Scales for tapering at .0001

[[mi...]]

Hello everyone.  New to the group. 12 year Ativan user.. Preparing to taper. Im wondering how and what equipment everyone is using to measure microgram daily reductions for slow tapering? I can only find scales that read as low as 1mg. How can I measure .0001 reductions for dry tapering starting with .5mg pills? 

[[Co...]]

Hello @[mi...]. Welcome to BenzoBuddies.

I am not the best person to advise on specific scales, but I expect other members will be able to help you.

I will comment, though, on being able to measure to 0.0001mg is far beyond what you will need. I am not sure how much more a benzo tablet typically weights than just the benzodiazepine, but it will be substantially greater. I suspect that a typical 0.5mg benzo tablet weighs several grams (someone else please confirm). I expect that being able to measure increments of 0.01mg should be good enough. And being able to measure to 0.001 more then good enough. Being able to measure to 0.0001mg is surely overkill (and the scales will be expensive too).

[[mi...]]

That makes sense. I think I meant .001 not .0001 I think it was Jellybelly posts I was reading about .001 reductions daily. I guess my uneducated initial thought was that a .5 mg benzo pill weighed .5mg. I bet you are correct that it weighs more than that because of the Filler combined with the active ingredient. Considering water titration method also but disolving pills into pre measured water then removing .001 percent each day seems like I "tedious" task. Although I'm willing to try anything. All the math to keep track of each day seems easy to screw up Considering how badly my brain works these days. I wonder if there's a chart or spreadsheet I could get to show the daily reduction measurements clear so I can track accurately? Thanks again!

[[je...]]

Hi @[mi...].

Have you tapered before? I'm interested in understanding why you are considering microtapering. The majority of our members are fine using jewelry scales bought from Amazon.  If you are not extremely sensitive, then a jewelry scale from Amazon is perfectly fine. I used it. Here's a link to the one I used.

 

[[mi...]]

I have never tapered before. I reduced my daily from 1mg to .5mg about 4 months ago without much problem. I've had severe anxiety most of my life which led to chronic alcoholism for many years. I stopped drinking 16 years ago and thats when I was first prescribed Ativan. Obviously medicating my anxiety with booze and now benzos. In recent weeks I've been experiencing alot of w/d symptoms and heightened anxiety. For quite a few years I was also on Zoloft in conjunction with the lorazapam. Im just lost and don't know where to begin. I've considered going back on the ssri's to help with the anxiety while tapering and even after. Honestly I just dont want to be on any of them. The Zoloft makes my anxiety worse when I start it and with the symptoms I'm experiencing now I just can't handle that. Had I known this would be the result of taking benzos longterm I would have never started. It was easier to just deal with the anxiety.  Im about to loose my job as its becoming too much to deal with along with the addiction. I thought a slow taper of .001 per day and a hold at lower doses similar to your taper may be a start at least. I just need a starting point. I have kids and need to be here for them. How did I ever get this far down the rabbit hole?? Feeling like there are no solutions. Thank you for responding.  Ordered a jewelry scale today. Going to try to get on a reg schedule of my .5mg dose till Jan. Same time same dose regularly.  Then taper. 

[[je...]]

I just want to clarify a couple of things. When you halved your dose, you didn't really have any issues right? Then you stayed on that dose for 4 months. While staying on 0.5mg, you started experiencing withdrawal symptoms without making a reduction?

I have actually used lots of different methods during my taper. For anyone new to tapering I would not suggest starting out with microtapering. In my opinion it's important to find out what percentage taper your body can handle. The best way to do that from my experience, is doing so through cut and hold. If you do microtapering, then it's extremely difficult to monitor your percentages because you do not feel the cut as it happens. You have a gradual increase. With cut and hold you make the percentage cut in one single cut, you feel your symptoms setting in between day 3-5 and then they usually level off around day 10 again. You can usually tell in 3-4 cycles whether your body can handle that specific percentage or if you need to adjust it. If you have never tapered before, my suggestion would be to start with cut and hold. But of course, whatever you decide to do, we will help and support you.

[[mi...]]

