Going from Valium to Klonopin

[[Md...]]

Greetings! I started a thread a few months back on this topic, but couldnt find it. I also didn't get very many answers (if I remember right) so here's the situation.

I was on Xanax, then was switched to Valium. I've been on it for a about a year, but there are days when the sedation really is just too much, so I have been thinking about switching to Klonopin in hopes to eradicate the sedation that Valium brings on. 

I'm simply wondering if anyone here has made this switch before and if so, how did it go?

Thanks.

[[an...]]

Don't get on Klonopin I am on a six-month taper of 3 pills a day for 13 years and it is HELL

[[je...]]

Hi @[an...]

Welcome to BenzoBuddies! 

Thanks for contributing. I’m sorry you’re struggling. Did you crossover from Valium to Klonopin? Please feel welcome to start your own thread if you need support. 

[[Li...]]

@[Md...]  I don’t recall reading about any currently active members who have switched from diazepam/Valium to clonazepam/Klonopin. But if we do have a member who meets your criteria, I hope they will share their experience.

In the interim, I’ll share my personal experience with clonazepam.  For me, it was extremely sedating.  So much so that I could not tolerate even a very low daytime dose.

In case you aren’t already aware of this …

Clonazepam is one of the more challenging benzodiazepines to taper because of its high potency and limited dosage forms and strengths.  In the US, the lowest strength solid dosage form available is a 0.125mg Orally Disintegrating Tablet; a manufacturer’s liquid is not available so individuals who wish to taper using a liquid have limited options (a professionally compounded solution or suspension or a do-it-yourself liquid made with tablets).

[[Md...]]

28 minutes ago, [[L...] said:

@[Md...]  I don’t recall reading about any currently active members who have switched from diazepam/Valium to clonazepam/Klonopin. But if we do have a member who meets your criteria, I hope they will share their experience.

In the interim, I’ll share my personal experience with clonazepam.  For me, it was extremely sedating.  So much so that I could not tolerate even a very low daytime dose.

In case you aren’t already aware of this …

Clonazepam is one of the more challenging benzodiazepines to taper because of its high potency and limited dosage forms and strengths.  In the US, the lowest strength solid dosage form available is a 0.125mg Orally Disintegrating Tablet; a manufacturer’s liquid is not available so individuals who wish to taper using a liquid have limited options (a professionally compounded solution or suspension or a do-it-yourself liquid made with tablets).

Thanks for your feedback. I suppose all benzos are a bit different in the way we respond to them. I have read that Valium is more sedating than Klonopin, and that the sedation from Valium goes away (which it hasn't for me). It has gotten slightly better, but I've been on it for almost a year and some days I don't notice any difference from when I first started taking it, so it's interesting to see different responses from what I've read from other people and forums and whatnot. I do wonder what a general consensus might be regarding Klonopin VS Valium and sedation. 

I have mentioned this before on this forum, but it seems to be the liquid that does me in. Before I was taking the liquid I would simply eat a full meal before a dose and actually not feel too bad.

You do bring up a good point about the tapering aspect. If I switched to Klonopin, then I would probably intend on switching back to Valium for tapering purposes, but I'm pretty far out from that point.

Thanks again for sharing your experience and feedback. 👍

Edited May 17 by [Md...]

[[Li...]]

Here’s your other thread @[Md...].

 

[[Md...]]

51 minutes ago, [[L...] said:

Here’s your other thread @[Md...].

Thanks for taking the time to find it!

[[Md...]]

4 hours ago, [[a...] said:

Don't get on Klonopin I am on a six-month taper of 3 pills a day for 13 years and it is HELL

Really sorry to hear this. Hopefully things will turn around for you sooner rather than later.

[[An...]]

9 hours ago, [[M...] said:

Greetings! I started a thread a few months back on this topic, but couldnt find it. I also didn't get very many answers (if I remember right) so here's the situation.

I was on Xanax, then was switched to Valium. I've been on it for a about a year, but there are days when the sedation really is just too much, so I have been thinking about switching to Klonopin in hopes to eradicate the sedation that Valium brings on. 

I'm simply wondering if anyone here has made this switch before and if so, how did it go?

Thanks.

If the sedation from the Valium is too much, why not just lower the Valium?

[[Ma...]]

