The Long Hold Support Group

[[NJ...]]

TMB: I am happy for your jump and hope things improve soon.

 

I did updose to .5 mg last night from .37. I still have some nausea this morning but a very potent ginger supplement seems to be helping. Cannot take any more zofran at this point.

 

I also reached out to a medical marijuana dr. this morning to see if he might be able to approve me for a card and how it works. I have been on the fence about this for a long time. Marijuana is supposed to be good for nausea. If I can tame the nausea at least some of the time, I feel I can complete the taper. We'll see. So I am still fighting and putting one foot in front of the other. I know it's a huge expense as well but my mental health has to matter. We are paying lots of $$ for college and private school tuition; I need to put me first in this equation.

 

Thanks again for everyone's support. It is another gloomy and wet day here, which I also think is dampening my mood.

[[To...]]

Thanks to all for your well wishes as I try to figure out how to slay this dragon.

 

I thought I had things licked with my taper - but post jump withdrawal is a new ball game for me and the mental and physical symptoms are more intense than I ever imagined. Everything is a trigger...

 

All I can do is keep trying. Glad I have now logged in two days in a row but I am only able to stay on for a few minutes. But progress nonetheless.

[[Gr...]]

NJStrength-  I hope the updose provides some relief for you. 

 

TooManyBennies -  I can't believe you have been off for so long.  In my mind, January is like a second ago. 

 

I am just holding here at .0625mg.  I am kind of in disbelief that I am holding here, because it just seems like such a small amount.  I do think a lot of what I am feeling is withdrawal from previous cuts.  This summer I went from .1875-->.125 and wow,  that hit me hard.  This is not hitting me as hard, but at the same time, I have been in withdrawal for ages now, so who knows what I have just gotten used to.

 

I have been reading Dr. Breggin's book,"Your Drug May Be Your Problem", which is super interesting.  I was sad to see he was listed on some website called quackwatch, cause I don't think he is a quack, but I do think we should think critically about whoever is giving us advice. 

[[...]]

 

NJStrength-  I hope the updose provides some relief for you. 

 

TooManyBennies -  I can't believe you have been off for so long.  In my mind, January is like a second ago. 

 

I am just holding here at .0625mg.  I am kind of in disbelief that I am holding here, because it just seems like such a small amount.  I do think a lot of what I am feeling is withdrawal from previous cuts.  This summer I went from .1875-->.125 and wow,  that hit me hard.  This is not hitting me as hard, but at the same time, I have been in withdrawal for ages now, so who knows what I have just gotten used to.

 

I have been reading Dr. Breggin's book,"Your Drug May Be Your Problem", which is super interesting.  I was sad to see he was listed on some website called quackwatch, cause I don't think he is a quack, but I do think we should think critically about whoever is giving us advice. 

 

Hi GreenCup,

 

I agree with you.  I is hard to believe we need to hold for so long at these low doses.  You might be right - you are still withdrawing from previous cuts.

 

But do you ever wonder if, like your book title says, the Klonopin could be the problem? 

 

I am really starting to wonder about it.  Could it be that each day, I take my little dose of Klonopin and the Klonopin itself is causes the sickness I feel?

 

Have you read about people saying once they stopped the taper (benzo free) they soon feel better?  I have seen a few posts like that.

[[He...]]

NJ- I'm hoping things get better for you at .5mg!  I can't even imagine feeling that poorly for so long, especially with a new job.  I understand the need to be functional for our kids.  I have two teenagers that I'm the chauffeur, cook, maid and mom to.  I also know how hard it is emotionally to updose after all of that work.  I haven't been at this very long and when I went up after my fast taper I felt better within two days and then starting doubting myself... thinking that I should have updosed to .125 first to see if that helped instead of all the way to .25.  It's a constant guessing game because everyone is different and the doctors don't understand.  We can only move forward knowing that we are trying our best to get back to the real us!

 

Greencup - it's amazing that you've been able to taper so low.  I'm now looking at how I'm going to continue my taper and .0625 seems so far away for me!

 

Bob - I'm going to try your sleeping tips.  I've split my .25mg dose into an am and pm.  I was doing OK sleepwise - waking up about 5am, but the past few nights I've been waking throughout the night.  I think that it's temporary, but I'd like to try some more natural methods.  I do take magnesium and 1.5mg melatonin.  I'm not sure that either does anything for me.  Insomnia from a med withdrawal is what go me into this benzo mess.  Ugh!  I think your recent post about klonopin being the problem is a good question.  When I taper, I want to go to zero and walk off vs. jump, but I was feeling depressed last week (a completely new and scary thing for me) and was wondering if klonopin is causing depression and my utter lack of motivation to do anything.