I have to respectfully disagree with @[Co...] on this. Myself and another user @[he...] and I’m sure others have had to order expensive .0001g scales. Ours cost $1500. I could not stabilize with the fluctuating doses as I got lower on K prior to this scale. I’m currently at .156mg K which is .0535g in pill weight. At this weight the cheap .001g scales from Amazon had a variance of 1.85% between .001 increments and also did not give the same reading every time which means each daily dose could vary 1-3% theoretically if not more depending on the scale that day. Even a perfectly measured dose could be off as much as 1.85% at my current dose. Many people do not have an issue with this variance, but my body can feel even the smallest adjustments in dose. I have finally started to slowly stabilize since I got my new scale a month ago, that guarantees a very precise and accurate measurement. I simply could not stabilize or taper on the other scale because I was so sick. Within a few weeks of using the highly precise scale, I felt a difference in my sleep, and now I can do a daily micro taper or a cut and hold and know exactly what I am getting down to 0.2% accuracy and precision. Some say it’s overkill, but they are speaking from their own experience. Myself and others who suffer with my changes would beg to differ. I think it’s important to realize that statements do not apply to everybody the same, so Colin is speaking from his experience and probably a majority of people who taper, but I am speaking for the percentage of us who suffer with inaccuracies that dramatically affect how we feel. How on earth would I taper as I get lower if I can only make cuts of 5% or greater precision and even then one week, I might be doing 10% without even knowing it due to the scale being off .001g that day. Yes the longer the half-life these things tend to average out over the days, but some people feel cuts quicker than others, and I can only say that for those who cannot tolerate liquid for precise doses as they get lower, they may need to consider an expensive scale because it is the only thing that has stabilized me and worked. It was worth the $1500, even though I didn’t have it to spend. But if you can handle some fluctuations in your dose and some inaccuracies and are not sensitive to small changes, then maybe a $20 Amazon scale will work. But you are dealing with a short half life drug like Ativan. So you need to realize that fluctuations in your dose as your taper will be felt stronger than with something like Valium which days in your blood longer. Just giving you my side of the coin. Again statements that are broad do not cover everyone the same so just make sure you do your homework and ask around, I’m just giving you my side of things, everyone is entitled to their opinion. You and most people likely don’t need this level of precision but as you get lower you might, if not you may need to switch to liquid. Or maybe you’re a lucky one who can handle just dry cutting all the way off with a cheap scale. 

Edited December 3, 2023 by [mi...]

[[mi...]]

To be clear, yes. Halved my dose and was doing well. Then recently I've been having headaches, racing heart, some vertigo. I think alot of the increase in my anxiety is job, life, stress related as I've been fine for months at half my original dosage that I've been taking once daily for 12 years. Occasionally ( vary rarely) taking more in cases of panic attack which are also rare. I just recently found out how damaging long term use can be and started studying the harm and just how hard it is to get off of them. That knowledge itself gave me tremendous anxiety 😆 To be honest reading posts on this page is making me even more worried! I was considering cutting my dose down from .5 to .25 but that may be too big a jump even though I did it from 1mg to .5mg. Just looking for the next step. Im afraid to cut 50% again. So I'm thinking to start with a 10% cut till I level off (hopefully) thus the need for a scale. Not sure how long it will take to adjust to a 10% cut and hold but even if its months before the next cut and level off, at least I'm making progress. I gotta get off them eventually! I'll get my normal dosage back on a regular schedule as its been more lately. Maybe go to a .25 dose twice daily instead of  5 once a day and then start 10% cut and hold. Does that seem like a reasonable plan?

[[mi...]]

@[mi...] thanks buddy. I appreciate the input. I certainly will spend the money on a more accurate scale if the fluctuations are too much for me. I dont exactly understand the numbers and weights to keep track of daily or weekly cuts to make sure im staying in track. Is there any kind of spread sheet or daily log that can be helpful? Math and measurements is NOT my strong point. 

[[mi...]]

If you’re comfortable with 10% cuts maybe try doing that every two weeks. Take 10% of your last dose away not of the original dose. So your actual cuts will always be 10% but the pill amount you take away will slowly get smaller if that makes sense. 

[[je...]]

7 hours ago, [[m...] said:

To be clear, yes. Halved my dose and was doing well. Then recently I've been having headaches, racing heart, some vertigo. I think alot of the increase in my anxiety is job, life, stress related as I've been fine for months at half my original dosage that I've been taking once daily for 12 years. Occasionally ( vary rarely) taking more in cases of panic attack which are also rare. I just recently found out how damaging long term use can be and started studying the harm and just how hard it is to get off of them. That knowledge itself gave me tremendous anxiety 😆 To be honest reading posts on this page is making me even more worried! I was considering cutting my dose down from .5 to .25 but that may be too big a jump even though I did it from 1mg to .5mg. Just looking for the next step. Im afraid to cut 50% again. So I'm thinking to start with a 10% cut till I level off (hopefully) thus the need for a scale. Not sure how long it will take to adjust to a 10% cut and hold but even if its months before the next cut and level off, at least I'm making progress. I gotta get off them eventually! I'll get my normal dosage back on a regular schedule as its been more lately. Maybe go to a .25 dose twice daily instead of  5 once a day and then start 10% cut and hold. Does that seem like a reasonable plan?

