Which to taper first, Seroquel or Clonazepam (so many tapering stratgies have failed)?

[[Al...]]

Hi,

I've been on both Seroquel and Clonazepam for more than a decade. Currenly on a total of Seroquel 100mg XR plus 100mg Regular (total 200mg), and 1mg of Clonazepam twice daily (total 2.0mg).

Tapering attempts of clonazepam have always, during the process, ended up in constant state of panic that is nuts, and forces me to reinstate.

I've typically brought down the Seroquel very slowly from anywhere to 50-75mg regular (no XR), then tried tapering off Clonazepam. 

I should mention that I've been switched to diazepam (Valium) multiple times, but for some reason, it produces side effects for me that Clonazepam does not, and I can't tolerate them.

I've heard some places medical facilities might use anticonvulsants, like gabapentin, to help to taper, but that medication produces side effects that I can't tolerage.

Given all this, for a person who is EXTREMELY sensitive to withdrawal (if I take 10% off of my benzo on any given day, I don't sleep the ENTIRE night), can users potentially educate me about whether there may be advantages to staying on the higher dose of Seroquel, which includes XR, and tryign to taper off Clonazepam FIRST?

Clonazepam withdrawal initially causes me severe insomnia and severe anxiety. I know Seroquel doesn't deal with the same receptors, and there's no evidence of it being a go to medication for benzo withdrawal. 

But I believe my Doc is thinking Seroquel might control the underlying issues, so the advice is to stay on it and get off the benzo BEFORE dealing with any Seroquel withdrawal.

Any thoughts would be appreciated, as I'm really sick of taking Clonazepam when, in my case, it dosen't do anything helpful for me.

 

[[Bu...]]

Hello @[Al...],

Welcome to BenzoBuddies,

I am so sorry that you are having such difficulty discontinuing the clonazepam.  I took it for many years, so I know it can really be a challenge to taper, but it is certainly possible.  

It's getting quite late where I am, so I'll need to log off soon, but I wanted to get your account going so other folks can help you.   

I also just have a couple of thoughts before I go.  You might benefit from starting your taper much lower than 10%.  I know many people have to start at 5% or even lower.  Some people have taken Seroquel to help with sleep during benzo withdrawal, so staying on that and tapering the Clonazepam first might be a benefit for you.

Also, the methods used in rehab centers are usually not appropriate for tapering off of a benzo.  The adjunct medications used there are a mixed bag at best and often cause issues at worst.  In my opinion, your best bet is a very slow taper of just one med at a time, using your symptoms to guide the amounts and speed of the taper.

I'm sure other folks will chime in soon with more advice.

I'm glad you found us and we'll do our best to help you with this.

[[Re...]]

Hi @[Al...], I feel compelled to share my experience as someone who has used both benzodiazepines and Seroquel. I was prescribed Seroquel to help with sleep during benzo withdrawal, and it was a disastrous experience for me.

From what I understand, Seroquel affects more neurotransmitter systems compared to benzodiazepines. While benzodiazepines primarily target the GABA receptor, Seroquel influences serotonin, dopamine, histamine, and adrenergic receptors.

Antipsychotics like Seroquel can have serious side effects, and I believe they are often prescribed too casually and used off-label more frequently than they should be.

Given my experience, I would choose a benzodiazepine over an antipsychotic any day.

If you’re considering alternatives, you might want to look into Dr. Mark Horowitz’s work on tapering off antipsychotics. He is a leading expert on evidence-based tapering strategies. He explains gabapentinoids and antidepressants as well in his book.

Many doctors do not fully acknowledge the need to taper off antipsychotics and may even deny the existence of antipsychotic withdrawal symptoms, despite documentation from patients and peer-reviewed studies.

It’s important to consider that introducing any new medication, supplement, or treatment during benzo withdrawal could add complications. Some people find it difficult to taper off these additional drugs, while others manage it more easily. Only you can weigh these risks and make an informed decision.

 

 

Edited August 14 by [Re...]

[[PE...]]

I would go for quentapine first.. for me it was a easy thing to stop and benzo was a nightmare. 

[[vo...]]

