Update on Post-Benzo Withdrawal Ambien Use

[[ke...]]

As with all posts on this forum, be aware that my results may not reflect what yours would be.

 

After more than a month of using Ambien nearly nightly, I stopped cold turkey. No problems at all, and definitely none of the dreaded restart of benzo withdrawal. Ambien doesn't always help with my insomnia but it does seem to work more often than it does not. When I first started using ambien again I would have some anxiety the next day, but that may have been due to the fact that I was still smoking/quitting smoking at the time. Now that I have been taking Ambien regularly for more than a month, I do not experience any rebound anxiety the next day (which I was afraid of given the short half-life of Ambien).

 

So all systems go and I am doing very well. Current pertinent (i.e., psychiatric) meds are 20 mg vortioxetine, 100 mg testosterone cypionate per week, and propranolol/hydroxyzine as needed for social anxiety (I do not take hydroxyzine with Ambien, and I do not use either of these medications very often).

 

I can say that Ambien seems addictive, because it tends to get me "high" for about a half-hour to an hour when I take it, but I have no trouble not taking it. From my experience I can say it should be used cautiously for anyone on this forum but it has not been troublesome for me, so if you're experiencing debilitating insomnia as I was, it can remain an option.

 

Hydroxyzine actually seems to be more reliable for me for sleep, but due to its long half-life, I find myself wiped out/sedated the next day much more-so than with Ambien. Generally, by the time I wake up (I tend to get 8-9 hours of sleep per night), I do not feel any of the effects of Ambien.

 

Hope this is helpful to at least one of you.

[[Es...]]

As with all posts on this forum, be aware that my results may not reflect what yours would be.

 

After more than a month of using Ambien nearly nightly, I stopped cold turkey. No problems at all, and definitely none of the dreaded restart of benzo withdrawal. Ambien doesn't always help with my insomnia but it does seem to work more often than it does not. When I first started using ambien again I would have some anxiety the next day, but that may have been due to the fact that I was still smoking/quitting smoking at the time. Now that I have been taking Ambien regularly for more than a month, I do not experience any rebound anxiety the next day (which I was afraid of given the short half-life of Ambien).

 

So all systems go and I am doing very well. Current pertinent (i.e., psychiatric) meds are 20 mg vortioxetine, 100 mg testosterone cypionate per week, and propranolol/hydroxyzine as needed for social anxiety (I do not take hydroxyzine with Ambien, and I do not use either of these medications very often).

 

I can say that Ambien seems addictive, because it tends to get me "high" for about a half-hour to an hour when I take it, but I have no trouble not taking it. From my experience I can say it should be used cautiously for anyone on this forum but it has not been troublesome for me, so if you're experiencing debilitating insomnia as I was, it can remain an option.

 

Hydroxyzine actually seems to be more reliable for me for sleep, but due to its long half-life, I find myself wiped out/sedated the next day much more-so than with Ambien. Generally, by the time I wake up (I tend to get 8-9 hours of sleep per night), I do not feel any of the effects of Ambien.

 

Hope this is helpful to at least one of you.

 

Ambien is a very dangerous psychiatric medication. And yes, it's a benzo. A z-drug. I personally found diazepam safer. The combo of the two almost killed me. If I were to recommend a benzodiazepine to anyone. I would only recommend diazepam.

[Guest [Le...]]

As with all posts on this forum, be aware that my results may not reflect what yours would be.

 

After more than a month of using Ambien nearly nightly, I stopped cold turkey. No problems at all, and definitely none of the dreaded restart of benzo withdrawal. Ambien doesn't always help with my insomnia but it does seem to work more often than it does not. When I first started using ambien again I would have some anxiety the next day, but that may have been due to the fact that I was still smoking/quitting smoking at the time. Now that I have been taking Ambien regularly for more than a month, I do not experience any rebound anxiety the next day (which I was afraid of given the short half-life of Ambien).

 

So all systems go and I am doing very well. Current pertinent (i.e., psychiatric) meds are 20 mg vortioxetine, 100 mg testosterone cypionate per week, and propranolol/hydroxyzine as needed for social anxiety (I do not take hydroxyzine with Ambien, and I do not use either of these medications very often).