If you're suddenly experiencing withdrawal symptoms when you didn't make a cut, it could be tolerance withdrawal. But it also could be the stress as you mentioned. Do the symptoms ever settle down or disappear for certain times?

Regarding splitting your dose, I would only do it if I were experiencing interdose withdrawal. The less you dose the easier it is to taper. But if you're having interdose withdrawal then yes, you would want to split your dose. Do you know how to determine whether you have interdose withdrawal?

When it comes to reductions we usually recommend cuts of 5- 10% every two weeks or so, depending on your symptoms. The cut will be calculated on each new dose and not the starting dose.

If you use dry cutting you'll take the weight of the pill in grams and deduct 10% of the pill weight and that will be your cut. In dry cutting this is equivalent to tapering 10% of the active ingredient. 

[[mi...]]

Yes I believe I'm experiencing some interdose withdrawal. The half-life of Ativan is pretty short. Im also definitely under more stress than normal through my work and personal life so this is probably having an affect as well. I will try splitting my dose. Once I can even out a bit and not be experiencing such bad symptoms I will try to start a taper. Thank you for the insight. Btw my sleep is usually pretty decent. Not lately.  Getting an hour or two at a time the last few days. 

[[Co...]]

On 03/12/2023 at 01:57, [[m...] said:

I have to respectfully disagree with @[Co...] on this. Myself and another user @[he...] and I’m sure others have had to order expensive .0001g scales. Ours cost $1500. I could not stabilize with the fluctuating doses as I got lower on K prior to this scale. I’m currently at .156mg K which is .0535g in pill weight.

Hi @[mi...]

That's a lot of scale. It should be remembered that the majority of our members are (probably) negatively economically impacted by benzodiazepine use or withdrawal, and/or their health was already less than optimal before benzodiazepines and likely hinders their ability to earn a crust. So let's explore if it is necessary for most members to use such an expensive scale for titration of benzodiazepines.

Assuming you use 0.5mg Klonopin tablets - 0.0535g pill / 0.156mg Klonopin equates to a (full) pill-weight of about 0.1715g. That's about an order of magnitude less than I guessed.

0.1715g = 171.5mg for the whole pill. And, again, there is 0.5mg Klonopin per pill.

This means that the Klonopin accounts for about one part in 343 of the pill.

But none of that is directly relevant. What is important is that we can divide the pill into reasonably small-sized chunks - one tenth of the pill is one tenth of the 0.5mg (0.05mg). One-hundredth of the pill is one-hundredth of 0.5mg (0.005mg). And so forth.

What is a reasonable division of a pill for our purposes? I would suggest that dividing the pill into hundredths is more than enough.

On 03/12/2023 at 01:57, [[m...] said:

At this weight the cheap .001g scales from Amazon had a variance of 1.85% between .001 increments and also did not give the same reading every time which means each daily dose could vary 1-3% theoretically if not more depending on the scale that day. Even a perfectly measured dose could be off as much as 1.85% at my current dose.

'Variance' is a bit complicated. Properly, variance is the squared differences from the mean (average) value. It has been a very long time since I've studied statistics. Can you link the balance you detail there, because I do not understand what is meant by "variance of 1.85% between .001 increments". Irrespective, I don't think this gets us very far in this discussion.

On 03/12/2023 at 01:57, [[m...] said:

Many people do not have an issue with this variance, but my body can feel even the smallest adjustments in dose. I have finally started to slowly stabilize since I got my new scale a month ago, that guarantees a very precise and accurate measurement. I simply could not stabilize or taper on the other scale because I was so sick. Within a few weeks of using the highly precise scale, I felt a difference in my sleep, and now I can do a daily micro taper or a cut and hold and know exactly what I am getting down to 0.2% accuracy and precision. Some say it’s overkill, but they are speaking from their own experience.

I do not write this to dissuade you from what you are doing or discourage you. But I feel I need to point out the difficulties in aiming for such high accuracy, especially when a considerable amount of money is might be involved.

There are many factors which affect your blood levels to a far greater degree than 0.2%.

