The Long Hold Support Group

[[HO...]]

Hi Hope,

I can only speak from my own experience. Yes, no matter how bad, or how long they lasted, every one of my wdsx always disappeared after a while. When I reduced my dose too quickly, (when I first started my withdrawal I actually went from 7.5 mg to 2.5 mg in a very short time...you can look at my signature.) that is when I got really bad wdsx. And it was at those times that I even got more than one wdsx at one time. I was quite miserable then,. I was new to this taper thing and didn't know that I was reducing my dose too fast. All the wdsx caught up with me from going to fast and boy did I crash! That's when I found help in this support group and decided to hold.

During  my 4 month hold, to get stable, I started to get Windows where everything disappeared for a few hours and I really felt like my old self again. It was like a miracle! The wdsx came and went, I had Windows and waves for four months.

By the end of my 4 mo hold, I was completely stable. I started to cut my dose again, again I went too fast and made many mistakes in my hurry to get off the Valium. And of course I paid for it with new

Wdsx!

So now I am careful. I still make mistakes, go too fast, and get new wdsx every few weeks. I am very sensitive to cuts and I have to remember to keep my cuts small and hold when my body gets Wdsx.

 

But yes, fir me, when I hold long enough, the wdsx definitely do slowly subside.

I am going slow so my wdsx are mostly minimal. I go sky because this way I can still to some part time work that I love, I can get out ofvthevhousecw it's my friends and go shopping etc, even while I am in withdrawal. I think it's better to be able to live my life during withdrawal, even if it will take longer to get off the Valium. It's better than having acute withdrawal sdfx and being house bound and miserable.

 

 

 

I hope this is what you wanted me to tell you. I hope it helps.

Right now I am reducing my dose by .02 or .03 I hold there fir 2or 3 weeks depending how I feel. Then I reduce again,

 

Good luck shooed! Do t ever give up! You will find the taper that works for you.

 

Heath

 

That's what my reduction was until I found a benzo wise doctor.

[[ly...]]

 

Hope,

 

I think just about everyone here has either held or is holding now.  I've had a couple long holds (8 months and 4 months) where I saw very bad wd just about disappear.  Since then I have been able to taper very comfortably and am able to live a full, active life.

 

 

[[HO...]]

Hi Hope,

I can only speak from my own experience. Yes, no matter how bad, or how long they lasted, every one of my wdsx always disappeared after a while. When I reduced my dose too quickly, (when I first started my withdrawal I actually went from 7.5 mg to 2.5 mg in a very short time...you can look at my signature.) that is when I got really bad wdsx. And it was at those times that I even got more than one wdsx at one time. I was quite miserable then,. I was new to this taper thing and didn't know that I was reducing my dose too fast. All the wdsx caught up with me from going to fast and boy did I crash! That's when I found help in this support group and decided to hold.

During  my 4 month hold, to get stable, I started to get Windows where everything disappeared for a few hours and I really felt like my old self again. It was like a miracle! The wdsx came and went, I had Windows and waves for four months.

By the end of my 4 mo hold, I was completely stable. I started to cut my dose again, again I went too fast and made many mistakes in my hurry to get off the Valium. And of course I paid for it with new

Wdsx!

So now I am careful. I still make mistakes, go too fast, and get new wdsx every few weeks. I am very sensitive to cuts and I have to remember to keep my cuts small and hold when my body gets Wdsx.

 

But yes, fir me, when I hold long enough, the wdsx definitely do slowly subside.

I am going slow so my wdsx are mostly minimal. I go sky because this way I can still to some part time work that I love, I can get out ofvthevhousecw it's my friends and go shopping etc, even while I am in withdrawal. I think it's better to be able to live my life during withdrawal, even if it will take longer to get off the Valium. It's better than having acute withdrawal sdfx and being house bound and miserable.

 

I hope this is what you wanted me to tell you. I hope it helps.