7 hours ago, [[A...] said:

Tapering attempts of clonazepam have always, during the process, ended up in constant state of panic that is nuts, and forces me to reinstate.

Given all this, for a person who is EXTREMELY sensitive to withdrawal (if I take 10% off of my benzo on any given day, I don't sleep the ENTIRE night)

Clonazepam withdrawal initially causes me severe insomnia and severe anxiety.

Any thoughts would be appreciated, as I'm really sick of taking Clonazepam when, in my case, it dosen't do anything helpful for me.

@[Al...] 

Hi Alex,

Since you asked for our thoughts, I'll be straightforward with you. I completely understand your fear and concern about being sensitive to withdrawal, along with severe insomnia and anxiety. I think it's safe to say that 90%—if not all—of us here on BB feel the same way and either already have or are currently going through the same thing. If you're determined to get off Clonazepam, you need to accept that those issues are a very real possibility.

When I rapid-tapered off benzos, for the most part, I didn't sleep for almost three months. Now, 14 months later, I'm still not getting much more sleep than I did after stopping. It really doesn’t matter which benzo you’re on; they all seem to bring about similar withdrawal symptoms.

If I were you, I'd follow the advice that @[Bu...] gave you about tapering and just go for it. There's no other way off these meds. That’s my brutally honest opinion. I hope you'll take the plunge and get off these harmful drugs—including the Seroquel. None of them do our bodies any good.

 

Edited August 14 by [vo...]

[[Al...]]

Thanks so much everyone for both the sympathy and responses!

@[vo...]

If I were you, I'd follow the advice that @[Bu...] gave you about tapering and just go for it. There's no other way off these meds. That’s my brutally honest opinion. I hope you'll take the plunge and get off these harmful drugs—including the Seroquel. None of them do our bodies any good.

I agree that in the majority of cases, tapering has to be done (I think there is a small part of the population that can taper extremely easy, without many issues). Just to reiterate, I've attempted tapering clonazepam multiple times from 2mg. Years back, got down to a little lower than 0.5mg, and the strange panic emerged. It's not a like a regular panic atttack that goes away. It merely doesn't go away without reinstating the medication (literally does not stop, and literally can not get one minute of sleep for days unless medication is reinstated). 

My main question, to repeat, is given my circumstances, does it sound like it makes sense to stay on Seroquel to deal with the underlying problem and dealing with Benzo withdrawal first?

@[PE...] Thanks for the direct response. Seroquel was easy for me to get off of when I had only taken it for a few months. I've been on it for more than a decade, and have to taper very slow. Plus given my sensitity to benzo withdrawal, there is no question that I would need some sort of sleep aid (medication, as none of the natural stuff does anything for me) during the prolonged withdrawal. That's why I stayed at around 50mg-75mg of immediate seroquel and then attempted tapering the benzo. 

@[Re...] Thanks for sharing your experience. Just to give you some context, in my case, Seroquel was not introduced for benzo tapering. It was introduced because once enough tolerance to benzos were there, I needed something stabilize anxiety and sleep. Conventional treatment would put me on an SSRI or SNRI, but neither go with me. So I went on Seroquel.

Yes, Seroquel is thought to impact different receptors, and yes the side effect profile can be horrible.

The fact that you've spoken to any Doctor that doesn't acknowledge it's withdrawal is not suprising. Unfortunately, as many people on here probably know, Doctors often don't know anything about withdrawal. Can you imagine that in the 1970's, when diazepam was the most prescribed drug in the world, I'm told that most Doctors didn't acknowledge it coule be addictive? That they didn't even acknowledge withdrawal symptoms?

Anyhow, I appreciate your comments (as well as everyone elses).

@[Bu...]

15 hours ago, [[B...] said:

I also just have a couple of thoughts before I go.  You might benefit from starting your taper much lower than 10%.  I know many people have to start at 5% or even lower.  Some people have taken Seroquel to help with sleep during benzo withdrawal, so staying on that and tapering the Clonazepam first might be a benefit for you.

Just learned how to quote section...

Thanks for the specific suggestion. In my case, 10%, or even 5% (eg goiing from 2.0mg to 1.9) is not even an option. I would not get one minute of sleep the entire night. So when you say 'or even lower' than 5%, I'm in that camp. I go from 2.0mg to 1.94, then 1.88, then 1.81, then 1.75 etc.

