Off Xanax 7 months, just off Kavinace (phenibut), back to acute? Encouragement?

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Hey Buddies,

 

So, it's been a tough couple weeks.  To cut to the chase- I've been off of Xanax for about 7 months.  My doc had prescribed Kavinace (a supplement by Neuroscience) to me while I was on the Xanax.  I had come to realize that something wasn't right a couple of months ago and believed that this Kavinace supplement was causing problems.  I was experiencing interdose withdrawals amidst still dealing with the healing from being off of Xanax.  My doc said "Can't be the Kavinace..."  After doing my own research, calling Neuroscience and reaching out to informed parties- Kavinace has approx 250 mg of phenibut in it.  Fact.  As per Neuroscience.  My doc had no idea what phenibut was.  So, I was on low dose Xanax (.25) and phenibut at the same time for a year.  Thankfully, that is not a high dose, but it is 250 mg every single day for a year.  Here's the issue- I had tapered off over a month and a half span, and have been off of the Kavinace for about 3 weeks- I feel like I've backslidden in my healing.  I don't want to say that it is just like acute for Xanax, but I have the shaking / hand tremors, extreme lethargy, mucus production like crazy, weird feeling like I'm going to have a seizure but I don't (it feels like overstiumation / upregulation, hard to describe... it's that brain fried feeling), nausea, mood swings... the list goes on.  It's just tough... I had been taking the Kavinace throughout this Xanax withdrawal (was often down to one Kav a week), but I believe it was a crutch.  I do believe that I still have about 7 months of healing under here though.  That's not disputable.  And I can feel it.  It's just that the phenibut withdrawal is horrible too.  I'm a doer and I like to be up and about... it's so hard to be back in bed and going through the tough stuff.  Also trying to taper off of my antihistamine (been on Zyrtec for about 3 years) and get any med out of my system.  Then, I'd be clean and clear.  Appreciate any encouragement.  Hope you guys and gals are well.  :-)

[[Ja...]]

Hey Buddies,

 

So, it's been a tough couple weeks.  To cut to the chase- I've been off of Xanax for about 7 months.  My doc had prescribed Kavinace (a supplement by Neuroscience) to me while I was on the Xanax.  I had come to realize that something wasn't right a couple of months ago and believed that this Kavinace supplement was causing problems.  I was experiencing interdose withdrawals amidst still dealing with the healing from being off of Xanax.  My doc said "Can't be the Kavinace..."  After doing my own research, calling Neuroscience and reaching out to informed parties- Kavinace has approx 250 mg of phenibut in it.  Fact.  As per Neuroscience.  My doc had no idea what phenibut was.  So, I was on low dose Xanax (.25) and phenibut at the same time for a year.  Thankfully, that is not a high dose, but it is 250 mg every single day for a year.  Here's the issue- I had tapered off over a month and a half span, and have been off of the Kavinace for about 3 weeks- I feel like I've backslidden in my healing.  I don't want to say that it is just like acute for Xanax, but I have the shaking / hand tremors, extreme lethargy, mucus production like crazy, weird feeling like I'm going to have a seizure but I don't (it feels like overstiumation / upregulation, hard to describe... it's that brain fried feeling), nausea, mood swings... the list goes on.  It's just tough... I had been taking the Kavinace throughout this Xanax withdrawal (was often down to one Kav a week), but I believe it was a crutch.  I do believe that I still have about 7 months of healing under here though.  That's not disputable.  And I can feel it.  It's just that the phenibut withdrawal is horrible too.  I'm a doer and I like to be up and about... it's so hard to be back in bed and going through the tough stuff.  Also trying to taper off of my antihistamine (been on Zyrtec for about 3 years) and get any med out of my system.  Then, I'd be clean and clear.  Appreciate any encouragement.  Hope you guys and gals are well.  :-)

 

I'm so glad I found your post even though it's been forever since you've posted it. I just wanted to let you know that I am also w/d from Xanax and phenibut and I took the same brand as you. I hope things have improved for you as I am scared shitless that this is forever.

[[pr...]]

Jazz,

 

Just saw this!  Would love to connect and chat about our experience!  You don't lose heart, friend!  I'll send you a PM.  Check your Inbox.

[[Ol...]]

This is all great information, thank you! My ND recommended something called 'Tranquility' which contains phenibut. Luckily I did a shit ton of research before taking it and came to the conclusion that I never want to go on another medication that requires a taper!! He also prescribed Baclafan which I also politely declined for the same reason. Thanks for spreading the word!

Something that I have been using that I think is helping is called Cortisol Manager, I mentioned it in another thread, it contains ashwaghanda root which helps lower cortisol levels. I take 1 at night and have woken up much more peaceful lately, I was waking up nice and squishy until my brain actually woke up and then I would go into a panic. Since I have been taking this it has really helped my mornings calm down a bit.

[[pr...]]

Glad you did your research and didn't get on it!  Very thankful for that!

[[co...]]