Right now I am reducing my dose by .02 or .03 I hold there fir 2or 3 weeks depending how I feel. Then I reduce again,

 

Good luck shooed! Do t ever give up! You will find the taper that works for you.

 

Heath

 

Yes. I'm following your taper. I'm super sensitive too. Did your fatigue even go away?

[[be...]]

I get dental pain too. Has everyone here who has done long holds severe symptoms cleared up? I love this group by the way.

Hi Hope, I am sure you will get some response soon, I just do not have severe sx this go round. We are glad you are here, things do and will get better.

 

You've done this before?

Yes two times time frame and such in my sig below. I did it all wrong first two times, too fast and crashed each time, there is no need to suffer if a taper is well thought out and no rushing and tweak if necessary and time is a big key I know that now, do not be afraid of losing time.

[[...]]

Hi everyone  I wish for everyone  today and beyond  better times, windows and great progress in healing 

 

 

                   

 

 

 

 

 

 

Love Nova xxx  :smitten:

 

Thank you Nova for that reminder ..... Crazy making isn't it!

I was soooo tired today I could hardly keep my eyes open , but I couldn t sleep either . Dragged myself around.

Thinking of you and hoping for things to get a bit easier , you need a break .

you are strong and will get through the this.

Love, MiYu  :smitten:

[[ga...]]

I get dental pain too. Has everyone here who has done long holds severe symptoms cleared up? I love this group by the way.

 

Absolutely! It was over 6 months before I was sure I was getting better. My symptoms are now much more manageable. I was a wreck before my hold.

 

How long was your hold.

 

I'm going to have to think about that one. I think I lost count at 6 months! It may have been closer to a year.

[[ga...]]

Hi everyone  I wish for everyone  today and beyond  better times, windows and great progress in healing 

 

 

                   

 

 

 

 

 

 

Love Nova xxx  :smitten:

 

Thank you Nova for that reminder ..... Crazy making isn't it!

I was soooo tired today I could hardly keep my eyes open , but I couldn t sleep either . Dragged myself around.

Thinking of you and hoping for things to get a bit easier , you need a break .

you are strong and will get through the this.

Love, MiYu  :smitten:

 

Thinking of both of you, Miyu and Nova. You are both strong. You both deserve a break. May your windows be right around the corner.

[[He...]]

Hi again Hope,

 

I too became dependent by accident when taking Valium by prescription. I had no idea I could become dependent on it in such a short time and on a low dose. I was misinformed by a relative that ncouraged me to take it because it was prescribed for me and I needed it. I'll never put another drug in my mouth again until I research it thoroughly.

 

My fatigue comes and goes. It was completely gone for a long time. Since my last cut started with new wdsx, I have gotten fatigue again.. But it's getting better.

 

You said you found a benzo wise Dr. That's great! Having a doc that understands what is happening when you go withdrawal, and one who supports you and your taper, well, that's half the battle right there!

You can taper anyway that works for you.  The way I am doing it works for me. But I do wish I could go faster. But I guess faster is just not for me.

 

Heath

[[be...]]

MiYu, we have your back, you are a Fighter.

[[be...]]

Has anyone heard from Valley?, hope he is doing Alright.

[[...]]

Wow, I just read about 5 pages of posts ..... I was planning on responding to all , but now I don't think I can ! Sorry , but just know that I read all your posts and am thinking of you.

I'll say a couple of things that my brain allows me to remember -

 

Congrats Begood! You are doing so great, you too Valley! 

 

Hi Heath and Gard, thinking of you..... :smitten:

 

Tooth pain , yes, I've had it . And I've had to go to the dentist probably a dozen times in the last six months , ugh  the tooth nerve pain wasn't to do with fillings though.

 

Remote illegal drug drops ...... I may be needing some of those Cant....... You've all got me worried now as I don't have a stash , maybe a weeks worth . I was going to tell my doc that I've made it down to 8 mgs , but now I dont think I will. I'm afraid he's going to push me to taper faster , and I really am not ready at all. Still having pretty intense symptoms .