 

TMB - congratulations!  Hoping that things only improve moving forward!!!

 

For me - I increased nortriptyline last week.  I'm using it to treat my chronic migraines.  Although it's an AD, it's the first thing that I've tried in a number of years that been effective.  I do have tinnitus and sound sensitivity right now along with some anxiety (it's a constant pit in the stomach type feeling) and I'm not sure if it's from klonopin or nortriptyline.  I guess that's the trouble with taking a couple of different medications at the same time!  So,  I'm still hanging at .25mg per day and plan to start tapering again mid-May.  It depends on how I feel after my nortriptyline dose change levels out.  It takes about three weeks for each change, so I'm just waiting it out.

 

[[...]]

Hi Heather43,

 

I do have a thought for you.  Instead of splitting your dose am and pm, why not try just all of it at bedtime? 

 

I understand you wanting to split between am and pm to make you days smoother, but if your primary problem is sleep, then give yourself all the "benefit" of klonopin at bedtime - it should really help. 

 

Since Klonopin is long lasting, I bet the bedtime dose will carry you into the day - in particular, if your sleep was better.

 

Sorry to hear you had a touch of depression.  It is the worse.  It doesn't visit me very often, but I dread it when it happens.  I have had good luck with 5-HTP on just the day of the depression.

 

I hope you feel better and can start your slower taper soon.

 

 

[[He...]]

Hi Bob,

 

I was taking it all at night, but I was trying to help myself avoid complete insomnia when I started tapering.  I also started noticing some anxiety during the day and was hoping that a morning dose would help.  That anxiety could be from the nortriptyline dose changes.  If the sleepless nights don't improve I may go back to taking my entire dose at night.  Thanks for the advice!

[[...]]

Hi Heather,

 

Understood.

 

I am planning to resume my taper after a nearly 2 month hold at 0.125mg.  I feel like I tapered too fast when I started and I have been paying for it.

 

I want to do the daily micro taper but mixing the liquid each evening is a bummer.

 

I am toying with crunching my pills into a powder, mixing with flour or sugar, and repackaging into these gel capsules I found on Amazon.

 

I know it sounds different, but it would be nice to have the convenience of capsules, each capsule being slightly less klonopin.

 

I will say, the math was fun - I am an engineer so I like solving math problems.  It has been a great way to distract me from the withdrawal.

 

 

[[Ma...]]

Hi Heather43,

 

I do have a thought for you.  Instead of splitting your dose am and pm, why not try just all of it at bedtime? 

 

I understand you wanting to split between am and pm to make you days smoother, but if your primary problem is sleep, then give yourself all the "benefit" of klonopin at bedtime - it should really help. 

 

Since Klonopin is long lasting, I bet the bedtime dose will carry you into the day - in particular, if your sleep was better.

 

Sorry to hear you had a touch of depression.  It is the worse.  It doesn't visit me very often, but I dread it when it happens.  I have had good luck with 5-HTP on just the day of the depression.

 

I hope you feel better and can start your slower taper soon.

 

Hey Bob7 , what does 5-HTP do for on the days u have depression?  I usually only have one or 2 a week but sometimes on that day I can be really down

[[...]]

Hi Heather43,

 

I do have a thought for you.  Instead of splitting your dose am and pm, why not try just all of it at bedtime? 

 

I understand you wanting to split between am and pm to make you days smoother, but if your primary problem is sleep, then give yourself all the "benefit" of klonopin at bedtime - it should really help. 

 

Since Klonopin is long lasting, I bet the bedtime dose will carry you into the day - in particular, if your sleep was better.

 

Sorry to hear you had a touch of depression.  It is the worse.  It doesn't visit me very often, but I dread it when it happens.  I have had good luck with 5-HTP on just the day of the depression.

 

I hope you feel better and can start your slower taper soon.

 

Hey Bob7 , what does 5-HTP do for on the days u have depression?  I usually only have one or 2 a week but sometimes on that day I can be really down

Hi Mary,

 

Well, I have only done this 5-HTP thing a couple of times but the last time I recall everything real well.  So here is the story...

 

I had been struggling with Klonopin taper withdrawal symptoms for weeks (bad chest pains) and lots of anxiety about getting my heart tested.  The tests were taking forever to get scheduled and get results.  I think after 10 days of acute anxiety, my brain tends to wear down and depression sets in.

