Alcoholics Anonymous and benzos

[[Ho...]]

Has anyone used the AA 12 step program for benzo dependency recovery?  Not sure this is the right path for me.  17 years of  klonopin 1mg, .5 mg for past 9 months.  Now trying to taper down to .25.  

Edited May 27 by [Ho...]
Clarify

[[Re...]]

Hello @[Ho...], Welcome to BenzoBuddies:) 

I approved your registration, you will be able to post to the Forum now. 

I am certain our Buddies will soon comment on your thread. 

Make yourself at home, 

RR

[[Id...]]

Hi @[Ho...], welcome here!

 I’m not the biggest expert here but I’ll try to help. Why are you asking this?
 

For what I know AA are far from science based, but most importantly usually problems with benzodiazepines are associated to physical dependence not to addiction.

Here’s a link that clarifies it

https://www.benzoinfo.com/addiction-vs-physical-dependence/

moreover is seems you were on a therapeutic dosage, you weren’t abusing it.

Would you like to share how you are tapering and what symptoms you have, if you have any?

Usually a 10% taper every two weeks is recommended, but it is just a rough recommendation. It’s about how you feel, your symptoms and your resources.

There’s a menu here with basic recommendations, but you can try to ask for clarifications or other users experience.

Personally I can say that experiencing withdrawal symptoms for me came with alcohol cravings… which is almost funny because I always have been almost a non drinker and I can’t drink even if I try (brain receptors seems to be the same but don’t count on me to explain this)

Was this helpful or did I miss the point?

 

[[Cr...]]

I agree with @[Id...]

AA is more for learning how to overcome the desires for alcohol and to help prevent you from using it again as a coping tool in life.

Unless you have been abusing benzos and don't know whether you have the willpower to stop yourself from using in the future, you may not get much out of it.

It could be good for getting you out of the house and meeting other people that may be struggling with the symptoms of their alcohol use (which shares similarities to benzo wd symptoms).

In short, going to AA won't prevent the withdrawal symptoms from coming but may help you deal with them in the form of a social distraction.

[[Re...]]

Hello @[Ho...],

While in case of alcoholism sudden complete abstinence is recommended (Edit: incorrect, see correction below) stopping benzodiazepines this way (cold turkey) , especially after using for a longer period is dangerous. 

A slow, symptom led taper will benefit you the most, by reducing your dose ever two-three weeks by 5-10% of the previous amounts. I will add some useful links about tapering and tapering methods. Benzoinfo.com also details why you should approach this issue carefully, please try to get informed through that site as well. 

I short, many of our members use the cut and hold method (often with the help of a nail file, blade and a precision scale), others use compounded or manufacturers liquids. If you plan your taper, follow your symptoms, you will most likely able to reduce/cessate your benzodiazepine without any major issues. 

We have many members who tapered successfully and are out there living a benzo fee life! 

If you need help with tapering, we have a wonderful Taper Strategies section. 

You can do this!

Take care 

 

 

[[Ho...]]

3 hours ago, [[I...] said:

Hi @[Ho...], welcome here!

 I’m not the biggest expert here but I’ll try to help. Why are you asking this?
 

For what I know AA are far from science based, but most importantly usually problems with benzodiazepines are associated to physical dependence not to addiction.

Here’s a link that clarifies it

https://www.benzoinfo.com/addiction-vs-physical-dependence/

moreover is seems you were on a therapeutic dosage, you weren’t abusing it.

Would you like to share how you are tapering and what symptoms you have, if you have any?

Usually a 10% taper every two weeks is recommended, but it is just a rough recommendation. It’s about how you feel, your symptoms and your resources.

There’s a menu here with basic recommendations, but you can try to ask for clarifications or other users experience.

Personally I can say that experiencing withdrawal symptoms for me came with alcohol cravings… which is almost funny because I always have been almost a non drinker and I can’t drink even if I try (brain receptors seems to be the same but don’t count on me to explain this)

Was this helpful or did I miss the point?

My therapist laughed at my benzo use and her answer was to go to AA.  I’ve binge drank  alcohol in the past but drinking doesn’t even remotely sound good.  Haven’t drank in 2 years.    I started to taper after my therapist laughed and it was the worst hell I’ve ever been through.  Seems having pressure to complete steps in AA make WDs worse.  Like I’m to blame for taking doctor prescribed klonopin and I blame myself for withdrawals 

[[Ho...]]

1 hour ago, [[C...] said:

I agree with @[Id...]

AA is more for learning how to overcome the desires for alcohol and to help prevent you from using it again as a coping tool in life.

Unless you have been abusing benzos and don't know whether you have the willpower to stop yourself from using in the future, you may not get much out of it.

