need klonopin advice again please!

[[md...]]

Have been on klonopin about 4 months now. .5  around 8am then .5 or.25 around 3 pm. I really want to stop and doc doesnt understand to taper wants me to just quit. Can someone hlp with the fastest but safest taper plan possible?? I am really concerned about seizures. Thanks!!

[[su...]]

Hello mdwilliams,

 

Here is some info that may be helpful to you. It may also help if your doctor saw this.

 

 

Why not to Detox or Cold Turkey a Benzodiazepine

 

 

I am the type of person who seeks to know what is happening and why, it brings comfort to me. I hope it does the same for you.

 

 

Why Benzos users should taper instead of cold turkey or go to a detox facility or do a rapid taper?

“The Benzo Book, Getting Safely off Tranquilizers” by Jack Hobson- Dupont, 2006

 

 

“Those who suffered the worst fates, it seemed, were the people who quit cold turkey. This is a dangerous undertaking. A sudden absence of benzodiazepine in the system may precipitate seizures, severe enough to cause death. Those who had survived were plagued with months- even years- of debilitating effects. This appeared to be the case as well with people who had tapered off benzodiazepine but had done so rapidly, over the course of days or weeks as opposed to months or years, either on their own or at a detox facility.”

 

 

Why Benzos are difficult to get off of compared to other drugs?

 

“The Benzo Book, Getting Safely off Tranquilizers” by Jack Hobson- Dupont, 2006

 

 

“It is the down-regulation of the neural receptors that differentiates benzodiazepine dependency from that of all other substances. That is the explanation of why getting off these drugs can be so horrendously difficult for some people, and why withdrawal symptoms for some can last days, weeks, months, even years after the last dose of benzodiazepine is taken. It is ignorance of this aspect of benzodiazepine discontinuation that leads medical professionals-- even addiction specialists who should know better-- to misunderstand the plight of benzodiazepine users. All of their exceptional difficulties and often bizarre discontinuation phenomena are a result of the single problem of down- regulation of the neural receptors after exposure to benzodiazepine.”

 

 

Summer

[[su...]]

 

Hello mdwilliams,

 

I would be best to get your doctor to support a slow taper. If he will not help, then getting a doctor that will support a slow taper is best.

 

Below: I will share some of the research that led me to the path I am on, regarding a slow taper. I shared this with my doctor and was able to get his support on doing a slow taper. I am the type of person who seeks to know what is happening and why, it brings comfort to me. I hope it does the same for you.

 

 

"Your Drug May Be Your Problem, How and Why to Stop Taking Psychiatric Medications" 2007 fully revised and updated edition, by Peter Breggin, M.D. (a Psychiatrist)

 

Peter Breggin, MD. “Again, keep in mind that these withdrawal methods are only guidelines and not absolute rules. Applying them depends on how fast you feel comfortable to proceed and on how much discomfort you experience and can bear between dose reductions.”

 

Peter Breggin, MD." The most important rule is to respect your own feelings and to avoid tapering faster than you find bearable. Stay within you own comfort zone when pacing your withdrawal. Keep in mind that the longer you were taking the drug, and the higher the dose, the more gradual your taper should be."

 

Peter Breggin, MD. "Clinical experience with benzodiazepines also suggests that extension of the withdrawal period is not harmful, especially after the initial dose has been decreased by 50 percent. In ordinary circumstances, however, patients should be allowed to share in controlling the process, especially in regard to slowing it down."

 

 

 

“The Ashton Manual” by Heather Ashton, 2002

Professor Ashton." It is sometimes claimed that very slow withdrawal from benzodiazepines "merely prolongs the agony" and it is better to get it over with as quickly as possible. However, the experience of most patients is that slow withdrawal is greatly preferable, especially when the subject dictates the pace. Those who have been on high doses of potent benzodiazepines such as Xanax and Klonopin are likely to need more time."

 

Professor Ashton.  "It cannot be too strongly stressed that withdrawal symptoms can be minimized and largely avoided by slow tapering."

 

Professor Ashton. “There is no need to hurry withdrawal. Your body (and brain) may need time to readjust after years of being on benzodiazepines. Many people have taken a year or more to complete the withdrawal."

 

Professor Ashton. "Slow withdrawal in your own environment allows time for physical and psychological adjustments, permits you to continue with your normal life, to tailor your withdrawal to your own lifestyle, and to build up alternative strategies for living without benzodiazepines."

 

Professor Ashton. "Actually, the rate of withdrawal, as long as it is slow enough, is not critical. Whether it takes 6 months, 12 months or 18 months is of little significance if you have taken benzodiazepines for a matter of years."

