Early in taper

[[Cu...]]

Hi -

 

Joining BenzoBuddies for general support and advice.

Started attempting to taper in mid-2018, by switching from Xanax to Valium, after being on Xanax for about eight months.

Tapered from 40-35mg daily. Held there for a while. Life crisis hit, brought me back to 40, with occasional forays to 45-50mg.

Now back at 35 for two days. Am experiencing tolerance-type WD symptoms at any recent dose.

Using Ashton schedule, only relief is in 20mg bedtime dose.

Hope this was halfway coherent. Quite foggy right now

 

Thanks,

-CurlyG

 

[[me...]]

Welcome to BenzoBuddies!  We are glad you decided to join us.  You'll find a lot of support and information on this forum, which is the only one of its kind online.

 

For those starting a taper, we generally recommend starting out at a rate of 5 to 10% every 10-14 days, then adjusting the taper to suit your own needs.  Note: very short term users may be able to taper faster.

 

Withdrawal symptoms, which vary widely but commonly include anxiety and insomnia, often occur during a taper, but these are temporary and will get better in time.  In general, first tapers are easier, but cold turkeys or multiple withdrawals may be more severe and longer lasting.  Here are a few links to get you started:

 

The Ashton Manual, a concise reference for tapering and symptom issues.  Chapter III contains excellent descriptions of common symptoms such as muscle issues, anxiety, and hyper-awareness

 

Withdrawal Support (during your taper)

 

Once again, welcome!

[[Ma...]]

Hey Curly and welcome.  You have come to the right place for support, there are some very experienced people on here, that were kind and generous enough to stay around after their taper was over to help us through our journey.  I need you to do us a favor. 

Go back to the Home Page, to your profile , click on it, look down and you will see where you need to put your drug history and doses.  Then we can see the whole picture to give you the best advice.

Again , welcome 

Mary ☮️🙏💜☮️🙏💜

[[ba...]]

Hi! ☺❤

[[Cu...]]

Hi, Mary - thanks for your reply.

 

I've added a sig with my dosage history.

 

I'm currently really suffering, even with the 40-35mg Valium taper, and I'm terrified of how much worse it's going to get.

 

None of this is made any easier by the fact that I'm going through several life crises presently, including discovering that my two beloved dogs (the most precious things in my life) that passed away in the past seven months were actually victims of pesticide poisoning by a careless painting contractor.

 

My anxiety is exceeded only by my depression. My insomnia is constant - usually only two or three hours sleep following my bedtime dose of 20 mg Valium and 600 mg Gabapentin. Often lately, I'll go complete nights with no sleep at all, even with the meds.

 

I want to get off these terrible meds desperately - they've literally broken my mind; but have read enough here to know not to rush the taper. Have also seen the horror stories of the way down from 2mg. I can't imagine that I have at least a year of this hell ahead of me, and even then, still suffering with the depression/anxiety/insomnia.

 

I can't even take anti-depressants, anti-psychotics, Remeron, or Benedryl to help, due to a cardiac condition known at Prolonged QTc.

 

I feel quite hopeless at the moment.

[[Ma...]]

Curly, I am so sorry about your dogs, that is horrible. 

I have been reading your drug signature, I too, was on 2 mgs of Xanax but I tapered down to 1.25mgs of Xanax before crossing to Valium. Valium sedated me so badly at 17 mgs, I could barely hold my head up.  You must have a high tolerance for it, if 20 mgs doesn't make you sleepy.

Can you tell me why you are on gabapentine? Pain?

I think, and I am no expert, your body has reached tolerance for the Valium.  That means it has become used to the amount you are taking and it wants more.  The problems are, once you have hit tolerance, updosing has a very good chance of not helping and you are already on a high dose.  We need to find a way to get you stabilized.  Your brain and central nervous system crave stability.

Do you think you could hold at the 35 mgs until your symptoms settles down?  I don't mean gone, I mean you can tolerate them. That will take awhile so you will have to hold on.  Then we can decide on the best way you can start tapering down.  I have found, imo, Valium is not nearly as helpful as Xanax with anxiety  .  Others have found it to be very depressing, so this will be hard.  We will be here for you, ask all the questions you need.  I am on the Long Hold Support Group if you want to come there.

