's didn't know what it was, they would choose schizophrenia, but now I think it is much more specific.  My problems with psychiatry is that I think they frequently diagnose normal human emotions as disorders.  I am starting to think that most depression and anxiety is caused by something that happened to someone and is actually a normal reaction to trauma.  I wonder if I didn't have such a terrible time with benzos, if I would think completely differently about this topic.  I know some people who swear that their SSRIs are the best thing that ever happened to them, and who am I to tell them anything otherwise. 

[[Ic...]]

I do believe that ADs help a lot of people and benzos actually help a lot of people. The issue I have with giving them to patients is the lack of knowledge on the doctor's part and consent. What I mean by consent is that doctors should be upfront with the risks. "This drug may save your life or you could get akathesia, brain fog, DP, and other things." There are people, like myself, who was functionally depressed. Yes, I could have been better with the benefits offered by an AD, but if it meant possibly getting the side effects then no. I only comment because I feel that we only admit to benzos changing the brain chemistry, but ADs can do that too. After a paradoxical reaction to an AD and the doctor insisting my "disease" was getting worse and not admitting to any withdrawals from the AD, I was put on a benzo to ease the symptoms.

[Guest [bl...]]

 

 

Sure but the goal of medicine and science should always be to move forward.  ADs, while I know they work for many people, they also have caused harm to many others.  Depression is a major health issue and it's not going away any time soon.  The fact that there is disincentive to develop new and safer treatments for it is simply a sign of a failing health care and pharmaceutical system.

 

I agree with you. The disincentive currently is commercial and there is no getting away from it. Pharma companies are not interested in research and development for new drugs. They are happy tweaking old drugs, marketing them as new, and reaping patents. 

 

On the bright side the health care system is trying to fill in the void. 2 old and cheap drugs -- ketamine and psilocybin -- are under FDA trials for depression. And they have showed astonishing success already. An analogue of ketamine, esketamine has already been launched commercially.

[[to...]]

 

 

On the bright side the health care system is trying to fill in the void. 2 old and cheap drugs -- ketamine and psilocybin -- are under FDA trials for depression. And they have showed astonishing success already. An analogue of ketamine, esketamine has already been launched commercially.

 

For sure Ketamine is an exciting development, maybe the most exciting of the last 30 years.  There are very few if any side effects, patients only need a few early sessions followed by follow up sessions every month or so.  It is not effective for everyone, but for those that it is effective for, they rave about it because it allows them to get off other medications. 

 

Unfortunately, it is not quite as effective for anxiety, which is why we need to keep pushing to find something analogous for anxiety so that we can finally move away from benzos. 

 

 

 

[Guest [bl...]]

 

Unfortunately, it is not quite as effective for anxiety, which is why we need to keep pushing to find something analogous for anxiety so that we can finally move away from benzos.

.

 

I did not know that.

 

Since SSRIs work on serotonin and since SSRIs are effective at treating anxiety and since psilocybin also works on serotonin, psilocybin might work on anxiety. I'm a genius, am I not? But jokes apart, I find it interesting that the 60s drugs (lsd, mushrooms, cannabis, ketamine, DMT) are now showing promise at treating depression & anxiety. And since the work on different neurotransmitters, the limitations of one drug might not be a limitation of another. Psilocybin is the only other drug that is in clinical trial right now.

 

There is a pop culture of microdising lsd in rage right now --  to enhance performance.

 

Unfortunately marijuana makes me freak out. But I've heard it does a good job calming nerves.