Some Factors Affecting Blood Levels:

• For example, Klonopin: stated half-life values vary (but let's go with 19-60 hours, as per Wikipedia), taken three times per day, 8 hours apart, same dose. If my maths is correct, blood levels will have dropped to about 75% (a drop of 25%) after 8 hours if we assume a half-life value of 19 hours. And blood levels will have dropped to about 91% (a drop of 9%) after 8 hours if we assume a half-life of 60 hours. (These numbers do not take into account absorption times for the tablets, which will positively affect the values a little.)
• The food we ingest and other medications we take can have significant effects upon the rate of metobolisation of Klonopin. This effect is minimised if all the medications are taken at set, evenly-spaced, times. But many other medications will be taken a different number of times per day, so there will remain a daily cycle.
• If you take your pills with or without food, this will likely affect the rate absorption to some degree (but, it would appear, not the extent of absorption). This will affect the peak and trough values of blood levels (but probably not to a great degree). This link is for alprazolam, but I expect it is similar for Klonopin. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/17655512/
• The difference between stated and actual dose of pills can vary very significantly. Generally, the FDA allows the true dose of a pill to vary by 80-125% of the stated dose between batches. The figures are similar for what is allowed for brands (compared with the generic). I cannot locate a straightforward answer to what is allowable for UDU (Uniformity of Dose Units) within a batch. But is surely significant.

The point is that your blood levels vary, and quite considerably, no matter how accurate you are in dividing your pills. And this is true even for relatively long half-life benzodiazepines taken several times per day. Some of the things which affect variation in blood levels can be mitigated to some degree, but you cannot control differences in dose between pills and batches. Nor can you stop the large drop in blood levels between doses (especially for shorter half-life benzodiazepines). Given all these factors, I am sceptical of the advantage of achieving theoretical dose accuracies to within fractions of percent, when other variations swamp this goal by two orders of magnitude (20%) or more.

On 03/12/2023 at 01:57, [[m...] said:

Myself and others who suffer with my changes would beg to differ. I think it’s important to realize that statements do not apply to everybody the same, so Colin is speaking from his experience and probably a majority of people who taper, but I am speaking for the percentage of us who suffer with inaccuracies that dramatically affect how we feel. How on earth would I taper as I get lower if I can only make cuts of 5% or greater precision and even then one week, I might be doing 10% without even knowing it due to the scale being off .001g that day.

If it works for you, then stick with that. I would never suggest that you change what is working for you. I am just leery of the suggestion that achieving such theoretical accuracies is optimal when they are swamped by other factors. I am not suggesting this is your intention, but this position has been pushed very hard by some parties in the past, so I tend to challenge it as potentially unnecessary when I come across it.

Aiming for higher accuracy will do no harm of course. Well, except to wallets. But I also caution against obsession. It can sometimes feel empowering for an individual to have more (perceived) control over their medicine - this should not be diminished. But for others, such obsession (particularly if titration not deliver for them) can be demoralising. For these people, acceptance might be the better option.

On 03/12/2023 at 01:57, [[m...] said:

Yes the longer the half-life these things tend to average out over the days, but some people feel cuts quicker than others, and I can only say that for those who cannot tolerate liquid for precise doses as they get lower, they may need to consider an expensive scale because it is the only thing that has stabilized me and worked. It was worth the $1500, even though I didn’t have it to spend. But if you can handle some fluctuations in your dose and some inaccuracies and are not sensitive to small changes, then maybe a $20 Amazon scale will work. But you are dealing with a short half life drug like Ativan.

Again, whatever works for you is good. I only take exception with the word 'need' for the reasons I have already outlined. I am sure you understand my reasons and concerns.

On 03/12/2023 at 01:57, [[m...] said:

So you need to realize that fluctuations in your dose as your taper will be felt stronger than with something like Valium which days in your blood longer. Just giving you my side of the coin. Again statements that are broad do not cover everyone the same so just make sure you do your homework and ask around, I’m just giving you my side of things, everyone is entitled to their opinion. You and most people likely don’t need this level of precision but as you get lower you might, if not you may need to switch to liquid. Or maybe you’re a lucky one who can handle just dry cutting all the way off with a cheap scale. 

Benzodiazepines are complicated, aren't they!? On the face of it, switching to Valium makes a lot of sense. But we know that some people do not react well to the change. I tend to suggest sticking with the benzodiazepine(s) we already have and use if this is manageable. And only consider changes if what we are doing is proving too difficult. And for similar reasons, unless there are pronounced interdose withdrawal effects, it might be foolhardy to switch once-a-day dosing to multiple times per day - after all, a switch to chronic dosing can increase dependency where before there was relatively little.