 

On that particular day, I could not stop thinking about my worries and the depression was creeping up on me for several days.  So I took 25 or 50 mg of 5-HTP and started to force myself to only think positive thoughts.  In about 45 minutes, I felt different.  I had been in a store with my wife and daughter while they were shopping for like an hour but I suddenly felt like I could see what is going on around me.  All day I was focused inward, on the depression, on the anxiety, on worrying about my heart.  But suddenly, I was looking around the store, and admiring things.  It was as if, 45 minutes after taking the 5-HTP, I stopped thinking inward and looked outward.  I keep encouraging myself to think only about nice things and times.  My depression lifted and it felt wonderful.  I kept on thinking only positive thoughts and the rest of my day was good.  The depression did not come back yet but I do feel it knocking on my door - like briefly in the morning.  Sometimes I take a cold shower, sometimes I  hit the YMCA.  If it gets back again, I will do another 5-HTP for sure.

 

Only once in my life was depression so bad I needed an AD.  Then I took celexa for a few months and when my world calmed down again, I was able to get off of it. 

 

I hope you can too.

[[He...]]

I’m an engineer too!  Mine is chemical.  I guess that’s why I’m leaning toward the liquid Microtaper

 

I’ve also bought the gel caps when I was considering drycutting.  That way I could weigh each dose out for the week, put it in the capsule to take later.  I haven’t looked at crushing and then putting into capsule.  I’m always concerned about losing too much of the med.  even with the liquid microtaper.

 

Since I’m taking nortriptyline(it’s an older tricyclic AD) for chronic migraines I don’t think I can take 5-HTP... I think I remember reading somewhere that it could cause seratonin syndrome if taken with an AD.

[[...]]

Hi Heather,

 

How cool is that - another engineer on the forum!  I am Electrical.  I am in R&D at a Medical Device Company (was Medtronic but Cardinal Health just acquired my group).  I went to school at University of Missouri Columbia.

 

Yes, I can see why a Chemical Engineer would flow toward a liquid process.  Funny!

 

So I have been doing some experiments today - what a great distraction from my symptoms.

 

I learned sugar is much better to use than flour - it flows better into the gel capsules and mixes more uniform with the crushed klonopin.  It also requires more sugar per capsule which gives me a greater dynamic range (more weight) on the scale.  The mix works well.  Klonopin crushes into a fine powder and you can see the distribution in the sugar looks homogeneous.

 

So my other concern is how long it would take to carefully measure each capsule.  But then I got this great idea.  I only want to try it for one month so need 30 doses.  Each is separated by about 0.007 grams of the sugar/klonopin mix.  So I got a pill box with 30 compartments.  Each labeled with the desired weight.  So now, I just start filling and measuring.  The point is, rather than exactly going for each measurement weight, I just fill a capsule and pop it into the compartment matching the weight I am at.  In this way, only the last few pills need to be filled and unfilled to get an exact weight.

 

In this way, I think I can get a month's worth filled accurately in about 20 minutes.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[[Ol...]]

Check out the book The Mood Cure by Julia Ross. There is so much good information there about amino acids, particularly 5-HTP, L-Tryptophan, and L-Tyrosene. They are all building blocks to our brain chemicals Serotonin and Dopamine. The book also talks about getting these naturally from your foods and even lays out meal plans. I learned a lot from the book and now take the amino even day as well as added protein and fats to my diet.

[[Wo...]]

Hi everyone, just checking in.  I am enjoying the conversation in the last couple of pages.  I can relate to a lot.  Holding for a long time because my body is still catching up to cuts, thinking about taking amino acids and if they could help with some symptoms and my previous idea of updosing.

 

Starting with the catching up to cuts - I have been at .033 for about a week now and have definitely had more windows, however, I am still having waves and now think I might have caught another cold (that would be 3 in 3 months).  I am really hoping it's not another cold because the last one was unbearable.  If it's not a cold then it's the benzo flu which I have had many many times.  I just came from CBT therapy and she wants me to practice radical acceptance this week. 

 

Amino acids - I reached out to a very expensive psychiatrist who is an integrative psychiatrist meaning she prescribes micronutrients and amino acids in addition to psych meds.  She is also an energy healer.  LOL, only in the Bay Area, California! I see her next week.  I have to drive an hour each way and she doesn't take insurance.  It'll be the most I've ever spent on a doctor but I feel I'm worth it to get a second opinion.  She in her late 50's so I know she's seen thousands of patients get of Benzos.

