The Long Hold Support Group

[[Tr...]]

Morning Stut,

 

Hope you're OK.  Glad to see you're back on here, supporting and encouraging us all.

 

My weekend had two faces: an awful Saturday ( after a really bad night with hardly any sleep).  Followed by a decent Sunday with less pain, especially in the afternoon. Even took a short walk.  But nothing to enjoy,  because of the muscle and joint pain.

Made an appointment this morning: having dry needling next Friday. Hope that will work.

 

Slept 6 hours last night, but again a lot of burning muscle pain this morning. Slowly getting less intens now. Hope it keeps getting better this afternoon.

 

Wishing you a symptom free day.

[[va...]]

Hi Stutt,

 

When you say you're ok I assume you're having a lot of symptoms. I hope you start feeling improvement soon. Hang in there. Everything will be OK in the end for you.

 

Stutt I want to ask you for some tapering advice. I'm a bit more than six months from my updose now. I'm of course better than last summer, which I don't think my posts back then even come close to describing. I was trying to sound better than I was so as not to scare myself. There was screaming in my brain 24/7, te terror was indiscribable. Absolutely no sleep most nights, or 1 hour nights due to the terror. It was very dangerous to be in that state because I was constantly thinking the unthinkable.

 

OK I'm gladly out of that, BUT I'm in constant fear. The level of fear is of course much less, but it's constant. I have not had one single moment of being relaxed, the normal relaxation one feels when you're let's say brushing your teeth... Not even one. The fear is there always.

 

I'm wondering if you think this is a reasonable position from which to start tapering again. I think I won't do it yet regardless of what you say, because I'm really scared of getting worse, having any kind of family emergency (not unlikely being a single mom and having two elderly parents), and not being able to deal with it. Or I look at people who've had agoraphobia and cognitive disability and are disabled for ten years due to tapering. I really can't risk that.

 

But as I know you never got stable before tapering, I'm wondering if you think it's not too risky to cut.

 

If you don't feel like answering I understand. It's OK.

 

I want to make clear that symptoms are not tolerance withdrawal. I've been in tolerance for years. My system is completely destabilized and sensitized due to the crash last summer. It was brutal. I heard cicadas in my head all day. I can't even begin to describe it. So this is a consequence of that crash. It is not tolerance withdrawal and I now that.

[[NJ...]]

Hi Stutt,

 

When you say you're ok I assume you're having a lot of symptoms. I hope you start feeling improvement soon. Hang in there. Everything will be OK in the end for you.

 

Stutt I want to ask you for some tapering advice. I'm a bit more than six months from my updose now. I'm of course better than last summer, which I don't think my posts back then even come close to describing. I was trying to sound better than I was so as not to scare myself. There was screaming in my brain 24/7, te terror was indiscribable. Absolutely no sleep most nights, or 1 hour nights due to the terror. It was very dangerous to be in that state because I was constantly thinking the unthinkable.

 

OK I'm gladly out of that, BUT I'm in constant fear. The level of fear is of course much less, but it's constant. I have not had one single moment of being relaxed, the normal relaxation one feels when you're let's say brushing your teeth... Not even one. The fear is there always.

 

I'm wondering if you think this is a reasonable position from which to start tapering again. I think I won't do it yet regardless of what you say, because I'm really scared of getting worse, having any kind of family emergency (not unlikely being a single mom and having two elderly parents), and not being able to deal with it. Or I look at people who've had agoraphobia and cognitive disability and are disabled for ten years due to tapering. I really can't risk that.

 

But as I know you never got stable before tapering, I'm wondering if you think it's not too risky to cut.

 

If you don't feel like answering I understand. It's OK.

 

I want to make clear that symptoms are not tolerance withdrawal. I've been in tolerance for years. My system is completely destabilized and sensitized due to the crash last summer. It was brutal. I heard cicadas in my head all day. I can't even begin to describe it. So this is a consequence of that crash. It is not tolerance withdrawal and I now that.

 

Val, I know this question is directed at Stut and not me, but I want to share my story.

 

I cut from 1 mg to .5 mg of K with tolerable symptoms. I then tried various times to get below .5, with holds, without, small cuts, updoses, etc. But I wasn't successful, and I think it is because I was trying to cut through symptoms. I was still incredibly nauseous, trouble sleeping, etc. but just kept going, which is why I was never stable.

 

If I were you I would wait longer, try to wait until the fear subsides. I can't see how cutting would make that better ... and it can get a lot worse.

[[St...]]

Morning Stut,

 

Hope you're OK.  Glad to see you're back on here, supporting and encouraging us all.