It was interesting to read your perspective, @[mi...]

[[Co...]]

I added some clarifications to my above post. Particularly around drops in blood levels of Klonopin between doses.

[[he...]]

I've read that food does not affect the metabolism of K as markedly as V, but I'm not sure of the exact magnitude. I never noticed any issues related to that per se, and did not schedule my eating around my dosing. It's possible it makes a bigger difference than I realized, but I believe it's negligible. The reason I bought the more expensive scale is because I'd had an Amazon kitchen scale in the past crap out on me while measuring coffee for roasting, and I knew I didn't want that to happen again with the stakes so much higher and with my health in the balance (pun intended). Plus, the added nominal accuracy (extra digit and enclosed weighing chamber) was a big bonus.

Edited December 4, 2023 by [he...]

[[mi...]]

So by variance I meant that when I measure for example .054g and then dropped down to .053g the next cut that would be approx a 1.85% cut. So since each time we measure out a dose we don’t know if it’s closer to .053 or .055 side of things since we can’t access another decimal place. Even if the scale rounds up or down a daily dose at this amount could theoretically swing back and forth over 1% or more and still show exactly .054g. I hope that makes sense. It is obsession I agree. But I never had an issue with this lack of precision until I destabilized and got hypersensitive to cuts and now I need extreme accuracy to control symptoms. But imagine getting lower and the percentage gets even higher. When you get to let’s say 3% between .001 increments you are having daily swings within that 3% amount all within the .001 increment you are at. Does this make sense or am I sounding confusing. Then you have to realize these scales are extremely sensitive to humidity, temp changes, etc so let’s say you are off even .001 which for a cheap scale is possible and even likely. You could be having sizable swings in dosing that for the ultra sensitive could be problematic. I was never able to tolerate liquid but those who switch to liquid often notice they stabilize much easier even before they begin cutting. Wonder if that’s because their daily dosing is more precise.

in regards to Valium yes I think the long half life would probably minimize this issue for some but those being so sensitive will have a tougher time making any switch I would think. I know I’ve never done well on V but everyone is different.

As far as things affecting absorption and drug availability I have never had issues eating before dosing or taking it on an empty stomach. But I have had major issues putting my cut pill into a capsule. I felt so much worse the next day every time I did it. Also taking my dose more than an hour or two after my normal time would throw me off for days. And this was happening when I was so stable that I didn’t even notice the effects of the drug actually working meaning I felt fine 24 seven and then I took my pill. I didn’t feel it do anything one way or the other good or bad because I just felt good all the time. And then, when either putting it in a capsule or taking it a few hours too late all of a sudden the next day and for a few days, I would feel massive brain, fog and digestive issues and just, a big increase in symptoms out of nowhere. So obviously my system didn’t like those subtle changes, yet food didn’t do anything and never has. And I know this isn’t all in my head because I’m the one willing to spend $1500 for on a scale because precision affects me greatly. Yes, that is a ton of money and I am not currently working but my wife is and so in my situation. It was worth putting it on a credit card because me stabilizing and surviving is way more important than whether or not we carry debt with this . But to each their own for sure, and most people probably don’t need this. 

[[je...]]

Hi @[mi...]

How are you doing?

[[mi...]]

1 hour ago, [[j...] said:

Hi @[mi...]

How are you doing?

I'm getting by. Lots of walks and no caffeine. I have a phone appointment with my PCP Friday to discuss getting my dosage to a place where I can at least level out to where I previously was. I'll try to stay there for a period of time and then start to taper. Im still having to split my dose because I get such bad interdose anxiety/wd?. My single evening dose gets me to about 6am and then its on! I'm also going to discuss switching to a longer half life med like K because I just can't make it between doses with the Ativan and would prefer to taper with a single dose. The LOR just wears off to fast. Any thoughts on that? I know some say not to switch but the Ativan is so short lived that I'm not sure I can taper with it. I also posted today ( don't think it's been approved yet) asking if anyone had success with medical detox on the front end of taper and also if anyone is using ssri's aka zoloft during taper or after jumping off to help with the what is sure to be hard anxiety. Which is why I started the benzos  in the first place. I know it takes awhile to metabolize zoloft and that's why they gave me Ativan to begin with. Then I got off the ssri and continued the benzos. Just wondering about inpatient treatment with detox and if anyone else is successfully using  ssri during tapering or after?

[[je...]]