It could be good for getting you out of the house and meeting other people that may be struggling with the symptoms of their alcohol use (which shares similarities to benzo wd symptoms).

In short, going to AA won't prevent the withdrawal symptoms from coming but may help you deal with them in the form of a social distraction.

Thank you so much for your input

[[Ho...]]

54 minutes ago, [[R...] said:

Hello @[Ho...],

While in case of alcoholism sudden complete abstinence is recommended, stopping benzodiazepines this way (cold turkey) , especially after using for a longer period is dangerous. 

A slow, symptom led taper will benefit you the most, by reducing your dose ever two-three weeks by 5-10% of the previous amounts. I will add some useful links about tapering and tapering methods. Benzoinfo.com also details why you should approach this issue carefully, please try to get informed through that site as well. 

I short, many of our members use the cut and hold method (often with the help of a nail file, blade and a precision scale), others use compounded or manufacturers liquids. If you plan your taper, follow your symptoms, you will most likely able to reduce/cessate your benzodiazepine without any major issues. 

We have many members who tapered successfully and are out there living a benzo fee life! 

If you need help with tapering, we have a wonderful Taper Strategies section. 

You can do this!

Take care 

 

3 hours ago, [[I...] said:

Hi @[Ho...], welcome here!

 I’m not the biggest expert here but I’ll try to help. Why are you asking this?
 

For what I know AA are far from science based, but most importantly usually problems with benzodiazepines are associated to physical dependence not to addiction.

Here’s a link that clarifies it

https://www.benzoinfo.com/addiction-vs-physical-dependence/

moreover is seems you were on a therapeutic dosage, you weren’t abusing it.

Would you like to share how you are tapering and what symptoms you have, if you have any?

Usually a 10% taper every two weeks is recommended, but it is just a rough recommendation. It’s about how you feel, your symptoms and your resources.

There’s a menu here with basic recommendations, but you can try to ask for clarifications or other users experience.

Personally I can say that experiencing withdrawal symptoms for me came with alcohol cravings… which is almost funny because I always have been almost a non drinker and I can’t drink even if I try (brain receptors seems to be the same but don’t count on me to explain this)

Was this helpful or did I miss the point?

So helpful.  So much guilt from withdrawals, like it was my fault

[[Cr...]]

25 minutes ago, [[H...] said:

My therapist laughed at my benzo use and her answer was to go to AA.  I’ve binge drank  alcohol in the past but drinking doesn’t even remotely sound good.  Haven’t drank in 2 years.    I started to taper after my therapist laughed and it was the worst hell I’ve ever been through.  Seems having pressure to complete steps in AA make WDs worse.  Like I’m to blame for taking doctor prescribed klonopin and I blame myself for withdrawals 

I believe your therapist believed that your problem with coming off klonopin was you not knowing how to cope with life in its absence. When in reality your problem is literally with the process of coming off of klonopin and getting through the recovery process of your body healing from benzo use.

A good therapist would not conflate addiction/abuse with physical dependence and should at least educate themselves about the withdrawal symptoms caused by discontinuing a benzo when used as prescribed.

If your issue wasn't side effects/tolerance/withdrawal but that you needed to pop a klonopin to deal with every little stressor in life then yeah maybe AA could help. But that doesn't appear to be the case.

 

Edited May 28 by [Cr...]

[[Le...]]

16 hours ago, [[R...] said:

Hello @[Ho...],

While in case of alcoholism sudden complete abstinence is recommended, stopping benzodiazepines this way (cold turkey) , especially after using for a longer period is dangerous. 

A slow, symptom led taper will benefit you the most, by reducing your dose ever two-three weeks by 5-10% of the previous amounts. I will add some useful links about tapering and tapering methods. Benzoinfo.com also details why you should approach this issue carefully, please try to get informed through that site as well. 

I short, many of our members use the cut and hold method (often with the help of a nail file, blade and a precision scale), others use compounded or manufacturers liquids. If you plan your taper, follow your symptoms, you will most likely able to reduce/cessate your benzodiazepine without any major issues. 

We have many members who tapered successfully and are out there living a benzo fee life! 

If you need help with tapering, we have a wonderful Taper Strategies section. 

You can do this!

Take care 

i really would t reccommend sudden complete abstinence from alcohol. it can kill you as easily as ct from benzos. 

[[Re...]]

You are right @[Le...], in cases of alcohol use disorder and dependence, there is in fact a risk of even life threatening withdrawal and delirium. You are right, I really was not enough cautious when I wrote this post. 

