The Long Hold Support Group

[[...]]

Ps the only time i seem to get a little break is when I make a tiny cut ..... I'll get something like a short window then , and then the WDs come on full force and seem to last forever!

Well this is interesting. I wonder if you made really small daily cuts of .005 for a week if,,you would feel better? Just thinking out loud.  --V

 

I don't know Valley , what I do know is my WDs get way worse after a time , I'm afraid to cut more at the moment as I'm in pretty bad shape right now . What I did this month was cut .001 gms , wait a few days , then cut another . 001 ...... Total of .005 gms which is 1/16 th of my 2 mg pill. I waited 2 weeks to make this last .001 , not getting a window from this one! Agh .....

[[Me...]]

Just dropped in to see how everyone is doing. Belated congratulations to Can't fly!!!

Many months, I'm still holding. Seems I'm about 50/50 as far as waves and windows.

 

Does the Shakey, quivery, kinda nervous feeling ever go away. Also, do you ever get over the constant fear and tension that you are going to just lose your mind and go bonkers? I'm getting weary and I know my family is struggling to watch me suffering during waves. Guess I'm in need of some help today. Someone ,throw me a line please!!!!

[[Va...]]

Ps the only time i seem to get a little break is when I make a tiny cut ..... I'll get something like a short window then , and then the WDs come on full force and seem to last forever!

Well this is interesting. I wonder if you made really small daily cuts of .005 for a week if,,you would feel better? Just thinking out loud.  --V

 

I don't know Valley , what I do know is my WDs get way worse after a time , I'm afraid to cut more at the moment as I'm in pretty bad shape right now . What I did this month was cut .001 gms , wait a few days , then cut another . 001 ...... Total of .005 gms which is 1/16 th of my 2 mg pill. I waited 2 weeks to make this last .001 , not getting a window from this one! Agh .....

Makes me wonder ho well you metabolize Valium... I wish I had more suggestions but it sounds like you are doing the best you can and listening to your body. Hang in there! --V

[[Va...]]

Just dropped in to see how everyone is doing. Belated congratulations to Can't fly!!!

Many months, I'm still holding. Seems I'm about 50/50 as far as waves and windows.

 

Does the Shakey, quivery, kinda nervous feeling ever go away. Also, do you ever get over the constant fear and tension that you are going to just lose your mind and go bonkers? I'm getting weary and I know my family is struggling to watch me suffering during waves. Guess I'm in need of some help today. Someone ,throw me a line please!!!!

Hi Mellow. Sorry for the rough patch. It sounds like the pattern is definitely playing out as indicated below.  --V

 

[[an...]]

Hi Lynn,

 

Congratulations to you!!  You are almost there--what an accomplishment.  I believe you will walk off with no problems.  I walked off at 0.01 mg when I finished my first taper.  No problems whatsoever.

 

You listened to your body and incorporated holds when needed.  Like you, I worried about long holds because of what I read, but now I am convinced the long holds are the way to go.  This is not a race, and the key is to go slow and hold when there is an uptick in symptoms. 

 

I am so happy for you!! 

 

Anne xoxox  :smitten:

[[He...]]

Nothing more to say really, excep

 

.  !! BRAVISSIMO to LYNN !  WHAT A WARRIOR,  just a tiny bit more to go, and no doubts in anyone's mind that you will slippy slide right off with no problem at all !

 

Good Job LYNNE! AND WE WILL BE RIGHT BEHIND YOU WHEN IT IS OUR TURN TOO!

 

Heath.  :yippee: :yippee: :yippee:  

[[ly...]]

 

 

Hey thanks for the well wishes everyone.  It means alot coming from this group.   It's been a long slog but I've mentally reached the finish line.  I'm ready to put a "period" on this chapter of my life.  I'll be looking over my shoulder for all of you.

 

I'll be around but perhaps not as much.

[[ga...]]

Ps the only time i seem to get a little break is when I make a tiny cut ..... I'll get something like a short window then , and then the WDs come on full force and seem to last forever!