Also, even with this slow taper, most recently, I completelly crashed when spacing out the tapering at 2 to 3 week intervals. Meaning I was waiting a minimum of two weeks before before any reduction. Even at that slow rate, I completely crashed at a little less then 1.25mg.

With regards to staying on Seroquel, while it may help cope with insomnia, I'm crossing my fingers that the XR provides some relief for anxiety, and hopefully keeps any crazy panic at bay.

16 hours ago, [[B...] said:

Also, the methods used in rehab centers are usually not appropriate for tapering off of a benzo.  The adjunct medications used there are a mixed bag at best and often cause issues at worst.  In my opinion, your best bet is a very slow taper of just one med at a time, using your symptoms to guide the amounts and speed of the taper.

I haven't looked at the evidnece lately, but when I did, the evidnece was very weak, even for gabapentin.

I appreciate your suggestion on the slow taper, but I have two questions:

Does my taper appear to be slow enough, or have you seen many people even go slower than this?

Have you seen many people comment that once their underlying condition was at least partially stabilized by another medication, the benzo withdrawal was at least possible?

I want to make a comment on compounding pharmacies, but I feel like that might be best for a whole new thread.

And besides @[Bu...], anyone else can feel free to comment and/or directly respond to the two questions. 

Thanks everyone, I REALLY appreciate all of your thoughts.

[[Bu...]]

Hi again, @[Al...],

First, I just want to say that I really appreciate your well-thought-out responses to everyone and your courteous manner!  Always a breath of fresh air.

As for your taper, I want to clarify that I am still trying to learn the finer points of good tapering.  (I didn't do a very good one.  I was sick all the way off.)   I would suggest that you start a thread in the taper forum with your proposed taper to get the opinions of some folks who are far more versed in it than I am.  I know there are people on the site currently doing some very, very slow micro-tapers who would be great resources and are more likely to see your question on that board. 

Here's the link: https://benzobuddies.org/forum/120-benzodiazepine-taper-strategies-planning/

4 hours ago, [[A...] said:

Have you seen many people comment that once their underlying condition was at least partially stabilized by another medication, the benzo withdrawal was at least possible?

Like you, many of us here are sooooo sensitive to everything that we end up managing by using methods other than medication.  I, for one, don't tolerate any other meds well.  I used a combination of CBT and talk therapy, plus mediation and prayer to manage my anxiety.  That said, I know there are some people who have added other meds or supplements or other methods to help during withdrawal.  The "search" function is undergoing maintenance right now, but when it's back running, you could try a search specifically for posts that mention using other medications during withdrawal.  (This would also be good to search for mentions of micro-tapers)  We also have an "Alternative Treatments" board that might be of interest to you as well.

 

 

[[Al...]]

HI @[Bu...],

I very much appreciate your response, including the information about how I might use this website to find information that may be very useful to me (and others).

When you say I may want to start a thread on in the taper forum, I'm assuming you mean "Benzodiazepine Taper Strategies (Planning)"? 

As for what's known as microtapering, I've tried it twice or three times in the past. I crashed very quickly with that method (within a few days every time).

Anyhow, thanks again to everyone. And should anyone want to add further comments, please feel free!!

ps. I do CBT, and am getting into meditation and prayer (dont mindfulness in the past).

Edited August 15 by [Al...]
Forgot to note something

[[Bu...]]

11 hours ago, [[A...] said:

When you say I may want to start a thread on in the taper forum, I'm assuming you mean "Benzodiazepine Taper Strategies (Planning)"? 

Yep, that's the one.

 

[[De...]]

As a few people have said, you should absolutely taper the benzo first, as it’s the more dangerous one (IMO). I detoxed and tapered of Klonopin in treatment, so not all rehabs are bad, but it’s not for everyone. I used Gabapentin during my treatment and it helped me tremendously, but that’s different for everyone.

I would keep your seroquil during your taper so you can have a shot at normal sleep patterns. 

 

[[Al...]]

@[De...] Thanks for your response. I have one question and a comment.