 

Go back to the Home Page and scroll down looking on the left side, you will see Support Groups, click there and look for the Long Hold.  Good luck Curly, we are here to help, we aren't Dr 's but we will give you our best advice.  Love, Mary. ☮️🙏💜☮️🙏💜

Curly, forgot a question, when you went from Xanax to Valium, did they do a slow crossover?

[[no...]]

I have been on Effexor (150 mg) for about 15 years. Started using klonopin for sleep 17 years ago. Initial dose was 1 mg; consistent dose of .5-.75 mg for about 16 years. Followed the following taper schedule on my own in preparation for meeting with a new psychiatrist (my old one was recommending I stay on klonopin and supplement with high doses of melatonin). 

 

So here's what I did.

 

12/1/19 - 4/1/19: Stuck to .5 mg klonopin, adding 3-6 mg of melatonin as needed.

4/1/19 - 4/3/19: Continue Effexor; decrease klonopin to .25mg; add 25 of Trazodone. Sleep got progressively worse.

4/3/19 - 5/1/19: Trazadone raised to 50 mg.

5/1/19-5/5/19:  Saw MD. Recommended either stopping klonopin or cutting further and increasing Trazodone to 50-100 mg. I thought since I did fairly well on .25 mg with 50 mg of Trazodone, eliminating klonopin would be easy. I was wrong! The last four nights have gotten progressively worse. I am nauseous on and off and barely slept last night.

 

I think I eliminated Klonopin too quickly and am going to take .25 mg tonight, talk to MD tomorrow.

 

Thoughts?

[[Ma...]]

I have been on Effexor (150 mg) for about 15 years. Started using klonopin for sleep 17 years ago. Initial dose was 1 mg; consistent dose of .5-.75 mg for about 16 years. Followed the following taper schedule on my own in preparation for meeting with a new psychiatrist (my old one was recommending I stay on klonopin and supplement with high doses of melatonin). 

 

So here's what I did.

 

12/1/19 - 4/1/19: Stuck to .5 mg klonopin, adding 3-6 mg of melatonin as needed.

4/1/19 - 4/3/19: Continue Effexor; decrease klonopin to .25mg; add 25 of Trazodone. Sleep got progressively worse.

4/3/19 - 5/1/19: Trazadone raised to 50 mg.

5/1/19-5/5/19:  Saw MD. Recommended either stopping klonopin or cutting further and increasing Trazodone to 50-100 mg. I thought since I did fairly well on .25 mg with 50 mg of Trazodone, eliminating klonopin would be easy. I was wrong! The last four nights have gotten progressively worse. I am nauseous on and off and barely slept last night.

 

I think I eliminated Klonopin too quickly and am going to take .25 mg tonight, talk to MD tomorrow.

 

Thoughts?

 

Ok nopakpdo, first I am no Dr but I will help as best I can..  I am going to assume the first date you put was really 12/18, so basically in the last 6 months , your meds and doses have jumped around quite a bit.  You probably do need to add back in .25 K , stabilize on that and then slowly taper that down.  You have been on K for a long time, coming off at a slow rate will keep you from running into a wall of symptoms.  Stabilize doesn't mean no symptoms, it means you can tolerate the symptoms, so you may have to hold at the ..25 awhile.  Then you can decided what kind of taper suits you best.

If possible, leave all your other drugs alone, same dose while you are tapering the K.  Your brain and central nervous system crave stability, that is very important, every time you change something, you excite them all over again.  Have a good discussion with your Dr, is he by any chance a benzo wise tapering Dr?  That would be great.  Most aren't, so come back here if you like to see what we think.  In no way are we saying we are more knowledgeable than your Dr, but we have a lot of experience.

Good luck tomorrow, Mary ☮️🙏💜☮️🙏💜

 

[[no...]]

Mary,

 

Thanks for your reply - quite helpful. I didn't know about not fluctuating other doses. I actually like the MD I am with. The first time I contacted her after the initial visit, she took the time to call me after hours.  Unfortunately, she is a visiting doctor and her contract ends in July.

[[Ma...]]

Mary,

 

Thanks for your reply - quite helpful. I didn't know about not fluctuating other doses. I actually like the MD I am with. The first time I contacted her after the initial visit, she took the time to call me after hours.  Unfortunately, she is a visiting doctor and her contract ends in July.

 

I'm sorry, that sucks, good benzo Dr 's are hard to find  . Keep in touch 

[[Cu...]]

Mary -

 

Thanks for the reply. No - I did a direct crossover from Xanax to Valium.