 

I can say that Ambien seems addictive, because it tends to get me "high" for about a half-hour to an hour when I take it, but I have no trouble not taking it. From my experience I can say it should be used cautiously for anyone on this forum but it has not been troublesome for me, so if you're experiencing debilitating insomnia as I was, it can remain an option.

 

Hydroxyzine actually seems to be more reliable for me for sleep, but due to its long half-life, I find myself wiped out/sedated the next day much more-so than with Ambien. Generally, by the time I wake up (I tend to get 8-9 hours of sleep per night), I do not feel any of the effects of Ambien.

 

Hope this is helpful to at least one of you.

 

Hello Kedeia,

 

While you have posted in the past about your choice to take the z-drug, Ambien, in order to get through medical school, please be aware that you may not promote the use of either benzodiazepines (or z-drugs) on the forum, a rule you agreed to when you joined the BenzoBuddies community.

 

All of us had reasons for starting these drugs, and often they were, or seemed to be, life-or-death issues.

 

However, the purpose of this forum is to help folks off, not offer them reasons why they should stay on – that’s a topic for a different type of forum.

 

Please review the Rules & Guidelines for the BenzoBuddies Community, linked below.

 

Thank you.

 

Leslie

Administrator

 

• Though we are not 'an anti-benzo website', we are dedicated to help those who wish to quit benzodiazepines. We therefore require that you do not promote the use of benzodiazepines within the BenzoBuddies community, as this would be contrary to our Mission Statement and the aims of the vast majority of memberships.
  

[[ke...]]

Sorry, I didn’t know Z-drugs were included under the benzodiazepine clause in the community rules and guidelines. It would probably be best to make that explicit by stating “benzodiazepines or Z-drugs”, since Z-drugs are specifically not benzos.

 

Actually, come to think of it, lots of drugs that people discuss on this site bind to the GABA receptor. Just so I’m clear, are the following drugs/supplements included in the benzo clause? Each can be addictive, and if Z-drugs are included I’m guessing the following are, too?

 

1. Valerian root.

2. Valproic acid.

3. Ethanol.

4. Barbiturates.

5. GHB.

6. GABA.

7. Ethosuxamide.

8. Methaqualone.

9. Baclofen.

 

I appreciate any clarifications you can provide.

[[al...]]

It doesn't take a medical degree to know that prescription z-drugs have a very similar potential for misuse and severe withdrawal symptoms as benzos, therefore they really don't needed to be specifically itemized under the forum rules. Questioning the exclusion of the supplements that you listed just shows your lack of respect for this forum and what it is trying to do.

[[ke...]]

Actually, I forgot to include baclofen.

 

I’m very serious about these supplements and drugs. Valproic acid is derived from valerian root and valerian root binds to the metabotropic GABA-B receptors, just as baclofen and GHB do. I’ve seen some very serious withdrawals in people using valerian root for monotherapy, especially in the context of benzodiazepine withdrawal. Valerian is actually far worse than zolpodem with regards to withdrawal, and this has been documented in the scientific literature. So it’s not very helpful to exclude it just because it’s labeled as a supplement. Mucuna pruriens and L-dopa are also supplements and they can be very dangerous, especially if combined with tyrosine.

 

If the goal is to avoid leading people into pitfalls, I think extreme caution should be used with any supplement that can produce the same effects as benzos. That includes valerian root. I don’t see why this should be controversial?

[Guest [Le...]]

Sorry, I didn’t know Z-drugs were included under the benzodiazepine clause in the community rules and guidelines. It would probably be best to make that explicit by stating “benzodiazepines or Z-drugs”, since Z-drugs are specifically not benzos.

 

Actually, come to think of it, lots of drugs that people discuss on this site bind to the GABA receptor. Just so I’m clear, are the following drugs/supplements included in the benzo clause? Each can be addictive, and if Z-drugs are included I’m guessing the following are, too?

 

1. Valerian root.

2. Valproic acid.

3. Ethanol.

4. Barbiturates.

5. GHB.

6. GABA.

7. Ethosuxamide.

8. Methaqualone.

9. Baclofen.

 

I appreciate any clarifications you can provide.

