Klonopin to valium crossover

[[Li...]]

Wise decision @[...].  The fact that you’re experiencing relief after reinstating is an encouraging sign.  

Benzodiazepine withdrawal can be quite taxing on the nervous system and body. The last thing you need at your age is to undergo major back surgery in a weakened, dysregulated state. 

 

[[...]]

Some relief but still awful. The nausea, fast heart beat -and chills.  No sleep at all. I start to fall asleep and within 1/2 hr am woke up suddenly with flushing fast heart beat, chills and NAUSEA which stays for many hours. I have 2 months now to get off these meds. Not sure if slow taper is good idea . I started again friday and am on a total of .125mg divided up into 3 doses per day.  I think I will suffer no matter what so the sooner I am done taper the better. I just dont know how much more I can tolerate. The CT was probably the worst so I guess I need to choose between fast or slow taper. Im rambling, sorry. Should I give .125mg more time.  I really am lost and worrying about what I might do. I sure didnt ask for this mess. Many on this forum have said restarting is a mistake. Should I be able to stabilize at this dose after stopping for 10 days. 

Edited April 6 by [...]

[[Li...]]

[[...]]

Ok. Here is another question. Since I stopped for 10 days does the body remember what dose you gave it before stopping or can I do a large cut on restarting.  As I said I have restarted at .125mg which is a little less than prior. Wondering what will happen if I cut that by 1/3 and just dose twice a day.  Or increase the two doses so as not to make such a large cut. eg. .11 mg divided in two doses. Thats about a 20% cut from the .141mg prior to stopping. Feel like im grasping at straws but sounds like thats pretty common for us that are struggling. 

Edited April 6 by [...]

[[Co...]]

Hi @[...]. Wherever you can, avoid complications. If you are reinstating, concentrate on that. Generally, when reinstating, you probably should wait a couple of weeks to assess the situation before making any new changes. Further, in your situation - upcoming surgery - I think I would settle in and only consider tapering off after the operation. Unless outside forces make this impossible, aim to tackle one thing at a time.

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I think I may be having paradoxical effects. I am following your advice and staying at .125 mg per day.  About an hour after each dose I get a flushing and sweating with a lot of nausea. The nausea lasts for hours.  
I feel so helpless. Every direction I take is hitting a wall. Running out of resolve.  Libertas and Colin, you guys have been hanging in there with me and I appreciate it. 
iI will continue this path unless there is a different one you suggest. 

[[Co...]]

[[...]]

Maybe just need a little more time to adjust to reinstating.  

[[Co...]]

[[Li...]]

 

Hello @[...].

I agree with @[Co...] about talking to your doctor.  

I wonder if your nervous system and body are in a dysregulated state due to your abrupt discontinuation from almost 0.15mg clonazepam on March 25? You’ve now reinstated to a lower dose (0.125mg) which was another ‘shock’ to your nervous system and body.  Dysregulated nervous systems fire off all sorts of weird signals (including what may or may not be paradoxical reactions).

In your shoes, I would be inclined to wait several more days to see if symptoms begin to settle down and trend toward improvement. 

Re: your upcoming back surgery …

Have you talked to your doctor about the possibility of using a professionally compounded liquid to obtain the doses you require?  If you are able to stabilize on the clonazepam and proceed with the surgery in June, one would hope that the hospital and rehab center would be comfortable administering a professionally prepared dosage form.

 

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I agree and will give this dose a few more days and see.  As far as the hospital they have agreed to me producing my own doses. Just some additional paperwork to go through. Will let you guys know how it goes. Today wasn’t bad. Now see how tonight goes.  

[[Li...]]

@[...]  I thought you might find this video of interest given your upcoming surgery.

 

[[...]]

Libertas.  Btw, how do I post your libertas logo without having to write it out?  Reviewed the video. As usual you have been very helpful. Video was interesting. I will for sure have conversation with anesthesiologists and hospital doctors regarding meds. The surgery issues alone are daunting not to mention what the benzo effect will be.  Very scary.  I try to occupy my mind with other things.  Hoping since my usage of Klonopin was only sporadic for about 3 months and I have been on a 5 month slow taper that it is not protracted. Thank you again for hanging in there with me.  Talk soon. 

[[Li...]]

Hello @[...].  I’m glad you found the video of interest.  Chris is super cautious about medications because he suffered from horrific akathisia after a far-too-rapid clonazepam detox. 

