Santa Fe shooter on Ritalin

[[Be...]]

Why is everyone always blaming guns as the problem for all these school shootings?  Just read that the Santa Fe school shooter has been on Ritalin since kindergarten.  I believe the Parkland school shooter was also on an antidepressant.  Now they want to try to take guns away from people.  They need to stop blaming guns and look at the drugs these young people are on.

[[sa...]]

Agreed! Big pharmaceutical just getting off Scott free. Most psychotropoc medications have a homicidal and/or  suicidal ideation risk.  It used to be listed on the side effects warning. I can’t find that it’s listed there anymore. Not even online either. Ruining the shooters life too along with all the victims and survivors and no one is talking about it. Pharmaceutical companies have blood on their hands from so many atrocities for greed. Shameful. The uptick of these shootings coincide with the overdrugging  of American kids.

[[Fl...]]

Pharmaceutical drugs, fatherless homes, kids raised in daycare and by computers and video games, the social isolation created by social media and technology in general, a society that teaches boys that they are essentially broken girls who are born with power and privilege, the push to remove religion from society, PC culture, "everyone is equal and everyone deserves a trophy" culture, victimhood culture.

 

These are just a few of the things that need to be addressed if we ever want to solve the school shooting problem. Sadly though, these issues will continue to be ignored by people who believe that it is more important to feel good about a proposed solution than to get to the root of the problem and implement solutions that might actually work, and by people whose political agenda is more important than actually saving lives.

[[Ph...]]

Pharmaceutical drugs, fatherless homes, kids raised in daycare and by computers and video games, the social isolation created by social media and technology in general, a society that teaches boys that they are essentially broken girls who are born with power and privilege, the push to remove religion from society, PC culture, "everyone is equal and everyone deserves a trophy" culture, victimhood culture.

 

These are just a few of the things that need to be addressed if we ever want to solve the school shooting problem. Sadly though, these issues will continue to be ignored by people who believe that it is more important to feel good about a proposed solution than to get to the root of the problem and implement solutions that might actually work, and by people whose political agenda is more important than actually saving lives.

 

Bingo!

[[Gr...]]

I just learned about nonviolent communication and as I was listening to that book, I was thinking that if kids learned this stuff, we would not have the problem we do with shooters.  If EVERYONE had empathy and caring for their fellow humans, it would probably solve a lot of problems.  I agree the drugs are bad, but I honestly think the problems go deeper than this.  Though, I am also thinking that the drugs make it a lot easier for people to get violent thoughts to begin with. 

[[Be...]]

When I was a kid and teen no one heard of antidepressants or Ritalin or any of that stuff.  Plus, we had no gruesome violence on TV.  The worst it got was a show called Mannix, but then we only got 3 channels on our TV then.  I even used to watch the Lawrence Welk show.  Laugh In was on and can't remember much more.  I do remember when they put the daytimes series Dark Shadows on.  It was so scary, I remember it started putting me a dark mood at times watching it and it traumatized me somewhat.  I know it affected my mood since it was a dark scary show.  Beginning of dark stuff on TV.  No computers or cellphones even phone answering machines then.  Just a phone on the wall.  Us kids would walk places without our ear glued to a cellphone and we'd actually talk to each other face to face.  We'd go to the bowling alley and play pool and use pinball machines    I agree that all the violent video games played by a kid who is taking a psychotropic drug can have dire consequences.  Too much stress for a young mind to handle.  I can't even handle seeing violence on TV as an adult.  It upsets me a great deal. 

 

Here's a good link about how psychotropic drugs can cause violence.  Robert Whitaker, author of Anatomy of an Epidemic.

 

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/mad-in-america/201101/psychiatric-drugs-and-violence-review-fda-data-finds-link

 

I wonder how many kids are taking tranquilizers too?  I know when you hit tolerance on them they can make a person homicidal.

[[Ga...]]

Pharmaceutical drugs, fatherless homes, kids raised in daycare and by computers and video games, the social isolation created by social media and technology in general, a society that teaches boys that they are essentially broken girls who are born with power and privilege, the push to remove religion from society, PC culture, "everyone is equal and everyone deserves a trophy" culture, victimhood culture.

 

These are just a few of the things that need to be addressed if we ever want to solve the school shooting problem. Sadly though, these issues will continue to be ignored by people who believe that it is more important to feel good about a proposed solution than to get to the root of the problem and implement solutions that might actually work, and by people whose political agenda is more important than actually saving lives.

 

Bingo !