Are you sure it was the Kavinance and not the Xanax that was causing interdose withdrawals. I know this is an old post... I was recently prescribed Kavinance by my ND. I'm suffering terribly at 13 months out from my last Benzo. I would like to only take one Kavinance per day for a short period of time. It sounds like I'll be playing with fire but from what I've researched, 250mg of Phenibut is a very low dose.... I'm not sure what's better; try an antidepressant or take this very sparingly and taper it. It's really a matter of surviving at this point... thanks alll.

[[Ma...]]

Those are just phenibut WD. GABAB receptors are pretty sensitive and take some time to heal.

 

Colley, I agree. If life is unbearable it isn't the end of the world to be on phenibut daily, as long as you don't go crazy with it. It doesn't cause the same side effects as benzos do, as far as impairment and sedation. A better choice than gabapentin too I think. I told you I like tianeptine too. 50mg a day works well for that. I'm going to quit tianeptine soon though because I'm starting to get back on track with everything else. Tianeptine is helpful to use when things get hard and easy to quit when you are ready to. Assuming you don't abuse it.

 

I really want to get off phenibut and everything else though. But I don't think phenibut affects the healing process from benzos. Once you are off benzos you are off benzos. It's as simple as that. It's just another drug to deal with. A separate WD to deal with basically. If anything being on phenibut has made this entire process dealing with acute benzo wd much easier.

[[Ch...]]

Hey, Pressingonward and JazzHands, when you tapered the Kavinace were you having symptoms each time you cut?

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@[ M...]

 

@ Chigrrl.... have you been using Kavinance for awhile and how many per day? Have you noticed any healing or are you now in a withdrawal situation from the Kavinance?

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Hi Pressing.

 

I wish that we had a support group for inter-dose withdrawals. I was not on pheni-but , but I was on remeron all the way through my ativan taper and beyond. A total of 14 months and a low dose of 3.5mg per night. At a year post jump from the ativan I was doing pretty well , but going cold turkey of the remeron about five weeks ago  put me back in an acute withdrawal. Like you I know it's just temporary and I do  have a year's worth of gaba rebuilding , but it is scary, challenging and sometimes depressing.

[[Ch...]]

I have been on Kavinace, one pill a day, for over a year. For much of my clonazepam taper I was taking two a day...one regular Kavinace and one Ultra PM. I'm definitely healing, regardless of the Kavinace. I just decided to get off of it in case it's impeding my full recovery.

I had extra symptoms after the first cut, and I think I've had a worse dp/dr since then, but otherwise I haven't noticed any other extra symptoms. That's why I'm thinking maybe it won't be that bad when I jump. I hope that's how things go.

I'm not going to tell you what to do, Colley, but I'll say that, while I think the Kavinace helped me to sleep for a little while, it sucks having to taper off this, too. It takes literally only 2-3 days for some people to become dependent. If you decide to take it, maybe only take it a couple times a week spaced out.  I would add that I've had the same symptoms the last few months, too; though they're getting better. The Kavinace hasn't been doing anything for awhile so I got through all that without any med/supplement help, honestly. I'm now at 17 months off of clonazepam and I can tell I'm slowly improving. I bet you can make it without extra meds, too...not that it's easy. It'll be one less hassle when you're healed because you won't have another taper in front of you.

[[pr...]]

Hi All,

 

I'm so sorry that I didn't see these replies earlier.  I haven't been on BB for a while.  I'd like to make a gentle case for doing our best not to be on Phenibut (Kavinace or other products).  I saw a comment on this thread that seemed to assume that being on Phenibut isn't that bad.  I kindly disagree.  In fact, the more research you do, it is possible that Phenibut could actually be worse than a benzo.  I've tried to be diligent in my research on Phenibut because I, like you friends, had felt or wondered if it was impeding my healing.  The conclusion that I have come to is a resounding "Yes."  I don't say this to scare anyone, as we shouldn't be afraid, but I do believe that we need to speak clearly about the truth and make sure we understand it.  Phenibut is a full on GABA agonist.  This means that it acts directly on the receptor, in basically the strongest relationship possible.  This would arguably be worse than a benzo, which is a PAM, or a positive allosteric modulator.  I'm not trying to sound all "sciency," but if you haven't looked these things up and understand them at a basic level, I would do that as soon as you can.  YouTube even has some great videos that show, in model format, what these things do and how the receptors react.  My final piece of info, that I believe is vitally important, is that, from my research, benzos act on the GABA A receptor.  It is known that Phenibut acts on the GABA B receptor.  So, if you put that together, one could feel, for a season, that Kavinace or other products are helping, but they are in fact damaging the other receptor.  One could end up with having both GABA receptors, A and B, being damaged at the same time.  I believe that's what happened to me.  I was on both at the same time.  I'm not claiming to be a scientist, nor an expert.  I welcome all corrections.  This is what I've found.  Either way, my stance is that it would be important to get off of any GABA affecting drugs and to do it in a wise way- tapering.  I pray that all of you are well!