2 hours ago, [[m...] said:

Im still having to split my dose because I get such bad interdose anxiety/wd?. My single evening dose gets me to about 6am and then its on! I'm also going to discuss switching to a longer half life med like K because I just can't make it between doses with the Ativan and would prefer to taper with a single dose. The LOR just wears off to fast. Any thoughts on that? I know some say not to switch but the Ativan is so short lived that I'm not sure I can taper with it

If the interdose withdrawal is too bad, then crossing over is a valid option in my opinion. However I would suggest you rather consider Valium than K. The reason being ease of taper. Valium comes in smaller doses than K and it makes it easier to make reductions. Klonopin is very potent and is not available in small doses which makes small reductions difficult. 

2 hours ago, [[m...] said:

Just wondering about inpatient treatment with detox and if anyone else is successfully using  ssri during tapering or after?

We generally don't recommend detox facilities. Benzo's need to be tapered according to your symptoms and tapering should be patient-led in our opinion. Inpatient they rip you off and do the equivalent of what is a cold turkey and then you have to deal with the consequences at home. Getting off benzo's is only step one. The next step is recovery. Once you're off, doesn't mean you will recover in a week or two. I am one year off and I am not fully recovered yet. It doesn't mean it will take this long for you, but generally it takes at least a couple of months and we have seen those who taper slowly have a better chance at a softer recovery than a cold turkey. 

2 hours ago, [[m...] said:

I also posted today ( don't think it's been approved yet)

When you join BB, it's only the very first post that has to be approved. After that you are free to post and start threads as you like - no more approval.

[[mi...]]

2 hours ago, [[j...] said:

If the interdose withdrawal is too bad, then crossing over is a valid option in my opinion. However I would suggest you rather consider Valium than K. The reason being ease of taper. Valium comes in smaller doses than K and it makes it easier to make reductions. Klonopin is very potent and is not available in small doses which makes small reductions difficult. 

We generally don't recommend detox facilities. Benzo's need to be tapered according to your symptoms and tapering should be patient-led in our opinion. Inpatient they rip you off and do the equivalent of what is a cold turkey and then you have to deal with the consequences at home. Getting off benzo's is only step one. The next step is recovery. Once you're off, doesn't mean you will recover in a week or two. I am one year off and I am not fully recovered yet. It doesn't mean it will take this long for you, but generally it takes at least a couple of months and we have seen those who taper slowly have a better chance at a softer recovery than a cold turkey. 

When you join BB, it's only the very first post that has to be approved. After that you are free to post and start threads as you like - no more approval.

Thanks for the response. I know I have alot of questions.  As I did more research today I totally agree that the Valium is a better option.. I just dont thing a reduction with Ativan would have as good of a chance. Have an appointment with Dr Friday to talk about crossing over options and a schedule. Wish me luck..I'll keep the group informed of my progress. I totally agree on the detox too. Cant be done in 2 weeks or 30 days and then your out on your own. Appreciate you taking the time friend. 

[[Bo...]]

Hi I’m new 

[[Co...]]

Hello @[Bo...]. Welcome to BenzoBuddies.

[[Id...]]

On 05/12/2023 at 02:03, [[j...] said:

However I would suggest you rather consider Valium than K. The reason being ease of taper. Valium comes in smaller doses than K and it makes it easier to make reductions. Klonopin is very potent and is not available in small doses which makes small reductions difficult.

I feel like a 1st grader between rocket scientists in this post, and mentally I am. A part from catastrophic personal experiences, I remember that switching to klonopin is expressly adviced against on benzoinfo, because of a different way, stronger if I recall well, to bind to receptors. Unfortunately I’m not in a shape to find a proper quote. Please correct me if I am wrong 

Edited December 14, 2023 by [Id...]
Grammar

[[Co...]]

12 minutes ago, [[I...] said:

I feel like a 1st grader between rocket scientists in this post, and mentally I am. A part from catastrophic personal experiences, I remember that switching to klonopin is expressly adviced against on benzoinfo, because of a different way, stronger if I recall well, to bind to receptors. Unfortunately I’m not in a shape to find a proper quote. Please correct me if I am wrong 

Hello @[Id...]

I think you may have misinterpreted @[je...]'s comments. Jelly was suggesting Valium might be a better option than Klonopin. Klonopin does seem to cause more problems for some some people. And although Klonopin has a longer then average half-life for a benzodiazepine, it is not as long as Valium, and unlike Valium, it is not not available in relatively low dose, low potency pills.

[[...]]

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