Well this is interesting. I wonder if you made really small daily cuts of .005 for a week if,,you would feel better? Just thinking out loud.  --V

 

I don't know Valley , what I do know is my WDs get way worse after a time , I'm afraid to cut more at the moment as I'm in pretty bad shape right now . What I did this month was cut .001 gms , wait a few days , then cut another . 001 ...... Total of .005 gms which is 1/16 th of my 2 mg pill. I waited 2 weeks to make this last .001 , not getting a window from this one! Agh .....

 

Miyu, that's the same pattern I use for cutting. Cut a little about twice/week. I was cutting every day but hated the tiny syringe and all the math.

 

I'm sorry it's not working for you, at least right now. I have heard of people who have said the classic Ashton method was the only thing that gave them windows. My symptoms are manageable with what I'm doing now with incorporated holds. And, personally, I am way too chicken to try an Ashton-sized cut.

 

I'm sorry this has been so difficult for you. I hope you can find a system works and get some relief soon.

Gard

[[...]]

Ps the only time i seem to get a little break is when I make a tiny cut ..... I'll get something like a short window then , and then the WDs come on full force and seem to last forever!

Well this is interesting. I wonder if you made really small daily cuts of .005 for a week if,,you would feel better? Just thinking out loud.  --V

 

I don't know Valley , what I do know is my WDs get way worse after a time , I'm afraid to cut more at the moment as I'm in pretty bad shape right now . What I did this month was cut .001 gms , wait a few days , then cut another . 001 ...... Total of .005 gms which is 1/16 th of my 2 mg pill. I waited 2 weeks to make this last .001 , not getting a window from this one! Agh .....

Makes me wonder ho well you metabolize Valium... I wish I had more suggestions but it sounds like you are doing the best you can and listening to your body. Hang in there! --V

 

Thanks Valley , yeah , I know , I do have the liver enzyme issue with Valium genetically , but I don't understand whybthatbwould make a taper more difficult , just because I metabolize fast ? I dose 3 X day to get around that . ..... I switched over form K as you know , and , I my WDs from that were horrendous too, with a very slow crossover . Unless I'm just not using the V somehow , well , not the way it's supposed to work ......

 

I always feel a little better in the evenings , and am feeling a bit better than earlier now , will see what tomorrow brings .

MiYu

[[...]]

Ps the only time i seem to get a little break is when I make a tiny cut ..... I'll get something like a short window then , and then the WDs come on full force and seem to last forever!

Well this is interesting. I wonder if you made really small daily cuts of .005 for a week if,,you would feel better? Just thinking out loud.  --V

 

I don't know Valley , what I do know is my WDs get way worse after a time , I'm afraid to cut more at the moment as I'm in pretty bad shape right now . What I did this month was cut .001 gms , wait a few days , then cut another . 001 ...... Total of .005 gms which is 1/16 th of my 2 mg pill. I waited 2 weeks to make this last .001 , not getting a window from this one! Agh .....

 

Miyu, that's the same pattern I use for cutting. Cut a little about twice/week. I was cutting every day but hated the tiny syringe and all the math.

 

I'm sorry it's not working for you, at least right now. I have heard of people who have said the classic Ashton method was the only thing that gave them windows. My symptoms are manageable with what I'm doing now with incorporated holds. And, personally, I am way too chicken to try an Ashton-sized cut.

 

I'm sorry this has been so difficult for you. I hope you can find a system works and get some relief soon.

Gard

Thank you Gard....its possible I might get Windows with the Ashton method , not quite as fast , but that cut and hold approach ... But I think my WDs would also be pretty unbearable.

My sense is that things will improve for me as I get lower in dose .... Surely it has to somehow as otherwise it would take me 16 years at this rate which is completely ridiculous!

Maybe I'll have to bite the bullet somewhere along the way  and suffer some really bad WDs ... But I'm really chicken when it Comes to suffering and get crazy panicky .

 

So I'll just keep doing what I'm doing for now and pray for the best ....

Love, MiYu 

[[...]]

 

 

Hey thanks for the well wishes everyone.  It means alot coming from this group.   It's been a long slog but I've mentally reached the finish line.  I'm ready to put a "period" on this chapter of my life.  I'll be looking over my shoulder for all of you.

