feeling awful on cross taper from klonopin to valium.

[[Ko...]]

@[Pa...]Thank you for your response. I guess she is better than most as she works with me to do a patient-guided taper. She seems a bit dismissive of the difficulties involved with withdrawing from benzos so I hope that I will not have too many struggles.

She knows that I have to work and have a highly cognitive job that I need to keep as I am a single parent.  I consider myself a short-term user as I started benzo for the first time in April of this year and first tried to come off of it in July only to develop scary withdrawal symptoms.  I wish I could just take 3 months off from work and try to do a fast taper but I know it doesn't work like that....ugh, so frustrating. 

 

[[Pa...]]

Yes, frustrating when you think about the fact that there is withdrawal, then there is recovery so it’s tough to know how long the whole process is going to take.  

Many of our members have been able to work full time, I did through my recovery and while it was difficult, it was much better than sitting home with no distraction from my symptoms. 

[[Ko...]]

My goal for this is to keep my job. I don't care how long it takes me to come off if I am able to do this.  

 

[[Fa...]]

Quote

Hi,

I am due to make my 3rd cut of diazepam. I have been decreasing by 0.5 mg every 2 weeks and gone from 10 mg to 9 mg. I was going to proceed with decrease to 8.5 mg yesterday but didn't sleep at all the night before and was wondering if I should still make the 0.5 mg decrease now or hold another week.  I could also decrease by 0.25 instead by quartering the tablets.  At some point I will be moving to liquid.

I have to go slowly due to needing to work a high-functioning job and sole breadwinner of the household. I have been struggling with ongoing severe fatigue, lack of  motivation and depression. I also get tinnitus and muscle pains. Sleep up until 2 days ago has been good although nonrestorative. 

Just looking for feedback as this is a lonely journey and the stakes are high for me. 

@[Ko...] If at some point you are moving to liquid, I would encourage you to go ahead and do so.  After 10-14 days of holding with the tablet and liquid combo, you may then easily, and accurately, reduce by whatever amount you feel most comfortable.  

The indecision, and associated anxiety, of when to switch to liquid vs. continuing to reduce via tablet splitting is perhaps intensifying your symptoms as well.  Wish you the best!

[[Ko...]]

@[Fa...]

thank you for your response. I decided to hold for 3 weeks this time and then will decrease to 8.5 on Wed. 

I am anxious about switching to part liquid combination- I don't know why except it seems more complicated.

[[Fa...]]

@[Ko...] I’m glad to hear you decided to hold for an extra week.  I’ve personally found that when I don’t know which direction to go, holding seems to be the best decision. 

In regards to moving a small portion of your dose to pharma liquid - it is less complicated than you may think.  In your situation, you would just draw up 1mg/1mL using a 1mL oral syringe and ingest it.  I then personally draw up filtered water 2-3 times into the 1mL syringe afterwards and ingest this ‘rinse’ water as well.

[[Ko...]]

 

And without diluting the liquid and using the 1ml syringe, one can reduce by increments as low as .1 mg or are you able to make smaller reductions than this?

I was either going with the 5% exponential drop every 2-3 weeks (which I would need the liquid for) or after this decrease, I may go with the .25mg decreases which I can do by quartering combinations of 2mg and 5 mg tablets. I found a chart that outlines how to do this all the way down to .25. 

Clearly, I am indecisive- it doesn't help that the NP thinks microtapering is unnecessary (easy for her to say) so I will be on my own if I need to do it that way.

[[Fa...]]

Without diluting the liquid, you are able to make reductions as small as .01mg/mL - as long as your 1mL oral syringe has .01 graduation marks (which most do).

Please proceed with whichever method you feel most comfortable with.  You can always change gears, and most people do at some point.  Just listen to your body and factor in sufficient holds as you are currently doing.  You very well may be able to handle .25mg reductions via tablets.  Perhaps proceed with this method, and then switch to tablet/liquid combo only if you feel it’s necessary down the road? 

Please keep us posted and reach out with any questions you may have along the way.

[[Li...]]

@[Ko...] I transitioned from Klonopin to Valium.  My doctor worked with me to find a dosage of Valium that felt like the equivalent to how I was currently feeling on the Klonopin.  For me 1 mg of K was equaled out for me at 30 mgs of V.  I have been on benzos for 20 years and I have been tapering for 4 years.  I did notice a difference going from the V tablets to the liquid.  I had to hold there for a bit to let my body just level out some.  Tapering is a rough.  Listen to your body and I hope that your NP listens to you.  It has been my experience that most medical practitioners do not know how to effectively get you off benzos and minimize the symptoms that you are having.    

[[Ko...]]

@[Li...]You have been down a long road to have been tapering for 4 years. I had been a relatively short term  user until I found out that I couldn't taper myself off clonazepam 0.5 mg once at bedtime and then my psych suggested detox if I couldn't do the 4 week taper. Now it's been 6 months as it took some time to find a provider who would do a long term taper and she insisted on switch to valium. 

