The Long Hold Support Group

[[Ca...]]

So Im guessing this stabalizing first would apply to insane fatigue post dosing, even though V is sedating??  This is starting to do my head in... -the fatigue bit...

Actually a few things are starting to slowly change...

Heave forbid i could get windows n waves...??

 

MiYu, Wishing you strength... you will find your way follow your bodys lead...

Hang in there...

 

Thank you Nova for all your support and encouragment, you do us proud...

 

Hi to Everyone... My best wishes..

Hi CF  I have the fatigue coming and going, also Anhedonia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anhedonia) low or no incentive , last week and the week before I had to really fight to keep my eyes open. Today is the first day I haven't had to lay down by 1pm, and today I am like the ocean waves going UP....calming down fir a short time then ...UP!!  Its night and day with this crap, but the little OK bits in between show its working , I noticed some very subtle changes for the better but its forgotten when the hell kicks up again and I think nothings changed or is ever going too Hope you settle down and get a break soon Mate 

 

 

Love Nova xxx  :smitten:

Anhedonia is so intense, it has sucked the very me out of me... It was obviously horrific from the opiates and I was aware of the how and why... -But when benzo WD hit too... -well that was it... -all over and beyond my coping skills... so just accepting and hoping i actually do heal from it... -hard to picture...

I can distract my mind out of it and try to keep my soh, but even thats hanging on a thread..

But as soon as something becomes physical, thats it.. My mind puts a stop to it.. perhaps even tries to shut the body down... I think i need to explore this more... Thanks for bringing it up, and the link too...

So I wonder, what do u know about nocturnal?? Or allergic to daylight??

 

Nova Thanks for all your great help over time...

Oo

Be well...

 

[[Ma...]]

Thank you all for the welcome. It's good for the spirit!!

[[Bl...]]

So Im guessing this stabalizing first would apply to insane fatigue post dosing, even though V is sedating??  This is starting to do my head in... -the fatigue bit...

Actually a few things are starting to slowly change...

Heave forbid i could get windows n waves...??

 

MiYu, Wishing you strength... you will find your way follow your bodys lead...

Hang in there...

 

Thank you Nova for all your support and encouragment, you do us proud...

 

Hi to Everyone... My best wishes..

Hi CF  I have the fatigue coming and going, also Anhedonia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anhedonia) low or no incentive , last week and the week before I had to really fight to keep my eyes open. Today is the first day I haven't had to lay down by 1pm, and today I am like the ocean waves going UP....calming down fir a short time then ...UP!!  Its night and day with this crap, but the little OK bits in between show its working , I noticed some very subtle changes for the better but its forgotten when the hell kicks up again and I think nothings changed or is ever going too Hope you settle down and get a break soon Mate 

 

 

Love Nova xxx  :smitten:

Anhedonia is so intense, it has sucked the very me out of me... It was obviously horrific from the opiates and I was aware of the how and why... -But when benzo WD hit too... -well that was it... -all over and beyond my coping skills... so just accepting and hoping i actually do heal from it... -hard to picture...

I can distract my mind out of it and try to keep my soh, but even thats hanging on a thread..

But as soon as something becomes physical, thats it.. My mind puts a stop to it.. perhaps even tries to shut the body down... I think i need to explore this more... Thanks for bringing it up, and the link too...

So I wonder, what do u know about nocturnal?? Or allergic to daylight??

 

Nova Thanks for all your great help over time...

Oo

Be well...

I relate to you on the anhedonia.  When those waves come i feel like doing absolutely nothing.

[[Bl...]]

Something interesting i wanted to share with you guys. I dont know how many of you have heard of Jennifer Leigh. She has a psyd in psychology and is very active in speaking out against long term benzo use and has a benzo support website. She is also a survivor of the benzo nightmare herself. I think she is one of the most knowledgeable people in the US regarding benzo withdrawal. I think she's kinda a big deal in the community.  Anyhow, I sought her out and spoke with her yesterday about my condition. It was the craziest experience. For the first time, I actually talked to a professional who understood 100% what i was going through. My friends, family, and doctors all just think im crazy and she totally validated everything that i though was going on with me. People have been telling me that im just crazy for so long i think i was starting to believe it. Very refreshing talking to someone who has specialized experience with this.

[[Va...]]