 

I hope this is helpful,

Summer

 

[[su...]]

 

Hello mdwilliams,

 

I have only done a slow taper. Here is what I have learned along with 2 examples: one from starting from 1mg of Klonopin, and the other from 0.75mg of Klonopin. I am not sure which dose your body is more stable to begin a taper.

 

 

You get the % by taking the dose reduction and dividing it by the dose you are currently at. For example; a 0.03125mg dose reduction from 0.5mg is a 6.25% dose reduction.  0.03125 divided by 0.5 = 6.25% reduction.

 

I have been dry-cutting. I have learned some important things about this process for me:

 

 

1) Each dose reduction I am able to get to a point where my body gets used to the dose and my withdrawal symptoms are lower. I usually get a couple of days where I have lower withdrawal symptom days. I have found that those several days enough for me to feel ready to take on another cut.

2) I have found that I need to hold for no shorter than 2 weeks.

3) I listen to my body and hold until it feels like it has adjusted to the new lower dose.

4) My average holds have been 2 to 4 weeks

5) In order to keep the symptoms at a tolerable level, I keep my cuts around 10% or lower.

6) I have been able to keep my cuts to .03125mg when I hit .5mg of Klonopin.

 

 

 

In case you are interested in how I am able to dry cut the lower doses:

 

Cutting .25mg:

 

Here is how I am able to get the .25mg pieces. I break the .5mg tablet in half.  The brand Klonopin is scored and breaks in half easily.

 

 

Cutting .125mg

 

Take the .25mg and cut that in half. That is a .125mg piece. . I use an angle razor like a box cutter. And cut on hard surface like glass or a mirror.

 

Cutting .0625mg

 

I have the 0.5mg Klonopin.

 

I break the 0.5mg tablet in half then, I cut 1/4th off of that. I use an angle razor like a box cutter. I have found that the razor is thinner and sharper than the pill splitters I have worked with. Yet, I have read that some have no problem using pill splitters.

 

I cut the 1/4 off of the tablet on a glass surface. I have found the glass surface to be hard enough to get a clean cut. I press down firm and fairly fast. The 1/4 breaks away (from the .25mg). Now I have 0.0625mg.

 

NOTE: If you are unable to get a chip that is .0625 mg then you could crush it into powder. That would work as well. You would take a .25 mg piece and separate it into 4 piles.

 

Cutting .03125mg (Powder)

The way I get the .03125mg is I crush a .25mg piece and separate the powder into 8 piles. I happen to have a window scraper so that is what I use or you could use a razor. I crush the .25mg on a dinner plate with the top part of a pill crusher. Then use the window scraper or razor to separate the pile into 8. Each pile is .03125mg.

 

Note: (What I do is crush the portion of the tablet. Then I put it in one pile. I do my best with the razor to separate the pile into two. Then I take the two piles and separate them into two. That makes four piles. Then I take those and separate them into two more piles. That makes eight.)

 

 

 

Cutting .0156mg (Powder)

 

The way I would get a .0156mg cut is by crushing .125mg piece (to get the .125mg, cut the .25mg in half). Then crush the .125mg on a dinner plate, into powder with the top of a pill crusher. I happen to have a window scraper so that is what I use or you could use a razor. Then separate the piles into 8. Each pile is .0156mg.

 

NOTE: With the powder, here is how I take it. I lick my finger, press it on the powder, then I put the powder in my mouth. Then I drink some water after.

 

Here is what a dose reduction of 0.0625mg from 1 mg would look like:

 

0.5mg

0.25mg

0.125mg

0.0625mg (Chip or Powder)

----------------

0.9375mg Total

That would be a 6.25% dose reduction

 

When I cut .75mg to do a .0625mg dose reduction, it looked like this:

0.25mg

0.25mg

0.125mg (Chip)

0.0625mg (Chip or Powder)

------------

.6875mg total

This is an 8.3% dose reduction.

 

Summer

[[Ho...]]

Have been on klonopin about 4 months now. .5  around 8am then .5 or.25 around 3 pm. I really want to stop and doc doesnt understand to taper wants me to just quit. Can someone hlp with the fastest but safest taper plan possible?? I am really concerned about seizures. Thanks!!

 

Hi mdwilliams,

 

We'd all like to get off these drugs fast but as summermeadow has shown you (thank you summer )...fast isn't the best way to go. Read through all of summer's information and let us know if you have any questions.

 

As summer has said, it's best to get a doctor to be on board with your taper.