From clonazepam to diazepam back to clonazepam. Want to taper.

[[Va...]]

On 16/08/2023 at 13:58, [[P...] said:

Its not dangerous to cross to Valium and using Ashton to guide you is a good plan if that's the way you're leaning.  Staying on the Clonazepam and Valium could be good too. 

Making mistakes is part of what we have to do to get through this, taper methods and rates need to be adjusted because this is one giant experiment with us as the subjects.  The powers that be have mastered how to get us on the drug but not how to get off of it, so its up to us.

Being obsessed with this is what the drug does to us, it consumes our thinking and our lives and only lets us feel negative emotions, this isn't you and it won't be you when you're off the drug and recovered from the injury you've sustained. 

As for liquid clonazepam, are you talking making your own or using a pharmaceutical?  I don't believe it available in many countries.

I m using pills but here are there liquid clonazepam is available in drops of 0.1 mg. So i can only reduce 0.1 mg. My doctor says it is up to me if i want the Ashton manual she would do it.

I already have a low dose of diazepam, taking them together make me consfused in the evening.

I still have not decided what to do.

[[Pa...]]

3 hours ago, [[V...] said:

I m using pills but here are there liquid clonazepam is available in drops of 0.1 mg. So i can only reduce 0.1 mg. My doctor says it is up to me if i want the Ashton manual she would do it.

Just so you know, our members have been able to dilute the liquid with water to make smaller reductions. 

I hope you can decide what to do because indecision can be stressful and that can increase symptoms. 

[[Fa...]]

Hi, @[Va...],

I agree with @[Pa...].  Once you make a decision, you will be able to 'rest' in your decision which should calm you nervous system to a degree.  Am I understanding correctly that you are currently taking 1.5mg clonazepam per day (three .5mg clonazepam tablets) and 2.5mg diazepam per day?  Are you taking half of a 5mg diazepam tablet to reach 2.5mg per day or one (1) 2mg tablet along with a quarter of a 2mg tablet?

The great news is it sounds as if you have a doctor/prescriber willing to allow a patient-led, symptom based taper!  Not every member is presented with this ideal scenario.

[[Va...]]

Thnx for the reply also @[Pa...] 

I know i'm lucky with my doctor.

She also suggested tapering venlafaxine. I used it for 18 years 150 mg. I am now at 125 mg. Was very hyperactive and high blood pressure. That is a little better now.

Yes i use 1.5 mg Rivotril and 2.5 mg valium. Half of a pill.

[[Pa...]]

23 hours ago, [[V...] said:

She also suggested tapering venlafaxine. I used it for 18 years 150 mg. I am now at 125 mg. Was very hyperactive and high blood pressure. That is a little better now.

Are you tapering both the venlafaxine and the Rivotril?

[[Va...]]

Yes, clonazepam now at 1.25 mg plus 2.5 mg valium. Tapered from 150 mg venlafaxine to 125 mg. And i'm gonna hold. I see my doctor on monday, there are options. Hold the benzodiazepines and taper down to 75 mg venlafaxine. Quit and start citolapram or escitilapram and than start benzo taper.

Or just hold 125 mg venlafixe and start tapering i still have not decided.

I have seen 4 addiction therepists in the last year to talk about tapering. Some say go to a detox facility. That s not gonna happen. I don t want to taper in 4 weeks. The other one said " the benzodiazepines all work the same" it s not possible that diazepam does make you more sedated, the third one did not know what valium was... she asked you are using valium and diazepam. Insaid valium is diazepam... they don' t really know.. i want to get rid of it for years. 

My house doctor had the most knowledge. But i think i know more than the doctors about the pills. 

I m leaning towards the Ashton manual. Because clonazepam makes me agitated, but on the other hand valium makes me sedated, the other option that they have is liquid clonazepam, 0.1 mg.

I still have not decided.

I will definetelly not switch back and forth. I ve done it 3 times.

So even if valium will suck i m gonna stick to it. 

What would you guys do in my situation. I really could use some advice in the scenario s mentioned above.

Just watched the the Long Ashton interview. 

 

Edited September 2, 2023 by [Va...]
Bad writing

[[Pa...]]

We typically suggest only tapering one medication at a time, its too difficult to know what is causing what so you can make corrections.

Do you always feel the Valium sedation or do you acclimate to it the longer you’re on it?  Most of our members who have made the cross say the sedation goes away.

Adding new medications and supplements can be problematic for some, our central nervous system is very sensitive while going through this so I’d try to avoid introducing anything new unless absolutely necessary, but if you must, start low and slow.

It does sound like you’re more educated about benzodiazepines than your providers, this is pretty common.  How did your appointment go?

[[Va...]]

4 hours ago, [[P...] said:

We typically suggest only tapering one medication at a time, its too difficult to know what is causing what so you can make corrections.