 

Hello Kedeia,

 

Since I included z-drugs in the post above, that was clarification enough for the purposes of asking you to refrain from promoting the use of drugs. However, I will pass your admonition along to Colin, the owner of BenzoBuddies.

 

As for your list of substances that may target GABA_A neurotransmitters, BenzoBuddies does not in any way advocate the use of other drugs or supplements. The use (or nonuse) of any substance is a determination wholly to be made by the patient, in consultation with his or her treating physician. However, boards have been created for the discussion of such topics.

 

Feel free to join the discussions that can be found in the Alternative Therapies & Supplements board and hash out the valerian root pros and cons there.

 

To discuss the drugs you named (none of which are promoted by BenzoBuddies), there is the Other Medications board.

 

To find information on how members here have responded to z-drugs, consider visiting the Z-Drug Support Group (Lunesta, Imovane, Zimovane, Ambien, Sonata, Zopiclone) board, now 238 pages long, and if you still have questions, ask them there.

 

In other threads you have portrayed yourself as a trained medical expert and future psychiatrist, and sternly warned members to answer your questions according to your directives; however, that is not how things operate here, so please try to tone that down a little. There’s a wealth of information to be found here, and sometimes more can be found just by looking around than by asking struggling, benzo-wracked members to be more immediately accommodating in the way that they reply to you.

 

Finally, if you still do not understand the problematic part about advising folks here that Ambien is ‘safe,’ kindly take it up at the Helpdesk, and do not continue to litigate this in the open forum.

 

Thank you.

 

Leslie

Administrator

 

In no specific order:

 

I’m not looking for approval, just looking for less of the heavyhandedness that (frankly) is a little ridiculous when said to someone who knows all about this stuff, right down to the cellular level...not to mention from personal experience. The data on the issues we share here is pretty sparse, in particular for post-benzo withdrawal use of Z drugs, so that’s what I’m after. No offense to anyone, it’s just that if you want to discount my working around 90 hours a week for the last three years learning about this stuff, that’s hardly a position of respect I’m afforded.

 

I have taken every antihistamine there is for insomni, including the prescription hydroxyzine. The long half-lives of all those is pretty detrimental when I have to wake up and be hyperfunctional an hour later. Ambien is dangerous but thank God its half-life is only a couple hours. I too have the memory deficits and personality changes but not so much the next day, which is fine by me.

 

Mostly I’m just trying to avoid seizures and brain damage, and wondering what others have experienced when using Ambien after benzo withdrawal. Again, no offense to anyone, but try to understand that talking to me about pharmacology is like explaining to a firefighter how dangerous fire can be. I appreciate all the kind words and personal stories for those who have provided them, so thank you immensely for that.

 

To whoever said I’m looking for sanction to take Ambien: Why are you even on this board if you’re just going to be a condescending judgmental dick? Do any of us really need that, ever?

[[ke...]]

Well, after some consideration, I’ve decided this isn’t worth further discussion to try and clarify what I was saying, on here or in other posts. Can you please delete this thread? If there’s an option for me to do that you can teach me how and that will be fine. Thanks in advance for the help.

[[Co...]]

Just a quick note about z-drugs. Although chemically distinct, their mode of action is almost identical to benzodiazepines. Indeed, patients routinely have their prescriptions swapped between the two drug classes. The most pronounced difference between the two groups is that most z-drugs have markedly shorter half-life values compared to benzodiazepines.

 

'Benzos' are used here as a shorthand for benzodiazepines and z-drugs. And the BB home page makes explicit the above and that the community covers both drug classes.

 

http://www.benzobuddies.org/

 

I am all for sensible clarifications where needed. But I am struggling to see where there is a lot of confusion over this matter (though I do not claim there is none).

[[ke...]]

I have to say that even after extensive practice with benzos and non-benzos, this is the first place where I’ve heard Z-drugs referred to as benzos. This is probably because they’re not benzodiazepines, and no professional would ever refer to Ambien as a benzodiazepine without being corrected by their colleagues. This includes any kind of “shorthand”, which (again) I’ve never encountered outside of this forum. Maybe it’s a layperson thing? I’m not trying to sound rude or condescending so please don’t take it that way.