Something interesting i wanted to share with you guys. I dont know how many of you have heard of Jennifer Leigh. She has a psyd in psychology and is very active in speaking out against long term benzo use and has a benzo support website. She is also a survivor of the benzo nightmare herself. I think she is one of the most knowledgeable people in the US regarding benzo withdrawal. I think she's kinda a big deal in the community.  Anyhow, I sought her out and spoke with her yesterday about my condition. It was the craziest experience. For the first time, I actually talked to a professional who understood 100% what i was going through. My friends, family, and doctors all just think im crazy and she totally validated everything that i though was going on with me. People have been telling me that im just crazy for so long i think i was starting to believe it. Very refreshing talking to someone who has specialized experience with this.

That's awesome BJ. Jennifer Leigh is very knowledgeable and understands the withdrawal process well. Glad you were able to speak to her! 

[[...]]

Begood.... Do you have any idea of what has been different for you in this last taper from the other two? Anything you can think of?

Hi M I'm still rough and have had a lot of  environmental and emotional stress put on me over the last few weeks and especially this week  But I've been thinking that beofre I joined BB I used to hold indefinitely and not go to deep about why I was having symptoms as it obviously that my body hasn't got enough of the drug and needs to be able to catch up.

 

As Birdman another Buddy has said time and time again, if you were to gather up all the doses you cut down from in one go then it would equate a lot of missed doses your body is missing. Another way she put it is if you get hold of a supplement or some candy that's the same size as your pills and held them in your hands, you would physically be able to see probably 2 to 8 hundred or more missed doses that you've cut out.

 

I actually just calculated mine and in the 2 years I've been suffering its  2,469 pills now I can see that's a LOT of doses thousands?  And that's the amount your body is trying to get stabilised from, also that the longer you've been deficient in the amount where you weren't in withdrawal the longer it will take to stabilise, whether you updose or reinstate.

 

I was also long term at a high dose so that's another factor, but I have stabilised in the past after being in a mess by holding, and unfortunately I'm a now in a bigger mess than I've ever been in from cutting at Ashton's rates. But the one thing I do recall is I did have the burning in the past for along time it felt like forever and I was convinced that was it for life, and my anxiety went high like now and I was very depressed like now.

 

So some of the bad symptoms I have now I also had in the past from cutting too quick, not being aware it was Benzo withdrawal, others came along 2 years ago when I did the Ashton's cuts but even back then I knew to try cut any further while feeling like that was NOT the way to go so I did the only thing knew to do and that was hold.

 

The other problem about reading to much on here is when we see other peole making good progress while we're suffering we think that we're the ones with the problem and we're doing something wrong by holding and not recovering as quickly as others. Its the way the benzo withdrwal is is effecting our brains, my thinking exactly the same my frazzled brain keeps telling me to do something but a lot of the time doing nothing is the best thing to do and this is one of those times.

 

I also am keeping myself aware the each time it gets worse I decide I need to cut, and end up no better off or worse for doing it, that's another 'BB' ritual I've unfortunately got on long play in my brain I would never have even thought about it before I read around the forum its too much information overload as well it clouds our judgement.

 

So I have decided to stop doing the ''I must do something to stop this'' and do nothing until it does stop and yes its really, really hard but its got to be done, before I joined BB as I said there is no way I would have even thought about cutting I did up dosing, and even then had to hold for sometime before it helped. But mostly I held  where I was and was able to taper with  no symptoms or miniscule occasional ones that were absolutely no problem at all. 

 

Love Nova xxx  :smitten:

e

 

Oh Nova you are an angel... Thank you.... I have to hold ..... Do nothing ..... I like the idea of looking at how many pills you haven't taken , I think I'll look at that today.

You give me hope dear  Nova , so grateful for you and all the other good people here. I'm sorry you a re suffering too 

Birdman is amazing , I've been reading some of her posts , wow , she's been through so much , like you. I don't quite understand what she did to stabilize ...... Did she take much larger doses for a week under medical supervision to calm down the "glutamate storm? " and then taper from there? I tried to find her story in hr posts but couldn't find it. Do you happen to know what page it might be on?

Thank you again for your experience and wisdom , you always make so much sense to me , and I think staying where I am is what there is to" do".

I get so disheartened after waiting so long to taper more , but in the end I am quite sure you are right that waiting and doing nothing is the best strategy .

May we have Windows very soon.....

Love, MiYu  :smitten:

[[...]]

I'm feeling so much worse the last couple of days .... 

I don't know what to do , my nervous system just seems so destabilized . I'm pretty sure things have got worse since I started liquidizing the 2 mgs mid April , but who knows if that's the cause .

I could go back to all dry pills, but not sure if that would cause further issues ....

 

Do I hold longer ? Updose ? I don't know , I know no one can tell me really what to do , but I'm pretty fed up ..... 