13 hours ago, [[L...] said:

Clonazepam is one of the more challenging benzodiazepines to taper because of its high potency and limited dosage forms and strengths.

With a scale, Clonazepam is actually not that hard from a cutting standpoint to taper.  I will be able to cut and weigh a 0.5 mg pill down to .05mg which is my planned jump dose.  It’s also not a bad choice for many people who have difficulties with Valium.  It has a longer half life (18-50 hours) than Lorazepam or Alprazolam, and has no active metabolites.  
 
While Valium has an even longer half life, many, including myself, had difficulties with the crossover as it can be very sedating and is not for everyone.  It also increases liver enzymes in some people so they should have labs drawn.  Either medication is suitable to taper, it just depends on the person.  

[[Li...]]

@[Ma...] In case you have not read it yet, you might find this paper of interest, especially the section about 7-amino-clonazepam (a metabolite of clonazepam):

 

Tóth K, Csukly G, Sirok D, Belic A, Kiss Á, Háfra E, Déri M, Menus Á, Bitter I, Monostory K. Optimization of Clonazepam Therapy Adjusted to Patient's CYP3A Status and NAT2 Genotype. Int J Neuropsychopharmacol. 2016 Dec 30;19(12):pyw083. doi: 10.1093/ijnp/pyw083. PMID: 27639091; PMCID: PMC5203763. 

 

[[Md...]]

8 hours ago, [[A...] said:

If the sedation from the Valium is too much, why not just lower the Valium?

Currently working on it, going at a rate of 5 to 10 percent cuts every month. 👍

[[or...]]

56 minutes ago, [[M...] said:

With a scale, Clonazepam is actually not that hard from a cutting standpoint to taper.  I will be able to cut and weigh a 0.5 mg pill down to .05mg which is my planned jump dose.  It’s also not a bad choice for many people who have difficulties with Valium.  It has a longer half life (18-50 hours) than Lorazepam or Alprazolam, and has no active metabolites.  
 
While Valium has an even longer half life, many, including myself, had difficulties with the crossover as it can be very sedating and is not for everyone.  It also increases liver enzymes in some people so they should have labs drawn.  Either medication is suitable to taper, it just depends on the person.  

I agree matt, I would have had a worse time with other benzos.  For just one thing, I would panic over having to schedule 2 or 3 doses.  The other is, since learning the scale's proper use (15 $ scale btw) with practice, I can trim it w/single edge blade, almost to the number every time.  I sometimes forget to take my dose on time because I feel fine and don't think about it.  It lasts a good 24 hours at least oregonlady

[[Li...]]

8 hours ago, [[A...] said:

If the sedation from the Valium is too much, why not just lower the Valium?

@[An...]’s post has reminded me of another member we had who crossed from Xanax / alprazolam to Valium / diazepam.  She experienced significant daytime sedation until she reached a dose of around 4-6mg. She hasn’t been active on the forum for several years but her username was Mary5588.

[[Ma...]]

46 minutes ago, [[L...] said:

In case you have not read it yet, you might find this paper of interest, especially the section about 7-amino-clonazepam (a metabolite of clonazepam):

Not sure if you’re trying to show me up or what the purpose of sending me an article about Clonazepam metabolism is. I don’t wish to turn this into an academic discussion.  
 

My only point in mentioning metabolites is that diazepam has a number of ACTIVE metabolites which is part of the reason it is active for over 100 hours.  
 

 

[[or...]]

Like I've learned, every single one of us is different, some similarities, but can be total opposites on effects of benzos.

[[Md...]]

1 hour ago, [[M...] said:

With a scale, Clonazepam is actually not that hard from a cutting standpoint to taper.  I will be able to cut and weigh a 0.5 mg pill down to .05mg which is my planned jump dose.  It’s also not a bad choice for many people who have difficulties with Valium.  It has a longer half life (18-50 hours) than Lorazepam or Alprazolam, and has no active metabolites.  
 
While Valium has an even longer half life, many, including myself, had difficulties with the crossover as it can be very sedating and is not for everyone.  It also increases liver enzymes in some people so they should have labs drawn.  Either medication is suitable to taper, it just depends on the person.  

Thanks for sharing. So you too weren't able to tolerate Valium too well, and went from Valium to Klonopin then? What were your symptoms on V compared to K? 