 

Updosing - I didn't end up going this route although it was SO tempting.  Instead, I stopped working.  I know that is not an option for many people and if it wasn't an option for me I may have chosen another path.  I would not be able to work right now in the condition I am in and I am grateful I have chosen to spend this time on my healing. 

 

***

 

Catching up on my DLMT attempt - I am sitting down with a pen and paper as Cant recommended to go through the posts and see if I can't make sense of how to do this.  I reached out to a scientist friend of mine (who ironically develops drugs for the pharmaceutical industry) to see if he'd help me.  I would really love someone to help me with the math, then help me do the whole procedure with the syringes, beakers, jars etc. to make sure I am getting it right.  I failed chemistry in high school and I never took another science class that was challenging! I'm humanities all the way!

 

Heather and Bob, since you are both engineers maybe I can post what I come up with and you can double check it for me?

 

I have been feeling stuck on how to move forward to get OFF this stuff.  If I am feeling so bad now and it could take months to get off then months to be in withdrawal post, I don't really see any solutions.  This is why my therapist is having me work on radical acceptance.

 

All the best!

 

WW

[[Su...]]

Great to hear from you WW

And how your decision not to updose was good for you!

 

I'd be very interested on what your new doc has to say about amino acids..... Pea protein was suggested to me by someone who was supposed to be benzo wise as good because it was full of amino acids -- I started to get anxiety after taking it and realized that one of the amino acids is glutamic = glutamate.    The anxiety went away when I stopped taking it though, quick fix!  But I think/hope that individual amino acids might be of more help?  Pea protein has a ton of them, which I guess is why body builders use it to build muscle...

 

I'm of the club that if we taper slowly enough that we won't have an acute period after stepping off this stuff..... that's my plan anyhow as I've seen others do it.  It does mean that the speed of taper that I had anticipated was so out of whack with what I'll be able to do.  But that's benzo w/d I figure, slow as a snail does the trick.  Here's hoping anyway...

SS

[[...]]

Hi WonderWoman-I would be happy to help you with math. Just let me know when you’re ready.

 

Everyone else-in my earlier post I said I’m trying to do a micro daily taper using dry ingredients instead of liquid.  The goal being to fill gel capsules with the dry ingredients so I don’t have to mess with measuring liquids each day.

 

I’m still experimenting with powders but I thougt I liked sugar. After a day of trying to cut with sugar I realize that maybe flour is a better way to go. Sugar wasn’t as uniform as I wanted.  I will experiment with flour in the next couple days.  I’ll let you know how that goes. 

 

I’m going to try to make 30 capsules each of which slowly reduces me by 0.001 mg of Klonopin per pill (per day).  I’ve been asking people what they think of that taper rate to get opinions. Do you guys have any opinions?  I don’t want to taper too fast but yet I don’t wanna be doing this forever.

 

 

[[Wo...]]

Thanks SS, I also want to avoid acute!! (of course)

 

Bob, I talked to a compounding pharmacy they use micro crystalline cellulose which is actually made of wood. Maybe look into it?

 

My scientist friend put this together for me. I am going to post in the DLMT and see what people think.  She was such an angel to do it.  She used Jim Hawks app and did the math by hand and said it was almost identical.

 

****

 

This is what I would suggest to start the process from what I've read on the website you sent:

 

1) Grind one tablet (0.5 mg) and dissolve in 1 mL vodka or just let one tablet dissolve overnight in the 1 mL vodka. There will be some tiny particle that will not dissolve, but the actual ingredient will be dissolved; you don't have to worry about the tiny particles. If you choose to grind the tablet first, be sure to brush off the bits stuck to any implement you use to grind the tablet, so it all goes in the liquid to dissolve.

 

2) Next, add 99 mL almond milk (or whatever else you want to dilute it with). If you use water, you will not need to refrigerate it. If you add any kind of perishable liquid, you will want to refrigerate it.

 

3) To obtain 0.034 mg, you would weigh 6.8 mL of liquid.  I am saying to weigh it, so you would need a scale that goes to less than 1 gram. Remember 1 gm of water is equal to 1 mL water, so if you have a gram scale that goes two decimal places past the decimal, that would be ideal (for the rest of the taper process). For your current does, once 1 tablet has been dissolved in the 100 mL, you would use 6.8 gm (which is the same as 6.8 mL) of solution to get the 0.034 mg dose.

 

4) Each day thereafter you will be using just a bit less, according to the schedule in the pdf. For example, on Day 2 you would use 6.75 g (or 6.75 mL).