[[Be...]]

FG, what does this mean "teaches boys that they are essentially broken girls?"  Our society is also trying to emasculate men too in alot of shows which isn't good.

[[Ch...]]

I just learned about nonviolent communication and as I was listening to that book, I was thinking that if kids learned this stuff, we would not have the problem we do with shooters. If EVERYONE had empathy and caring for their fellow humans, it would probably solve a lot of problems.  I agree the drugs are bad, but I honestly think the problems go deeper than this.  Though, I am also thinking that the drugs make it a lot easier for people to get violent thoughts to begin with.

 

Bingo! 

[[Be...]]

Too much negative mental stimulation on young developing brains.  Kids need a soothing and calm environment with less mental stimulation, not to mention all the terrible junk food they ingest that can make them anxious and depressed and sick.

[[Li...]]

Illegal drugs, alcohol, psychiatric drugs and bullying are the main causes of all of the recent mass shootings.  I've played video games since the early 1980's when I was a little kid and they actually kept me out of trouble.  The same goes for TV shows and movies.  My entire generation that is on the fringe of the "millennials" were saved by video games, computers, TV and movies and even as adults, we still are.  I also was raised by a single mother.  I never went on a mass shooting before although when I was severely polydrugged on antipsychotics such as Zyprexa, I did feel the urge to commit violent acts.

 

I've also heard morons saying that school shootings are caused because of entitlement due to white male privilege but those statements are nothing more than racist, sexist and completely unproven.  The first official school shooting actually dates way back to July 26, 1764 at the Enoch Brown school massacre which was caused by Native Americans.  The mass shootings will likely continue no matter what legislation is changed but I hope instead of these things happening at a school where innocent children are slaughtered, they happen at these corrupt pharmaceutical companies that made us all sick and suffering.

[[Fl...]]

FG, what does this mean "teaches boys that they are essentially broken girls?" 

 

Masculinity is vilified by our culture. Ever heard the term "toxic masculinity"?

 

Tucker Carlson did an excellent series on this a couple of months ago. Here is an interview with Jordan Peterson he did that explains it a lot better than I could-

You can search youtube for "Tucker Carlson Men in America" to see more.

 

Our society is also trying to emasculate men too in alot of shows which isn't good.

 

Yes, this is just part of it. The media is absolutely BRUTAL to men and boys. Spend an evening watching tv and you will see show after show and commercial after commercial where the men and boys are made out to be stupid, incompetent, immature etc, whereas women and girls are the smart, mature ones who have all of the answers. This is the message we are sending to boys, and then we wonder why some of them go off the deep end? Doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out what is going on here.

 

Too much negative mental stimulation on young developing brains.  Kids need a soothing and calm environment with less mental stimulation, not to mention all the terrible junk food they ingest that can make them anxious and depressed and sick.

 

I'm not sure I agree with the idea that kids need "less stimulation", they just need to be taught how to channel their energy properly.

 

I do very much agree that diet has negative effects though. The introduction of processed foods with hydrogenated oils and sugar IN EVERYTHING coincides with the rise in obesity and depression. Again, not too difficult to see how this might correlate with many of the problems society is facing today.

 

Illegal drugs, alcohol, psychiatric drugs and bullying are the main causes of all of the recent mass shootings.

 

This is one thing that I disagree with. This recent anti-bullying campaign sounds great on the surface but it ignores the REAL issue. Bullies have been around since the dawn of time and they will always be around. The difference today is that kids aren't taught how to deal with bullies. This is just another example of society ignoring the root of the problem in favor of a solution that feels good.

 

I never went on a mass shooting before although when I was severely polydrugged on antipsychotics such as Zyprexa, I did feel the urge to commit violent acts.

 

There is definitely a link between these mass shootings and psych drugs. They probably won't make the "average" teenager go on a shooting rampage but I am sure you can extrapolate how it would be possible for the drugs to be the tipping point if the kid is a little more fragile or unstable.

 

I've also heard morons saying that school shootings are caused because of entitlement due to white male privilege but those statements are nothing more than racist, sexist and completely unproven.

 

This is just more nonsense that again, ignores the root of the problem and allows a certain group of people to promote their own agenda. Everything that is evil today is blamed on men (specifically white men) and masculinity and you can rest assured that these groups will not pass up any opportunity to use a tragedy to promote the idea that the "patriarchy" is responsible.

 

 

[[Gr...]]