 

And you are correct, I'm definitely experiencing tolerance withdrawal.

 

I will look for you in the Long Hold support group, but I don't think I can do a long hold. I need to get off these drugs quickly, as just today I noticed a complete and drastic hole in my long-term memory that seems almost impossible. I'm so disturbed by it, I'm at the edge. I know it was caused by the drug, rather than a withdrawal symptom, and can't continue to sacrifice my cognitive abilities and memory to extend the taper. I would rather suffer a little extra withdrawal agony than continue to damage my brain. I'm going to try a strict Ashton withdrawal, with my next cut tomorrow.

 

I'm going to find the appropriate area to post my specific problem, but here's the short form in case you can offer any advice. I grew up with my grandparents' three dogs as if they were my own. If you had asked me anytime until recently, I could have told you all three of their names without hesitation. They were as familiar as if they were my siblings. This morning, I drew a complete blank on one of their names. There's just a total hole where the memory was. It's been a full day of struggling, and I can't even come close. And it's the one of the three I was closest to.

 

I guess my question is: what is your experience with such a dramatic long-term memory loss, and the odds of it being permanent? It feels like there's blank spot in my mind. I also realize that I was tremendously cognitively impaired over the past year, but this particular aspect of what looks like early dementia has me utterly freaked-out.

 

To reiterate: it's like forgetting the name of one of one's own siblings.

[[Ma...]]

Mary -

 

Thanks for the reply. No - I did a direct crossover from Xanax to Valium.

 

And you are correct, I'm definitely experiencing tolerance withdrawal.

 

I will look for you in the Long Hold support group, but I don't think I can do a long hold. I need to get off these drugs quickly, as just today I noticed a complete and drastic hole in my long-term memory that seems almost impossible. I'm so disturbed by it, I'm at the edge. I know it was caused by the drug, rather than a withdrawal symptom, and can't continue to sacrifice my cognitive abilities and memory to extend the taper. I would rather suffer a little extra withdrawal agony than continue to damage my brain. I'm going to try a strict Ashton withdrawal, with my next cut tomorrow.

 

I'm going to find the appropriate area to post my specific problem, but here's the short form in case you can offer any advice. I grew up with my grandparents' three dogs as if they were my own. If you had asked me anytime until recently, I could have told you all three of their names without hesitation. They were as familiar as if they were my siblings. This morning, I drew a complete blank on one of their names. There's just a total hole where the memory was. It's been a full day of struggling, and I can't even come close. And it's the one of the three I was closest to.

 

I guess my question is: what is your experience with such a dramatic long-term memory loss, and the odds of it being permanent? It feels like there's blank spot in my mind. I also realize that I was tremendously cognitively impaired over the past year, but this particular aspect of what looks like early dementia has me utterly freaked-out.

 

To reiterate: it's like forgetting the name of one of one's own siblings.

 

Curly, that happens to all of us and it heals, but if you try to push on when you are in such bad shape, you really have no idea how much sicker you can get, please believe me.  If you push it and get worse, you will eventually end up having to hold even longer.  If you don't want to hold, then consider a very low daily liquid micro taper, you can keep moving forward and if you do okay, you can speed it up then.  Whatever you do Curly, we are here for you.  Love, Mary 🍀🍀🍀🍀

[[no...]]

I talked to my MD on Monday. She upped me to 150 mg of Trazadone, continue .25 mg of Klonopin and morning dose of Effexor. Slept great Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday. Lowered Trazadone to 125 last night and still slept well.

 

I have one son moving out in ten days, one graduating high school in three weeks and moving across the country in August. I am also trying to change jobs. NO MORE MEDICINE changes for awhile (except fluctuating Trazadone)

 

[[Ma...]]

I talked to my MD on Monday. She upped me to 150 mg of Trazadone, continue .25 mg of Klonopin and morning dose of Effexor. Slept great Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday. Lowered Trazadone to 125 last night and still slept well.

 

I have one son moving out in ten days, one graduating high school in three weeks and moving across the country in August. I am also trying to change jobs. NO MORE MEDICINE changes for awhile (except fluctuating Trazadone)

 

You have a lot going on!  Glad you are sleeping well, that means so much . Keep us posted, Mary 💜💙💘💜💙💘.  No changes for awhile, good idea

[[La...]]

Hi & Welcome to the group! Stay Strong- it gets better!