You can see the math in the Excel file I've attached, but just use the volumes in blue on the pdf.

 

I set the worksheet to have the last dose at approximately 0.019 mg, so you will need a total of 4 pills (0.5 mg each) and roughly 2.5+ months to complete the taper to that amount. Of course, you can stop before that if you'd like.

 

Day Date Dose 1 Total

dose

# / / mg = ml mg/day

1 / / 0.0337 6.74 0.0337

2 / / 0.0335 6.70 0.0335

3 / / 0.0332 6.64 0.0332

4 / / 0.0330 6.60 0.0330

5 / / 0.0327 6.54 0.0327

6 / / 0.0325 6.50 0.0325

7 / / 0.0323 6.46 0.0323

8 / / 0.0320 6.40 0.0320

9 / / 0.0318 6.36 0.0318

10 / / 0.0315 6.30 0.0315

11 / / 0.0313 6.26 0.0313

12 / / 0.0311 6.22 0.0311

13 / / 0.0308 6.16 0.0308

14 / / 0.0306 6.12 0.0306

15 / / 0.0304 6.08 0.0304

16 / / 0.0301 6.02 0.0301

17 / / 0.0299 5.98 0.0299

18 / / 0.0297 5.94 0.0297

19 / / 0.0295 5.90 0.0295

20 / / 0.0292 5.84 0.0292

21 / / 0.0290 5.80 0.0290

22 / / 0.0288 5.76 0.0288

23 / / 0.0286 5.72 0.0286

24 / / 0.0284 5.68 0.0284

25 / / 0.0282 5.64 0.0282

26 / / 0.0280 5.60 0.0280

27 / / 0.0277 5.54 0.0277

 

4/17/2018 Liquid taper Daily Plan

 

http://bzo.spes-lavaux.ch/titration/titrationResult.php 2/2

To PDF Back

 

Day Date Dose 1 Total

dose

# / / mg = ml mg/day

28 / / 0.0275 5.50 0.0275

29 / / 0.0273 5.46 0.0273

30 / / 0.0271 5.42 0.0271

31 / / 0.0269 5.38 0.0269

32 / / 0.0267 5.34 0.0267

33 / / 0.0265 5.30 0.0265

34 / / 0.0263 5.26 0.0263

35 / / 0.0261 5.22 0.0261

36 / / 0.0259 5.18 0.0259

37 / / 0.0257 5.14 0.0257

38 / / 0.0255 5.10 0.0255

39 / / 0.0254 5.08 0.0254

40 / / 0.0252 5.04 0.0252

41 / / 0.0250 5.00 0.0250

42 / / 0.0248 4.96 0.0248

43 / / 0.0246 4.92 0.0246

44 / / 0.0244 4.88 0.0244

45 / / 0.0242 4.84 0.0242

46 / / 0.0241 4.82 0.0241

47 / / 0.0239 4.78 0.0239

48 / / 0.0237 4.74 0.0237

49 / / 0.0235 4.70 0.0235

50 / / 0.0233 4.66 0.0233

51 / / 0.0232 4.64 0.0232

52 / / 0.0230 4.60 0.0230

53 / / 0.0228 4.56 0.0228

54 / / 0.0226 4.52 0.0226

55 / / 0.0225 4.50 0.0225

56 / / 0.0223 4.46 0.0223

57 / / 0.0221 4.42 0.0221

58 / / 0.0220 4.40 0.0220

59 / / 0.0218 4.36 0.0218

60 / / 0.0216 4.32 0.0216

61 / / 0.0215 4.30 0.0215

62 / / 0.0213 4.26 0.0213

63 / / 0.0212 4.24 0.0212

64 / / 0.0210 4.20 0.0210

65 / / 0.0208 4.16 0.0208

66 / / 0.0207 4.14 0.0207

67 / / 0.0205 4.10 0.0205

68 / / 0.0204 4.08 0.0204

69 / / 0.0202 4.04 0.0202

70 / / 0.0201 4.02 0.0201

71 / / 0.0199 3.98 0.0199

72 / / 0.0198 3.96 0.0198

73 / / 0.0196 3.92 0.0196

74 / / 0.0195 3.90 0.0195

75 / / 0.0193 3.86 0.0193

76 / / 0.0192 3.84 0.0192

77 / / 0.0190 3.80 0.0190

78 / / 0.0189 3.78 0.0189

Quantity of tablets of 0.5 mg needed: 4 (total: 1.9984 mg)

[[...]]

Thanks WW23 for the micro crystalline cellulose recommendation - I will look into it.