Surgery is indeed scary.  But based on your previous posts it sounds like you have taken/will take all appropriate steps to prepare for it.  I wouldn’t worry overmuch about the clonazepam (other than to make sure your surgical team and anesthesiologist know you are taking it).  Versed/midazolam is frequently used for anesthesia and procedural sedation so anesthesiologists know how to manage this class of medication.  

To tag a member in a post, enter the @ followed by the first letters of their username (e.g.  in my case ‘Lib’).  A popup menu will appear with a list of usernames that begin with those letters.  Select the username of the member you wish to tag.  The tag will be automatically inserted into the body of your post.

[[...]]

@[Li...]  Think I have tapered to fast last 5-6 weeks.  I thought I was doing sort of ok but just got slammed monday and wont stop. Im 3 weeks out from surgery. Hope with no more drops I can stabilize by 6/11. Had a cortizone shot Monday so dont know if that’s just a coincidence or did it contribute. Going to show my schedule of tapers since I ct’d on 3/21 for 10 days.
4/1-4/14  .125 mg, 4/15-4/20  .115 mg, 4/21-4/27  .105mg,  4/28-5/5  .097 mg,  5/6-5/15  .088 mg,  5-16- current  .079 mg

Think I got a little too optimistic since prior to Monday there were w/d but I was handling them   When I look back now I realize it was about 35% drop in 5 weeks. Too much. Do the drops add over time? Am I having w/d from more than one drop done earlier?  Trying to up-dose a bit would most likely be a mistake.  Do you agree?

 

 

[[Li...]]

Hello @[...].  Tip of the hat for mastering the fine art of using @mention to alert me to your post!

I agree with you that you have likely exceeded the taper rate you can comfortably tolerate.  Based on the numbers you’ve shared, your taper rate was approx 22.4% in April and is approx 18.56% so far this month.  (The cortisone shot may — or may not — be a factor. Some members have had issues with these whereas others have not.)

Clonazepam has a relatively long half-life, so dose reductions can take a while to fully manifest (e.g. up to 12 days depending on the individual).  So, yes the rapid reductions you’ve made thus far have likely been “stacking up” on one another.  Or, to put it another way, the dose reductions have been so large and so fast, your nervous system has not had sufficient time to adapt to them. 

Assuming you wish to be as stable as possible before your upcoming surgery and given the limited amount of time available to achieve this goal (3 weeks),  I suggest you at least consider a small updose.  What dose were you taking the last time you felt ‘ok’ (i.e. withdrawal symptoms were stable and tolerable and functionality was acceptable)?

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@[Li...]  Yep, that’s what I thought. Got a little cocky thinking I had things under control. I will start a 10% up-dose tonight and see how that goes.  

[[Li...]]

That’s a sound strategy, @[...].  I hope it brings you both relief and stabilization.  I also hope you’ll keep us posted as to what transpires.  Updosing is a topic of great interest to members of this community — the more we can learn about it by sharing our experiences, the better. 

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@[Li...]I decided not to updose and stayed on current dose. Seems I have somewhat stabilized and am getting ready for surgery on Tues 6/11.  Will let you know how things go.  Trying to stay positive.  

[[Li...]]

@[...] How are you doing?  

[[...]]

Had surgery 6/11. Hospital told me i could bring meds. After surgery they said no and would only provide .25 mg. As i was at .08 mg i said no and had to just stop. It has been five weeks since surgery. Nausea is relentless. Cant eat, lost 20 lbs. pretty sure its wds but since last surgery gave me a bad infection i am in hospital and surgery team is looking for signs of infection. Worried about meds they are giving me. This is an awful process to go through for anyone but for a short time user it is frustrating. 

[[Ct...]]

[[Li...]]

Oh no @[...].  I’m so very sorry to hear this.  Even though 0.08mg of clonazepam may no longer be exerting a therapeutic effect, this does not mean it has no effect. These drugs can cause multiple changes in our brains and our bodies, even after short-term use.

Have you discussed the possibility that you may be in acute benzodiazepine withdrawal with your care team?  

Is a benzo-knowledgeable clinician available who could consult with your care team? 

[[...]]

@[Li...]Home from hospital. Think infection might be low chance after tests and discussing with surgical team.  Nausea has eased as of yesterday.  Hoping I am making progress. Will post sometime later with updates.  

[[Li...]]

Hello @[...].  Home from the hospital with a low chance of infection and nausea easing sounds like progress to me — here’s to more of the same in the days to come!