Where I'm from, there's an extremely prestigious and GOVERNMENT funded (not private) mental health facility that deals with all sorts of issues. If I remember correctly, a physician that I consulted with there told me that they sometimes use Gabapentin (not sure if she was referring to a detox, or fast taper).

As an educational question (I know you are not offering medical advice), can you let me know what doses of gabapentin were used either on you, or from what you understand are more broadly used when they use this method?

 

7 hours ago, [[D...] said:

I detoxed and tapered of Klonopin in treatment, so not all rehabs are bad, but it’s not for everyone.

Glad you seem to be doing well, and definitely not for everyone. There are a relatively small percentage of people, I've read, that have almost no issues with even a quick withdrawal. Hypothetically, if this type of pesron went through a fast taper and used gabapentin, there wouldn't be issues. But the standard advice is not to detox if you've been on the benzo for more than a few weeks.

7 hours ago, [[D...] said:

As a few people have said, you should absolutely taper the benzo first, as it’s the more dangerous one (IMO).

This is tricky, as atypical antipsychotics have a potentially extremely bad side effect profile. The side effects are sometimes oberved to be dose dependent (higher=worse). I don't think there's a serious body of scientific studies that has looked at the negative effects of long term seroquel use.

Having said that, I think for most peopole, benzo withdrawal will be way worse in comparison.

7 hours ago, [[D...] said:

I would keep your seroquil during your taper so you can have a shot at normal sleep patterns.

That's the plan for now. Hoping it give s me a shot at decent sleep, in addition to keeping any notable anxiety/panic at bay.

Thanks again!

[[Fa...]]

@[Al...] How long ago did you attempt the Diazepam crossovers?  Also, were the attempts at crossing over done over a period of time or a jump from Clonazepam to Diazepam?  Lastly, since the last attempt at crossing over to Diazepam, how long did you wait to begin a taper?

[[Al...]]

@[Fa...] Thanks for your questions.

15 minutes ago, [[F...] said:

How long ago did you attempt the Diazepam crossovers?

The most recent one was at least a few years back. Perhaps 5 years ago, rough estimate?

 

15 minutes ago, [[F...] said:

Also, were the attempts at crossing over done over a period of time or a jump from Clonazepam to Diazepam?

My Doctor and I were basically on the same page: Do a slow crossover with the Ashton manual as a reference.

As far as I can remember, I would crosssover 0.5mg of clonazepam to 10mg of diazepam, wait two weeks, then deal with another 0.5mg of clonazepam, and repeat. Each 0.5mg crossover was made every two weeks.

A few things happen when I'm on diazepam. I feel high, which I don't feel at all while on clonazepam (this is not the unbearable side effect).

Next, I get notable headaches on diazepam. This is an example of a side effect that that I can't tolerate.

Next, I get notable nightmares and sweating. Have no clue why, and I don't think this is common. This is very hard to tolerate.

Third, some stomach issues that are very uncomfortable.

So just to be clear, in previous attempts, I've crossed over to diazepam sucessfully ever time (I think three of four attempts?). But after a few weeks or a month or two of withdrawing off diazapam, I get to a point where the side effects of diazepam are way too unbearable. 

The MOMENT I switch back to clonazepam, the side effects from diazepam go away.

Doctors have found this strage when I tell them, but hey, I'm just reporting the facts.

Feel free to to give me any comments/input.

Also, I've considered another potential way to use diazepam to withdraw. Don't know if I should ask here or post on the other forum?

Thanks!!

ps. Forgot to answer a question... After fully crossing to diazepam, I've waited anywhere from 2 weeks to 1 month before starting to taper of diazepam.

Edited August 16 by [Al...]

[[Fa...]]

@[Al...]  You have done everything correctly from all the information you have provided.  I was not able to crossover to Diazepam for my taper, either.

I think it would serve you well to stay on the dose of Seroquel that keeps you the most comfortable.  I would not try to 'strong arm' it moving into a benzo taper.  If 100mg XR and 100mg Regular is what works, I feel sticking with that is important.  I agree that tapering the Clonazepam first is most logical.

Next is the taper rate.  I am one of those who cannot taper anymore than 3% of my current dose.  I've tried less, and I've tried more.  Also, at what times do you dose?

