Painkillers?

[Guest [Fl...]]

I had a shoulder operation just over a year ago due it disslocating after an assualt at a cashpoint. They bolted some bone somwhere to stop this happening. Whilst it doesn't dislocate anymore it does cause some extreme pain. My doc knows of the diazepam taper and says it will be 'fine' to take a painkiller when necessary and perscribed me something with 30mgs of codeine in it and 500mgs paracetamol. I have kind of lost faith with 'medical professionals' since this whole diazepam thing. So I'm kind of concerned about taking it and thought I would ask here, would it be 'fine' to take it as and when or would it mess up the taper?

 

I have tried the off the shelf paracetamol and also ibruprofin but doesn't help much as it feels like a trapped nerve type pain. I haven't ever tried codeine and am not sure if it would effect the diazepam etc. Any advice greatly appreciated.

 

Many thanks.

 

[[bu...]]

It won't cause any interaction with the diazepam.

[Guest [Fl...]]

Ah ok, thanks Builder. much appreciated.

[Guest [Fl...]]

Sorry, probably a stupid question but I've been reading other threads on here about something called 'Oxy', on the box I have it says Co-Codomal 30/500. Is that the same thing as this 'Oxy' that some have had trouble with, I'm in the UK so thought it may be the same thing but with a different name?

 

I just googled codeine and says its an opiate, is that right?

[[ti...]]

Codeine is an opiate. Oxycodone is percocet, hydrocodone is vicodin. At least in the US There is also oxycontin, which I believe is an extended release vicodin

I was on opiates before the clonazepam, before interactions were discovered

I can say I have never had any interactions. Codeine is not as potent as the percocet I am on

As far as my taper, it woukd not effect it since I am staying on my percocet. I hear they target different areas of the brain.

Imo, you should google drug interactions with codeine and valium and watch for that. Probably safe if it was prescribed, plus you can always take them at different times of the day

[[ti...]]

Sorry, oxycontin is a more concentrated percocet. The interaction between codeine and valium is mild per my google.

I was curious too. Good luck whatever decision you make

[Guest [Fl...]]

Ok thankes tinwi really appreciated. I'm reading thier are withdrawals from codeine too so am unsure if to take it. I'm not sure I can take any more withdrawals on top of the benzos or do you avoid them, say, if you took them once or twice a week?

[[ti...]]

I dont think you would get wds if you took them once a week, or if you only took them a few weeks

[[ti...]]

Have you tried physical therapy or injections?

[[bl...]]

I take codeine for my migraines during my valium taper and it is fine doesn't affect withdrawal act all just helps ease migraines.

[[Ca...]]

I had a shoulder operation just over a year ago due it disslocating after an assualt at a cashpoint. They bolted some bone somwhere to stop this happening. Whilst it doesn't dislocate anymore it does cause some extreme pain. My doc knows of the diazepam taper and says it will be 'fine' to take a painkiller when necessary and perscribed me something with 30mgs of codeine in it and 500mgs paracetamol. I have kind of lost faith with 'medical professionals' since this whole diazepam thing. So I'm kind of concerned about taking it and thought I would ask here, would it be 'fine' to take it as and when or would it mess up the taper?

 

I have tried the off the shelf paracetamol and also ibruprofin but doesn't help much as it feels like a trapped nerve type pain. I haven't ever tried codeine and am not sure if it would effect the diazepam etc. Any advice greatly appreciated.

 

Many thanks.

 

The main thing i would watch if u end up taking them more regular, say more than 2-4 tablets per day, is that it might have a cushioning effect on any/some valium side effects (sx)... -thus in theory, alowing you to taper faster than you perhaps should. Leaving you dependant on them to stop the accumulated valium sx. -dont be afraid of codeine, if used sparingly and your doses dont continue to climb, just be aware and carefull...

 

The stronger opiates like oxycontin are a whole different monster... and IMHO will mess with your taper, especialy on larger doses. They are well known to be highly addictive... -and trust me, tapering them is no fun... -thats y im on the valium...

 

Perhaps if u think it more of a nerve type pain, it might b worth discussing something like gabapentin or surgical options with your Dr...

Codeine and other opiates are often not very effective fore nerve pain...

 

I have never checked this, but my Dr calculated that 8 x 500/15 codeine per day, was about equivalent to 3mg/d of oxycontin...

 

All the best.

 

[[La...]]

Opioids and benzodiazepines can be a very dangerous combination of medications, depending on how much you take and how you metabolize medications. For example, they both slow down respiration and they both affect balance badly.