 

My weekend had two faces: an awful Saturday ( after a really bad night with hardly any sleep).  Followed by a decent Sunday with less pain, especially in the afternoon. Even took a short walk.  But nothing to enjoy,  because of the muscle and joint pain.

Made an appointment this morning: having dry needling next Friday. Hope that will work.

 

Slept 6 hours last night, but again a lot of burning muscle pain this morning. Slowly getting less intens now. Hope it keeps getting better this afternoon.

 

Wishing you a symptom free day.

Awe  Troch don't lose hope sadly it is the nature of the beast.l think we all struggle with that.l truly believe the dry needling will help a little.Give it a chance.Stay strong my friend.X

[[St...]]

Hi Stutt,

 

When you say you're ok I assume you're having a lot of symptoms. I hope you start feeling improvement soon. Hang in there. Everything will be OK in the end for you.

 

Stutt I want to ask you for some tapering advice. I'm a bit more than six months from my updose now. I'm of course better than last summer, which I don't think my posts back then even come close to describing. I was trying to sound better than I was so as not to scare myself. There was screaming in my brain 24/7, te terror was indiscribable. Absolutely no sleep most nights, or 1 hour nights due to the terror. It was very dangerous to be in that state because I was constantly thinking the unthinkable.

 

OK I'm gladly out of that, BUT I'm in constant fear. The level of fear is of course much less, but it's constant. I have not had one single moment of being relaxed, the normal relaxation one feels when you're let's say brushing your teeth... Not even one. The fear is there always.

 

I'm wondering if you think this is a reasonable position from which to start tapering again. I think I won't do it yet regardless of what you say, because I'm really scared of getting worse, having any kind of family emergency (not unlikely being a single mom and having two elderly parents), and not being able to deal with it. Or I look at people who've had agoraphobia and cognitive disability and are disabled for ten years due to tapering. I really can't risk that.

 

But as I know you never got stable before tapering, I'm wondering if you think it's not too risky to cut.

 

If you don't feel like answering I understand. It's OK.

 

I want to make clear that symptoms are not tolerance withdrawal. I've been in tolerance for years. My system is completely destabilized and sensitized due to the crash last summer. It was brutal. I heard cicadas in my head all day. I can't even begin to describe it. So this is a consequence of that crash. It is not tolerance withdrawal and I now that.

Morning Janice l will give you the short answer to that one bloody hell nooooo . Listen honey you are in the same position as me you need to be functional for your daughter and yourself.This is not easy no matter what you do however it is doable if you are patient and go very very cautiously.l think this is now about getting you as good as possible and for that to happen we are talking about giving this as long as is necessary.l know you have a lot of fear however it will lessen as time passes.When you do begin to taper way in the future we will look at it then.X

[[St...]]

Just a wee add on Janice have you ever googled tolerance withdrawal? Other than this website l have never ever heard of it.l will say this tolerance most definitely is a problem however again it affects all of us very differently so try not to worry about it for now.X

[[va...]]

Just a wee add on Janice have you ever googled tolerance withdrawal? Other than this website l have never ever heard of it.l will say this tolerance most definitely is a problem however again it affects all of us very differently so try not to worry about it for now.X

 

Thank you Stutt for your great advice and your sincere care. I will stay put for now then. I hope you stabilize very very soon. This path is so hard and the idea of never getting well enough to taper is haunting me. However it would be so dangerous to go back to hell again and no guarantee that I'd manage to gain some stability again like I have now. So yes, staying put for as long as it takes. Love to you and your daughter Stutt. You deserve to have a great life.

[[Tr...]]

Hi Valiumnomore and Stut,

 

Thank you so much for these posts. I started to dry micro taper again last week, but had to stop. Feeling extremely horrible this afternoon. Felt like having a heartattack. Got so scared. Was tapering only 0,001 mgs of the total weight of the pills per day.  But even that wasn't doable. Like you,  Valiumnomore,  I feel like I will have to stay on this amount of Diazepam forever. Wanted so desperately to get below 3 mgs,  but it's utterly impossible. This poison is killing me. There's a free e- book by one of prof. Ashton ' s earliest patients,  called

" Prisoner on prescription."    That's what we are.  :'( 

[[Fi...]]

Hi Valiumnomore and Stut,

 

Thank you so much for these posts. I started to dry micro taper again last week, but had to stop. Feeling extremely horrible this afternoon. Felt like having a heartattack. Got so scared. Was tapering only 0,001 mgs of the total weight of the pills per day.  But even that wasn't doable. Like you,  Valiumnomore,  I feel like I will have to stay on this amount of Diazepam forever. Wanted so desperately to get below 3 mgs,  but it's utterly impossible. This poison is killing me. There's a free e- book by one of prof. Ashton ' s earliest patients,  called

" Prisoner on prescription."    That's what we are.  :'(

 

Hi Troch, 

 

I just want to respond regarding what you wrote about regarding your taper.  I am dry cutting too and cutting 0.001 daily is, in my opinion, an amount that is too much for some of us to handle.  I know people who have cut 0.001 every other day and it's too much for them. Some people can do it but they really feel it. 

