Scared and needing help from 3mg Diazapam

[[Sc...]]

Hi fellow sufferer's. 

                I have only posted a few times, but not on this board. I don't know where to go from here, I was cut from 10mg down to 4.5mg in 4 months 2022. (August)

                 I had to stop there, as it was brutal, I held to the December then cut a quarter bringing me to 4mg, held till February 23, I made another drop bringing me to 3.5mg, I held this till August 23as I  had up and coming brain surgery, to face, Had the surgery July, and I stupidly within a month cut another quarter. It was to much on top of surgery, It was bad I did go back up to 3.5 for few days, then wrote on BB and a few lovely people answered me @[Wi...] being one of them. I decided to stick at 3mg from September   till now. But in the last week, I have had awful feelings after taking this dose, Terrible dizziness and balance, head pressure pain visual disturbances, Nausea, which has been with me through whole taper, two and a half stone weight loss, Tinnitus and and a load more.

               What to do now. The last drop was to much I believe 5% -10% is recommended. I have bought a jeweler's scale, but have no idea what these % are please please could someone help. If I take 5% away is that everyday. I have had good moments in this long hold, but this lady week has frightened me, which I know does not help. I don't even want to take the tablets now as I am afraid of side effects. 

                  But I know CT is not the answer. Thank you to anyone who Answers this 

[Guest [...]]

Hi @[Sc...]

You would simply cut 5-10% and then hold for 10-14 days, or until you feel recovered from that cut. Then cut again. 

Here’s how you calculate your reduction percentage.

Because you are at 3mg daily (assuming you’re dosing once per day), weigh 2 tablets together to get the total weight, which for example… may weigh something around 0.344

 

Using a calculator

First you want to get the scale weight of 3mg’s so, 0.344 - 25% = 0.258

Now you have the total scale weight (0.258) of the 3mg dose you will be cutting from. 

 

(For a 5% reduction) 0.258 x 95% = 0.2451 (drop the 1 and call it 0.245 since the scale can’t calculate that extra digit) 

From the two tablets, break, shave or file (maybe a combination) your dose down to 0.245, and that’s your total daily dose after making a 5% reduction.

(For a 10% reduction) 0.258 x 90% = 0.2322 (drop the 2 at the end and call it 0.232).

From your two tablets, break, shave or file down to 0.232 and that’s your total daily dose weight after a 10% reduction. 

For each next cut, you would make the same calculation from your remaining dose weight.

Example:

If your previous cut was 5%, and you wanted to do another 5% cut, you would simply calculate from your remaining dose weight 0.245 x 95% = 0.23275 (either drop the 75 since the scale can’t calculate the digits after 0.232, or round it up to 0.233 (since the 75 makes it closer to 0.233 than 0.232) That’s your next dose after another 5% cut

If your previous cut was 10%, use the remaining dose 0.232 x 90% = 0.2088 ( I’d probably round that up to 0.209 since it’s closer to 0.209 than it is to 0.208) 

 

I hope I haven’t confused you, Mary. 

Feel free to ask questions if you are confused. 👍

 

 

 

 

[[Sc...]]

@[Wi...] Thank you so much for your reply, I have been so bad today I can't take all this in, but I could show it to somebody who is coming to see me tomorrow. I dose 3 times a day 1 mg each, I really feel I'm having interdose withdrawals now. 

                 So I literally only take 5% away from one tablet not everyday? (Dose) for week then hold for 10-14 days? 

              You are so kind to have gone to all this trouble explaining everything, it's so much time consuming for you, 

                  I'm so scared at moment I think I've held to long and the dose now feels like it's poisoning me, and obviously there is no therapeutic effect, I feel like I'm in Acute. 

                        I should have done these cuts when I was having good days, have I messed everything up? It's so painful I'm sorry for moaning you have been so kind

              It's good to have your advice 

[[Sl...]]

Can you ask your doctor for liquid diazepam? At these low doses, I find it easier to measure using a syringe. In the USA you can get a 1 mg/mL solution without a special compounding pharmacy -- you just have your physician write for liquid instead of pills. This had made tapering much easier. 

[Guest [...]]

Hi @[Sc...]

Im so sorry you’re experiencing such intense symptoms lately whilst holding.

Are you sure you haven’t had any external emotional upsets, difficulties, or overstimulated yourself by taking too much on? I just went into a rough wave from emotional triggers that normally (if well) wouldn’t have been an issue. Also, just know that the more we panic and fear what we’re experiencing, it creates a loop by feeding back into the nervous system and increasing symptoms. It can be a vicious cycle. 

You would just calculate your 5% reduction and then make your next 10-14 days of doses that same dose. 

Definitely get your visitor to walk you through it. 

First, just focus on doing that initial calculation to get the scale weight of the dose you’re at right now. You need that scale weigh of your current 3mg dose from which to then calculate your 5% reduction. 

Please don’t apologise… it’s not your fault you are unwell and it’s okay to express it. It’s not moaning. 🫂

[Guest [...]]

@[Sc...]

@[Sl...] has suggested switching to liquid, and although it’s an option, you are quite symptomatic and trying to switch to another delivery system (Liquid) can sometimes come with its own difficulties, especially if you are unstable. The fact that you are tapering diazepam (the easiest benzo to taper accurately with scales), if you can just get your head around those calculations, I would stick to tapering the tablets rather than attempt a switch to liquid right now. 