 

So is this the math you want me to check?  If so, I will start it tomorrow as it is getting late here tonight.

 

Bob

[[Wo...]]

Bob,

 

Actually this math was done with the Jim hawks app and it is accurate.  Just making sure the steps she has outlined looks good.  Prob good for a DLMT person to double check.  Night night.

[[Ca...]]

Hey Guys..  Bit fried at thd moment, just reading bits..

 

WW, great progress.. its all a bit different from how i did it, a different method thats all.. And the different medication throws the numbers out for me.. So im not much help, But I am following, fwiw..

 

Wishing everyone the best...

[[Ba...]]

i don't know what to do.

 

Have felt awful lately.

 

I had updosed one time to get to dentist last week and had a good day followed by bad ones.  Had panic, had depression, had allergic reactions, hot/cold, etc.

 

Had been taking lyrica now and then, not huge amts., probably average of 35 mg... stopped that.  And try to take minimal ambien.  One night I did tak a whole and felt better.  Took half last night, 2 hrs sleep and dreadful.

 

I am just not getting myself off these and wonder what kind of help I can get.

 

There are so many meds I cannot take --  ADs never were good for me, antihistamins dry me out like crazy--  I just don't know.

 

Scared eing alone and isolating.  I could have gone t oyoga this evening but I could not move out of bed.

 

I don't see this ending or going anywhere.

 

Wondering if going so slowly has hurt rather than helped?  Feeling like need someone to take care of me.... there is nobody.

 

Beyond sad.

 

Oh and don't think it helps that ambien was on was mylan and this crap is teva brand.

[[Mi...]]

Check out the book The Mood Cure by Julia Ross. There is so much good information there about amino acids, particularly 5-HTP, L-Tryptophan, and L-Tyrosene. They are all building blocks to our brain chemicals Serotonin and Dopamine. The book also talks about getting these naturally from your foods and even lays out meal plans. I learned a lot from the book and now take the amino even day as well as added protein and fats to my diet.

 

I thought Ashton said not to take any supplements while tapering. Are amino acids a supplement? Also hope I am doing this “quote” thing right. First time trying to quote then reply to a post.

 

xxoo

Miamigirl

[[Ca...]]

i don't know what to do.

 

Have felt awful lately.

 

I had updosed one time to get to dentist last week and had a good day followed by bad ones.  Had panic, had depression, had allergic reactions, hot/cold, etc.

 

Had been taking lyrica now and then, not huge amts., probably average of 35 mg... stopped that.  And try to take minimal ambien.  One night I did tak a whole and felt better.  Took half last night, 2 hrs sleep and dreadful.

 

I am just not getting myself off these and wonder what kind of help I can get.

 

There are so many meds I cannot take --  ADs never were good for me, antihistamins dry me out like crazy--  I just don't know.

 

Scared eing alone and isolating.  I could have gone t oyoga this evening but I could not move out of bed.

 

I don't see this ending or going anywhere.

 

Wondering if going so slowly has hurt rather than helped?  Feeling like need someone to take care of me.... there is nobody.

 

Beyond sad.

 

Oh and don't think it helps that ambien was on was mylan and this crap is teva brand.

Hi,

Have you recently stopped lyrica??

Stopping after just one week gives me a huge kick...

 

Steady yourself, and trust in what you are doing... Step your way through it, bit by bit, day by day..

If you do change things, try to have a solid plan...

Sorry its being so hard to find some stability...

[[Ca...]]

Check out the book The Mood Cure by Julia Ross. There is so much good information there about amino acids, particularly 5-HTP, L-Tryptophan, and L-Tyrosene. They are all building blocks to our brain chemicals Serotonin and Dopamine. The book also talks about getting these naturally from your foods and even lays out meal plans. I learned a lot from the book and now take the amino even day as well as added protein and fats to my diet.

 

I thought Ashton said not to take any supplements while tapering. Are amino acids a supplement? Also hope I am doing this “quote” thing right. First time trying to quote then reply to a post.

 

xxoo

Miamigirl

Well the Quote worked Miamigirl...!!

 

Ashton prob has good reasons to suggest not adding to the mix..

But we are also evolving beyond her work (imho) through the internet and sheer numbers... Not to mention emerging genetics... We now know that her tapering speeds can be much too fast for many people...

Clinical vs Anecdotal, perhaps..?

 

[[Ba...]]

a kick??

 

I stopped few days ago trying to simplify my situation.

 

How do I knokw what is doing what at this point.