 

MiYu

 

 

 

MiYu,

I couldn't even begin to advise you on this, I just do not have enough experience. But you say thus all started when you went to liquidizing your pills.

Let me just say this...

 

Are you absolutely 100% sure you are measuring and liquidizing your pills accurately? And consistently?And are you shaking up the solution each time befote you use it.? It seems to me that your body should be used to the liquid by now?  Is there anyone who can check on your method of liquidizing your pills? Please excuse me if I am all wrong about this. I am just trying to find a way of helping you out here.

I am stymiedad just like you are.

 

I feel for you! I hope things improve quickly.

 

Also, just like Lynn, when I went to liquid, I used Roxane liquid. So easy! Just mix with water. I never used pills to make a liquid. It just seemed like the possibility of the pills not dissolving properly might  be a hindersnce.Could it be that the pills are not dissolving properly and the drug is not dispersed equally throughout your solution?

 

Just wondering about that.

 

Heath  

 

Thank you dear Heath but I don't think it's that ... All I'm doing is dissolving 2 mgs of my daily dose in a little vodka and diluting that with water before I take it..... I take the whole thing and rinse out the glass and drink that too, so I'm not loosing a drop..... So , my only thought was whether it's the liquid that Has somehow effected how I absorb the Valium and process it or something . Or I'm reacting to the little bit of alcohol ....

I haven't changed my dose at all though. I'm going to take Novas wise advice and just keep holding and trust that eventually things will settle down.perhaps at some point I will have to updose , I don't know, but I'm going to give it three months more at least and see what happens . Patience patience !

 

I hope you are doing well  Heath , love, MiYu  :smitten:

[[...]]

I'm feeling so much worse the last couple of days .... 

I don't know what to do , my nervous system just seems so destabilized . I'm pretty sure things have got worse since I started liquidizing the 2 mgs mid April , but who knows if that's the cause .

I could go back to all dry pills, but not sure if that would cause further issues ....

 

Do I hold longer ? Updose ? I don't know , I know no one can tell me really what to do , but I'm pretty fed up ..... 

 

MiYu

 

So sorry you are not doing well MiYu, I wish I could advise you, I will tell you something that I have learned since I have been holding, towards the end of my hold of one month, I tend to have more blips, nothing bad, but annoying. Well what I have found out is that when I start my taper again I seem to not have any blips, if I do they are so minor I can not call them a blip. So for me I know now that I can not hold for 2 months anymore as I started not feeling as good towards the last week or so, is this doable for you I do not know, but just wanted to throw this out. But if things should get bad, I would hold for 6 months if needed to be functional [meaning me] as I know nothing says that I will not have a hard time at anytime. This all being said, I have done these long holds and they work as I had a base line of stable now, never with the first two tapers. Stay Strong.

Thanks Begood, maybe it's time to try a cut and see..... I can always hold of things get bad from it....it has been my experience that I do get worse when I cut , but also I don't seem to be improving by holding either . So maybe I have to go through some ups and downs before I stabilize ....

So weird how your first two tapers were hard and this one is so much better for you ..... What a mystery how these meds effect us.

In some ways I have stabilized , in that each day is pretty predictable as far as being yucky! When I was really going through bad WDs , I had a lot more symptoms , now I just feel ill all the time. The burning never stops , and I have worsening brain fog....

Wish I could make a choice , I think I have to try something as I don't think I'm getting anywhere at the moment . I really don't want to get worse though.....

:smitten:

MiYu when I posted this I was referring to my experiences, and not trying to sway you over to cut before you are ready or stable, I must keep it real and not hide how I am doing, and why I am doing the things I do. I still think that fear, not accepting even when it is hard to give in or up, rushing and the other words I have trouted here remain true. So honestly you are going to have to decide what is best for you, I maybe should have worded my responds differently but it was getting late for me. Also you said it was weird that my first two were so bad and now this 3rd time is not, well that is real easy if you remember, or maybe you forgot, I was going too fast, cutting too much and basically doing all the things that long time sufferers do here fast and big cuts. I finally realized that I was either going to stay on Valium forever, or bite the bullet and try one more time, but with my own way, so I proceeded like a turtle and you are right this has been like night and day for me and for the better, holding and cutting really low has worked for me, and I do a ten day taper once a month at 5% and then hold for 1month and for me it is working fine. Just like many say here we all have to find the way that works for us, and again was referring to how it has been for me in my other post. I still believe it is going to be OK for you, but it may take longer for you to get stable. I will say after my 2nd failed taper, I held for a long time and just do not remember how long before I decided to proceed but I was feeling stable at the time I started 3rd taper. Stay Strong.