 

I am only cutting that amount every 5-7 days and I hold when I start to feel symtoms.  I've been able to move down slowly doing it that way.  I'm not saying you have to do what I'm doing nor am I suggesting you taper at this time.  Its just that the 0.001 jumped out at me.

 

Even people who use the DMLT and use a smaller daily percentage, which is often 0.0001, find that  cutting daily can be too much. 

 

I guess I wanted to mention this because that 0.001 can add up quickly and a micro taper does not have to be daily. 

 

Final Healing

 

 

 

 

[[Gu...]]

I was cutting every two weeks and that was hard.  I think daily cutting adds up quickly.

[[Fi...]]

I was cutting every two weeks and that was hard.  I think daily cutting adds up quickly.

 

It really does. 

[[De...]]

Hi v,

I dont have cast iron. I do have dome heavy stainless steel ones.

Maybe ill wear s bullet broof vest.  Lol. Anotjer incident up the street. Cops everywere.  Jim told me.. That one down the street was something out of a movie. Ptetty sure the guy was on probabation and possession of a weapin that was not legal. Well everyone was ok nobody got hurt. He did fite a couple of shots at the police. 🤤 Hes in court today facing alot of charges. Smywsy keep holding amd workimg on coping skills. Ypu need to stay funvtuonal. Ly dd

 

 

[[De...]]

Hi stut,

I hope your sx ease up soon.  I know you arent feeling do well.  This is so hard with all the twists and turns. All the obstacles and setnacks. We will get there. I guesd i have to give the thyriod med a chance. I just dont know why i have these mental sx. Maybe i am crazy. Rhe dame tape keeps going on and on in my head and i have to figure things out and u cant. I guess i need to surrender. I cant figure it out. I hope i am not going to be like this forever. Ly Suzy

 

[[va...]]

Hi stut,

I hope your sx ease up soon.  I know you arent feeling do well.  This is so hard with all the twists and turns. All the obstacles and setnacks. We will get there. I guesd i have to give the thyriod med a chance. I just dont know why i have these mental sx. Maybe i am crazy. Rhe dame tape keeps going on and on in my head and i have to figure things out and u cant. I guess i need to surrender. I cant figure it out. I hope i am not going to be like this forever. Ly Suzy

 

DD you are not crazy it's all wd. I'm in fear all day. It's all bwd plus probably hormones not helping. You're suddenly better and then BAM, a wave. I'm sorry your neighbors are such troublemakers. You get an arsenal of stainless steel pots and pans and stay safe dd. We want to all stay alive for ourselves and for each other 💕💚💐. It was an exhausting day and I'm in a shitty wave from hell. I'm drop by the faith boards to find some solace for my exhausted soul and then of to the couch to watch some reality TV hoping that relaxes me a bit. Good night everyone.

[[Ma...]]

Hi stut,

I hope your sx ease up soon.  I know you arent feeling do well.  This is so hard with all the twists and turns. All the obstacles and setnacks. We will get there. I guesd i have to give the thyriod med a chance. I just dont know why i have these mental sx. Maybe i am crazy. Rhe dame tape keeps going on and on in my head and i have to figure things out and u cant. I guess i need to surrender. I cant figure it out. I hope i am not going to be like this forever. Ly Suzy

 

DD you are not crazy it's all wd. I'm in fear all day. It's all bwd plus probably hormones not helping. You're suddenly better and then BAM, a wave. I'm sorry your neighbors are such troublemakers. You get an arsenal of stainless steel pots and pans and stay safe dd. We want to all stay alive for ourselves and for each other 💕💚💐. It was an exhausting day and I'm in a shitty wave from hell. I'm drop by the faith boards to find some solace for my exhausted soul and then of to the couch to watch some reality TV hoping that relaxes me a bit. Good night everyone.

 

Night Vali, sorry about the wave.  Hope you feel better soon.  Mary 💜💜

[[va...]]

You too Mary. And keep your frying pan loaded. I hope your pain eases up so that you can have more of a life 🙏

[[De...]]

Ahaaaa! V you really are the funniest All my frying pans are loaded and im ready. Maybe some kitchen utensils too. 