The crossover itself was very difficult, and the depression that lasted for several months was unreal. Fortunately, that went away for the most part, but the sedation and brain fog (probably from the sedation) can be pretty difficult at times. 

It also doesn't help that I was told to dose 3 times a day (the third dose is no problem, since I take it before bed), which is how I was dosing Xanax before I developed I/D withdrawals, so my doc just basically told me to keep the dosing schedule the same. I can see his point, but simultaneously am wondering if it's overkill due to the long half life of Valium. I'm honestly wondering if i could get by combining my morning and afternoon dose at once. 🤔

 

[[Md...]]

15 minutes ago, [[L...] said:

@[An...]’s post has reminded me of another member we had who crossed from Xanax / alprazolam to Valium / diazepam.  She experienced significant daytime sedation until she reached a dose of around 4-6mg. She hasn’t been active on the forum for several years but her username was Mary5588.

I'm a long way from home in that case. Currently at 27mg a day, but have heard mixed things about the sedation being dose dependent. I certainly hope it is in case I choose to stay on Valium until the end of my taper. 

[[Li...]]

13 minutes ago, [[M...] said:

Not sure if you’re trying to show me up or what the purpose of sending me an article about Clonazepam metabolism is. I don’t wish to turn this into an academic discussion.  

Sometimes a paper is just a paper @[Ma...].  You have identified yourself as a physician so I simply thought you might find this paper interesting given your comment about clonazepam and its major metabolite.    It was brought to my attention a while back by another member who was both an MD and a PhD in pharmacology.  

 

 

[[or...]]

16 hours ago, [[a...] said:

Don't get on Klonopin I am on a six-month taper of 3 pills a day for 13 years and it is HELL

Hi Anne, I can relate in that I took just did 1 mg a day for 35 years, and did one CT and one taper of too much per month, before I found BB.

Welcome to BB by the way, don't hesitate to make a post of your own as many of your peers (people that have personal experience w/benzo) will reach out to be there for you, including me, oregonlady

Edited May 18 by [or...]

[[Ma...]]

11 minutes ago, [[M...] said:

What were your symptoms on V compared to K? 

I literally had trouble getting out of bed.  It was very sedating for me and I’m a very active person.  I also didnt like the way it made my head feel and gave me stomach issues.  Some people do fine with it though.  To me it’s a matter of preference.  We all react differently.  

[[Li...]]

5 minutes ago, [[M...] said:

I'm a long way from home in that case. Currently at 27mg a day, but have heard mixed things about the sedation being dose dependent. I certainly hope it is in case I choose to stay on Valium until the end of my taper. 

27mg is indeed a hefty dose of Valium.   How many times a day do you take your dose?  Have you and Dr. Josef discussed the pros/cons of trialing nighttime dosing only?

[[Md...]]

This conversation now begs the question, does one benzo cause more intense w/d side fx after a proper taper is completed? 🤔

Again, maybe this just leads straight back to the default answer, which is, "Everyone is different."

Given the amount of years benzos have been on the market, it kind of baffles me that we don't have more research regarding some of the most basic questions. 

 

[[Md...]]

3 minutes ago, [[M...] said:

I literally had trouble getting out of bed.  It was very sedating for me and I’m a very active person.  I also didnt like the way it made my head feel and gave me stomach issues.  Some people do fine with it though.  To me it’s a matter of preference.  We all react differently.  

Did you have any issues crossing over to K? I'm also curious as to how you did the transition, if you don't mind sharing. 

[[or...]]

4 minutes ago, [[M...] said:

This conversation now begs the question, does one benzo cause more intense w/d side fx after a proper taper is completed? 🤔

Again, maybe this just leads straight back to the default answer, which is, "Everyone is different."

Given the amount of years benzos have been on the market, it kind of baffles me that we don't have more research regarding some of the most basic questions. 

I think we are all baffled by the benzos affects, at least I am on my own body.  I agree with Dr. Heather Ashton on each person deciding their own best taper method, which is what I've done along the way.  I'd rather be my own guinea pig than some doctors who's maybe never taken a benzo in their life, and really short on education and studies that are few and far between.

I started with lower cuts, that were recommended, and they were too big for me to keep some form of quality of life.  People's opinions are good, but I take what I feel I can use, and leave the rest.  It's how my body speaks to me that I'm all ears with oregonlady

Edited May 18 by [or...]