Do you always feel the Valium sedation or do you acclimate to it the longer you’re on it?  Most of our members who have made the cross say the sedation goes away.

Adding new medications and supplements can be problematic for some, our central nervous system is very sensitive while going through this so I’d try to avoid introducing anything new unless absolutely necessary, but if you must, start low and slow.

It does sound like you’re more educated about benzodiazepines than your providers, this is pretty common.  How did your appointment go?

I have the appointed tomorrow.

I m still not sure. So i m gonna hold venlafaxine. And or liquid clonazepam reduction or cross taper to valium, i already take 2.5 mg valium every day.

What should i do?

I think diazepam calms me more down and clonazepam makes me more numb mentally.

[[Pa...]]

4 hours ago, [[V...] said:

I think diazepam calms me more down and clonazepam makes me more numb mentally.

@[Va...], it looks like diazepam agrees with you the most, and if you find yourself too sedated, you can adjust your dose.  If you’ve ever looked at equivalency tables you’ll see how much they vary, we don’t all fit into the same box so maybe you can find the right dose for you.

[[Va...]]

On 03/09/2023 at 23:02, [[P...] said:

@[Va...], it looks like diazepam agrees with you the most, and if you find yourself too sedated, you can adjust your dose.  If you’ve ever looked at equivalency tables you’ll see how much they vary, we don’t all fit into the same box so maybe you can find the right dose for you.

I finally made a decision.

Was 1.5 mg clonazepam and 2.5 mg diazepam.

Switched to 1.375 mg clonazepam and 5 mg diazepam.

Gonna hold the 5 mg diazepam ( helps me with sleep and restlessness and taper every few weeks a quarter tablet 0.125 mg clonazepam untill i reach 0.75 mg and then use a scale.

Any thoughts on this method?

Am i going too fasr?

[[Pa...]]

Hi @[Va...], so the plan is to taper the Clonazepam, then tackle the Diazepam after that, if so , then thats a great plan.  .125 may be too fast but you won’t know that until you try.  You may be able to get away with a .125 reduction for the first and possibly the second but you may need to slow down after that.  This is an experiment and you’re the subject but if you keep good records of your reductions and your symptoms, then you can use this information to determine your next cuts.  

[[Va...]]

9 hours ago, [[P...] said:

Hi @[Va...], so the plan is to taper the Clonazepam, then tackle the Diazepam after that, if so , then thats a great plan.  .125 may be too fast but you won’t know that until you try.  You may be able to get away with a .125 reduction for the first and possibly the second but you may need to slow down after that.  This is an experiment and you’re the subject but if you keep good records of your reductions and your symptoms, then you can use this information to determine your next cuts.  

I have a scale, how do i make smaller cuts? 

[[Pa...]]

@[Va...], this member has some good information in the history portion of their profile, let me know if it answers your questions, he’s still active so we can ask him to drop by if you need more information. https://benzobuddies.org/profile/265365-[...]/?tab=field_core_pfield_34

[[Va...]]

I microtapered a little more than a quarter pill last month (clonazepam) i used it for more than 10 years One pill is 0.200 mg. Went from 0.165 to 0.145. Noticing a lot of tension, shakiness inside and fatigue. Also i am in a very stressfull periode in my life. Should i hold continue or go back. Don't know if it is the stress or the withdrawal?

[[Fa...]]

Hi, @[Va...].  If it were me in your shoes, I would try a hold.  Once you feel that the stress subsides, and any withdrawal symptoms ‘stabilize’, you could continue your taper.  ‘Stabilization’ for me just means more predictability with my symptoms - not that I am feeling great again.

I feel it is important to factor in holds when ‘micro tapering’ - or continuously making daily, or weekly, small reductions in dose.  This allows your CNS to ‘catch a breathe’ in my opinion and see where you stand. 

Also, something to note (if you don’t already) is that you reduced a little over 12% of your dose over this past month.  This is something you may have to monitor and adjust accordingly if your body and symptoms are telling you such (ie., symptoms increasing in severity from previous reduction periods).  

[[Kh...]]

On 30/08/2023 at 09:07, [[V...] said:

Thnx for the reply also @[Pa...] 

I know i'm lucky with my doctor.

She also suggested tapering venlafaxine. I used it for 18 years 150 mg. I am now at 125 mg. Was very hyperactive and high blood pressure. That is a little better now.

Yes i use 1.5 mg Rivotril and 2.5 mg valium. Half of a pill.

 

Hey there -- I can vouch for a cross over to diazepam.  I did it from around 1 mg Xanax.

Once I was able to achieve a certain diazepam level I found that I only needed a dose at bed time - given its long half life. 

This addresses the sleepiness issues.  Still in taper mode but progress being made.