So Hope , I've been holding for a while now , Except for a 1/4 mg reduction over 7 months. Which probably wasn't the best thing to do , but I listened to the benzo lie that told me I should . I thought it was such a small amount , I still think that ! But I am not stable and still have too many symptoms to taper . They are changing though , well some are anyway. I have a bit more energy , the burning continues , I'm not sleeping well,  and thats new . The cortisol surges have stopped , as have the hot sweats.  The lead legs come and go.

So , it's non linear as dear Nova says , is it ever ! And we all need the support to be reminded that this benzo thing is all over the place ! Even today I was entertaining  cutting thoughts ! And the one about me being the one who will never stabilize is pretty insistent ......

 

Ok , that's as much as my benzo brain can remember .....

 

Love to all , MiYu 

 

Ps , I'm having illegal thoughts , like , please save your stashes once you are off so that any of us left hanging can beg you to do stuff you shouldn't , via usps, or drop ship from AU 

[[...]]

MiYu, we have your back, you are a Fighter.

 

You are such a sweetheart Begood, now you made me cry  :smitten:

[[...]]

I ran out of meds once and never again and so I have a good hoard as well. What if the world as we know it ends and I don't rob a pharmacy in time 😂. I'm not going CT in an apocalypse. Jeeze only someone with extreme anxiety would think this. I didn't tell my Dr. I was tapering until I had at least an extra 6 week supply. Than out of being proud of myself I told her and she threw me down to my current dose. Should have lied longer.

Me neither!!!    Time to make friend with the local junkies I avoided all these year's !! They get scripted up for them then sell em' to use the money to buy whatever drug of choice their on,  that being said I would be up shittz creek come the apocalypse.  My ears are way to sensitive to get out and the rare occasions I do its around 4-5am before the traffic builds up as my hearing is seriously sensitive

 

I've got a stash at home but I also got a jar full of bits where the pills crumbled when I tried to cut them or the half's weren't even enough, and I got paranoid about the dose. That is until I realised that although I take 3 doses I take the same 2 halves of the same pill so it works out I'm still getting the same dose in a 24 hour window.  But I still get paranoid I would run out if I got cut off for any reason  Oh the joys of freaking withdrwal and a  chemically warped anxious  brain Talking of Brains don't worry about brain damage check out this that I posted earlier 

 

Man was able to live with but a sliver of cortical neurons for years

http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=180471.msg2386217#msg2386217

 

Love Nova xxx  :smitten:

 

Wow Nova, on the link!  :thumbsup:What can one deduce about benzo WD from this I wonder? 

[[ly...]]

 

 

MiYu,

 

I hope you get a good nights sleep.

[[Va...]]

Has anyone heard from Valley?, hope he is doing Alright.

Hi BG! I'm doing great. Had a rough week of dizziness but it seems to have passed. Geez, I step away for a bit and there's 5 pages of posts lol.

 

I hope everyone can reach a point where they actually have really good days. It's those days that will let you know you're going to make it off. I am filled with optimism on those days and remember what it was like to think clearly and how I used to be. Holding definitely pulled me out of a deep dark hole. Hang in there buddies! --V

[[ga...]]

Wow, I just read about 5 pages of posts ..... I was planning on responding to all , but now I don't think I can ! Sorry , but just know that I read all your posts and am thinking of you.

I'll say a couple of things that my brain allows me to remember -

 

Congrats Begood! You are doing so great, you too Valley! 

 

Hi Heath and Gard, thinking of you..... :smitten:

 

Tooth pain , yes, I've had it . And I've had to go to the dentist probably a dozen times in the last six months , ugh  the tooth nerve pain wasn't to do with fillings though.

 

Remote illegal drug drops ...... I may be needing some of those Cant....... You've all got me worried now as I don't have a stash , maybe a weeks worth . I was going to tell my doc that I've made it down to 8 mgs , but now I dont think I will. I'm afraid he's going to push me to taper faster , and I really am not ready at all. Still having pretty intense symptoms .