 

I'll be around but perhaps not as much.

 

Well done Lynn ! Hope you slide off with no problems 

Love, MiYu

[[no...]]

 

 

Hey thanks for the well wishes everyone.  It means alot coming from this group.   It's been a long slog but I've mentally reached the finish line.  I'm ready to put a "period" on this chapter of my life.  I'll be looking over my shoulder for all of you.

 

I'll be around but perhaps not as much.

 

Well done Lynn ! Hope you slide off with no problems 

Love, MiYu

Hi M What's happening to you is the same as I'm going through plus an arsehole upstairs  neighbour on top other ongoing stress I really shouldn't be having to think about never mind deal with, and ''windows'' some people class that as feeling a bit better than usual others want the big miracle of 100% well we all want that. I did have a window 100% for a few minutes January.

 

But since that its been really bad or not so bad, yesterday was the first day for a week I was actually able to sit up all day not have to lay down on the floor all day, with an arsehole continuously playing a PC game day and night loudly. Yesterday I could also shrug it off a lot easier but today its getting to me again, so this is proof my CNS is till rearranging its self as its still very unstable.

 

Also I was cutting after having to lay down for a day or two  during a hold previously but this time decided to hold as every time I go up or down I end up wishing I just continued staying where I was and holding.    I personally am thinking it may be a a year or even longer before I get stable I could be wrong it maybe sooner as its so unpredictable, but all I know is comparing ourselves to other makes  matters a LOT worse. I unfortunately picked that habit up form joining BB before I just took it for what it was withdrawal which meant I had to do nothing but keep taking the same dose for however long, but also I got worse symptoms by cutting at Ashton's rate after being introduced to it on here.

 

I believe I may also be a fast metaboliser but as someone else said to another poster when the drug was working before withdrawal you were still metabolising it at the same rate as now . Anyway all I know is I went into hell before and was 100% convinced I was stuck there forever ( Just like I am now ) except I didn't do mad stuff like cutting when I was feeling that badly or not stable for quite some time.  I held the same dose for a long time and eventually I got really well again until the big mistakes of doing the too big dreaded Ashton's cuts. Up-dosing or cutting is going to effect an already sensitive CNS and the best thing to do after trying both ways or at least one is to choose a dose sit there and don't move until you make REAL improvement for quiet some time before resuming your taper.

 

 

 

Love Nova xx  :smitten:

[[no...]]

Congratulations Lynn   

 

 

 

 

 

Love Nova xxx  :smitten:

[[no...]]

 

 

Hey thanks for the well wishes everyone.  It means alot coming from this group.   It's been a long slog but I've mentally reached the finish line.  I'm ready to put a "period" on this chapter of my life.  I'll be looking over my shoulder for all of you.

 

I'll be around but perhaps not as much.

 

Well done Lynn ! Hope you slide off with no problems 

Love, MiYu

Hi M What's happening to you is the same as I'm going through plus an arsehole upstairs  neighbour on top other ongoing stress I really shouldn't be having to think about never mind deal with, and ''windows'' some people class that as feeling a bit better than usual others want the big miracle of 100% well we all want that. I did have a window 100% for a few minutes January.

 

But since that its been really bad or not so bad, yesterday was the first day for a week I was actually able to sit up all day not have to lay down on the floor all day, with an arsehole continuously playing a PC game day and night loudly. Yesterday I could also shrug it off a lot easier but today its getting to me again, so this is proof my CNS is till rearranging its self as its still very unstable.

 

Also I was cutting after having to lay down for a day or two  during a hold previously but this time decided to hold as every time I go up or down I end up wishing I just continued staying where I was and holding.    I personally am thinking it may be a a year or even longer before I get stable I could be wrong it maybe sooner as its so unpredictable, but all I know is comparing ourselves to other makes  matters a LOT worse. I unfortunately picked that habit up form joining BB before I just took it for what it was withdrawal which meant I had to do nothing but keep taking the same dose for however long, but also I got worse symptoms by cutting at Ashton's rate after being introduced to it on here.

