Adrenal Fatigue - do all benzo people suffer from this during w/d?

Hello - I'm just wondering if it is just a 'given" that most all of us Benzo withdrawal sufferers suffer from Adrenal Fatigue?  Without getting the saliva test, is there any other way to know.  I am reading Adrenal Fatigue by J. Wilson and it is quite interesting.  I am very interested in the food section and that is what I am going to work on.  I feel that most of his suggestions in other areas are just what every human being should do to have a healthy life.  Has anyone followed his food plan or any other suggestions of his and has it helped?

Thank you for your thoughts and comments on this.  Still trying to heal..............

Hoping2BFree

I had a saliva test several months ago and it showed that I had adrenal fatigue.  The RN recommended that I take 2000-3000 mg. of Vitamin C a day.  The medical community as a whole, however, does not recognize adrenal fatigue unless it is Addison's Disease or Cushing's Syndrome (from what I understand).

 

I did go to an endocrinologist to have my cortisol levels checked (via a blood draw), but it showed no adrenal insufficiency.

 

I do know that I have been more sensitive to certain foods and sounds since tapering from Klonopin.

 

I did read "Adrenal Fatigue" several years ago and found the information helpful in James Wilson's book.  It's a shame, however, that there is such a polarity in beliefs among the medical profession regarding this.

 

At any rate, those are my experiences (and thoughts) regarding adrenal fatigue.  I do think that Dr. Wilson's dietary recommendations about staying away from high glycemic foods and eating a protein food with each meal certainly make sense.

 

Wishing you well ...

 

fg

I also read the book, its a pitty I didn't read it before I got the pills!!!

 

I think we/ I for sure was over stressed and instead of getting adequate help they gave me pills that stressed me even more!!!

 

I am taking his supplements - once a day not 3 times a day as he says -but they do well with me. I noticed a difference once I ran out of supplies - my supplements were stuck for 2 weeks at customs!!! I import them as I live in the Netherlands.

The reduced output of the Adrenals is not likely to be due to a malfunction of the adrenals themselves...but rather the suppression of the HPA Axis, particularly the CRH in the PVN of the Hypothalamus by benzos.  Suppression of CRH inturn causes decrease ACTH release from the pituitary gland- which is necessary for activation of the adrenal outputs.  The adrenals themselves are working properly...they are just not getting the proper signals from further up the HPA Axis.  This is how benzos cause decreased adrenal output and thus sx's of adrenal fatigue.

 

Here is a diagram showing the path of CRH from the brain to the adrenals to help you understand all this.

 

http://geekymedics.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/Hypothalamic-Pituitary-Adrenal-Axis3.jpg

 

I have a thread called "How Benzos Cause HPA Axis Dysregulation"  which explains all this if you care to read it.  Here's the link:

 

http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=44373.0

 

Thank you all for your reply - Fishing Guy, who did you go to for your saliva test, what kind of doctor?  I am afraid if I go to an endocrinologist they will pooh-pooh the adrenal fatigue thing and do a blood test and everything will be normal. 

  Elizabeth - thank you - I have Wilson's adrenal fatigue supplements as well - they came with the book whne I ordered it.  I have been afraid to take any kind of supplement so far though.

    Perseverance - thank you for your link.  I have read your link on the HPA axis - had a bit of a hard time understanding it and then when I looked up Adrenal Fatigue and found that it wasn't even acknowledged by the medical profession, I thought - well this is just another doctor looking to make some money off of vulnerable people what with the supplements he sells as well.  So my suspicions have gotten the better of me.... 

    I guess I would like to know if anyone else has followed his protocol for food, supplements, exercise, etc and gotten well from bz w/d? 

    Thanks everyone for taking the time to respond - I appreciate it!

Hoping2BFree

Hoping,

 

You're missing the point...it is not adrenal fatigue...it is irregular levels of ACTH from the pituitary gland causing the adrenal outputs to be low.  Your adrenal function is more than likely fine...

 

The adrenal cannot have correct outputs if the inputs are off.

 

The inputs are off because benzos effected that part of the brain which tells the adrenals what to do.

 

I know this stuff is extremely complex...right?

Yes and no,

 

I was tired and stressed out whem they gave me the benzo's for insomnia, so I most probably had adrenal fatigue and it just got made worse!!!

THe supplements and the book won't take away the w/s 

 

But there is some wisdom to be used to have a better tapper - that is the concepts about food, and make sure your sugar/insuline levels are stable, the reduce environmental stress, keep your body healthy with the rigth supplements.

 

So read it and pick up what can help you

Hoping2Bfree,

 

I obtained a saliva test kit from my family doctor who carries them.  I believe you can also purchase them from ZRT labs:  http://www.zrtlab.com/test-kits/saliva-testing-kits.html.