 

Thank you so much Begood for clarifying ! I don't think I was stable at all when I started my taper . I got symptoms really fast. I had just finished a very difficult cross from klonopin ,it was hellish, even  with updosing from the standard equivalent of K to V. If only I knew what I know now  how many of us say that !

You all give me hope that I will recover and find my way , I just have to be patient and wait for my body to catch up, however long that takes .....

Love, MiYu  :smitten:

[[...]]

 

 

MiYu,

 

I'll echo Nova to some extent.  I started my taper almost a year before I found BB.  I made extremely large cuts at the beginning and was very bad off.  I held - first for 3 months as it took that long after my first cut to get in any shape to cut again.  After the second cut I held for 8 months.  I felt no pressure to cut and believed that I needed a long period of time to recover from those cuts.  This was just common sense and something I didn't even discuss with my pdoc  (I had figured out for myself that the xanax was causing my problems and I needed to get off it).  With the holds things started to get better and better.  I truly don't remember exactly how that went or when and what dropped off - only that by the end of the year I was well enough to go back at it.

 

It was coming here and reading/being told of tolerance wd that  panicked me into racing the next few months - with bad results.  I found the Long Hold Support Group after I had decided to hold once again.  I knew already that long holds worked for me and after thinking about my prior experience I realized that the talk of tolerance certainly did not apply to me.  Holds to allow adjustment and recovery were a necessary part of my taper.  I would get off when I got off and allow my body to dictate things.

 

This doesn't mean that I don't sometimes get caught up in looking at others getting off much quicker and I do have the occasional doubt about whether I am doing the right thing here.  I sometimes have to have a talk with myself about this - but not often these days.  I've found my path.

 

Thank you Lynn, I'm glad you've found your path

Just one question , you agree with Nova to some extent .... I'm not sure for your post if there was something you didn't agree with? At any rate , I have to find my path and seeing what everyone here has gone through and what they have had to do gives me so much hope .

Love, MiYu 

[[...]]

And one more thing it wasn't the hold that destabilised me it was the cut being too big or too soon every-time, when I cut after a long hold and holding long enough to enjoy not worry about tapering for a bit and the relief of no symptoms then I cut again until the cuts got too big and to frequent and that's what got me into trouble. The hold was what healed the problem not caused it, and I was doing great holding for a few months between each cut then cutting again, and I wish I could remember clearly how long I held the last time I hit a bad wall.

 

I know  it ran into months, it may have been 9 months or longer I just don't know. But I do know I was able to cut 1/2mg every 2 to 3 months  C+H dry cuts  with no problems, and if I had stuck to the way I had done it all along I would have been off by now or at least on the final piece. I wasn't aware that the holding long enough between cuts  was the reason I wasn't struggling with symptoms before.

 

Love Nova xxx  :smitten:

Hi all, I just rang the Bristol tranquilliser project, and spoke to a chap there  and explained about all my circumstances updose included, and he said what I already said and that was to keep holding at the dose your now on if your unstable don't attempt to cut until you stabilise different people take different time scales to stabilise. Just because one person is fine  within a certain time scale does not mean everyone should be within that range, and its usually months not weeks before  lots of people stabilise, its normal not abnormal for some to take longer than others.

 

 

Not that I asked him, but he also said that holding my updose  will not have caused any harm, and neither will holding it for as long as it takes to get stabilised. And you will know  when your ready to cut rather than doing it in panic mode trying to stop the symptoms as it will obviously make it worse, and it will take sometime if you been unstable for a long time. He also said they handle a LOT of peole who were cutting at Ashton's rates and it was way too fast, and they recommanded no more than 1/2 MG  or even less cut  at the very minimum 4 weeks, and two to three months is even better. 

 

 

Anyway top and bottom is this pick a dose don't keep going up an down, an don't even think about cutting while unstable then hold at that dose for however long it takes to stabilises and then hold for a while not just a few days or a week beofre you cut again and hold and wait for each blip to pass . Man!! talk about unpredictable, and non linear, early on I went hurting and anxious early this morning to feeling calm, an at peace with myself and the world calm and in control, now I've flipped back the opposite to very anxious, certain things revving up, and feeling a bit paranoid again. But that's how it goes  with this stabilising stuff, roil on sweet stability!!

 

 

 

Love Nova xxx  :smitten:

 

Thank you Nova!  :smitten:

[[...]]

And just a hi to everyone , and hugs to those who are struggling still with lots of symptoms

Love MiYu  :hug:

[[ga...]]

Magnolias, Hi and welcome.