While I do think some types of masculinity maybe are toxic and should be examined, as a mother of a 9 year old boy, I do think the boys are getting the short end of the stick many times now.  Recently, I was browsing online for shirts, and I was kind of shocked at what the boys shirts said, so they I looked at what the girls shirts said.  You could look at any of the big kids clothing stores for examples of this.  On the boys shirt, it said things like:  "Rules are made to be broken"  "Oh No, I almost had to talk to someone today"  "Video games are my life"  "Oh No, I almost did some work!"  "Lazy for Life"  and then on the girls shirts it said things like:  "Future boss"  "Future leader"  "I can have emotions and be tough"  "Girl Squad Goals"  "I love my Daddy" .  It gets even more disturbing to see what's on the baby t-shirts. 

 

After I read those shirts, I actually had a talk with my son, telling him that he could do and be whatever he wanted.  The talk was SO REMINISCENT of what my parents told me as a girl growing up in the 70s and 80s.  I just couldn't bear to say nothing while society says boys are socially awkward and can't work hard or enjoy anything but video games and pizza. 

[[Fl...]]

While I do think some types of masculinity maybe are toxic and should be examined, as a mother of a 9 year old boy, I do think the boys are getting the short end of the stick many times now. 

 

You are spot on correct about the messages that are being sent to boys but there is no such thing as "toxic masculinity". It's just another attempt to portray men as the root of all evil.

 

As I said in my last post, there are benefits and drawbacks to certain parts of masculinity AND femininity. Despite the push to portray everyone and everything as "equal", there are inherent differences between men and women. But none of the traits that manifest themselves within either sex, gender, whatever you want to call it are "toxic". They simply are what they are. When people don't try to socially engineer these natural tendencies out of people they do a pretty good job of balancing themselves out and everyone is better off for it.

 

The problem is that today's society isn't encouraging men or women to utilize their strengths wisely and balance their weaknesses by working cooperatively with the opposite sex. It's all "me me me me ME!" and society ultimately pays the price.

 

[[Be...]]

We need men in our society who are strong and masculine and who don't fall apart emotionally when things get tough.  Women need them.  Women aren't as physically strong as men and we need strong men to dig holes, build buildings, assemble heavy things for us, do heavy maintenance projects, etc.  We don't need men who just sit around, get fat and eat all day and play video games.  Men need to be raised to be STRONG AND ASSERTIVE and to go out and work hard and provide for their families.  I'm from the old school where kids need a mother and a father.  I believe women should stay home and take care of the kids and be the nurturer, if she can, and dad can go to work and make the money and provide for the family.  Now that I'm disabled and sick all the time, I realize how important it is to have a strong man in the home or always available to take care of the "heavy lifting."  I used to be very independent and could do most all of the "heavy lifting," but not now.  I think men also have more mechanical minds.  Why are there so many men as auto mechanics, inspectors, etc, and not women?  I wonder if these shooters had mothers and fathers and were raised to be strong men?  Maybe the Santa Fe shooter wasn't raised to be a strong, masculine guy and was frustrated?  Just wondering.  Why would a kid need to take Ritalin in kindergarten?  Sounds like he had problems at home.  Kids never took psych drugs when I was a kid.  Bullying is a very big problem now and moreso than it used to be when I was young in the 60's and 70's.  There was never any bullying in any of my schools or at home.  Kids say anything they want to now and parents don't discipline them for having a "smart mouth."  When I was a kid none of us kids could ever talk back to parents or teachers or we'd get our mouths "washed out with soap," or even pepper.  I think all the foul and loose talk is a cause of alot of domestic violence too.  Just heard the nabes outside yelling at each other.  I yelled out the door, "talk nice."  I don't think the heard me though.

[[Fl...]]

We need men in our society who are strong and masculine and who don't fall apart emotionally when things get tough.  Women need them.  Women aren't as physically strong as men and we need strong men to dig holes, build buildings, assemble heavy things for us, do heavy maintenance projects, etc.  We don't need men who just sit around, get fat and eat all day and play video games.  Men need to be raised to be STRONG AND ASSERTIVE and to go out and work hard and provide for their families.  I'm from the old school where kids need a mother and a father.  I believe women should stay home and take care of the kids and be the nurturer, if she can, and dad can go to work and make the money and provide for the family.  Now that I'm disabled and sick all the time, I realize how important it is to have a strong man in the home or always available to take care of the "heavy lifting."  I used to be very independent and could do most all of the "heavy lifting," but not now.  I think men also have more mechanical minds.  Why are there so many men as auto mechanics, inspectors, etc, and not women?  I wonder if these shooters had mothers and fathers and were raised to be strong men?  Maybe the Santa Fe shooter wasn't raised to be a strong, masculine guy and was frustrated?  Just wondering.  Why would a kid need to take Ritalin in kindergarten?  Sounds like he had problems at home.  Kids never took psych drugs when I was a kid.  Bullying is a very big problem now and moreso than it used to be when I was young in the 60's and 70's.  There was never any bullying in any of my schools or at home.  Kids say anything they want to now and parents don't discipline them for having a "smart mouth."  When I was a kid none of us kids could ever talk back to parents or teachers or we'd get our mouths "washed out with soap," or even pepper.  I think all the foul and loose talk is a cause of alot of domestic violence too.  Just heard the nabes outside yelling at each other.  I yelled out the door, "talk nice."  I don't think the heard me though.