I have chosen to go super slowly so only reduced from 10 to 9.5 to 9.0. Tomorrow I will either go to 8.5 or 8.75.  My main symptoms are ears ringing, brain buzzing feeling, and lack of enjoyment/interest/motivation/fatigue.  I get a lot of intrusive dark thoughts.

I have developed such anxiety about the taper as the stakes are so high for me. I am divorced and work full-time. The only reason I keep going is that I have 2 daughters.  

[[Li...]]

16 hours ago, [[K...] said:

@[Li...]You have been down a long road to have been tapering for 4 years. I had been a relatively short term  user until I found out that I couldn't taper myself off clonazepam 0.5 mg once at bedtime and then my psych suggested detox if I couldn't do the 4 week taper. Now it's been 6 months as it took some time to find a provider who would do a long term taper and she insisted on switch to valium. 

I have chosen to go super slowly so only reduced from 10 to 9.5 to 9.0. Tomorrow I will either go to 8.5 or 8.75.  My main symptoms are ears ringing, brain buzzing feeling, and lack of enjoyment/interest/motivation/fatigue.  I get a lot of intrusive dark thoughts.

I have developed such anxiety about the taper as the stakes are so high for me. I am divorced and work full-time. The only reason I keep going is that I have 2 daughters.  

@[Ko...] I really hope that goes well for you.  I tried to go under 1 mg of Klonopin and my body couldn't handle it.  That is why we switched to valium.  And I completely understand about needing to work and raise kids.  I have been in the boat.  Before I found the doctor that helps me now I dosed myself down way to fast and completely stopped my K.  I could not function and I was flooded with the intrusive thoughts.  For days everything that I had ever done wrong in my life from childhood on went through my mind.  I call it a spiritual purging.  Listen to your body.  Sometimes slow and easy is best. 

 

[[Ko...]]

@[Li...]I have to decide whether to play it safe and drop by .25 mg or drop by .5mg (5.7% drop). I guess since I am so worried about staying functional for my job that I should decrease by .25mg (only a 2.7% drop)

My job is difficult and requires a lot of interaction with people and cognitive work.  SO much pressure which makes my anxiety really high.

My thoughts loop only on wishing I could go back to April of this year and tried harder with the cannabis products for the insomnia rather than taking klonopin. Ugh- I really get stuck on this.

[[Ya...]]

On 8/31/2023 at 12:22 AM, [[K...] said:

Hi again- I started on 0.5 mg of clonazepam and am in the middle of a cross taper- filled in my history on my profile.

I have been on 0.25 mg clonazepam and 5 mg valium for past 2 weeks. I started with the valium crossover 3 weeks ago.  I feel so fatigued, depressed, and unmotivated with brain fog. I also have some nausea, episodic mild dizziness,  and malaise.  All I feel like doing is lying around- this is really not an option as I need to be working.

I can't tell if I am having withdrawal from clonazepam or am overmedicated now that the valium has taken full effect at 3 weeks.  Is there anyway of telling? I have some mild tinnitus but not anxious or agitated.  Previous withdrawal symptoms from attempting to lower the klonopin too abruptly were severe tinnitus and electric surging like I was filled with electricity so I think that I am overmedicated.

The NP wants me to go to 10 mg of valium and get rid of clonazepam. Or should I just go to 7.5 mg of valium since I feel so overmedicated?  I know Ashton equivalent was 0.5 clonazepam to 10 mg of diazepam but I am wondering if I fall on the  lower end of things

Or I could go to 7.5 mg of valium and do a week of .125 mg clonazepam for a week and then transition over to the 10 mg of valium.

I did discuss with her all of these issues and she is firm on wanting me to switch to all valium and dropping the klonopin- I wish there was a way of knowing what to do....I only have the 5 mg valium tablets to work with. She definitely thinks I am overly anxious and OCD- wants me to start gabapentin and prozac but I am not doing those things.

How much time take your body to stable and get red off severe tinnitus and electric surging

[[Ko...]]

That happened when I cut my dosage of klonopin in half for a few days back in July. I went back to the.5 dosage and the electric surges stopped pretty quickly. The tinnitus has calmed down and is not as loud but is pretty much there all the time .

[[Kh...]]

22 hours ago, [[K...] said:

That happened when I cut my dosage of klonopin in half for a few days back in July. I went back to the.5 dosage and the electric surges stopped pretty quickly. The tinnitus has calmed down and is not as loud but is pretty much there all the time .

I am cutting Xanax and experiencing both these things..do they eventually subside?   No fun but I am dead set on stopping Xanax usage.  Crossing to Valium now…prettty low dosages,… my profile history is up to date. 🙏

[[Ko...]]

The electric surges did stop but the tinnitus is always there- not as loud as it was though.

I am tapering off valium very slowly in hopes of minimizing disruptive withdrawal symptoms.