 

I believe I may also be a fast metaboliser but as someone else said to another poster when the drug was working before withdrawal you were still metabolising it at the same rate as now . Anyway all I know is I went into hell before and was 100% convinced I was stuck there forever ( Just like I am now ) except I didn't do mad stuff like cutting when I was feeling that badly or not stable for quite some time.  I held the same dose for a long time and eventually I got really well again until the big mistakes of doing the too big dreaded Ashton's cuts. Up-dosing or cutting is going to effect an already sensitive CNS and the best thing to do after trying both ways or at least one is to choose a dose sit there and don't move until you make REAL improvement for quiet some time before resuming your taper.

 

 

 

Love Nova xx  :smitten:

One more thing as someone else pointed out about doing long holds no matter how long you had to hold for, ''If you had liver damage you wouldn't expect you liver to heal in a given time frame , and if it wasn't say ''tough you had long enough now you have to drink this vodka'' would you? So why expect your brain to do it  because you already held X-amount of time, and still don't feel stable?.'' Calenders, time, days, weeks, months whatever  . are ALL insignificant to our bodies  individual healing/ rate of reaching homoeostasis.

 

 

 

Love Nova xxx  :smitten:

[[sl...]]

Just to make something clear. Everything Cant says should be taken with a grain of salt. Or a shakerful of salt. I do not like math! I bow to the math gurus. When my brain comes back, I will try it again, but not until then!

 

SI, did you know there's a "preview" button at the lower right that lets you see your post before you post? That way you can see if the emojis worked. So often they don't. But then you can mess with them until they do.

 

Gard

 

 

OK right 

You are like me then!

Except I don't think it's a matter of waiting until my brain comes back.

I've always been like that with numbers.

Thank the Lord for calculators but I just couldn't get my head around those titration schedules.

I get brain freeze but can't blame the benzos.

[[sl...]]

 

 

Valley Um  I've put a question to you on the Diaz -Pam's Example of a daily reduction plan thread in the titration section.

There is no rush because I'm holding at 5mgs for the time being until I feel ok but I needed a bit of help if I do a titration.

Would be glad of some advice.  [anyone  but I just saw a post by Valley over there so thought he might help as I've probably got it all wrong 

Hi slowly. I'd be happy to help. Just let me know what you need.  --V

 

Valley thank you so much.

I've been onto the thread and printed out the schedules you did for me

I probably will start with the  .02ml reductions initially and see how that goes.

I have felt so much better both yesterday and today - so far.

 

Vertigo still around but doesn't start until around 2 hours before my dose time, ear pain and eye puffiness/watering/itching seem to have gone.

I think the symptoms do go away after each cut but seem to take a while and don't start until I'm around 20 plus days into a cut.

The titration method might help this, I'm hoping, but I will wait until I feel stable enough before starting it.

I'm learning to be a patient tortoise 

[[ga...]]

 

Thank you Gard....its possible I might get Windows with the Ashton method , not quite as fast , but that cut and hold approach ... But I think my WDs would also be pretty unbearable.

My sense is that things will improve for me as I get lower in dose .... Surely it has to somehow as otherwise it would take me 16 years at this rate which is completely ridiculous!

Maybe I'll have to bite the bullet somewhere along the way  and suffer some really bad WDs ... But I'm really chicken when it Comes to suffering and get crazy panicky .

 

So I'll just keep doing what I'm doing for now and pray for the best ....

Love, MiYu 

 

I'm sorry it's so hard, Miyu. I'm glad you're listening to your body. I know somehow you will work this out and get through this. :smitten:

[[Va...]]

 

 

Valley Um  I've put a question to you on the Diaz -Pam's Example of a daily reduction plan thread in the titration section.

There is no rush because I'm holding at 5mgs for the time being until I feel ok but I needed a bit of help if I do a titration.

Would be glad of some advice.  [anyone  but I just saw a post by Valley over there so thought he might help as I've probably got it all wrong 

Hi slowly. I'd be happy to help. Just let me know what you need.  --V

 

Valley thank you so much.