 

V, That's about my rate, too.

 

Everybody, This thread is really flying. Can't keep up with everything! But we are all one day closer to freedom. 

 

Gard

[[ly...]]

 

 

MiYu,

 

I'll echo Nova to some extent.  I started my taper almost a year before I found BB.  I made extremely large cuts at the beginning and was very bad off.  I held - first for 3 months as it took that long after my first cut to get in any shape to cut again.  After the second cut I held for 8 months.  I felt no pressure to cut and believed that I needed a long period of time to recover from those cuts.  This was just common sense and something I didn't even discuss with my pdoc  (I had figured out for myself that the xanax was causing my problems and I needed to get off it).  With the holds things started to get better and better.  I truly don't remember exactly how that went or when and what dropped off - only that by the end of the year I was well enough to go back at it.

 

It was coming here and reading/being told of tolerance wd that  panicked me into racing the next few months - with bad results.  I found the Long Hold Support Group after I had decided to hold once again.  I knew already that long holds worked for me and after thinking about my prior experience I realized that the talk of tolerance certainly did not apply to me.  Holds to allow adjustment and recovery were a necessary part of my taper.  I would get off when I got off and allow my body to dictate things.

 

This doesn't mean that I don't sometimes get caught up in looking at others getting off much quicker and I do have the occasional doubt about whether I am doing the right thing here.  I sometimes have to have a talk with myself about this - but not often these days.  I've found my path.

 

Thank you Lynn, I'm glad you've found your path

Just one question , you agree with Nova to some extent .... I'm not sure for your post if there was something you didn't agree with? At any rate , I have to find my path and seeing what everyone here has gone through and what they have had to do gives me so much hope .

Love, MiYu 

 

No, there is nothing I disagree with - it's just that my actual experiences have been different in some respects.  I can absolutely echo the portions that are the same.

[[be...]]

I have not been on site, since early am, but I will tell all, the oldies and the newbies, it is so comforting to have so many here sharing and helping each other, it does a Heart good to read the support and care each one of you give each other, we have no fighting or pushing a way here, we just all try to help one another. All Stay Strong and know that we are all here for each other. Just do the best you can each day, and for those who may question if they are healing as they go down, yes you are, as Valley and others here at BB has said, if we did not heal while going down there would be no need to taper....of course it does not diminish the hard times. I am so proud of each one of you that have chosen your path that will help you. As a Friend would say Onward an Upward!!!

[[Al...]]

Hello everyone,

 

I found this a little while back and I find it helps me in the hard times.

 

" 7/11 breathing. A skill to use for anxiety. It’s recommended to do it for 10-15 minutes. Like any other skill it does require a lot of practice. I advice that you practice it when you are feeling calm so you are ready in a time of need. If you lose count, which is easily done, simply start again until you do 15 minutes. It will also help with distraction even if you don’t get it right the first hundred times.

 

Breathing out longer than you breathe in actually activates your parasympathetic nervous system!

 

Anxiety is your sympathetic nervous system (“fight or flight”) setting off all the alarms, while breathing like this will set the parasympathetic system (“rest and digest”) into action shutting off the alarms and settling your nerves.

 

Other things that help: laughing, checking out what’s going on around you (moving head and eyes to orient to your surroundings), getting curious about something.

 

Take care, be safe."

 

Hugs to all

 

ATU 🙏

[Guest [wi...]]

That's great information lynn and willdoit! I'm sure if a moderator were contacted, it could be pinned.

 

Love the new avatar BG! --V

Yes it needs to be pinned. I am sure willdoit will ask. Thanks that is Fifi...

 

I sent Megan a PM letting her know we were interested in getting Jennifer's tapering gems pinned.  I'll let you know what she says.  👍🏽

 

Honestly,  I don't know why the "rush" mindset is so prevalent on BB.  I see the results over and over and over; often resulting in bad suffering, lost jobs and relationships, failed tapers, reinstatement...well, just terrible stuff.  I shake my head when some come in to "help" with advice to push thru, rapid taper, suggest a hold is dangerous or that no healing occurs until the "poison" is completely out.  Yes, we have to untangle ourselves and at a pace that our brain can adjust to.

 

Thank you again Wdi!

Reading "stickies" might help new (and some longer) members a bit...

Thanks for letting us know what the name of pins are. "Stickies"

lol... -I think it was explained in a sticky... (perhaps not)?

 

Hi friends,

 

I haven't heard back from Megan regarding creating a sticky post for Dr. Jenn's important tapering message. 