Ahh jims home. Ihate when he comes in screaming. And pionts out all the bad. Screw it all. I hope you find some peace on the faithboard. G'night ly dd

[[va...]]

Dd I'll pray that he stops screaming at you or that you find a way to improve things for you. You deserve some peace. Nighty nite 😙🌍🏖️🏞️🌄🌌

[[De...]]

Thanks v ! 🤣❤

[[In...]]

Hi Valiumnomore and Stut,

 

Thank you so much for these posts. I started to dry micro taper again last week, but had to stop. Feeling extremely horrible this afternoon. Felt like having a heartattack. Got so scared. Was tapering only 0,001 mgs of the total weight of the pills per day.  But even that wasn't doable. Like you,  Valiumnomore,  I feel like I will have to stay on this amount of Diazepam forever. Wanted so desperately to get below 3 mgs,  but it's utterly impossible. This poison is killing me. There's a free e- book by one of prof. Ashton ' s earliest patients,  called

" Prisoner on prescription."    That's what we are.  :'(

 

Hi Troch, 

 

I just want to respond regarding what you wrote about regarding your taper.  I am dry cutting too and cutting 0.001 daily is, in my opinion, an amount that is too much for some of us to handle.  I know people who have cut 0.001 every other day and it's too much for them. Some people can do it but they really feel it. 

 

I am only cutting that amount every 5-7 days and I hold when I start to feel symtoms.  I've been able to move down slowly doing it that way.  I'm not saying you have to do what I'm doing nor am I suggesting you taper at this time.  Its just that the 0.001 jumped out at me.

 

Even people who use the DMLT and use a smaller daily percentage, which is often 0.0001, find that  cutting daily can be too much. 

 

I guess I wanted to mention this because that 0.001 can add up quickly and a micro taper does not have to be daily. 

 

Final Healing

 

So true FH. I was working my way up to those daily cuts of .001 mg, but discovered that I could not do daily cuts at all. Those symptoms  do pile up very quickly, and make one feel completely overwhelmed with warnings that one should not cut daily.

 

And then the “fun” begins.

[[Fi...]]

Hi Valiumnomore and Stut,

 

Thank you so much for these posts. I started to dry micro taper again last week, but had to stop. Feeling extremely horrible this afternoon. Felt like having a heartattack. Got so scared. Was tapering only 0,001 mgs of the total weight of the pills per day.  But even that wasn't doable. Like you,  Valiumnomore,  I feel like I will have to stay on this amount of Diazepam forever. Wanted so desperately to get below 3 mgs,  but it's utterly impossible. This poison is killing me. There's a free e- book by one of prof. Ashton ' s earliest patients,  called

" Prisoner on prescription."    That's what we are.  :'(

 

Hi Troch, 

 

I just want to respond regarding what you wrote about regarding your taper.  I am dry cutting too and cutting 0.001 daily is, in my opinion, an amount that is too much for some of us to handle.  I know people who have cut 0.001 every other day and it's too much for them. Some people can do it but they really feel it. 

 

I am only cutting that amount every 5-7 days and I hold when I start to feel symtoms.  I've been able to move down slowly doing it that way.  I'm not saying you have to do what I'm doing nor am I suggesting you taper at this time.  Its just that the 0.001 jumped out at me.

 

Even people who use the DMLT and use a smaller daily percentage, which is often 0.0001, find that  cutting daily can be too much. 

 

I guess I wanted to mention this because that 0.001 can add up quickly and a micro taper does not have to be daily. 

 

Final Healing

 

So true FH. I was working my way up to those daily cuts of .001 mg, but discovered that I could not do daily cuts at all. Those symptoms  do pile up very quickly, and make one feel completely overwhelmed with warnings that one should not cut daily.

 

And then the “fun” begins.

 

I know Intend. It's made to sound easy and that our brains won't feel the cuts so harshly. But a lot of us really do feel them. 

 

 

 

 

[[In...]]

FH,

 

I feel them so severely that I can’t even explain it.

[[Fi...]]

FH,

 

I feel them so severely that I can’t even explain it.

 

Intend, I know you do plus you have had all the generic switches as well.  So unfair. 

 

Sometimes my cuts don't hit hard but other times they do and then the despair and sadness over being on Klonopin overwhelms me. I'm feeling that today after some decent days. 

 

 

 

 

[[Tr...]]

Thanks Final healing and Intend,

 

I needed to hear that.  I feel so miserable. So much anxiety. Feel like exploding. O, this is so unbelievable.  Thinking about asking the psychiatrist for an AD. Want to be admitted to the psych. hospital. Can't do this alone anymore.

[[Cl...]]

I typically hold my Klonopin cuts for 6 weeks.