I've been onto the thread and printed out the schedules you did for me

I probably will start with the  .02ml reductions initially and see how that goes.

I have felt so much better both yesterday and today - so far.

 

Vertigo still around but doesn't start until around 2 hours before my dose time, ear pain and eye puffiness/watering/itching seem to have gone.

I think the symptoms do go away after each cut but seem to take a while and don't start until I'm around 20 plus days into a cut.

The titration method might help this, I'm hoping, but I will wait until I feel stable enough before starting it.

I'm learning to be a patient tortoise 

Glad you're feeling better!  --V

[[po...]]

Did Diaza-Pam like to dilute with 100mls?  Im planning on diluting my 5mg liquid V with 50mls.  Would it be better to dilute more?  or does it not make that big a difference?  Im just asking from the last few posts. 

[[Va...]]

Did Diaza-Pam like to dilute with 100mls?  Im planning on diluting my 5mg liquid V with 50mls.  Would it be better to dilute more?  or does it not make that big a difference?  Im just asking from the last few posts. 

5mg diluted in 50ml is the same as 10mg diluted in 100ml so you're good to go. 

[[...]]

 

 

Hey thanks for the well wishes everyone.  It means alot coming from this group.   It's been a long slog but I've mentally reached the finish line.  I'm ready to put a "period" on this chapter of my life.  I'll be looking over my shoulder for all of you.

 

I'll be around but perhaps not as much.

 

Well done Lynn ! Hope you slide off with no problems 

Love, MiYu

Hi M What's happening to you is the same as I'm going through plus an arsehole upstairs  neighbour on top other ongoing stress I really shouldn't be having to think about never mind deal with, and ''windows'' some people class that as feeling a bit better than usual others want the big miracle of 100% well we all want that. I did have a window 100% for a few minutes January.

 

But since that its been really bad or not so bad, yesterday was the first day for a week I was actually able to sit up all day not have to lay down on the floor all day, with an arsehole continuously playing a PC game day and night loudly. Yesterday I could also shrug it off a lot easier but today its getting to me again, so this is proof my CNS is till rearranging its self as its still very unstable.

 

Also I was cutting after having to lay down for a day or two  during a hold previously but this time decided to hold as every time I go up or down I end up wishing I just continued staying where I was and holding.    I personally am thinking it may be a a year or even longer before I get stable I could be wrong it maybe sooner as its so unpredictable, but all I know is comparing ourselves to other makes  matters a LOT worse. I unfortunately picked that habit up form joining BB before I just took it for what it was withdrawal which meant I had to do nothing but keep taking the same dose for however long, but also I got worse symptoms by cutting at Ashton's rate after being introduced to it on here.

 

I believe I may also be a fast metaboliser but as someone else said to another poster when the drug was working before withdrawal you were still metabolising it at the same rate as now . Anyway all I know is I went into hell before and was 100% convinced I was stuck there forever ( Just like I am now ) except I didn't do mad stuff like cutting when I was feeling that badly or not stable for quite some time.  I held the same dose for a long time and eventually I got really well again until the big mistakes of doing the too big dreaded Ashton's cuts. Up-dosing or cutting is going to effect an already sensitive CNS and the best thing to do after trying both ways or at least one is to choose a dose sit there and don't move until you make REAL improvement for quiet some time before resuming your taper.

 

 

 

Love Nova xx  :smitten:

 

Thank you Nova  :smitten:

I'm glad you've decided to stay put with your dose now , that sounds wise.

I actually felt a bit better today , some improvements for sure . I had a bad wave mid morning that passed . And yes , my ' normal' , or Windows or whatever are not feeling like a healthy normal self at all!

That's ok , as long as I don't feel really really bad I can deal with that . I'm going to do little experiments and see, nothing drastic . I am clearly recovering  from my small cut , even tho it was so small and it was pretty rough, so that's a good sign at least . Last week was horrible ,Mand then I posted a couple of days ago how bad I felt and hopeless , or was it yesterday

And today was better , so there you go .......