Way more chronic alcohol users will benefit from the 12 points and abstinence (as it is the topic of this thread, and in a medically assisted facility) than any benzodiazepine user ever will. I meant only this. Physical dependence forms deeper and a faster rate I believe. 

 

 

[[Go...]]

I will say that I’ve attended NA meetings quite frequently over the past year.  While I don’t believe the 12 steps directly help withdrawal symptoms related to Benzo, I will say the communication and fellowship available helps.  I have been alone for a very long time, and being able to share with others has helped me with the anxiety that is constant in Benzo w/d.

[[Go...]]

On 27/05/2024 at 11:31, [[H...] said:

Has anyone used the AA 12 step program for benzo dependency recovery?  Not sure this is the right path for me.  17 years of  klonopin 1mg, .5 mg for past 9 months.  Now trying to taper down to .25.  

And I was Klonopin as well for 21 years.

[[Id...]]

1 hour ago, [[G...] said:

 

I will say that I’ve attended NA meetings quite frequently over the past year

 

Do you think that, communication and fellowship apart would be a good option for someone that suffers for following doctor’s instructions?

 I ‘d understand if it was talking about our symptoms, but, from a total ignorant point of view on the NA, I fear that guilt part and guilt feeling for abuse situations could mess up subconsciously or not in a period, like benzo healing, that already exposes ourselves to out of scale guilt; rumination and regrets as part of the symptoms. 
 

Just my reasoning 

Edit: forgot to add  that I am really really glad it helped you

Edited May 30 by [Id...]

[[Ho...]]

38 minutes ago, [[G...] said:

I will say that I’ve attended NA meetings quite frequently over the past year.  While I don’t believe the 12 steps directly help withdrawal symptoms related to Benzo, I will say the communication and fellowship available helps.  I have been alone for a very long time, and being able to share with others has helped me with the anxiety that is constant in Benzo w/d.

Yes the fellowship and pushing myself out of comfort zone to attend meetings is beneficial.  But there are some people who have opinions about benzo with no knowledge of how tapering and healing works.  They are not to insert these opinions.  I think their hearts are in the right place.  I had so much misplaced guilt in a push to “work the steps” while my brain is still healing.  Thanks for sharing

On 28/05/2024 at 14:42, [[C...] said:

I agree with @[Id...]

AA is more for learning how to overcome the desires for alcohol and to help prevent you from using it again as a coping tool in life.

Unless you have been abusing benzos and don't know whether you have the willpower to stop yourself from using in the future, you may not get much out of it.

It could be good for getting you out of the house and meeting other people that may be struggling with the symptoms of their alcohol use (which shares similarities to benzo wd symptoms).

In short, going to AA won't prevent the withdrawal symptoms from coming but may help you deal with them in the form of a social distraction.

Thank you so much for your input

[[Ho...]]

1 hour ago, [[I...] said:

Do you think that, communication and fellowship apart would be a good option for someone that suffers for following doctor’s instructions instructions?

 I ‘d understand if it was talking about our symptoms, but, from a total ignorant point of view on the NA, I fear that guilt part and guilt feeling for abuse situations could mess up subconsciously or not in a period, like benzo healing, that already exposes ourselves to out of scale guilt; rumination and regrets as part of the symptoms. 
 

Just my reasoning 

Apart from fellowship and communication, I don’t feel AA is beneficial.  Agree, 100% yes, that the guilt part of AA while benzo healing and beyond, is not a good combination.  At least not in my situation.  My sponsor’s heart is in the right place, but she is just ignorant ( like I was) as to the unique healing process from taking benzo.  

Edited May 30 by [Ho...]
Clarification

[[ta...]]

On 27/05/2024 at 10:31, [[H...] said:

Has anyone used the AA 12 step program for benzo dependency recovery?  Not sure this is the right path for me.  17 years of  klonopin 1mg, .5 mg for past 9 months.  Now trying to taper down to .25.  

Hello! I found that SMART Recovery to be crucial in my recovery. SMART doesn't condone MAT, or tapering. SMART also is a no guilt no shame program. SMART is derived from the principles of CBT/REBT. https://smartrecovery.org/what-is-smart-recovery

 

[[Go...]]

1 hour ago, [[I...] said:

Do you think that, communication and fellowship apart would be a good option for someone that suffers for following doctor’s instructions?

 I ‘d understand if it was talking about our symptoms, but, from a total ignorant point of view on the NA, I fear that guilt part and guilt feeling for abuse situations could mess up subconsciously or not in a period, like benzo healing, that already exposes ourselves to out of scale guilt; rumination and regrets as part of the symptoms. 
 

Just my reasoning 

Edit: forgot to add  that I am really really glad it helped you

Wow