coronavirus fears

[[Ka...]]

Hi all, i'm sure everybody sees now the rates with which the coronavirus is spreading. How are you guys feeling about it? I'm honestly becoming really scared, even though I'm in the US, and it hasn't really started spreading here like it has been in Europe and Asia, but they put out an official warning yesterday saying to prepare for the virus spread as much as possible. So I went on amazon yesterday and bought respirator N95 masks for myself and for my family ( they are saying now regular masks are not working to protect you against coronavirus?). I really hope that it starts to die out soon as the spring gets here, but it really is scary how fast it's spreading and the potential of what can happen if people start getting sick all over, i'm afraid i'm going to be a #1 victim because I've had air hunger and all kinds of breathing issues lately along with bad benzo flu, I can barely breathe as it is. I just wanted to vent and see what else you guys are doing to protect yourself from coronavirus these days if anything?

[[de...]]

I thought about it and concluded that as result benzo withdrawal I am no longer afraid of death.  I feel like death every day it's become familiar. 

 

Take precautions with hand washing and so forth and get a mask if it makes you feel safe.  I'm not getting one.  But really we have no control over it.  Accept. 

 

My motto is don't panic or gasp to do so leaves you more open to breathing it in. 

 

I hope I don't appear flippant.  Seriously, I'm not overly concerned.

 

Try not to worry. 

[[Su...]]

I guess it depends on your age group. If you're less than 50 yo then your death risk as a result of coronavirus is 0.4% so no panic really... and it's probably already spreading in the US...

[[Fl...]]

I'm a lot more worries about the panic it might cause and the downstream effects of that than the virus itself.

[[Ka...]]

I have worries about the panic too but I guess I'm panicking about the virus too maybe it's just my symptom right now. I also just read about this 23 year old athlete from Iran yesterday who fought for her life for 10 days and finally died,  so yeah that made me worried, but you're right its just common sense handwashing and staying away from crowds. The fact that I'm housebound for the most part right now is probably a good thing)).

[[Ma...]]

Since I am close to the mysterious community case' I am kind of near the center of concern in California I am equally concerned about the nature of the response. No isolated center away from populations for just such a threat where we could be virtually certain not to expose populations?. The plane trip and the decision of the bring them to Travis AFB Wouldn't a more isolated center have been advisable?.The strange story on the airplane where the Coronavirus negative folks from the cruise ship were lied to that the positive folks would not be on the plane. The lack of high quality particle masks and no plans to make an emergency effort to produce them for the public?

 

Some of this is obviously worst case scenario but if we start to have massive amounts of cases hospitals will be completely overwhelmed. Some sort of pop up treatment facilities will be necessary not to mention a ventilator shortage I too am not that afraid to die, so this is not really coming from a paranoid place in terms of personal health

[[Te...]]

Somehow I'm not worried. Social media loves to get on the bandwagon and shout out all types of fears. Not one case in San Francisco, yet the mayor issued a state of emergency; it should have been a preparedness sort of talk. There were people canceling their meal reservations because of fears of an outbreak. Nancy Pelosi had to go to Chinatown in order to get people to go there. It's chaos. At the beginning of the virus, I saw lots of people with masks on. Yesterday I saw only one man wearing a mask.

 

Meanwhile, my ex-husband is planning for Armegeddon and stockpiling food for weeks. His area has not been hit at all. But he worries that governments aren't telling the true story, and he can't trust them.

 

Maybe I should worry, but honestly, I've thought about death so much during the benzo crap that worrying about this seems a bit absurd.

[[Ka...]]

Meanwhile, my ex-husband is planning for Armegeddon and stockpiling food for weeks. His area has not been hit at all.

that's funny I'm a little better today, yesterday was the day that I read the news and got into a panicky mode, today I talked to a friend of mine who doesn't think anything bad is going to happen, I sure hope so. At least people have had had enough time now hopefully to work out some kind of emergency plan seeing what's happening in Europe, but my whole family is in Russia, half a planet away, so it's really scary being scattered like this when pandemic can hit any minute. Anyways, thank you for your responses, let's try to stay optimistic!!)

[Guest [pe...]]

I hope I get it

[[Ma...]]

Just in case people are not aware here in California there has been no one has been tested other than those who were both symptomatic and 'to have had known contact with Corona positive individuals until this lone community acquired case. At a minimum there is massive uncertainty. Apparentkly the CDC is gearing up to start a lot more testing in this region so we should know soon. Of course even if we do find there are a large number of infections there is still a chance that virus has in some way run it's course either by mutating to a less virulent form or by the poop out effect that usually happens to viruses at the end of winter. There are some indication that it is slowing in China if that can be trusted, and I would doubt quarantine procedures alone could be responsible for that

[[Be...]]

I hope I get it

 

ditto here. 

[[to...]]

I hope I get it

 

ditto here.

 

Why?

[[Te...]]

Yes, I must admit that crossed my mind, too. At least doctors would be able to understand the reason and everyone around me would be sympathetic. There are absolutely no tests to pinpoint exactly what we're going through.

[[He...]]

Actually KathyM I’m interested in how you got off

Kpin and how you stayed off. Any lingering

wd symptoms? Congrats on that.

I have no opinion on the virus. It is

what it is. Personally I live isolated so

unlikely to get it. I heard masks don’t always

help but hand washing and hygiene does.

Keep hands off face etc but do what

feels right for you.

[[Aj...]]

I thought about it and concluded that as result benzo withdrawal I am no longer afraid of death.  I feel like death every day it's become familiar. 

 

Take precautions with hand washing and so forth and get a mask if it makes you feel safe.  I'm not getting one.  But really we have no control over it.  Accept. 

 

My motto is don't panic or gasp to do so leaves you more open to breathing it in. 

 

I hope I don't appear flippant.  Seriously, I'm not overly concerned.

 

Try not to worry.

 

I agree. Terrified of having to kill myself but not of dying of anything else...

 

[[Bl...]]

I hope I get it

 

ditto here.

 

Why?

 

bad joke here...sorry but I am offended by this.

 

[[Ma...]]

I hope I get it

 

ditto here.

 

Why?

 

bad joke here...sorry but I am offended by this.

 

Not seeing a joke

[[Bl...]]

I hope I get it

 

ditto here.

 

Why?

 

bad joke here...sorry but I am offended by this.

 

Not seeing a joke

I don't happen to know anyone that would like to get sick by a virus. We, benzobuddies, happen to be sick (physically) enough in my opinion, and we come here to support each other. So I assume this is a bad joke around the forum and I am offended by it.

 

Blossom

[[Ka...]]

Yea let's hope nobody gets sick with any viruses)

@healthyme, I live pretty isolated too, and hope that helps with the virus too, I do appreciate your advice. Actually when I think about this virus on the one hand I'm really afraid of catching it because I already have all the nasty respiratory sx, but on the other ( in a very perverted kind of way) I hate to be sick and stay at home all the time while other people are living their lives, so i'm thinking it won't feel quite as bad if everybody is on quarantine..))

as for how I got off of klonopin healthyme, I did a very quicktaper, just over a couple of weeks, and then did a lot of kindling the first 6 months after I jumped, because I was in such a bad shape mentally I wasn't making the best decisions for myself. Then I got to the point where I knew I wouldn't survive much longer if I continued with all the kindling, by october 2018 I was in worse shape than acute, so I stopped everything all together, and been trying to survive ever since.. Some of the sx are starting to veeeryyy slowly go away, but i still have bad depersonalition, cog fog, memory issues, and my akathisia has recently been replaced by crushing fatigue. Are you still tapering off of klonopin? if you need any advice you can pm me any time, i'll be glad to help ( not so much with the taper advice though, I didn't do it the right way).

[[Te...]]

I hope I get it

 

ditto here.

 

Why?

 

bad joke here...sorry but I am offended by this.

 

Not seeing a joke

I don't happen to know anyone that would like to get sick by a virus. We, benzobuddies, happen to be sick (physically) enough in my opinion, and we come here to support each other. So I assume this is a bad joke around the forum and I am offended by it.

 

Blossom

 

Well, the longer I'm in this (6 years now) the more I think of death. Although I'm healing, it's very, very slow. So naturally I think of death during the coronavirus. It's just what I've come to think over the years, not that I want to. But too many symptoms for too long have worn me down. And not being understood AT ALL and having to see doctors all the time also causes me to think of death because they're so negative.

[[pi...]]

I thought about it and concluded that as result benzo withdrawal I am no longer afraid of death.  I feel like death every day it's become familiar. 

 

Take precautions with hand washing and so forth and get a mask if it makes you feel safe.  I'm not getting one.  But really we have no control over it.  Accept. 

 

My motto is don't panic or gasp to do so leaves you more open to breathing it in. 

 

I hope I don't appear flippant.  Seriously, I'm not overly concerned.

 

Try not to worry.

 

lol its kind of morbid bud, but i chuckled sadly when i read this cause i can totally relate. accepting our mortality is the only way out of the thought loop of worrying about health and death.

 

glad im not the only one who gets their quite often these days because of our experience with benzos. 

[[Gu...]]

 

We've had other pandemics like the huge one in 1919 that killed 50-100 million people and another in 1957 and another in 1968.....All are long gone as this one will be eventually..

I, too, am worried because I live alone and don't want to die alone if it comes to that...

I think we'll be okay if we listen to the CDC and take reasonable precautions..

 

Alan

 

[[ho...]]

I understand that withdrawal is such a big part of our lives that it seems one more issue is a bridge too far.

I believe in preparing for the worst, and hoping for the best. I would like to say,"No one will be affected," but looking at the rapid turn of events in places like Italy and UK, not sure that's reasonable. We do not have all the data yet, as many countries conceal infections/deaths for political and economic reasons.

 

I want everyone to make their own decisions based on facts, not feelings or rumors.  I tried to answer the most common questions. Everything I've written is straight from scientific documents or quotes by CDC with one dissenting point, which is spelled out clearly. Hope it's helpful.

 

As of Mar 9, CDC still asserts 80% of cases will be mild, but did make this announcement on CNBC:

"CDC tells people over 60 or who have chronic illnesses like diabetes to stock up on goods and buckle down for a lengthy stay at home"

 

Dr. Nancy Messionnier: "The CDC is recommending people with underlying conditions or who are over 60 to stock up on medications, household items and groceries to stay at home 'for a period of time,' she said. The U.S. government recommended travelers with underlying health conditions avoid taking any cruises anywhere in the world. 'We also recommend people at higher risk avoid non-essential travel, such as long plane trips,' she said."  Messioner also remarked no one had immunity as this is a never-before-seen virus.

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/09/many-americans-will-be-exposed-to-coronavirus-through-2021-cdc-says.html

 

WHERE ARE ANY INSTRUCTIONS/PLANS?

2007 CDC document on Pandemic preparation; revised in 2017.  Go to page 33, Section V -  Use of Non-pharmaceutical Interventions by Pandemic Severity Category  https://stacks.cdc.gov/view/cdc/1142# *This link has an error. (Thanks for heads-up Libertas.) Just checked this one 12 Mar. and it works: https://stacks.cdc.gov/view/cdc/11425  You can also download it as a PDF.  Apologies all.

 

 

WHEN IS A PERSON CONTAGIOUS?

Anytime they have symptoms, they shed virus. It is assumed by doctors at this time, they are infectious.

Can be up to 27 days before symptoms begin. A few "super spreaders" have been proven to infect others even before they began to feel sick. 

Recovered patients have tested positive up to three weeks after. Unknown if they are infectious to others.

 

Mar 2020- *ONLY applies so far to the mildest cases. Scientists have found that although patients still can test positive in the mild cases, this shed virus is NOT infectious after 10 days from the onset of symptoms.

 

"... by scientists in Berlin and Munich, is one of the first outside China to look at clinical data from patients who have been diagnosed with Covid-19, the disease caused by the coronavirus, and one of the first to try to map when people infected with the virus can infect others. " https://www.statnews.com/2020/03/09/people-shed-high-levels-of-coronavirus-study-finds-but-most-are-likely-not-infectious-after-recovery-begins/

 

Young children and teens <18yo seem to be only mildly sick. Statistically more likely to be hospitalized if >60yo, with >80yo worst outcomes. *Can be reinfected. China still limiting personal movement due to this.

 

HOW DO I CATCH IT?

Contact with the virus: 

People-  Virus is given off through droplets via cough/sneeze (spit, mucous), and feces/urine. Infection goes to the lungs preferentially, but also the gut.

 

Things- (AKA fomites) Sticks to cloth, steel, plastic, etc. The length of time it lasts on the surface depends on factors like temperature (likes cold, destroyed by very hot >120F), the kind of surface, UV light exposure, and if the surface gets cleaned. It has been shown to be “alive” on smooth surfaces up to 9 days.

 

In the air- 

"The coronavirus that causes Covid-19 can linger in the air for at least 30 minutes and travel up to 4.5 metres (14.7 feet) – further than the 'safe distance' advised by health authorities around the world, according to a study by a team of Chinese government epidemiologists."

 

“It can be confirmed that in a closed environment with air-conditioning, the transmission distance of the new corona virus will exceed the commonly recognized safe distance.” The researchers wrote in a paper published in peer-review journal Practical Preventative Medicine  March 6, 2020.                         

 

This was based on a cluster outbreak among people on 4 hour bus ride in Hunan.

https://www.scmp.com/news/china/science/article/3074351/coronavirus-can-travel-twice-far-official-safe-distance-and-stay

 

HOW DO I KNOW I HAVE IT?

First question- have you traveled to high outbreak area (country or location) or come in contact with an infected person?  If yes to either, isolate for the sake of others even if you feel fine. Monitor temp.

Second question- Do you have symptoms after either of the above? Contact local health department for test info in your area.

 

Getting tested-  The PCR tests (swab nose/throat) have been running about 80-85% predictive- meaning positive test, you got it; negative test, you don’t. It is not a guarantee either way as multiple cases have had negative tests, but still tested positive later for the virus.

A chest CT is the single greatest diagnostic tool so far, but even it is not 100%. A 23yo Chinese girl had no symptoms, OK chest CT, but still had the virus and infected 6 other people.

 

WHAT ARE THE SYMPTOMS?

According to most case histories, 3 phases: 1. Begins feeling like a cold. Mild fever, dry cough. Lasts about 4-10 days (Many recover from here.)  2. If progresses, flu-like symptoms: fever 101-102F, intense cough, lethargy, body aches, some get gut problems. 1-2 more weeks  3. If continues, temp >102F, difficulty breathing even sitting up, unable to get out of bed. If this happens, call 911 immediately and tell them you may have the virus please so they can take appropriate precautions. 

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/about/symptoms.html

Example of progression:  https://thehill.com/changing-america/well-being/prevention-cures/481377-california-husband-and-wife-infected-with

 

HOW DO I TREAT IT?

Isolate from others. CDC recommends the ill should wear mask/something over nose and mouth, especially when they have to go out of isolation to not spread it.

Keep hydrated-  Take in fluids, water, and oral rehydration solution. Buy sachets or make your own https://rehydrate.org/solutions/homemade.htm  Eat high protein with good fats if you can.

Not recommended to take anything to reduce fever unless over 102F or if patient has some special health condition. Fevers occur to make it too hot for the virus.

 

There is no current medicine to treat against the virus, only supportive care. Thailand has used a combination of anti-virals for AIDS patients with some success. Chinese doctors tried an old malaria drug at 10 hospitals with great outcomes.

 

"Breakthrough: Chloroquine phosphate has shown apparent efficacy in treatment of COVID-19 associated pneumonia in clinical studies "  https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/bst/advpub/0/advpub_2020.01047/_pdf/-char/en

 

WHAT SHOULD I DO TO LIMIT CONTAMINATION?

Consider everything contaminated when going out and clean up accordingly.  Wash your hands with sanitizer if out frequently.  DON"T TOUCH YOUR FACE  when in public places.  At home, vigorously scrub with soap and water including the wrists for full 20 seconds.

 

It is recommended to use masks and goggles if around the ill. Gloves if handling contaminated stuff. Studies have shown cleaning any infected patient's room twice a day with disinfectant greatly drops the virus present on surfaces. "donning and doffing" How to put stuff on and take it off without contaminating yourself. https://www.cdc.gov/hai/pdfs/ppe/ppe-sequence.pdf

 

Wipe anything you've touched: doorknobs, keys, sink handles, credit cards, etc. with bleach solution or disinfectant wipes. Standard is 1/2 cup bleach to one gallon of water. https://modernsurvivalblog.com/health/disinfectant-bleach-water-ratio/  Don't forget things like the car's doors, fuel opening, and interior (steering wheel, gear shift, handles, car seats, etc ).

1. If you have been to a medical facility, good idea to wash those clothes when you get home. Directly to the washer w hot water. 

2. Clean bottoms of shoes and leave outside the door or on a mat.

3. Money and your credit cards are filthy.  UV light on both or wipe CC with bleach solution. *Although not tested against coronavirus, UV works on SARS. https://uvdisinfection.com/

5. Do not use your phone while out or be prepared to constantly clean it! Apple just amended their policy. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-8093457/Apple-amends-guidelines-iPhone-care-allow-use-disinfecting-wipes-isopropyl-alcohol.html 

6. Purses and diaper bags, etc. sit on floors/public surfaces so they are contaminated. Kid’s stroller wheels or wheelchairs the same.  Clean them off before bringing into your house. Ladies- Consider tiny cross body purse you never take off.

7. If an item is microwave safe, either dampen with water or put wet paper towel with it in microwave on high a couple of minutes. The microwave excites water molecules to cause heat.

 

Personal comment: *Due to known pre-corona virus infection control rules, and OSHA guidelines, I cannot agree with CDC's position that healthy people should not ever wear a mask in this pandemic. Yes, the virus particle by itself is sometimes so small it can pass through an n95 mask, but it is usually stuck on water droplets, dust, mucous which together increases the size.  Although any mask is NOT 100% protection (except biohazard gear), stopping the virus from directly hitting nose/mouth is a good idea versus nothing. Understand many things are sold out. There are washable cloth ones, but they're more expensive. I don't feel I can appropriately advise you about alternatives due to legalities, etc. Sorry, don't want to go there.*

 

Due to critically low supply, there have been state/CDC recommendations to severely restrict mask use  even in hospitals with the only exceptions being ICUs and known contaminated patients' rooms. In most circumstances, they have only the patient wear one (except in negative pressure rooms.) https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/seattle-health-care-providers-scramble-to-ration-medical-supplies-as-coronavirus-cases-climb/   

 

Don't want to debate anybody over this.  Other countries require people to wear them in public.

 

All of this is just information. What you choose to do with it, up to you.

 

 

 

 

[[Ka...]]

Thank you @hothot, that's great information!

[[sk...]]

Just think, if we didn't have the internet no one would ever know about coronavirus.