 

I have to talk to my doc tomorrow and I don't think he's going to be very happy with my ' progress' , but , if he isn't , I'm starting to look for a new one .

 

Hang in there sweetie , love, MiYu  :smitten:

 

Ps Does anyone have any experience with liver enzymes and low WBC count? Usually liver enzymes go up when liver problems are happening , but mine are really low , can't find any info online about it relative to benzos ...

 

 

I'm sorry you still have the neighbor problem

[[...]]

 

Thank you Gard....its possible I might get Windows with the Ashton method , not quite as fast , but that cut and hold approach ... But I think my WDs would also be pretty unbearable.

My sense is that things will improve for me as I get lower in dose .... Surely it has to somehow as otherwise it would take me 16 years at this rate which is completely ridiculous!

Maybe I'll have to bite the bullet somewhere along the way  and suffer some really bad WDs ... But I'm really chicken when it Comes to suffering and get crazy panicky .

 

So I'll just keep doing what I'm doing for now and pray for the best ....

Love, MiYu 

 

I'm sorry it's so hard, Miyu. I'm glad you're listening to your body. I know somehow you will work this out and get through this. :smitten:

 

Thank you Gard  :smitten:

[[no...]]

 

 

Hey thanks for the well wishes everyone.  It means alot coming from this group.   It's been a long slog but I've mentally reached the finish line.  I'm ready to put a "period" on this chapter of my life.  I'll be looking over my shoulder for all of you.

 

I'll be around but perhaps not as much.

 

Well done Lynn ! Hope you slide off with no problems 

Love, MiYu

Hi M What's happening to you is the same as I'm going through plus an arsehole upstairs  neighbour on top other ongoing stress I really shouldn't be having to think about never mind deal with, and ''windows'' some people class that as feeling a bit better than usual others want the big miracle of 100% well we all want that. I did have a window 100% for a few minutes January.

 

But since that its been really bad or not so bad, yesterday was the first day for a week I was actually able to sit up all day not have to lay down on the floor all day, with an arsehole continuously playing a PC game day and night loudly. Yesterday I could also shrug it off a lot easier but today its getting to me again, so this is proof my CNS is till rearranging its self as its still very unstable.

 

Also I was cutting after having to lay down for a day or two  during a hold previously but this time decided to hold as every time I go up or down I end up wishing I just continued staying where I was and holding.    I personally am thinking it may be a a year or even longer before I get stable I could be wrong it maybe sooner as its so unpredictable, but all I know is comparing ourselves to other makes  matters a LOT worse. I unfortunately picked that habit up form joining BB before I just took it for what it was withdrawal which meant I had to do nothing but keep taking the same dose for however long, but also I got worse symptoms by cutting at Ashton's rate after being introduced to it on here.

 

I believe I may also be a fast metaboliser but as someone else said to another poster when the drug was working before withdrawal you were still metabolising it at the same rate as now . Anyway all I know is I went into hell before and was 100% convinced I was stuck there forever ( Just like I am now ) except I didn't do mad stuff like cutting when I was feeling that badly or not stable for quite some time.  I held the same dose for a long time and eventually I got really well again until the big mistakes of doing the too big dreaded Ashton's cuts. Up-dosing or cutting is going to effect an already sensitive CNS and the best thing to do after trying both ways or at least one is to choose a dose sit there and don't move until you make REAL improvement for quiet some time before resuming your taper.

 

 

 

Love Nova xx  :smitten:

 

Thank you Nova  :smitten:

I'm glad you've decided to stay put with your dose now , that sounds wise.

I actually felt a bit better today , some improvements for sure . I had a bad wave mid morning that passed . And yes , my ' normal' , or Windows or whatever are not feeling like a healthy normal self at all!

That's ok , as long as I don't feel really really bad I can deal with that . I'm going to do little experiments and see, nothing drastic . I am clearly recovering  from my small cut , even tho it was so small and it was pretty rough, so that's a good sign at least . Last week was horrible ,Mand then I posted a couple of days ago how bad I felt and hopeless , or was it yesterday

And today was better , so there you go .......