 

Barbiturates are very similar to benzos in mechanism of action as well; the only real difference being that they increase duration of GABA channel opening rather than frequency of opening. In fact, all the drugs and supplements I listed have mechanisms “similar” to Z-drugs. That’s why I asked for clarification. If Z-drugs are subsumed under the benzo “shorthand” on this message board then it makes perfect sense to me that all the other drugs I listed would be, too. They all bind to the GABA receptor (whether A or B) and all can have rather nasty withdrawal. But I think this board follows convention that isn’t subject to logical rigor, because that’s not how convention works. Lots of people are prescribed benzos and Z-drugs and can have problems from them, hence this site, which I understand is not designed for medical science technocracy. I have, however, spoken with several M.D.s on this site and we have discussed pharmacology at length, so I don’t think it’s something that should be forbidden or frowned upon. In my view, it never hurts to be scientific and logical, and my questions (whatever you may think of them) were in earnest, and are rigorously scientific and logical.

 

The reason Z-drugs are so distinct is that, with the dosages commonly prescribed and approved by the FDA, they do not feature a “kindling” effect of inducing sedative-hypnotic withdrawal. This is why they were so popular when they first came out, and in fact still are quite popular.

 

This raises a further question involving gabapentin. This drug was designed as a GABA analogue but surprisingly has absolutely no activity at the GABA receptor. However, it does feature some very nasty withdrawal, rivaling that of benzo withdrawal. TONS of people are switched from benzos to gabapentin. So is gabapentin considered to be in the same group as benzos here?

 

Also, I should state to Leslie that in the previous thread you referenced, several other users agreed with me that the “preachy” approach was not always best, and didn’t find anything wrong with my request for anecdotes without scolding. The best threads I’ve read involve people “telling their stories” but not preaching to others, and as I’ve said before, I generally think that’s a good way to go about things. It’s standard practice for group discussions in AA and NA, for example. I didn’t sternly demand that people take that approach; I politely requested that they do. And almost everyone obliged and were very kind and helpful. In the future I’ll simply avoid making such requests, but it’s inaccurate to characterize as anything other than exactly that, a request.

[[Co...]]

I have to say that even after extensive practice with benzos and non-benzos, this is the first place where I’ve heard Z-drugs referred to as benzos. This is probably because they’re not benzodiazepines, and no professional would ever refer to Ambien as a benzodiazepine without being corrected by their colleagues. This includes any kind of “shorthand”, which (again) I’ve never encountered outside of this forum. Maybe it’s a layperson thing? I’m not trying to sound rude or condescending so please don’t take it that way.

 

Barbiturates are very similar to benzos in mechanism of action as well; the only real difference being that they increase duration of GABA channel opening rather than frequency of opening. In fact, all the drugs and supplements I listed have mechanisms “similar” to Z-drugs. That’s why I asked for clarification. If Z-drugs are subsumed under the benzo “shorthand” on this message board then it makes perfect sense to me that all the other drugs I listed would be, too. They all bind to the GABA receptor (whether A or B) and all can have rather nasty withdrawal. But I think this board follows convention that isn’t subject to logical rigor, because that’s not how convention works. Lots of people are prescribed benzos and Z-drugs and can have problems from them, hence this site, which I understand is not designed for medical science technocracy. I have, however, spoken with several M.D.s on this site and we have discussed pharmacology at length, so I don’t think it’s something that should be forbidden or frowned upon. In my view, it never hurts to be scientific and logical, and my questions (whatever you may think of them) were in earnest, and are rigorously scientific and logical.

 

The reason Z-drugs are so distinct is that, with the dosages commonly prescribed and approved by the FDA, they do not feature a “kindling” effect of inducing sedative-hypnotic withdrawal. This is why they were so popular when they first came out, and in fact still are quite popular.

 

This raises a further question involving gabapentin. This drug was designed as a GABA analogue but surprisingly has absolutely no activity at the GABA receptor. However, it does feature some very nasty withdrawal, rivaling that of benzo withdrawal. TONS of people are switched from benzos to gabapentin. So is gabapentin considered to be in the same group as benzos here?