In the 'About Me' section of your profile, there is a field for History.  It would be helpful for both you and members to write your history to date.

What is the lowest percentage rate of reduction you have tried?

Edited August 16 by [Fa...]

[[Al...]]

@[Fa...] Thanks for your response. I really appreciate your thouhts and everyone elses!

I'll respond to what you wrote a few minutes ago. But likely won't be back on again until tmrw.

20 minutes ago, [[F...] said:

You have done everything correctly from all the information you have provided.  I was not able to crossover to Diazepam for my taper, either.

Yes I did a conservative crossover to diazepam. But two notes.

In my case, I was able to successfully cross over to diazepam. It's the the side effects of being on diazepam that didn't allow me to taper much off of it (side effects drove me right back to switching to clonazepam).

Another quck note I'd make, and I am NOT advising anything, and am NOT offering professional advice . The Ashton manual notes a 1:20 ration for clonazepam and diazepam (meaning 1mg of clonazepam equals 20mg of diazepam). I do not have her manual pulled up, but I'm pretty sure in her references, she notes that some people use different ratios.

25 minutes ago, [[F...] said:

I think it would serve you well to stay on the dose of Seroquel that keeps you the most comfortable.  I would not try to 'strong arm' it moving into a benzo taper.  If 100mg XR and 100mg Regular is what works, I feel sticking with that is important.  I agree that tapering the Clonazepam first is most logical.

Thanks for these thoughts!! I think sticking to the Seroquel dose while slowly tapering the benzo might make the most sense, particularly given my history, which I have discussed.

27 minutes ago, [[F...] said:

Next is the taper rate.  I am one of those who cannot taper anymore than 3% of my current dose.  I've tried less, and I've tried more.  Also, at what times do you dose?

At 2mg clonazepam per day (1 mg in the morning, 1mg at night, roughly 12 hours apart), I am able to reduce roughly 3% down to 1.5mg. Given my most recent failure, I might adjust it to 3% once I hit 1.5mg (previously I just kept going down 0.0625 every two weeks or so).

And want to hear something interesting? This is only my experience, but I am UNABLE to taper down 1.5% every week, whereas I am able to taper 3% every two weeks. And I can tell you that I have vast experience in experimenting, under the supervision of my Doctor, to label this as a fact, at least for me.

33 minutes ago, [[F...] said:

In the 'About Me' section of your profile, there is a field for History.  It would be helpful for both you and members to write your history to date.

Never knew this, I'll get to it at some point, thanks for letting me know.

33 minutes ago, [[F...] said:

What is the lowest percentage rate of reduction you have tried?

The lowest I have tried doing a dry taper (pill splitting) is a 3% reduction.

In theory, the lowest percentage reduction I have attempted is two or three microtapering trials. Some people have reported sucess with microtapering, so I'm not criticizing anyone (if it worked for you, great!). But I did it as carefully as I could, and each time I crashed within a few days.

Thanks again, and you or anyone else can feel free to comment!   

[[Al...]]

ps. @[Fa...] I took a quick look at your profile. If it's not too pesronal, may I ask why you weren't able to cross over to diazepam?

[[Fa...]]

@[Al...]  Of course, ask me anything.

When I tried to switch, I went into acute at Stage three of crossing over.  It was not sustainable for me.  Clonazepam has a real 'kick' to it, while Diazepam does not.  I've never investigated, and nor will I at this point, how I metabolize these drugs.  So, there may be a physiological reason for this that I am not aware of.  That is how I decided to not crossover and to stick with tapering Clonazepam.

In terms of daily micro-tapering...it did not work for me.  I may state things you already know as I can see you are very intelligent and have done all of your research very thoroughly...