 

I have to talk to my doc tomorrow and I don't think he's going to be very happy with my ' progress' , but , if he isn't , I'm starting to look for a new one .

 

Hang in there sweetie , love, MiYu  :smitten:

 

Ps Does anyone have any experience with liver enzymes and low WBC count? Usually liver enzymes go up when liver problems are happening , but mine are really low , can't find any info online about it relative to benzos ...

 

I'm sorry you still have the neighbor problem

Hi M  Mine were low along with my white blood cell count, I lost over 5 stone unable to put weight on and still losing it but ''they didn't know why?'' its got to be Benzos or the withdrawal, I'm hedging bets its the withdrawal as that's when mine were noticed  when I was in unbeknown tolerance withdrawal. 

 

Before my blood test were all fine, Benzo withdrawal is also know to mash up your immune system, so it figures it wil hit our liver too, Diazepam/ Valium is metabolised by the liver Ativan is done Via the kidneys.  And I forgot until recently I was put on Amitriptyline for the nerve pain which turned out to be Benzo withdrwal related, for ages.  And the day I had my hip replacement done the leg where the op was done woke me up shooting up over my head!!! 

 

I worked out it had to be the drugs but thought it was the amitriptyline so still in the dark about Benzos or ALL the drugs I was on should be tapered  I stopped them CT, that helped. But then I went into even worse withdrawal as now it was times two, the amitriptyline withdrawal was the same as Benzos and I was convinced it was the operation or the new hip. And my lovely surgeon said they had noticed stuff but it wasn't to do with the op and they were puzzled. I had bad edema of the feet and legs which I now know was Benzos withdrawal ..again

 

On top of all this  I had also been tapering the Benzo's  before the op but decided to hold due to the op and that was when I did my long hold for over a year as I was so ill with everything the taper went out the window, I just stopped and held. I remember now  It took me  well over a year holding in hell before I got any where near stable and eventually  began to have windows and waves, not full windows just sometimes were better than others still unaware what was really going on. 

 

Eventually I got true windows, I was also drinking  on and off  and sometimes heavy as I couldn't stand the pain in the middle of it all too as I had no Idea about anything.  Smoking weed and cigs on and off heavily,  but I stopped drinking and smoking completely  as soon as I found out what was what 2 years ago and found the dreaed Ashton manual on here. But for ALL this and still in the dark as as to why my ''illness'' kept flaring up ,  I consistently held, throughout all of that and the windows began getting longer, and I would say it took over 18 months  until things were really on the up. I was living again with symptoms but hugely improved, sure I had bad days when I was still wondering WTF is happening now???

 

 

But they were becoming far and few between and I could function better even on a really bad day, I was healing but didn't know it, I began to do things I hadn't been able to do for many year's. And learned stuff I wanted to for many years, and I also got myself off  lots of different opiate pain killers,  and within two year's I had the occasional fleeting symptom and was tapering again with no extra problems at all. But doing long holds between every 1/4 I cut, sometimes holding a month other times for a few months.

 

 

I also took no notice of how long and didn't care how long either I was getting there slowly but surely and having a wonderful life, while heading in the right direction.  I had a wonderful year amazing year, then realised it was the Benzos, and began looking for information and came across BB, looking from the outside everyone seemed to be wonderfully more informed than me oh yeah?? Like others on here I have a love hate relationship with this forum, I am eternally grateful for it being here and the really wonderful people I've met.  And the nasty  ones I disliked I blocked but now their gone  YAY!!!!!

 

But I wish to God that the Ashton manual wasn't pushed like some bloody Holy book on here, and it was, and SHOULD BE made VERY CLEAR instead that its only a guide line NOT set in stone to be followed. And it can be WAY TOO FAST for a LOT of People, to gut at those rates and that a SYMPTOM BASED TAPER was pushed more along with HOLDING, and RETRACTING A CUT IF NEEDED THEN HOLD!!!!  This is my hate part with the forum, following the Ashton manual is what fkd not just me up but LOTS of people on here go look at the protracted threads they  MOSTLY did Ashton or to rapid a taper with no holds or calling 4 weeks a ''long hold''' its not, its a ''normal hold'' between cuts.