 

Also, I should state to Leslie that in the previous thread you referenced, several other users agreed with me that the “preachy” approach was not always best, and didn’t find anything wrong with my request for anecdotes without scolding. The best threads I’ve read involve people “telling their stories” but not preaching to others, and as I’ve said before, I generally think that’s a good way to go about things. It’s standard practice for group discussions in AA and NA, for example. I didn’t sternly demand that people take that approach; I politely requested that they do. And almost everyone obliged and were very kind and helpful. In the future I’ll simply avoid making such requests, but it’s inaccurate to characterize as anything other than exactly that, a request.

 

A few quick comments and then I must go.

 

1) The mode of action of benzodiazepines and z-drugs are identical. This is not true of barbiturates (as you, yourself stated). Nor is it - as far I know - true of any of the other drugs you listed. This does not mean they do not have effects, of course. And even if mode if action is truly analogous, other factors (such as binding strength (to receptors), potency, etc.) will come into play. As far as I know, no other class of drugs so closely mimics benzodiazepines as z-drugs.

 

2) BB's is primarily concerned are about providing support and practical help, not discussion about pharmacodynamics (it is a side interest to the forum, and not even that for the majority of members).

 

3) If we are being precise, although 'kindling' associated with the use of benzodiazepines is quite widely speculated upon within these circles, it is far from being accepted by the medical profession.

 

4) The reason that z-drugs cause fewer problems with dependency compared to benzodiazepines is not because of (unproven) differences in kindling effects; rather, it is because of (in most cases) the much shorter half-life values of z-drugs compared to benzodiazepines. If you chronically dose the patient with a z-drug, they too will develop dependency. This is why I would always suggest that in the first instance those taking a short half-life z-drug (taken no more regularly than once per day) to first attempt a rapid taper (under a doctor's supervision, of course).

 

A general note: I am little involved with any of this stuff anymore. So, if I am out of date, by all means point me to some relevant literature.

 

Thanks.

[[Es...]]

I have to say that even after extensive practice with benzos and non-benzos, this is the first place where I’ve heard Z-drugs referred to as benzos. This is probably because they’re not benzodiazepines, and no professional would ever refer to Ambien as a benzodiazepine without being corrected by their colleagues. This includes any kind of “shorthand”, which (again) I’ve never encountered outside of this forum. Maybe it’s a layperson thing? I’m not trying to sound rude or condescending so please don’t take it that way.

 

Barbiturates are very similar to benzos in mechanism of action as well; the only real difference being that they increase duration of GABA channel opening rather than frequency of opening. In fact, all the drugs and supplements I listed have mechanisms “similar” to Z-drugs. That’s why I asked for clarification. If Z-drugs are subsumed under the benzo “shorthand” on this message board then it makes perfect sense to me that all the other drugs I listed would be, too. They all bind to the GABA receptor (whether A or B) and all can have rather nasty withdrawal. But I think this board follows convention that isn’t subject to logical rigor, because that’s not how convention works. Lots of people are prescribed benzos and Z-drugs and can have problems from them, hence this site, which I understand is not designed for medical science technocracy. I have, however, spoken with several M.D.s on this site and we have discussed pharmacology at length, so I don’t think it’s something that should be forbidden or frowned upon. In my view, it never hurts to be scientific and logical, and my questions (whatever you may think of them) were in earnest, and are rigorously scientific and logical.

 

The reason Z-drugs are so distinct is that, with the dosages commonly prescribed and approved by the FDA, they do not feature a “kindling” effect of inducing sedative-hypnotic withdrawal. This is why they were so popular when they first came out, and in fact still are quite popular.

 

This raises a further question involving gabapentin. This drug was designed as a GABA analogue but surprisingly has absolutely no activity at the GABA receptor. However, it does feature some very nasty withdrawal, rivaling that of benzo withdrawal. TONS of people are switched from benzos to gabapentin. So is gabapentin considered to be in the same group as benzos here?

 

Also, I should state to Leslie that in the previous thread you referenced, several other users agreed with me that the “preachy” approach was not always best, and didn’t find anything wrong with my request for anecdotes without scolding. The best threads I’ve read involve people “telling their stories” but not preaching to others, and as I’ve said before, I generally think that’s a good way to go about things. It’s standard practice for group discussions in AA and NA, for example. I didn’t sternly demand that people take that approach; I politely requested that they do. And almost everyone obliged and were very kind and helpful. In the future I’ll simply avoid making such requests, but it’s inaccurate to characterize as anything other than exactly that, a request.