 

Also, I have found that staying away from refined foods, sugar and junk food makes the tapers easier.  I have become much more sensitive to foods since tapering from Klonopin (mostly due to a bad 5-day detox that really did a number on my body).  However, eating right has definitely helped me.  I have found that the more things I can stack in my favor the easier the tapering is.

 

Hope this helps.

 

fg

Hoping and Elizabeth,

 

Sorry if I came off a little testy in my last response…I was having a bad day after finding out I am again losing two more teeth due to the effects of benzos.

 

Anyway, getting back to the subject-

 

24 hour salivary tests are good for checking the diurnal patterns of the adrenal outputs but do not rule the adrenals in or out.  The Suprachiasmatic Nucleus (SCN) of the Hypothalamus is the master clock of our circadian rhythms and has been shown to be effected by benzos, which can throw it out of phase.  This is most likely because GABA is in nearly every cell and plays a major role in its regulation.

 

So that is one thing that can throw the levels off, another is the ACTH coming into the adrenals from the pituitary which stimulates steroid hormone synthesis and secretion.  Low or erratic levels of ACTH due to benzos effect on the Hypothalamic-Pituitary-Adrenal (HPA) Axis will negatively influence Adrenal outputs.

 

An ACTH stimulation test can help narrow it down.  In this test the patient is injected with ACTH and the Adrenal outputs are monitored.  If the Adrenals respond properly you can rule out Adrenal malfunction and assume the problem lies further on up the HPA Axis (in the pituitary gland or the Paraventricular Nucleus (PVN) of the Hypothalamus) which ultimately control Adrenal outputs.

 

The PVN secretes Corticotropin Releasing Hormones (CRH) which tells the Pituitary Gland to secrete ACTH.  Having a CRH stimulation test will check to see if the Pituitary Gland is responding properly to rule it in or out.

 

If the Adrenals and Pituitary both pass these functional tests then it can be assumed that the problem lies in the PVN.  The PVN secretes CRH on in a diurnal pattern throughout the day.  Abnormalities in a 24 hour salivary test can reflect a problem here, and in that way be useful in confirmation.

 

Benzos are known to disrupt CRH from the PVN and thus blunting ACTH output from the pituitary gland, which then ultimately results in low adrenal outputs.  There can also be a shift between suppression and activation of CRH during inter-dose w/d while on benzos contributing to overall HPA Axis dysregulation.

 

Between benzos effects on the circadian rhythm via the SCN, and ACTH levels via the PVN to Pituitary route, the outputs of the adrenals will be negatively effected.  Irregularities in the SCN output can cause the circadian pattern of Adrenal outputs to be off…and the suppressive effects of benzos on the CRH levels can cause the Adrenal outputs to be low.

 

Here is a link to a web page that describes each of the tests I mentioned:

 

http://endocrine.niddk.nih.gov/pubs/addison/addison.aspx#secondary

 

This is why I said your Adrenals may not be the problem at all…and that the problem may stem from other things which control the Adrenal outputs which are known to be effected by benzos.

 

This also goes for pre-existing fatigue sx's...as there are so many things that can cause this it is always best to run tests to narrow it down.

 

Wow, you are a bigger info gig that I am!!

 

I am also in bad shape, I am not having my periods, my eyesight took an nose dive, I have no muscles....

and worse of all I am not sure if I want to stay in my marriage - which brings fear and uncertainty of how to handle all the changes.....

 

So I am not Miss Happiness!!! Franky (as in Frankenstein) is a better name.

 

 

I had the ACTH stimulation test done with my endocrinologist, but everything turned out fine.  I found out that the fatigue I had was coming from Klonopin, which disrupts the sleep cycle (specifically stages 3 and 4 of sleep, so that you don't get restful REM sleep).  At any rate, I was never rested even if I slept 14 hours.  I had to eventually go back on Paxil just to get restful sleep.  I am slowly improving and sleeping must better now.

 

fg

Thank you persevereance for that detailed update.  I am going to print it out, look up the link and take all of it with me to the doctor as soon as I can find one (an endocrinologist). 

Thank you again!

Hoping2BFree

Hi Hoping - what does the book say adrenal fatigue is?  does it mean that the adrenal grands just kind of burn out from so much oveerwork?  i am so interested in this.  this stress is so hard.  i was also wondering if it said anything about what the effects the adrenalin has on our bodies?  it is so unusual.  i will start on a lot of vit c. 

Perseverance,

 

So what's the "cure" for adrenal fatigue brought on by benzos (aside from weaning yourself off of them)?  I have found nothing that works so far.

 

fg