Like begood, I'm struck by the amount of wisdom is on this thread and I feel very strongly that the message here about tapering needs to be heard by newbies.  Not sure how to do that.  I can get quite distressed think about the many people who've been harmed trying to keep up with the Ashton rate.  I know sound like an old worm out record constantly harping about this issue, but I feel we can save lives by educating people who visit this board. 

 

Thank you to everyone here.  This is one of the most important threads, imo, on this forum.

[[Ca...]]

That's great information lynn and willdoit! I'm sure if a moderator were contacted, it could be pinned.

 

Love the new avatar BG! --V

Yes it needs to be pinned. I am sure willdoit will ask. Thanks that is Fifi...

 

I sent Megan a PM letting her know we were interested in getting Jennifer's tapering gems pinned.  I'll let you know what she says.  👍🏽

 

Honestly,  I don't know why the "rush" mindset is so prevalent on BB.  I see the results over and over and over; often resulting in bad suffering, lost jobs and relationships, failed tapers, reinstatement...well, just terrible stuff.  I shake my head when some come in to "help" with advice to push thru, rapid taper, suggest a hold is dangerous or that no healing occurs until the "poison" is completely out.  Yes, we have to untangle ourselves and at a pace that our brain can adjust to.

 

Thank you again Wdi!

Reading "stickies" might help new (and some longer) members a bit...

Thanks for letting us know what the name of pins are. "Stickies"

lol... -I think it was explained in a sticky... (perhaps not)?

 

Hi friends,

 

I haven't heard back from Megan regarding creating a sticky post for Dr. Jenn's important tapering message. 

Like begood, I'm struck by the amount of wisdom is on this thread and I feel very strongly that the message here about tapering needs to be heard by newbies.  Not sure how to do that.  I can get quite distressed think about the many people who've been harmed trying to keep up with the Ashton rate.  I know sound like an old worm out record constantly harping about this issue, but I feel we can save lives by educating people who visit this board. 

 

Thank you to everyone here.  This is one of the most important threads, imo, on this forum.

agree, There are so many times I want to reply to a post with" just go read the last few pages on long hold support..." -on occasion I do... but often i dont... -not sure why, perhaps people need to be ready to find it for themselves, so it "clicks" -not sure...?

 

 

[[Va...]]

That's great information lynn and willdoit! I'm sure if a moderator were contacted, it could be pinned.

 

Love the new avatar BG! --V

Yes it needs to be pinned. I am sure willdoit will ask. Thanks that is Fifi...

 

I sent Megan a PM letting her know we were interested in getting Jennifer's tapering gems pinned.  I'll let you know what she says.  👍🏽

 

Honestly,  I don't know why the "rush" mindset is so prevalent on BB.  I see the results over and over and over; often resulting in bad suffering, lost jobs and relationships, failed tapers, reinstatement...well, just terrible stuff.  I shake my head when some come in to "help" with advice to push thru, rapid taper, suggest a hold is dangerous or that no healing occurs until the "poison" is completely out.  Yes, we have to untangle ourselves and at a pace that our brain can adjust to.

 

Thank you again Wdi!

Reading "stickies" might help new (and some longer) members a bit...

Thanks for letting us know what the name of pins are. "Stickies"

lol... -I think it was explained in a sticky... (perhaps not)?

 

Hi friends,

 

I haven't heard back from Megan regarding creating a sticky post for Dr. Jenn's important tapering message. 

Like begood, I'm struck by the amount of wisdom is on this thread and I feel very strongly that the message here about tapering needs to be heard by newbies.  Not sure how to do that.  I can get quite distressed think about the many people who've been harmed trying to keep up with the Ashton rate.  I know sound like an old worm out record constantly harping about this issue, but I feel we can save lives by educating people who visit this board. 

 

Thank you to everyone here.  This is one of the most important threads, imo, on this forum.

agree, There are so many times I want to reply to a post with" just go read the last few pages on long hold support..." -on occasion I do... but often i dont... -not sure why, perhaps people need to be ready to find it for themselves, so it "clicks" -not sure...?

So true. 

[[be...]]

That's great information lynn and willdoit! I'm sure if a moderator were contacted, it could be pinned.

 

Love the new avatar BG! --V

Yes it needs to be pinned. I am sure willdoit will ask. Thanks that is Fifi...

 

I sent Megan a PM letting her know we were interested in getting Jennifer's tapering gems pinned.  I'll let you know what she says.  👍🏽

 

Honestly,  I don't know why the "rush" mindset is so prevalent on BB.  I see the results over and over and over; often resulting in bad suffering, lost jobs and relationships, failed tapers, reinstatement...well, just terrible stuff.  I shake my head when some come in to "help" with advice to push thru, rapid taper, suggest a hold is dangerous or that no healing occurs until the "poison" is completely out.  Yes, we have to untangle ourselves and at a pace that our brain can adjust to.