So Hope , I've been holding for a while now , Except for a 1/4 mg reduction over 7 months. Which probably wasn't the best thing to do , but I listened to the benzo lie that told me I should . I thought it was such a small amount , I still think that ! But I am not stable and still have too many symptoms to taper . They are changing though , well some are anyway. I have a bit more energy , the burning continues , I'm not sleeping well,  and thats new . The cortisol surges have stopped , as have the hot sweats.  The lead legs come and go.

So , it's non linear as dear Nova says , is it ever ! And we all need the support to be reminded that this benzo thing is all over the place ! Even today I was entertaining  cutting thoughts ! And the one about me being the one who will never stabilize is pretty insistent ......

 

Ok , that's as much as my benzo brain can remember .....

 

Love to all , MiYu 

 

Ps , I'm having illegal thoughts , like , please save your stashes once you are off so that any of us left hanging can beg you to do stuff you shouldn't , via usps, or drop ship from AU 

 

Correct!

[[ga...]]

Has anyone heard from Valley?, hope he is doing Alright.

Hi BG! I'm doing great. Had a rough week of dizziness but it seems to have passed. Geez, I step away for a bit and there's 5 pages of posts lol.

 

I hope everyone can reach a point where they actually have really good days. It's those days that will let you know you're going to make it off. I am filled with optimism on those days and remember what it was like to think clearly and how I used to be. Holding definitely pulled me out of a deep dark hole. Hang in there buddies! --V

 

Good to see you, V! Give Cookie a hug from the thread!

[[Va...]]

Has anyone heard from Valley?, hope he is doing Alright.

Hi BG! I'm doing great. Had a rough week of dizziness but it seems to have passed. Geez, I step away for a bit and there's 5 pages of posts lol.

 

I hope everyone can reach a point where they actually have really good days. It's those days that will let you know you're going to make it off. I am filled with optimism on those days and remember what it was like to think clearly and how I used to be. Holding definitely pulled me out of a deep dark hole. Hang in there buddies! --V

 

Good to see you, V! Give Cookie a hug from the thread!

Cookie says hi!

 

[[He...]]

Stay strong Miyu, your Windows WILL come. You are in my thoughts and prayers.

Heath

[[Ch...]]

I am really bewildered, and more than a little upset, by a noticeable increase in fatigue that I am experiencing after a very long hold (nearly 15 months).

 

It really is getting quite disabling and I am trying to work out what is happening.

 

Could it be a wave, even after all this time, and after months of stability?

 

If not, what could be happening?

 

nd what can I do to get out of it? I really want to get on with cutting further soon, but am concerned about making all the symptoms worse. Or could cutting be the way out of this?

[[no...]]

I am really bewildered, and more than a little upset, by a noticeable increase in fatigue that I am experiencing after a very long hold (nearly 15 months).

 

It really is getting quite disabling and I am trying to work out what is happening.

 

Could it be a wave, even after all this time, and after months of stability?

 

If not, what could be happening?

 

nd what can I do to get out of it? I really want to get on with cutting further soon, but am concerned about making all the symptoms worse. Or could cutting be the way out of this?

  Hi Chalkey if  you were stable for months it may have been a good idea to have had a trial cut earlier on after months of being stable.  But now feel that  the hold is now making things worse if it were me and I was positive that it was the hold had possibly played out I would try a small cut and see how it went it could be you CNS has healed enough to try now, no one can know for sure.

 

But I will say one thing and that is when I did a long hold before and was stable  as I was going to get for months , I still had the occasional blip symptom that was no problem at all then cut and was fine going down by holding for a few moths in-between each cut. It was going from cutting at my own pace to Ashtons pace that messed me up,  and here something I read on another forum that positively  encourages long hold until you stabilise on Benzos

 

The only time we may encourage someone to make a cut and continue with a taper when they are symptomatic is if they've been holding for so long, they've reached a period of extreme fatigue and their nervous system is crashing. In this case, especially if they are already near the end of their taper, it may be worth continuing on.

 

 

 

Love Nova xxx  :smitten:

[[be...]]

Has anyone heard from Valley?, hope he is doing Alright.

Hi BG! I'm doing great. Had a rough week of dizziness but it seems to have passed. Geez, I step away for a bit and there's 5 pages of posts lol.

 

I hope everyone can reach a point where they actually have really good days. It's those days that will let you know you're going to make it off. I am filled with optimism on those days and remember what it was like to think clearly and how I used to be. Holding definitely pulled me out of a deep dark hole. Hang in there buddies! --V

Valley sorry you had the dizzies, not pleasant at all, I never know when I get a bout if it is the taper or my Meniere's, I just do not know, but thankfully I do not have the dizzies often. Are you going faster than normal, I know how some tweak their taper? Yes you had a lot of posts to go through yesterday. Hoping that you stay stable and have a good week.

 

[glow=red,2,300]"COOKIE'S" NEW 2017 POSTER "CHOOK"[/glow]

[[no...]]

Hi all  I keep getting the cut, cut, cut!! voice every time I feel even more terrible than the normal feeling terrible all the time ( No I'm not going to do it I'm holding) beside my upstairs neighbour crashing about from early hours until not long ago, they also been cutting down trees with chainsaws right behind my home a few feet away

 

Anyway all these things add up and then I get despondent about how long will it take before I feel any benefit from holding my last 6, plus a couple of 3 months hold wasn't great help ( I now believe it was because I never held LONG ENOUGH each time) then began to remember that in the past I had held for quite some time past 6 months possibly a year or longer.

 

But even so my  chemically brain is  still convinced on bad days its not going to be much help but then I read post where other people need to hold maybe 9, 1o, 12 months or a bit longer beofre they have any changes at all like this, and it helps a bit 

 

That's not the kind of slow taper I am describing.

I suspect that with everything you have put yourself through, med and chemistry wise, what you need is a very long hold, probably eight months to a year, just changing nothing.

 

 

I also remember thinking about it now that when my long holds back in the past did work from feeling terrible most of the time to occasionally a little better for a short while then to hell again. That it went from subtle or totally unnoticed changes  where I was convinced I was fkd for life ( yes I feel like that again today BIG TIME  ) to suddenly everything gathered momentum and got better and the same as I didn't notice things were getting better even if they did go back wards for a while. I never noticed for a while I was  really well, better than I had been for years  either!! fks sake!!  

 

That hit me when I found myself all happy one morning looking at the bus timetable to go into town I hadn't been able to go on buses or any further than the front of my home on my best days for year's previously and was also very agoraphobic for ages as well as bed ridden in agony. But ALL that went, a lot of my paranoia is from reading too much on here and other forums looking for some kind of 'EUREKA!! moment amongst all the information over load. 

 

But I'm not going to find the answers outside of me, that's looking in the wrong place its not external we are all unique our circumstances may be similar but our path and our journeys are as different as there as stars in the heavens and there's squillions of stars out there all

 

But as things comeback to me in the rare  quiet moment's I can think rationally I can see its not to be found externally I have to trust the process my body knows what its doing even if I feel like it I’m not going to make it and then I remember my poor body is going though it with me and tell it thank you for carrying me through all this for so long. 

 

Another bad habit I picked up form reading too much on here was  trying to be too precise when cutting my pills and having a break down if the halves weren't exactly the same size and the quarters and too weigh everything or '' your going to end up having  problems and withdrawal'.

 

The problem I did get was its cost me a few hundred pounds unnecessary  buying all sorts of scales, containers, glass jars,  as every-time I read something else about the equipment I got in a state of high anxiety and bought yet more this happened a few times after reading different threads each time the subject crouped up. 

 

For years I got myself off many different pills Benzos included by breaking bits, until I found out about pill cutters, then cutting and not worrying about how precise 1/2 or a 1/4 was as long as I had my doses that day sorted I was fine, and never gave it any thought  at all except to take it end of.  That and long holds and each time and just dealing with any symptoms the best I could until they went away or weren't even worth thinking about.

 

So know I am trying to reprogram my brain back to that way of doing things, and just looking at symptoms for what they are symptoms that will get better in time not how much time before they do, and after over 2 year's of feeding it with the opposite on here that's going to take some doing.

 

I also never ever once though any symptoms I had were never going to go away either I just knew it was a case of staying put until they did go  never mind about how long that never entered my mind and I felt well enough to cut then cut and see how it went from there. . The only time I ever thought 'this is it'' was when I kept getting misdiagnosed and that my symptoms were yet another ''illness'' or the'' illnesses'' getting worse . When I knew it was withdrawal it was a game changer for me, I just wish I hadn't been pointed to the Ashton as  ''biblical truth'' 

 

Love Nova xxx  :smitten:

[[Va...]]

Has anyone heard from Valley?, hope he is doing Alright.

Hi BG! I'm doing great. Had a rough week of dizziness but it seems to have passed. Geez, I step away for a bit and there's 5 pages of posts lol.

 

I hope everyone can reach a point where they actually have really good days. It's those days that will let you know you're going to make it off. I am filled with optimism on those days and remember what it was like to think clearly and how I used to be. Holding definitely pulled me out of a deep dark hole. Hang in there buddies! --V

Valley sorry you had the dizzies, not pleasant at all, I never know when I get a bout if it is the taper or my Meniere's, I just do not know, but thankfully I do not have the dizzies often. Are you going faster than normal, I know how some tweak their taper? Yes you had a lot of posts to go through yesterday. Hoping that you stay stable and have a good week.

 

[glow=red,2,300]"COOKIE'S" NEW 2017 POSTER "CHOOK"[/glow]

Thanks BG. I did try to see what would happen if I went a little faster and it hit me about a week later. i was feeling really good at first so it kept me cutting past my hold days. I won't get caught in that again.  --V

[[Ch...]]

I am really bewildered, and more than a little upset, by a noticeable increase in fatigue that I am experiencing after a very long hold (nearly 15 months).

 

It really is getting quite disabling and I am trying to work out what is happening.

 

Could it be a wave, even after all this time, and after months of stability?

 

If not, what could be happening?

 

nd what can I do to get out of it? I really want to get on with cutting further soon, but am concerned about making all the symptoms worse. Or could cutting be the way out of this?

  Hi Chalkey if  you were stable for months it may have been a good idea to have had a trial cut earlier on after months of being stable.  But now feel that  the hold is now making things worse if it were me and I was positive that it was the hold had possibly played out I would try a small cut and see how it went it could be you CNS has healed enough to try now, no one can know for sure.

 

But I will say one thing and that is when I did a long hold before and was stable  as I was going to get for months , I still had the occasional blip symptom that was no problem at all then cut and was fine going down by holding for a few moths in-between each cut. It was going from cutting at my own pace to Ashtons pace that messed me up,  and here something I read on another forum that positively  encourages long hold until you stabilise on Benzos

 

The only time we may encourage someone to make a cut and continue with a taper when they are symptomatic is if they've been holding for so long, they've reached a period of extreme fatigue and their nervous system is crashing. In this case, especially if they are already near the end of their taper, it may be worth continuing on.

 

Love Nova xxx  :smitten:

 

Hi Nova this is really interesting - thankyou . Ii didn't realise holds can play out. And the quote you pasted from another board makes it seem very mich like I need to cut.

 

I was planning to start cutting in January but life stressors derailed that.

 

I am intrigued to know how a long hold can play out and lead to extreme fatigue. If anyone can explain that I would be very gratteful.

 

If there is a positive to take from this, it has made me psychologically ready at long last to cut, where  I had been hesitating in case it made me worse for the summer and when work is getting to its busiest.

 

It feels counterintuitive but everything you say poihts to a cut being necessary.

 

i have ordered some gram scales and am getting the kit together to start cutting after I get back from a short break next weekend.