 

 

So now its back to listening to myself remembering what worked when nothing else did, and I know no one wants to hear it  but the truth is it took a LONG  time  HOLDING to get myself from a bad place, to waves and windows, then to the window staying open, and getting wider all the time, yes the AMAZING, does get SUPER AMAZING!!! There is no drug on this planet that can give you this over powering love of life and humanity, even the worse of it you love  ALL humanity without judgement and realise your are EVERYONE and EVERYTHING that you can see. 

 

 

I was there its incredible until fkn Ashton  cutting rates slammed it shut on my head!!! AAARRGGHH!!!  !@#$%^&*":   !@#$%**) AAAAAAAGGGGGGGGHHHH !@#$%^&*"!@#$%**)  :tickedoff:  Ah!! that's better  I have so much more I want to say as I want to help not just me but others going through this hell to find some hope no matter what, it will take time don't push it it will come. An occasional good day is not stabilisation, but its a sign your on your way there. I can't type no more its hard going on the brain too much stimulation, and this has taken me well over an hour to type now.

 

And I need a break now but I will put what information comes back to me on here for others who think months later the holds not working, or its getting worse this will happen, it did beofre I got to my happy placed during my last very long hold I just written about.  I just had to keep holding and let my body do its thing uninterrupted and just be with the symptoms long enough for the turn about.  :hug: To everyone that reads this.

 

 

 

Love Nova xxx  :smitten:  

[[no...]]

PS The 1/4 cuts I refer to in the post above this one was 1/4mg MG a time NOT the whole dose Just in-case anyone reads the above and decides to try it.

 

 

 

Love Nova xxx  :smitten:

[[sl...]]

Is everyone struggling with insomnia?  just curious.

 

Just spotted this from way back in the thread.

I have had insomnia since I was aged 7 and like Gard I have had sleep studies done and psych/sleep specialist help.

I was told by one of them that med students spend around one half day only, learning about sleep, which explains why there seems to be so little knowledge of insomnia.

 

There is a strong hereditary/genetic element  in mine, which they said explains why not much will help it  "you're just one of the unlucky ones"  lol

 

We can trace it back through at least 3 generations that we know of ....my great grandfather, two great great uncles, two great uncles, grandfather, father, aunt,  my brother, and two of my daughters [identical twins]

I don't list it amongst my symptoms because it is just a part of my life which i just try to live with.

 

It was the reason I took Nitrazepam [beginning of my sig] because of a particular trauma, and it does work, but I didn't like the groggy foggy after effects and after adding diazepam I came to the conclusion that I was no better with benzos and definitely better in other ways without them.

I'm used to not sleeping but can't stand feeling groggy and fuzzy brained and feeling as if I'm walking though treacle.

I  just do all the recommended "sleep hygiene" things and so do my aunt and my daughters.

 

The past generations of the family, and my brother, have become what the doctors call "high functioning" alcoholics because of insomnia...nobody would guess, or ever did guess, that they drank because they were never drunk and they did very demanding jobs.

 

Wine makes me sleep too but I avoid it because I know what would happen  ...big time!!

 

That's why I was a bit doubtful about vodka titrating lol but I think I'll cope with the tiny amounts involved.

 

I always take at least 2 hours to go to sleep - I don't clock watch but I know from where I got to in my book before it dropped to the floor and often I know I'm going to fall asleep because I've "read" 3 or 4 pages without taking it in, so I put the book down in an orderly way 

It's a nasty thing to live with but others have worse so what the hell

 

A good night it 4  hours unbroken, which I can easily cope with.

A bad night is just no sleep.

I was once in hospital and the nurse said  "yes you slept, I checked in on you 3 times"

"You came in 4 times"  I replied ....she was amazed.

 

SO ...yes it's one of my symptoms but not because of benzos except probably a bit of  rebound insomnia after I stopped taking the Nitrazepam.

Thought I'd put this on because you asked way back and because I'm happy to share any experiences with it or give any help to anyone on here  cos you are all so good  :hug: