Adult children of narcissists (ACON)

[[va...]]

I wish everyone could at least find peace with their parents or siblings before they die.  I had problems with my dad since he was abusive, but made peace with him before he died.  I made peace with my abusive mother too but she's still alive.  I wonder how it feels to not have peace with a parent who was abusive before they die?

 

THIS is the kind of guilt tripping/victim blaming  post I meant is the reason why this kind of group does not work unless it's heavily moderated by people who are really versed in narcissistic parents and the devastating effects on their children.

[[Wi...]]

I wish everyone could at least find peace with their parents or siblings before they die.  I had problems with my dad since he was abusive, but made peace with him before he died.  I made peace with my abusive mother too but she's still alive.  I wonder how it feels to not have peace with a parent who was abusive before they die?

 

THIS is the kind of guilt tripping/victim blaming  post I meant is the reason why this kind of group does not work unless it's heavily moderated by people who are really versed in narcissistic parents and the devastating effects on their children.

 

With all due respect, I don't perceive Becks's post as 'guilt tripping/'victim blaming'. We find peace in our own way. For some that includes reconciliation and forgiveness; for others, it might mean letting go/'forgiving', yet walking away (my case); for others, choosing not to engage with the idea of 'forgiveness', and cutting off contact permanently, or maintaining minimal contact.... There's no one way, and no judgment.

 

One can heal from even the most devastating narcissistic abuse. Yes, it's hard work and unspeakably painful. But I, for one, am no 'victim' (because I choose no longer to be one), and I carry no guilt. That is my choice. I choose to heal and move forward -- to look to the future with hope (after having chosen to do the painful work of healing my past hurt). No one's comments can change that.

 

Becks asked a valid question -- what does it feel like? Surely a question we've all considered in this process. My choices might look different from Becks's, but we all want the same thing: inner peace and a happy, healthy life. Question is, how do you move towards that, instead of always being tied to the past? Surely that's what really matters.

[[ma...]]

I wish everyone could at least find peace with their parents or siblings before they die.  I had problems with my dad since he was abusive, but made peace with him before he died.  I made peace with my abusive mother too but she's still alive.  I wonder how it feels to not have peace with a parent who was abusive before they die?

 

Becks, both my parents are still alive but I've read a lot about this and can tell you that all is possible. People can handle it in many ways, as Wildflower said. You can find for example:

• people that feel relieved when their abusers die because they finally feel safe
  
• people that feel absolutely nothing because they had cut all ties and the abuser was long out of their lives; some know their abusers died only after many months or even years
  
• people that feel sad because they still hadn't let go of the idea that their parent could change - although, as we know, this would not likely ever happen
  
• people that can't stand the reality of never having had a loving parent and when their abuser dies completely reinvent him/her in their memory and grieve him/her as if he/she had been the parent they wished (I've seen this happen, they suppress the bad memories and retell their past) - I personally find this very sad
  
• people that feel guilt at never having been able to fix the relationship with their parents - these are people that never healed from the abuse and continued carrying the burden of guilt that narcissists project onto their victims; narcissists don't feel guilt but they love to control others by playing with their empathy and making them feel guilty even about stuff they can't control.
  

I'm trying to overcome the later kind of feelings. When I finally understood the abusive dynamics in my family of origin, I realized that I had been continuously suffering and feeling guilty for not having a close relationship with mother. And yet, I often tried. It was her that subtly pushed me out of her life. Despite this soon after she would start again complaining that we never visited her, that she had been abandoned by her daughter (me), etc. I carried a constant burden of guilt for not doing enough for her and also for not feeling like doing it. Fortunately, I have come to understand this game and now I expect she does her part. She doesn't do, of course, and continues to complain, but I no longer feel guilty. If she died now I would feel sorry for her but I wouldn't feel guilty for not having made "peace" with her.

 

I put peace between quotes because the only way to have peace with a narcissist is often to submit to his/her torture (which of course does not feel like peace to us as what they need is that we feel bad). Remember that we are not talking about imperfect parents who love their children deep down. Narcissists love no one, not even themselves, and need to crush others to feel better. It's sickness, not imperfection. When narcissists have children, they do the same to them, play with them, crush them. It is not in general possible to have peace with this type of person because they usually do not want to change. The other day I read an interesting explanation: narcissists do not want to change because what reality has to offer them is far inferior to their delusional self-image.

 

Of course, as your parents get older, they may lose their manipulative power. However, some say, age can also make them even worse. Or they may become so dependent that they really need to start treating you well. Anything is possible.

 

I also understand what Val says, there are groups, specific about narcissistic abuse, where moderators have a lot of experience and there are clear rules about what can't be said. One of those things is being judgmental about forgiveness. Forgiveness is something only each of us knows if we should give and if our abusers deserve it. FORGIVENESS IS NOT REQUIRED and to suggest otherwise is very negative for the healing process of abused people. But I believe that many make this kind of suggestion without understanding the implications. People that had normal (or even nearly normal) parents have a lot of difficulty understanding how we feel, as the worst of this kind of abusers hide their bad actions very well.

-------------------------------------

 

A different subject the conversation here left me thinking about is related to what Estee and Marygold said about the difficulty of separating from their mothers, or even thinking badly about them, even after all they've done. This reminded me of something I read about trauma bonding. As I understand it, trauma bonding can be a problem for some children of narcissistic parents, who are subject to contradictory, positive and negative messages. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traumatic_bonding. I don't think this happens to me because since I was a teenager I am clearly my mother's scapegoat and so my problem is not so much to separate myself from her as to realize that after all our bad relationship was not my fault. And, at least for now, my challenge is more to overcome a series of self-defeating habits and the constant guilt that dominates me even over even things that don't concern me. But this may not be so simple and anyway I would like to learn a little more about the subject.  I found this book https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07F3QQ4RB/ref=dbs_a_def_rwt_hsch_vapi_tkin_p1_i2. Has anyone read it?

[[Ma...]]

I have one question with which I can always make the situation clear to me, step out the childs food steps:

 

When it comes to love, and what is a good love or relationship - It is simple. Thats why I am so into animals.

If you love someone or something , you let it be free and your love is encouraging and nurishing.

If your love is a true and good love, you will see that the animal will return to you without any action requested from you, just to get in touch with you. No matter if it is a wild animal, or a pet. Let free what you love and if your love is a good, caring and nursishing love, the other party will come back to you, get in contact to you again and these will be the moments you treasure, because they are truly a gift.

 

Any time I wonder if my parents maybe are misunderstood by me I put this picture into my mind. And I see that I do not WANT to return to them, I do not feel free, I feel like I get trapped, I have a bad conscious and of course - I do not feel encouraged, or nourished in any way.

Same with other people, by the way.

 

I think when it comes to finding peace, I stick to this picture. How can one make peace with a person who does not know or understand what I am talking about? A conversation or argument will lead nowhere.

What I could do is to speak out loud, when it comes to my father and he was able to agree and also said sorry. Sorry did not last long and I had to learn also, that no matter what he said... it did not matter. What mattered was that I had spoken out loud and made a point.

With my mother - no chance. She would run into depersonalisation. I still do not know if that is a strategy or whatever... she "forgets" a lot also...

I know even if she will be dead, peace will not come to me. Because she is such an ambivalent person and I will be trapped again and again because I know she was traumatized as a child and then I am trapped in the thought "yes, and that was my fault??? Is anyone traumatized doomed to give that to the children"... and so on... VERY VERY difficult to escape this dilemma. Cause I do not want to blame the victim. See, now I am angry. That is what happens.

 

I think, with peace its the same as with love. we cannot MAKE it. It has to come freely, as a gift.

[[Ch...]]

I wish everyone could at least find peace with their parents or siblings before they die.  I had problems with my dad since he was abusive, but made peace with him before he died.  I made peace with my abusive mother too but she's still alive.  I wonder how it feels to not have peace with a parent who was abusive before they die?

 

THIS is the kind of guilt tripping/victim blaming  post I meant is the reason why this kind of group does not work unless it's heavily moderated by people who are really versed in narcissistic parents and the devastating effects on their children.

 

Becksblue’s comment doesn’t strike me as any of these things. If this is a topic that needs to be ‘heavily moderated by people really versed ...on their children’ then this subject should not continue to be discussed on this forum. No one on the team meets those qualifications.

 

Let’s remain civil to all who join the conversation or this thread will need to be closed.

[[Wi...]]

There are so many valuable insights to reply to in the latest posts. My energy is very low this morning, but I hope to write a bit more later.

 

We all are very easily triggered in withdrawal. Add other issues (past trauma, present stressors, health challenges), and it's very, very hard to stay steady. I've often written things which, upon re-reading, I wished I'd phrased differently, or whatever. (Geez, that's an understatement!   Val, for what it's worth, I find you do a much better job than me in staying more neutral.) Sometimes I go back to stuff of weeks ago, and I realise that the troubles I've experienced in the meantime have completely changed my perspective on the matter -- I no longer agree with myself, at all!

 

So. It's really tough. And nothing here is the last word. Val, I hope you join us again when you feel up to it. Your presence and contributions are valuable. And Becks, your take on things often brings up unexpected questions, a different angle. I very much enjoyed reading magnesi's thoughts on your question.

 

Estee, you have an authentic, heartfelt way about you that I find really soothing. (I love the 'three Rs' in your sig.) I appreciate what you wrote here: 'I also have another strategy if someone upsets me. I'm trying to understand what it is about them that caused the upsetting comment. I could even have a look at their posts. After a while, I may find the comment not distressing at all. I could feel less and less anger towards people in general. Hopefully. I know that my feelings for people are not about them. They are about me.' Wow. This is helping me.

 

I read something from Viktor Frankl this morning, and I immediately thought of it when I read your post, Estee:

 

Between stimulus and response there is a space.

In that space is our power to choose our response.

In our response lies our growth and our freedom.

 

Sending warmth and strength to everyone here.

 

 

 

[[Wi...]]

 

I think when it comes to finding peace, I stick to this picture. How can one make peace with a person who does not know or understand what I am talking about? A conversation or argument will lead nowhere.

What I could do is to speak out loud, when it comes to my father and he was able to agree and also said sorry. Sorry did not last long and I had to learn also, that no matter what he said... it did not matter. What mattered was that I had spoken out loud and made a point.

With my mother - no chance. She would run into depersonalisation. I still do not know if that is a strategy or whatever... she "forgets" a lot also...

I know even if she will be dead, peace will not come to me. Because she is such an ambivalent person and I will be trapped again and again because I know she was traumatized as a child and then I am trapped in the thought "yes, and that was my fault??? Is anyone traumatized doomed to give that to the children"... and so on... VERY VERY difficult to escape this dilemma. Cause I do not want to blame the victim. See, now I am angry. That is what happens.

 

I think, with peace its the same as with love. we cannot MAKE it. It has to come freely, as a gift.

 

I very much relate to your description, Marigold. My mother, especially, is the same. She was sexually abused by her father when she was a child, and then he committed suicide. So there's that. And we feel guilt...I feel protective towards her despite her dysfunctional treatment of me. It's very hard to navigate that.

 

Of course, it is not our fault. Your mother is an adult now, and every adult is responsible for her own actions. She is no longer a victim (and, as adults, neither are we). We are not doomed to repeat the cycle. That's the thing. It can stop with us. With our mothers, I find, they often don't have the same level of self-awareness that we do. They didn't have the same access to the tools we have to help ourselves: websites, workbooks on trauma, educational material, holistic health practices, etc.

 

Someone once said, 'My mother couldn't give me what she didn't have in her to give.' That helped me somewhat -- the idea that she simply wasn't aware enough, wasn't capable, due to her own trauma/fears/inadequacies/illnesses/imbalances. I'm not saying this is true in every case. There are degrees of this, and there certainly are cases of outright sociopathy, even evil. And I'm not excusing the behaviour, or the damage caused.

 

The peace you make is not with your parents. Not primarily, I mean, since that might not be possible. It is with the situation as it was, and with the decision that you deserve a brighter future -- and that takes time. You work at coming to a place of peace within yourself -- regardless of whether you decide to stay, walk away, forgive or not. That's the most important thing. (Sometimes, the best we can do is to love people from a distance. Sometimes, that can be the healthiest choice for everyone -- parents included.)

 

For me, I realised that peace would not come to me, or from them. I had to work towards finding it within myself. Because I cannot control their actions/responses, only my own. It starts with the decision (followed, perhaps, by setting boundaries that you can adjust as you go along). It is very, very hard, yes. But it gets easier with time. And I cannot believe how my life and health have changed for the better since coming to this realisation.

[[va...]]

Hi girls (I wonder why there are hardly any boys in acons groups).

 

Estee and wildflower thank you so much for your support. Wildflower I thought you hated me so it's really nice to have this post from you. Things are not always what we think. I will try to stay away from this group because I do believe this type of group needs to be moderated by someone who has suffered badly at the hands of an NPD disordered parent and these groups don't belong in BBs. In the same way that benzobuddies has to be moderated by someone who's gone through the hell of benzo withdrawal. I know mods here do a good job but this type of group simply needs a different set of rules (in my opinion). For reasons that would be too long to explain here, the forgiveness issue is very very triggering to me and to many other ACONs. It's unbearable even. It's not good for me to read about forgiving my abusers no matter how much I breathe on it Estee. I need safe spaces when it comes to revisiting my childhood, and this does not feel safe to me. I love the fact that you guys are doing such a great job here together and I will of course see you on all the other boards where this very sensitive topic is not spoken of.

 

The girl becks blue I'm sure meant no harm.

 

If anyone is like me and needs to join a group specifically oriented to and moderated by ACONS, there are a few on fb that have helped me tons. One is "children of toxic parents, though love not allowed", then there's "scapegoat children of narcissistic parents" these are closed groups.

 

I wish everyone a happy healing. I believe if I survived my "father" I can survive the benzo, although to deal with my father I had my brain one hundred percent healthy. But I'll keep the faith.

 

 

[[Wi...]]

Val, I'm so happy you stopped by! I've always liked and respected you, despite our ways being different, sometimes. You're strong, you have a mind of your own, and you're getting through this. You sound like a good mother to your daughter.

 

I respect and understand your decision, but know that you are among friends here. It's clear to me how much everyone values you. And it can be good, even in trauma, to be exposed to different ideas.

 

But triggers are hard with a trauma background, and even more so in w/d, for sure. If it helps at all, I can tell you that I also find the forgiveness issue very triggering. I think even the term is loaded and doesn't feel 'safe' for many us. As time has passed, I've managed to find ways around it, and it no longer bothers me as much. I much prefer to focus on 'letting go'/moving on, finding inner peace (after having worked through the trauma, not denying the pain in any way)....

 

I hope you can read here on days when you feel stronger...maybe in the future. Sending a warm hug.

[[va...]]

Val, I'm so happy you stopped by! I've always liked and respected you, despite our ways being different, sometimes. You're strong, you have a mind of your own, and you're getting through this. You sound like a good mother to your daughter.

 

I respect and understand your decision, but know that you are among friends here. It's clear to me how much everyone values you. And it can be good, even in trauma, to be exposed to different ideas.

 

But triggers are hard with a trauma background, and even more so in w/d, for sure. If it helps at all, I can tell you that I also find the forgiveness issue very triggering. I think even the term is loaded and doesn't feel 'safe' for many us. As time has passed, I've managed to find ways around it, and it no longer bothers me as much. I much prefer to focus on 'letting go'/moving on, finding inner peace (after having worked through the trauma, not denying the pain in any way)....

 

I hope you can read here on days when you feel stronger...maybe in the future. Sending a warm hug.

 

This means a lot. 

[[Es...]]

I really hope we manage to keep Peace in this Support Group. Didn't have the time to read the most recent posts. Will catch up later. I'll be quite busy in the next couple of days. Just wanted to address what Magnesi had written earlier.  I wrote it in the early morning. Couldn't post cause of technical issues.

 

Becks, both my parents are still alive but I've read a lot about this and can tell you that all is possible. People can handle it in many ways, as Wildflower said. You can find for example:

people that feel sad because they still hadn't let go of the idea that their parent could change - although, as we know, this would not likely ever happen

 

I put the part I relate to in Bold.

 

I'm trying to overcome the later kind of feelings. When I finally understood the abusive dynamics in my family of origin, I realized that I had been continuously suffering and feeling guilty for not having a close relationship with mother. And yet, I often tried. It was her that subtly pushed me out of her life. Despite this soon after she would start again complaining that we never visited her, that she had been abandoned by her daughter (me), etc. I carried a constant burden of guilt for not doing enough for her and also for not feeling like doing it. Fortunately, I have come to understand this game and now I expect she does her part. She doesn't do, of course, and continues to complain, but I no longer feel guilty. If she died now I would feel sorry for her but I wouldn't feel guilty for not having made "peace" with her.

 

I put peace between quotes because the only way to have peace with a narcissist is often to submit to his/her torture (which of course does not feel like peace to us as what they need is that we feel bad). Remember that we are not talking about imperfect parents who love their children deep down. Narcissists love no one, not even themselves, and need to crush others to feel better. It's sickness, not imperfection. When narcissists have children, they do the same to them, play with them, crush them. It is not in general possible to have peace with this type of person because they usually do not want to change. The other day I read an interesting explanation: narcissists do not want to change because what reality has to offer them is far inferior to their delusional self-image.

 

A very good point.

 

I also understand what Val says, there are groups, specific about narcissistic abuse, where moderators have a lot of experience and there are clear rules about what can't be said. One of those things is being judgmental about forgiveness. Forgiveness is something only each of us knows if we should give and if our abusers deserve it. FORGIVENESS IS NOT REQUIRED and to suggest otherwise is very negative for the healing process of abused people. But I believe that many make this kind of suggestion without understanding the implications. People that had normal (or even nearly normal) parents have a lot of difficulty understanding how we feel, as the worst of this kind of abusers hide their bad actions very well.

 

I totally agree. I find it impossible to forgive.

 

A different subject the conversation here left me thinking about is related to what Estee and Marygold said about the difficulty of separating from their mothers, or even thinking badly about them, even after all they've done. This reminded me of something I read about trauma bonding. As I understand it, trauma bonding can be a problem for some children of narcissistic parents, who are subject to contradictory, positive and negative messages. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traumatic_bonding. I don't think this happens to me because since I was a teenager I am clearly my mother's scapegoat and so my problem is not so much to separate myself from her as to realize that after all our bad relationship was not my fault. And, at least for now, my challenge is more to overcome a series of self-defeating habits and the constant guilt that dominates me even over even things that don't concern me.

 

Makes a lot of sense to me. The self-sabotage is something very difficult. It takes time to realize these behaviors. And to change them. Replace the destructive habits with constructive ones. Trauma bonding makes me think of another concept. The Stockholm syndrome.

 

Magnesi, I haven't read the book you mentioned. Thanks for the suggestion. This was a great post overall.

I may not always reply to people's posts. Not because I ignore them. Due to time constraints. I'm grateful to every single person who brings something positive to this Support Group. I will be reading the posts in the next few days. Not enough time to write.

 

Val, I hope you stay. You may need a break from posting, but I guess it makes sense to read this thread.

[[va...]]

Estee thank you from the bottom of my heart for quoting this post by Magnesi which I had missed.

 

Magnesi thank you for explaining the issue with forgiveness.

 

Estee I see what you mean and thank you for the invitation, but I really need to stay as calm as possible during this withdrawal hell, and this thread is going to become too rocky at times, so as I told you, I will stick to the FB support groups I mentioned and Magnesi also mentioned. This is my choice, but I'm glad this group does work for you and other people and I will read of course as I spend all my spare time on BBs (I should work to improve this but I find it helps too).

 

Thanks again.

[[ma...]]

Thank you so much Estee for your kind constructive words. Val, I hope you will come back when you feel better, but I understand that sometimes we need to retire to our cocoon because we are fragile.

 

I would like to leave a word of thanks also to Benzobuddies and their moderators, who generously give us their time for this forum to exist. And also to Colin, the founder, who is not afraid that BB is a space of freedom, or to make mistakes, or to apologize when he thinks he could have done better. I deeply admire this.

 

This is why BB is by far the best forum of its kind and I am deeply grateful for its existence. As can be seen from my signature, I already finished the benzo a long time ago. But I am still here because although there are forums dedicated, for example, to antidepressants, which is what I am dealing with right now, BB still works best for me.

 

Indeed, other forums may be more specialized in antidepressants or narcissism, but BB is a place of freedom where we can grow. We do not grow in very safe spaces, these are our comfort area. We grow when we are challenged, when we make mistakes and accept to correct them. And this is more possible on BB than on any other site I know.

 

Narcissism forums also have problems. They can amplify nonsense. I have seen, for example, people call narcissism things that are clearly just their parents' imperfection and receive a chorus of approval. In some cases it even seems to me that the narcissist is the author of the post and not the people he/she complains about, but his/her view is rarely challenged.

 

I would love for people here not to be upset when someone challenges them and to accept that sometimes people react hotly because we are only human. What matters is that in the end we all try to resolve disagreements and discuss matters civilly. This is something our narcissistic parents can't do, and we had terrible examples, but we want to be able to do better.

 

I will try later to edit this post to include some example, links, because now I am short on time.

 

Note: I thought of writing an introduction to this group, with some recommendations and cautions. I hope next week I have time.

[[be...]]

This is a great thread. And I agree with magnesi, thanks to Colin and the members here. One thing I’ve learned over the years, you can’t change others, you can only change yourself. This was very difficult for me to accept. I’ve been going to al anon meetings for years and this is their mantra.

 

I recall the day I learned that my father died. I was typing something on my desktop in my office. My brother John popped in (he hated my father), and said, dad died last night. I felt nothing. No relief, no anger, no, pity. Nothing! I just said to him, well that’s a shame and went on typing. I guess I was no longer angry at him. I just forgot about him. I’m not sure if this is good or bad. I never even thought about him. Until this thread was started.

[[Ma...]]

I have to say that the most helpful sentence I have read the last years.. came from Floridaguy, a member here on bb.

I was complaining and crying not getting help from a person I had asked again and again and that I could not understand how this person could NOT understand and refuse to do something.

His advice was How can you expect someone to do that if you have asked so many times and got bad results with that?

 

Totally right.

To accept that people stick to a behavior no matter if you die or get hurt or not - that is the most difficult thing.

I think if you have overcome that point, you are really really far in healing regarding this relationship.

Next step is focusing on yourself.

And the last step is that naturally these people get cut off your heart, just because it happens, because you have moved on.

 

So, benzogirl, I see this as a sign of healing and growth.

[[be...]]

Thanks, Marigold1 

[[su...]]

 

Narcissism forums also have problems. They can amplify nonsense. I have seen, for example, people call narcissism things that are clearly just their parents' imperfection and receive a chorus of approval. In some cases it even seems to me that the narcissist is the author of the post and not the people he/she complains about, but his/her view is rarely challenged.

 

 

This was my experience also. Labeling can be a huge trap, and sometimes the forums become echo chambers: people write for approval and validation (which is not bad, per se) only, to hear their own views echoed -- and they get it...unless they dare to talk outside the accepted narrative. But there can be a lack of focus on constructive healing approaches and moving forward. So sometimes, you still find the same members there 5 years later, stuck in the same phase.

 

 

Yeah I was part of one I still sometimes go on but I feel like so many people sign up to complain about people in their lives who most likely don't have personality disorders and aren't even necessarily abusive.  Its lots of mother in laws complaining about their daughter in laws and like how they won't let them see their grandkids enough and how they don't like their bad attitude. One women was posting endlessly about her husband's mistress he got pregnant and kept going back to and how to get rid of her. It was hard when I was trying to process childhood abuse stuff to post and even get people who understood. The moderators did but who else would respond it was hard to say.

 

valiumnomore I appreciate the support you gave me but I get getting triggered by certain things. I am sorry to see you leave. I hope you find healing from benzos and from what you've been thru.

 

Thank you to everyone else who responded to my earlier post. It helped lots to have support. Since the thread has moved on I won't go back to it now but thank you.

 

 

 

[[Br...]]

I'm another which follows this thread.  In the past I've wrote many personal stories on Quora.  At one time I found it therapeutic to share true stories and several understood.  At one time I also followed Dana Morningstar who also lived the nightmare and it's interesting as the livestream allows for an interactive experience.  The guy I still check in with periodically is Richard Grannon.  That englishman bluntly (but effective) lays it out there by using analogies which are easily understand.  About a week ago he did a vid called "my ex kicked the shxt out of me".  What I know is this can be an a parent, a significant other......anyone in the NPD realm.  The second part is focused on healing and is just as powerful.  Most often I find his earliest videos were the most helpful.

 

Otherwise I'll also state that many of us raised by pwNPD - we were raised with danger.  We never knew when an eggshell would break thus at an early age our eyes and ears were constantly scanning for danger.  Ultimately some of us became "reactive".  For me, that defensive bundle of nerves morphed into true anxiety disorder....which led to benzos.

 

In 10 years I've never met a person (face to face) who truly understands NPD.......nobody. In the past I've seen three therapists who allegedly knew NPD......they didn't.  Basically I was paying them to attend psychology class based on my experiences and with each, I  quit after one visit.  My point is.......many forums are good (not all)....they have to be.  Without them, NPD is an alien concept and only those who have lived it will truly understand.  We need validation and some forums and some YT provide it.

 

 

 

[[be...]]

What bothers me is when I talk about my father to my mother, she says, get over it!

[[Ma...]]

What bothers me is when I talk about my father to my mother, she says, get over it!

 

The same attitude like saying to someone "loose weight" or "Just let go".

one should answer "let yourself grow a heart"..

 

Stupid and hurting at the same time. Excellent.

Its not about getting over something - thats how it goes in THEIR world. For us, its about understanding and relief and freedom.

[[be...]]

Yep. I used to think my mom was pretty perfect. Now, hardly...

[[su...]]

I went through such rumination and guilt for posting here. Maybe I shouldn't label anyone as narcissist.  My mom I really don't know how to make sense of her behavior sometimes. I lived through some hard stuff from both my parents at times. They also were very loving at times. Both very different. I had good times with both. They both also put me through some stuff.  I just have been trying to process my life and in benzo w/d I don't know what is up or down.  I feel so terrible. I feel guilting even calling anything I dealt with abuse. Though some things blatantly were. Its so hard to process this stuff in benzo w/d.

 

 

Yeah I don't think they are narcissists. I think I just survived some trauma and abuse but I don't think they meant it.

[[Es...]]

I went through such rumination and guilt for posting here. Maybe I shouldn't label anyone as narcissist.  My mom I really don't know how to make sense of her behavior sometimes. I lived through some hard stuff from both my parents at times. They also were very loving at times. Both very different. I had good times with both. They both also put me through some stuff.  I just have been trying to process my life and in benzo w/d I don't know what is up or down.  I feel so terrible. I feel guilting even calling anything I dealt with abuse. Though some things blatantly were. Its so hard to process this stuff in benzo w/d.

 

 

Yeah I don't think they are narcissists. I think I just survived some trauma and abuse but I don't think they meant it.

 

The rumination and the guilt for having written about them. I totally get it. NPD is just one of many personality disorders.

 

I used to be in denial about Mother till 2016. I knew there was something terribly wrong. I just didn't know that a personality disorder like NPD exists.

 

I was never in denial about Father. I knew from the beginning. When I stopped being his little girl. This is how I got close to Mother. I had no one else to turn to.

[[Ma...]]

I went through such rumination and guilt for posting here. Maybe I shouldn't label anyone as narcissist.  My mom I really don't know how to make sense of her behavior sometimes. I lived through some hard stuff from both my parents at times. They also were very loving at times. Both very different. I had good times with both. They both also put me through some stuff.  I just have been trying to process my life and in benzo w/d I don't know what is up or down.  I feel so terrible. I feel guilting even calling anything I dealt with abuse. Though some things blatantly were. Its so hard to process this stuff in benzo w/d.

 

 

Yeah I don't think they are narcissists. I think I just survived some trauma and abuse but I don't think they meant it.

 

The rumination and the guilt for having written about them. I totally get it. NPD is just one of many personality disorders.

 

I used to be in denial about Mother till 2016. I knew there was something terribly wrong. I just didn't know that a personality disorder like NPD exists.

 

I was never in denial about Father. I knew from the beginning. When I stopped being his little girl. This is how I got close to Mother. I had no one else to turn to.

 

I was so shocked by the last sentence, cause it is just so true. I have always been wondering why I still hold on to my mother so deeply knowing its not good for me but being unable to do a break off.. I had no one else to turn to.

I had not one else. And I was a kid. I needed someone. At least some-one.

Sadly that someone wasn't stable.

[[be...]]

I felt the same but instead I used my best friends mom as my second mom.