 

Zolpidem (Ambien) is a benzodiazepine receptor agonist.  A hypnotic agent. It binds to the GABA-A receptors at the same location as the benzodiazepines. It causes serious BZD interdose WD, because of its short half-life (2-3 hours). Similarly to the benzodiazepines, it produces tolerance and dependence.

 

Let me quote a fragment from this article, which dates back as long as five years ago. I can imagine Ambien is still a "Cash Cow" for the Big Pharma, which would do anything to advertise it as a "non-benzo", "z-drug" or label it with any name that could continue to bring financial profits.

 

Iatrogenic benzodiazepine abuse is emerging as a common mental health problem in neuro-psychiatric practice. Zolpidem, which selectively binds to γ-aminobutyric acid type A (GABA-A) receptors, was launched for the treatment of insomnia with the hope that it produces no dependence. However, animal studies, reviews and case reports demonstrate that ZOLPIDEM CAN RESULT IN TOLERANCE AND DEPENDENCE.

 

I have worked with many psychiatrists over the years, including sleep specialists. All of them referred to zolpidem as a benzo. Many of them stressed the fact that zolpidem had primarily been considered as a safer alternative to the benzodiazepines. Why in fact it proved to be as dangerous.

 

You are using many scientific terms and talking a lot about your medical background. Plus throwing mood stabilizers and supplements into the mix. You can really sound very convincing and scientific. I think this thread is dangerous and it freaks me out. Cause zolpidem used to be my "best friend" for a long time. And I thought I was in control. I don't want people to suffer like I did.

 

You said you want this thread deleted, then write a lengthy argument, which sole aim is to state the clear "difference" between the "benzos" and the "non-benzos" ("z-drugs"). Oh, how safe the term "non-benzo" sounds. I'm sorry, but your posts here make me think of a veiled marketing action.

 

I met so many long-term Ambien users on a certain internet site. They would do anything to convince me that zolpidem has no addictive potential and that it is a "non-benzo". A typical denial mechanism, which only showed the power this chemical compound can have over a person's mind.

 

I really shouldn't contribute to any more replies on this thread. I have been following it closely since the beginning and it scares me. I don't want people to go through the hell of Ambien WD like I did.

[[ke...]]

Replies to all above, in sequence:

 

Kindling is well-accepted in the medical field as a consequence of benzodiazepine withdrawal. I can’t really point to any recent literature because it’s been accepted for so long. It’s even in the free textbooks I got as discards. Would you like me to post those?

 

The GABA receptor is a pentameter and has two alpha, two beta, and one gamma subunit. Different drugs bind to the different subunits and elicit different effects. But the Z-drugs do not act exactly like benzos, otherwise they would be used for stage fright, phobias, social anxiety disorder, panic disorder, etc. They have no indications thereof because they have to use thereof because they don’t work close enough to benzos to be therapeutic. I could get deeper into the pharmacology here of subreceptors but since people on this thread seem to disdain that I’ll avoid it unless requested.

 

I never said Ambien was safe for everyone. I said it could be an option for some but would have to be used with extreme caution. I said it was a non-benzo because it is a non-benzo. GHB is another non-benzo that binds to the GABA receptor and is wonderful for sleep but is extremely dangerous. Just because I truthfully and accurately labeled a drug as a non-benzo doesn’t mean it’s safe, especially since I pointed out how dangerous it can be. I’m honesty not sure where you got most of your censure.

[Guest [Le...]]

. . .

I’m honesty not sure where you got most of your censure.

 

Kedeia:

 

You have been asked several times, both here and via PM, to stop litigating the moderation on the open forum, but rather to open a Helpdesk ticket if you wish to discuss it further.

 

Since you remain puzzled about having received several moderation notices, please re-read the following post containing your educated opinion that Ambien, which your physician described to you as being ‘safe,’ can remain an option for members here.

 

I am once again reminding you that you may not offer up such advice, as well-meaning as it may seem, on a forum whose mission is to help folks get OFF benzos and z-drugs, AND I will *once again* suggest that you glance over the 238 pages in the link that I provided you with previously, where you can read how many lives were severely damaged by Ambien and other z-drugs.