Daily micro-tapering still requires holds.  Many do not take this into consideration.  I did not.  However, the reason I switched back to cut and hold is because I needed to be able to have some degree of insight as to what I was experiencing as I cut to navigate it better.  Meaning, I needed to feel that I could see when I started to feel the cut and the pursuant symptoms as I moved through it.  Also, I needed to feel that I could sense when I had adjusted to the cut.  I was highly symptomatic and I was dealing with severe AKA at that time.  With the daily micro taper, I didn't feel I could sense what reduction I may be reacting to?  Does that make sense?  So, for the way my mind works, I needed a more structured and 'predictable' (using the term loosely) timeline with each cut.  I felt more 'in control', and it decreased my fear of what I was experiencing and gave me some reasoning which helped to ease my mind as much as possible.  I crashed with my attempts at DMT.  For others, it works like a charm.

 

 

[[Al...]]

@[Fa...]Thanks for your response.

I hate starting witht his note, but just remember, any of my comments are for educaitonal purposes, and not professional advice.

7 hours ago, [[F...] said:

When I tried to switch, I went into acute at Stage three of crossing over.  It was not sustainable for me.  Clonazepam has a real 'kick' to it, while Diazepam does not.  I've never investigated, and nor will I at this point, how I metabolize these drugs.  So, there may be a physiological reason for this that I am not aware of.  That is how I decided to not crossover and to stick with tapering Clonazepam.

If it's not sustainable and/or you can't handle it, then it follows that diazepam doesn't seem like an option. If you're curious, you could investigate it. But in terms of helping you withdraw, I very much doubt any investigation into how the two benzos work (clon and diazepam) would be useless, as your brain and body are already telling you that diazepam is not an option.

7 hours ago, [[F...] said:

In terms of daily micro-tapering...it did not work for me.  I may state things you already know as I can see you are very intelligent and have done all of your research very thoroughly...

Thanks and you seem quite thoughtful and intelligent yourself!

7 hours ago, [[F...] said:

With the daily micro taper, I didn't feel I could sense what reduction I may be reacting to?  Does that make sense?  So, for the way my mind works, I needed a more structured and 'predictable' (using the term loosely) timeline with each cut.  I felt more 'in control', and it decreased my fear of what I was experiencing and gave me some reasoning which helped to ease my mind as much as possible.

My interpretation of the Ashton manual (along with online lectures I saw of her ages ago), and many other sources, is that feeling in 'control' for the person withdrawing is very important. And at least from what you're saying, if something is not structured, it can become extremely difficult to know what's causing what. That may create unncessary hurdles in the withdrawal process.

7 hours ago, [[F...] said:

 I crashed with my attempts at DMT.  For others, it works like a charm.

 

I really want to respond as to why I believe some people crash with DMT attempts, while in practice, it works for others with no problem.

BUT, I will not do so, because I feel my analysis, even though based on strict logic and empirical evidence, might dissuade others to do the DMT method. Any if it's working for some people, I don't see a point in discouraging it.

Question: When you said clonazepam has a 'kick' to it, for you, that diazepam doesn't, can you expand just a little on that? For me, diazepam makes me feel high, while clonazpeam doesn't produce that effect at all.

Edited August 16 by [Al...]

[[Fa...]]

4 minutes ago, [[A...] said:

Question: When you said clonazepam has a 'kick' to it, for you, that diazepam doesn't, can you expand just a little on that? For me, diazepam makes me feel high, while clonazpeam doesn't produce that effect at all.

@[Al...]  That is a good question.  I wonder if @[Li...] would have insight into this?  I would explain it best by saying that Clonazepam seems to be the most potent benzo.  There may be some information out there that would state the opposite...I don't know.  I have heard others express similar sentiments regarding their experience when comparing the two being they are two of the longest acting benzos.  After being on it for the amount of time I was and then trying to cross over to Diazepam, it felt to me that the Diazepam could not cover me regardless of the supposed conversion dosage amount.  It felt as though I had not taken anything.  I did not have symptoms as you did.  That is how I experienced it...but, that is just my experience.  Always open to being corrected in terms of potency.

 

[[Al...]]

@[Fa...] Thanks for answering my question. It's a geat example to other readers about how individual differences can play such a crucial role.

In your case, it felt like Diazepam did not cover you. In my case, I felt completely high with diazepam (and side effects that I couldn't tolerate), while I don't feel high at all on clonazepam.

As for potency, it depends how you define the word.

When scientists and experts refer to a benzo being "highly potent" compared to another benzo that is comparably "low", all they're talking about is the weight of the active medical ingredient (active medical ingredient refers to whatever drug is in the tablet you are taking, and not the filler).