 

Thank you again Wdi!

Reading "stickies" might help new (and some longer) members a bit...

Thanks for letting us know what the name of pins are. "Stickies"

lol... -I think it was explained in a sticky... (perhaps not)?

 

Hi friends,

 

I haven't heard back from Megan regarding creating a sticky post for Dr. Jenn's important tapering message. 

Like begood, I'm struck by the amount of wisdom is on this thread and I feel very strongly that the message here about tapering needs to be heard by newbies.  Not sure how to do that.  I can get quite distressed think about the many people who've been harmed trying to keep up with the Ashton rate.  I know sound like an old worm out record constantly harping about this issue, but I feel we can save lives by educating people who visit this board. 

 

Thank you to everyone here.  This is one of the most important threads, imo, on this forum.

agree, There are so many times I want to reply to a post with" just go read the last few pages on long hold support..." -on occasion I do... but often i dont... -not sure why, perhaps people need to be ready to find it for themselves, so it "clicks" -not sure...?

So true. 

Widi,Thank you for being brave to support your heart felt theory, it is not always well excepted by others, but we have a voice and not to help is a Sin I think, I think that it takes time sometimes to hear back from Mods. You have plenty of believers here.

[[ly...]]

That's great information lynn and willdoit! I'm sure if a moderator were contacted, it could be pinned.

 

Love the new avatar BG! --V

Yes it needs to be pinned. I am sure willdoit will ask. Thanks that is Fifi...

 

I sent Megan a PM letting her know we were interested in getting Jennifer's tapering gems pinned.  I'll let you know what she says.  👍🏽

 

Honestly,  I don't know why the "rush" mindset is so prevalent on BB.  I see the results over and over and over; often resulting in bad suffering, lost jobs and relationships, failed tapers, reinstatement...well, just terrible stuff.  I shake my head when some come in to "help" with advice to push thru, rapid taper, suggest a hold is dangerous or that no healing occurs until the "poison" is completely out.  Yes, we have to untangle ourselves and at a pace that our brain can adjust to.

 

Thank you again Wdi!

Reading "stickies" might help new (and some longer) members a bit...

Thanks for letting us know what the name of pins are. "Stickies"

lol... -I think it was explained in a sticky... (perhaps not)?

 

Hi friends,

 

I haven't heard back from Megan regarding creating a sticky post for Dr. Jenn's important tapering message. 

Like begood, I'm struck by the amount of wisdom is on this thread and I feel very strongly that the message here about tapering needs to be heard by newbies.  Not sure how to do that.  I can get quite distressed think about the many people who've been harmed trying to keep up with the Ashton rate.  I know sound like an old worm out record constantly harping about this issue, but I feel we can save lives by educating people who visit this board. 

 

Thank you to everyone here.  This is one of the most important threads, imo, on this forum.

agree, There are so many times I want to reply to a post with" just go read the last few pages on long hold support..." -on occasion I do... but often i dont... -not sure why, perhaps people need to be ready to find it for themselves, so it "clicks" -not sure...?

So true. 

 

I think my hesitation is that there is often someone who comes in stating that a hold hurt them - I, frankly, question whether the hold was just not long enough.  I do believe that for a few a hold is not enough and an updose may be required.  And there may be some who are truly paradoxical.  But this journey is one of trying different things and finding what works for us, individually.  I would have never considered a hold a waste of time if it didn't "work" - just a necessary trying of something, as we often have to try a number of things to find the right thing.  That said, holds were the right thing for me.

[[no...]]

Look at Deep Canyon for one, she was in a terrible state, and seriouly ill with withdrawal symptoms but held for a year before she got any  change  at all, and here's her last post  below  Look how different it is from the poor women absolute in dispair who first posted on here

 

 

Love Nova xxx  :smitten:

 

 

good morning all

 

I got back from the doctor yesterday and after a long talk he said lets just go up 1/4 mgs for now and see if that helps..he said theres no reason to go back to 4mg of k if you dont need to..so that will put me at 3mgs..he said just take the .87gms of k and up it to .130 equal to the other 3 and that would make it 3 mgs..