 

Meanwhile, DO NOT continue to argue about this, or you will lose the ability to post freely.

 

Thank you.

 

Leslie

Administrator

 

. . .

I can say that Ambien seems addictive, because it tends to get me "high" for about a half-hour to an hour when I take it, but I have no trouble not taking it. From my experience I can say it should be used cautiously for anyone on this forum but it has not been troublesome for me, so if you're experiencing debilitating insomnia as I was, it can remain an option.

 

Hydroxyzine actually seems to be more reliable for me for sleep, but due to its long half-life, I find myself wiped out/sedated the next day much more-so than with Ambien. Generally, by the time I wake up (I tend to get 8-9 hours of sleep per night), I do not feel any of the effects of Ambien.

 

Hope this is helpful to at least one of you.

[[Da...]]

Replies to all above, in sequence:

 

Kindling is well-accepted in the medical field as a consequence of benzodiazepine withdrawal. I can’t really point to any recent literature because it’s been accepted for so long. It’s even in the free textbooks I got as discards. Would you like me to post those?

 

The GABA receptor is a pentameter and has two alpha, two beta, and one gamma subunit. Different drugs bind to the different subunits and elicit different effects. But the Z-drugs do not act exactly like benzos, otherwise they would be used for stage fright, phobias, social anxiety disorder, panic disorder, etc. They have no indications thereof because they have to use thereof because they don’t work close enough to benzos to be therapeutic. I could get deeper into the pharmacology here of subreceptors but since people on this thread seem to disdain that I’ll avoid it unless requested.

 

I never said Ambien was safe for everyone. I said it could be an option for some but would have to be used with extreme caution. I said it was a non-benzo because it is a non-benzo. GHB is another non-benzo that binds to the GABA receptor and is wonderful for sleep but is extremely dangerous. Just because I truthfully and accurately labeled a drug as a non-benzo doesn’t mean it’s safe, especially since I pointed out how dangerous it can be. I’m honesty not sure where you got most of your censure.

 

Please, get deeper into the pharmacology.

[[Es...]]

Please, get deeper into the pharmacology.

 

From what the Administrator has suggested on 23/06/19 and 25/06/19 in this thread, the issue of benzodiazepine agonists (or so-called "z-drugs") potential "safety for some", claimed by Kedeia, should further be discussed at the Helpdesk. As there are too many vulnerable individuals on this site. Who could be susceptible to the indirect marketing of zolpidem's "benefits". If this is indeed the case, which I'm afraid it could be.

 

Any replies on this thread elicit further references to the OP's presumed knowledge of neuropharmacology and her medical background. Which of course cannot be proved in any way, but contribute to her credibility, as "scientific". No "preaching" or "censure" on the OP's part. Just pure scientific data.

 

Any replies will give the thread wider attention and are dangerous to the well-being of people trying to recover from the damage caused by the benzodiazepine agonists, z-drugs included.

 

The OP claimed on 23/06/19 that she wants the thread deleted. Now she has been putting an enormous amount of her time and energy into it for another two days, against the Administrator's warnings to stop. WHY?

 

This is a place where people damaged by the benzodiazepine agents fight for survival on a daily basis. Not a "Journal of Neuropharmacology", with a place for free ads.

[[Co...]]

I am not saying that the following community guidance applies in this case, but it is pertinent, so it is worth highlighting here:

 

Additional Advice & Guidelines:

 

Please adopt a non-prescriptive writing style. Relating your experiences, stating options, or posting suggestions of what other members might do are all welcome. However, advising members of what they should or must do is against the ethos of the BenzoBuddies Community. Nor should you attempt to 'diagnose' medical problems or suggest medical treatments to other members. This policy also applies to members with medical qualifications. A more detailed explanation of this policy can be found in our Guidelines Regarding the Giving of Medical Advice document.

 

The reason we include medical professionals in the above advice is twofold:

 

1) We do not screen our members, so have no way of verifying any claimed qualifications.

 

2) Even if could verify the qualifications of a particular member, BB takes the view that it would be improper for a doctor/nurse/psychiatrist/etc. to practice medicine via this medium.