So for example, if 1mg clonazepam is supposed to have the same effect as 20mg of valium, clonazepam is considered comparably VERY high potent. Simply put, it takes 20 times the amount of mg of diazepam to produce the same effect.

So in the Ashton manual, when you read that there is a bit of evidence (perhaps not conclusive), that highly potent benzos are harder to come off of, that's what she's referring to.

Thanks.

Edited August 16 by [Al...]

[[Fa...]]

@[Al...]  Okay...that makes sense.  Thanks for explaining that. And, yes!  We are each unique, and when we try to find someone to mirror our experience, it often proves to be futile.  Can lead to tons of frustration...then, ultimately, a better understanding of our body and what works for us.  

[[De...]]

21 hours ago, [[A...] said:

@[De...] Thanks for your response. I have one question and a comment.

Where I'm from, there's an extremely prestigious and GOVERNMENT funded (not private) mental health facility that deals with all sorts of issues. If I remember correctly, a physician that I consulted with there told me that they sometimes use Gabapentin (not sure if she was referring to a detox, or fast taper).

As an educational question (I know you are not offering medical advice), can you let me know what doses of gabapentin were used either on you, or from what you understand are more broadly used when they use this method?

Glad you seem to be doing well, and definitely not for everyone. There are a relatively small percentage of people, I've read, that have almost no issues with even a quick withdrawal. Hypothetically, if this type of pesron went through a fast taper and used gabapentin, there wouldn't be issues. But the standard advice is not to detox if you've been on the benzo for more than a few weeks.

This is tricky, as atypical antipsychotics have a potentially extremely bad side effect profile. The side effects are sometimes oberved to be dose dependent (higher=worse). I don't think there's a serious body of scientific studies that has looked at the negative effects of long term seroquel use.

Having said that, I think for most peopole, benzo withdrawal will be way worse in comparison.

That's the plan for now. Hoping it give s me a shot at decent sleep, in addition to keeping any notable anxiety/panic at bay.

Thanks again!

I did 4 days detox followed by 35 days in-patient at a rehab facility. I was on 800mg of Gab 2x per day. I wouldn’t say Gabapentin was a primary thing during my recovery but it did help soften the blow. I was physically dependent on both Klonopin and Ambien, so my detox was more complicated than most.

Detox and in patient was the right move for me, as I was rapidly declining mentally and have a (very brief) history of suicidal ideations (a long time ago). I was not suicidal, but I tried tapering myself for 3-4 months prior to going in and was rapidly declining. I will also note I had the luxury/privilege of going to one of the best rehabs in the US deep in the Rocky Mountains. Not everyone has this opportunity and consider myself extremely fortunate to have had the means to go there.

Gabapentin was one of my “as needed” medications, meaning I could take it or not take it. I chose to take it for the full duration of my stay.

My path was very atypical and I would not suggest it for many people, but given my history, I saw where I was going.

I will say one of the best benefits of my stay in treatment was the ability to have a Psychiatrist, therapist, pharmacy, general health doctor and case manager observing me 24/7. I tapered off K in 28 days and came out of rehab completely off both K and Zdrug. I have not taken a pill for 7 months and my recovery has gone well. Still some bad days, but I feel very lucky to be where I am at.

I can also say I was in treatment with 5 other people who were detoxing from benzos and we absolutely had it the worst. 3 people I was with completed treatment and 2 AMA’d. it’s not an easy path.

Rehab for benzos is also a very strange fit because most of my stay there was catered towards addiction, and I was not technically an addict (just dependent), but I benefited nonetheless.

Hope that helps and I hope you are well. Stay strong.

[[Kr...]]

@[De...]Are you still on gabapentin or any other medications?

[[De...]]

27 minutes ago, [[K...] said:

@[De...]Are you still on gabapentin or any other medications?

I take a very small dose of an SSRI right now and I have Gabapentin I take sparingly for long flights. 

[[De...]]

I’m also by no means advising anyone to take Gabapentin. I don’t believe it’s completely safe or if it’s a recommended medication for benzo tapering. This was just my experience.