 

Not much to argue with here. Social conservatism gets a bad rap in today's world but the people who criticize it obviously don't realize that conservative values served as a foundation to build the prosperous societies we live in today.

 

What it comes down to is that these mass shooters have been failed by society. Not that this absolves them of personal responsibility, but anyone who truly cares about issues like this understands that we have to dig deep to get to the root of the issue if we ever want to see any kind of meaningful change. You can take everyone's guns away  and you can tell boys that masculinity is evil but that isn't going to solve this problem.

 

We didn't have these kinds of mass killings until recently. What has changed? There have always been lots of guns around and men today are LESS masculine than they were half a century ago (testosterone levels have been on the decline for decades). http://thechart.blogs.cnn.com/2011/08/18/modern-life-rough-on-men/

 

 

[[Ri...]]

Mass homicide is an acceptable side effect according to the drug regulating agencies.

 

 

 

[[Be...]]

FG, good article.  I noticed that even young men in sports today don't have well-defined muscles like they used to in the 70's when I was in highschool and used to watch the men in sports and even date them.  Now it looks like the young boys have a layer of fat or something on their muscles.  It's very odd, but noticeable.  Maybe it's because of decline in their testosterone?

[[Ch...]]

FG, good article.  I noticed that even young men in sports today don't have well-defined muscles like they used to in the 70's when I was in highschool and used to watch the men in sports and even date them.  Now it looks like the young boys have a layer of fat or something on their muscles.  It's very odd, but noticeable.  Maybe it's because of decline in their testosterone?

 

Maybe it’s because they simply eat too much of the wrong foods and don’t get enough exercise. That can be said of the vast majority of Americans, male or female.

 

I look at my photos from the 60s and 70s.  We were all slim and everyone’s hair was unprocessed. We looked so much healthier than today’s young people.

[[Ch...]]

While I do think some types of masculinity maybe are toxic and should be examined, as a mother of a 9 year old boy, I do think the boys are getting the short end of the stick many times now.  Recently, I was browsing online for shirts, and I was kind of shocked at what the boys shirts said, so they I looked at what the girls shirts said.  You could look at any of the big kids clothing stores for examples of this.  On the boys shirt, it said things like: "Rules are made to be broken"  "Oh No, I almost had to talk to someone today"  "Video games are my life"  "Oh No, I almost did some work!"  "Lazy for Life"  and then on the girls shirts it said things like:  "Future boss"  "Future leader"  "I can have emotions and be tough"  "Girl Squad Goals"  "I love my Daddy" .  It gets even more disturbing to see what's on the baby t-shirts. 

 

After I read those shirts, I actually had a talk with my son, telling him that he could do and be whatever he wanted.  The talk was SO REMINISCENT of what my parents told me as a girl growing up in the 70s and 80s.  I just couldn't bear to say nothing while society says boys are socially awkward and can't work hard or enjoy anything but video games and pizza.

 

Agreed. 

 

Messages like these are powerful. Companies who sell negative or socially irresponsible messages on kids’ clothing are complicit, as are parents who dress their kids in anti-social clothing.

 

Just my two cents as a mom and teacher.

[[Fl...]]

Maybe it’s because they simply eat too much of the wrong foods and don’t get enough exercise. That can be said of the vast majority of Americans, male or female.

 

I'm sure both factors contribute. Poor diet and lack of exercise is a big part of the reason for the decline in test levels. And it's a self perpetuating cycle, as with many of these other things. Poor diet and lack of exercise lead to lower testoterone levels which leads to obesity and other health problems, and this all ties in with lowered self esteem, the inability to attract someone of the opposite sex, this could all lead to depression which then leads someone to the pills, and there we are.