If you need me to walk you through step by step while you calculate and weigh, then we can do that. 🫂

[[Sc...]]

@[Wi...]

Maybe I have had some emotional upsets, but it's just the reaction of my body which I can actually time now, so soon after taking my tablet. But I know our bodies are not reacting in the same way. Im not a type of person who sits and dwells on these feelings as much as they frighten me. I distract as much as I can, and maybe yes I push myself, I'm sorry to hear you have had some trigger points lately, I do hope you have turned a corner. This is such a cruel situation for us all to be in. I will show this to my visitor today, but I won't lie I don't feel very confident after talking to him, I feel more educated about the situation even though he is working in this field. You can only get a trustworthy answer from people like yourself going through it. As I have come up against so many non believers that this is Benzo withdrawal, I have lost my trust. 

          So thank you for giving me a little hope. It's not been a good night and another day ahead makes me weary.....But I will do it!!! As we all are. I will post after visitor been

                Thank you 

            

[[Sc...]]

@[Sl...] Thank you so much for taking time to reply, 

             I can't even get to speak to a Doctor all our Drs have left surgery, and we only have Nurse practitioners seeing patients and they have no training at all in Benzo withdrawal, and I don't think we can get liquid solutions here in UK our NHS is  in a terrible state.

             But I will look into this liquid compound you mention and maybe try to see a pharmacy. But at the moment as @[Wi...] has said I'm so afraid of my withdrawal symptoms at moment any changes are frightening me, even to think of a cut now, 

                 Thank you so much for your advice it means a lot, from what I read I gather the US is much more ahead in knowledge and excepting there is damage from these tablets, The UK is not the same. I wish I could find a Benzo wise Dr here to advise and guide me.

[Guest [...]]

The UK is waking up @[Sc...]

Mark Horowitz (benzo wise psychiatrist) who went through his own difficult taper and withdrawal was on The Project (current affairs type show) in Australia last night about the change in deprescribing guidelines in the UK. 

I think it’s available in the UK through Amazon from early march. 

He discussed everything we discuss here and admitted he was given absolutely no training in deprescribing as a psychiatrist. 

He also wrote a column in the Guardian about the terrible situation we’re all in… how we’ve been forced into online forums because nobody believes us, including doctors. 

He had 300 emails the next day from people needing help tapering, but the most interesting thing is that 6 of those emails were from other psychiatrists asking him for help tapering of their own medications. 

Keep in touch and I’ll walk you through the calculation and weighing as you do it, if necessary. 🫂

[[Sc...]]

That's very interesting to hear @[Wi...] I will look this gentleman up. All these doctors are happy to prescribe tis poison but will not look into or believe the damage they have done, to so many innocent people.

             Even the gentleman who came to see me, said people like me are only a small minority!!!!! The majority of people walk of this medication with no problems!!...... Clearly not, yet when I mention forums, I am looked at as oh your one of them people don't believe all you see on them. It makes my blood boil.

                    I do have a rough idea with these scales, but I might still be asking your advice if you don't mind. I'm to afraid to start anything now, as something is very wrong with every dose I take within a short time horrible wd start. And that stays until I take another dose, and the same pattern continues again, and they are very strong withdrawal symptoms (so uncomfortable).

           I don't know if I've destabilized, or it's interdose withdrawals from holding so long. Do you have relief when taking your doses? And have you cut lately? I don't know if I'm aloud to ask you these questions, I will understand if you can't answer though.

Been awake all night again and now to face another day, like so many others on here. How does this happen in 2024 there should be so much more help and understanding of this predicament it's been going on for years the medical professionals are choosing to ignore us!! Thanks again for reaching out.

[Guest [...]]

Don’t let those people rile you, Mary. They are just misinformed and ignorant, but they will be the ones looking like fools as the truth emerges and can no longer be denied. They will be the ones who will have to face up to all the unnecessary pain they have caused through ego and ignorance. 

I don’t feel any of my doses, Mary. I just know that taking them daily stops symptoms from increasing. 

Although, there was a time when I was very unstable where my symptoms increased immediately after each dose, but eventually it resolved. I can’t say this is the same case for you or not. Some members having similar issues find that making a reduction brings with it a brief window or decline in symptoms for the first few days after, but there really is no way of knowing for sure. It really is trial and error to find the best way forward. 

You may eventually find that things just settle as though a wave has passed, or you may have to decide to move forward by making a reduction.

You’d been holding for some time before this increase in symptom suddenly began occuring post dose, and if you feel there’s really no external stress or emotional trigger behind the increased symptoms, then you may have to start tapering slowly, rather than remaining stuck where you are for too long without relief. 

I will help you with the scales and calculations, so don’t be concerned with that. 

I just hope this all settles down for you soon, so you can taper more comfortably. 🫂

 

[[Ty...]]

Hey there just wanted to let you know I'm in a very similar boat. I have tapered from 10 mg diazepam down to around 2 - 3 mg in the last 3 months. I'm struggling very much as well just figured maybe we can be some support for each other. I had a few days where I was taking 1.5 mg but it seems to be getting worse the head fog the derealization. I've had to go back up a little to 2.5 - 3. I am determined though just figured maybe it would make you feel better to know you're not alone and we are around the same dose with the same struggles. Blessing 

 

Tyler