 

hes such a nice and good doctor i have been seeing him for yrs..he told me to stop reading and listening to the negative posts on fb.he said alot of times the mind will then have you thinking you are having those symptoms from the benzo brain..he said read positive things..and go and look at yourself in the mirror every morning and tell yourself you will be well and you will be ok..he said you have to stop thinking about all the bad others are going through..cause it can make it happen to you..the mind is a very powerful thing..i know he is right..and hes just a md not a specialist or therapist..but a wise man..he has had to updose other patients before trying to get off of benzos and said if upping slowly they have never had any problems so he told me to stop worrying about it..its different than adding a different med that the body is not use too

 

he also said we will talk next month and see if there are any changes at all and if so then we would consider going a bit higher..but he said i should feel better from this amount in some way..

since i have been at this same dose..taking more should work faster..and he said you have to realize that the reason everyone is so different is because they have other issues..be it stressors, health conditions, mind set, so many things that it makes everyone different..

 

will be back later have to eat..i weighed 123.6 lbs yesterday...i am doing the happy dance..he also said he wanted me walking stores more cause what people experience when they go in a store and feel strange is actually anxiety from being in a closed in store and so many people in there..and i just have to push through that and not let the anxiety win..and if i am tired then sit down..he said take the wheelchair in and walk as long as i can but dont over do and then sit down and let terrie push me..

 

he said that when you lose weight and get weak..as many of us do here...you have to gain the weight back and be stable at the weight then your body can work on getting stronger cause its trying to maintain the weight gain..thats why its so hard to rebuild the strength i once had..something he said doesnt happen over night but will in time..how much time no one knows..but the more you work at it the faster it happens..

 

well off to eat..and will check on everyone in a bit

 

hugs to everyone here..and hope some of this helped or made sense..if any of you have questions you cant get answers from your doctor from let me know and i will write them down and ask him next month

 

deep

[[Ma...]]

Hi,

This is my first taper after taking temazapam for 25 years. I am tapering valium and now realize I have to taper for 10 to 15 days (dlmt) and hold. Symptoms of ibs and insomnia just cropped up after 19 days of tapering. Luckily, I find I bounce back quick. Yesterday, day 3 of hold the ibs was much better and last night the sleep improved. I'm not back 100% with the sleep. My question is, do I hold until I back to pre symptom status? I think Valley said some buddies do 10 on and 10 off. This being my first taper , do you think it is safe to resume when symptoms go away? Whatever length that is? 5,7, 10 days ect.

[[ly...]]

Hi,

This is my first taper after taking temazapam for 25 years. I am tapering valium and now realize I have to taper for 10 to 15 days (dlmt) and hold. Symptoms of ibs and insomnia just cropped up after 19 days of tapering. Luckily, I find I bounce back quick. Yesterday, day 3 of hold the ibs was much better and last night the sleep improved. I'm not back 100% with the sleep. My question is, do I hold until I back to pre symptom status? I think Valley said some buddies do 10 on and 10 off. This being my first taper , do you think it is safe to resume when symptoms go away? Whatever length that is? 5,7, 10 days ect.

 

Congratulations on your excellent progress and tapering at a pace that is quite manageable for you!  Yes, having symptoms go away is a clear green light.  Many here never have wd sxs completely go away - I don't.  My only caveat would be that it may be prudent to wait 2 weeks as symptoms sometimes take this long to manifest.  A renowned taper support organization recommends 3 weeks.  2 or 3 weeks is more of a "taper schedule" than a hold, imo.  All the best!

[[...]]

Here is a place where all those doing LONG HOLDS can hang out.

 

Post what you want, where you are at and how you feel, post anything !!!

 

 

I would like to long hold or at least would love to take it real slow with tapering as I am having a very hard time tapering of the way it is prescribed by my doctor. I just cannot endure it any more. Before I am tapered of paxil but I could taper it myself because I was able to get it in Liquid form. but now I am left on Oxazepam and it seems you cannot get that in liquid and even not in smaller tablets than 5 mg. That makes tapering ver y difficult. does any one know if it is somewhere possible to get oxazepam in liquid? please let me know .         

[[Va...]]

Here is a place where all those doing LONG HOLDS can hang out.

 

Post what you want, where you are at and how you feel, post anything !!!

 

 

I would like to long hold or at least would love to take it real slow with tapering as I am having a very hard time tapering of the way it is prescribed by my doctor. I just cannot endure it any more. Before I am tapered of paxil but I could taper it myself because I was able to get it in Liquid form. but now I am left on Oxazepam and it seems you cannot get that in liquid and even not in smaller tablets than 5 mg. That makes tapering ver y difficult. does any one know if it is somewhere possible to get oxazepam in liquid? please let me know .       

You can make your own liquid solution if it's not available in liquid form.  --V