 

Actually I should have mentioned the diet and exercise thing in my initial post. It's a HUGE issue and it's yet another thing that has changed drastically over the past half century. If everyone started eating better and getting more exercise the world would be a much different (better) place.

[[Gr...]]

I honestly do not think women or men need to stay in any one sort of role, for humans to be able to not kill each other.  Though I think we really need to look at how we are treating each other and how we teach our children to treat each other.  The whole idea of teaching by shaming people into behaving properly, instead of telling them WHY to behave, I think is a big part of the problem.

 

It's easy to get lost in the rules, and I think people are way too into rule following these days.  I feel like human compassion is just lost for many.  Drugging children to make them sit still in school, or police shooting suspects for not moving their hands properly, I mean, we are SO INTO compliance at any cost, I don't know what the point of living in that sort of world is.  Aren't we here to help each other and get joy from making life better for one another? 

 

Also, we don't HAVE to make life worse for some people just because we make it better for some.  I'm not sure why this happens.  Maybe, on an instinctual level, humans feel that all good things are scarce resources, like food, but we FEEL it with money too, even though it isn't true. 

[[Be...]]

Everyone was thin and healthy in the 70's.  There might have been one overweight person in each class at school and that was it.  My sisters and other friends and other girls were couch potatoes in the 70's in high school and none of them were overweight.  You couldn't get my one sister to run ever.  Our kids are being poisoned now from the pollution, bad food, and lack of exercise and too much stress and maybe even too many vaccinations that are wrecking their immune systems.

[[Ph...]]

This issue of guns doesn't have to be complicated.  There was a time when most people in our society basically knew what the rules were.  There was a consensus.  People in general followed the rules.  There were clear definitions of right and wrong, and the prevailing myths taught that there were consequences...even eternal ones...to breaking the rules.  As much as many people don't want to hear this and will cover their ears, stomp their feet and scream like a toddler so they can't hear it, the rules were based on Judeo-Christian ethics and myths.  (Gasp!!)  At least half of this forum's members were not yet alive when these rules prevailed and society "worked."  They were born into chaos, strife, confusion (much of it manufactured) and the tube and know nothing else.  There are new myths now, with a host of supporting memes reinforced by every tap on your device.  But they don't work.  The previous world was compatible with guns.  The new world isn't.

 

Sometimes the answers are clear and simple but at the same time totally unacceptable...because to apply them we'd need to go back and try again.  And that would reverse progress.  Right?

 

[[Fl...]]

This issue of guns doesn't have to be complicated.  There was a time when most people in our society basically knew what the rules were.  There was a consensus.  People in general followed the rules.  There were clear definitions of right and wrong, and the prevailing myths taught that there were consequences...even eternal ones...to breaking the rules.  As much as many people don't want to hear this and will cover their ears, stomp their feet and scream like a toddler so they can't hear it, the rules were based on Judeo-Christian ethics and myths.  (Gasp!!)  At least half of this forum's members were not yet alive when these rules prevailed and society "worked."  They were born into chaos, strife, confusion (much of it manufactured) and the tube and know nothing else.  There are new myths now, with a host of supporting memes reinforced by every tap on your device.  But they don't work.  The previous world was compatible with guns.  The new world isn't.

 

Sometimes the answers are clear and simple but at the same time totally unacceptable...because to apply them we'd need to go back and try again.  And that would reverse progress.  Right?

 

I agree with pretty much everything you wrote but I would replace the word "guns" with something else. Maybe "itself"?? Maybe society is no longer compatible with itself.

 

Guns are simply a means to an end. If you could somehow snap your fingers and get rid of all of the guns tomorrow, you don't truly believe that this would solve the problem, do you? Of course it wouldn't because guns are just the most convenient method for these killers to achieve their goals (and maybe guns make the biggest statement?). People commit mass killing using trucks and homemade explosives as well. What are we going to do, ban vehicles, fertilizer and diesel fuel? Why isn't anyone campaigning to get rid of these other things? Gun control advocates won't even engage in that discussion because it exposes the holes in their argument.

 

And as far as the Judeo-Christian ethics thing goes, I grew up Lutheran but from a pretty young age I knew religion wasn't really for me. When I grew up I wasn't as bad as some people when it came to mocking religion but I did have a few laughs at its expense along the way.

 

The thing is, the older I get the more I realize that this is what built the prosperous and relatively safe society we live in today and I believe that the slow death of christianity plays a big role in these problems we are seeing today.