 

Have a look at this recent New York City Health document. There's a warning right off the top regarding the combo of benzos and opioids:

 

https://ndews.umd.edu/sites/ndews.umd.edu/files/Benzodiazepines%20CHI.pdf 

 

[Guest [Fl...]]

Ok thanks for all your replies it's much appreciated. I'm kinda scared to take them now. I'm sick to death of taking ANY more pills of anything to be honest. I'm not sure what to do, the pain is awful, like shooting type nerve pain (I wish I never had that good damn opration now). I guess I'm not going to sleep anyhow with or without pain on top of the benzo taper. I've tried Ibru gel, heat pads, tens machine etc it just wont let up. I might just try one and see how it goes. I've not heard of Oxycontin I'm not sure they have it here in the UK..

[Guest [Fl...]]

My concern mainly is due to the fact that I was speaking to someone who was also on this site was taking a painkiller called tramildal (?) Or something (I'm not sure if thats the right name or if it's like codeine) and ended up in hospital in a bad way. Reading that document up makes me even more concerned.

[[La...]]

Tramadol is definitely an opioid. I had a terrible reaction to it too! UGH. Not good for me. One dose flattened me. I was terrified. I gave the rest of the medication to a friend who didn't have ANY reaction to it at all (no positive or negative)! Just goes to show you how different medication metabolism can be!

 

Fleety, have you had any physiotherapy? If there's pain there, it would be good to figure out why. If there's a restriction in the range of motion or strength, then those can be causes of pain that a physio can address with you. If there's something else going on, wouldn't it be good to get it checked out further, e.g x-ray, MRI or CAT scan? Did you do physiotherapy after the surgery? The shoulder is a joint that moves in a lot of directions, so if it's not moving well due to tightness or weakness (e.g. muscles, tendons, ligaments), then physio can help a lot. If you get at the root cause of the pain, then presumably, you won't need to worry about medications at all, right? I hope so!

 

I'm not a fan of the opioids. They obviously have a place in the pain management arsenal, but here in North America, we're hearing many horror stories of people who got hooked on them after starting with a prescription from their doctors. The results are pretty sad. They just talked about it again on CBC Radio this morning.

 

If you're still on benzos, then you have to be quite careful about the combination with opioids. Talk with your doc. Do some more reading. Make an informed decision. And please take care!

[[pu...]]

I had in injury during withdrawal, I ruptured a disk in my spine.

 

Taking painkillers was the worst idea I ever had. Felt great at first then

it quickly got wound up in the benzo addiction/withdrawal and made things so much worse

and really damaged my body.

 

Take an epsom salt bath and start doing simple stretches, find a physical therapist that will help you,

drug free.

 

You're really messing with fire.

[Guest [Fl...]]

Hi, thanks again. Yes I've been doing pyshio since the Op. Hm I'm getting the impression to steer clear of these meds. I certainly don't want to be in withdrawal frkm something else on top of benzos. So much for my doctor saying they would be 'fine'.

[[La...]]

I think the biggest lesson is about being skeptical. I think we should ask a lot more difficult questions of our doctors and look things up a lot more. We owe it to ourselves.

[Guest [Fl...]]

Yeah although I tend to find it insults thier ego if I read stuff off the internet and tell them. It was hard enough to get them to do benzo taper

[[La...]]

The way I've done it before was to bring in medical journal articles and ask questions. I really tried not to insult anyone, but I did have to say things like "I'm not comfortable taking more medications." I know it's hard, though. There was another doctor that I had to stop seeing altogether. Too hard.

[[La...]]

With my benzo taper, I just brought the Ashton Manual and said I wanted to get off the medication using this plan. He went along with the idea, even though he didn't have specific knowledge. Thank goodness for the internet! We're lucky to be able to access such info.

[Guest [Fl...]]

I don't understand how from the millions of perscriptions handed out for Benzo's and Z-drugs how Doctors could not know of the problems they cause. It takes 1 minute to Google. Why is this not an international scandal?

[[La...]]

Good question, Fleety! The info has been out there for years. I think it's just too easy to prescribe. And the pharmacists just seem to go along with it. There should be checks and balances for these prescriptions, but there aren't.

 

Again, I think our best weapon is knowledge. The more informed we are, the better decisions we can make. Of course, we shouldn't have to know everything about all medications, but with the internet, we have access to so much now. I'm grateful for that, and I feel bad about those who have gone before us -- alone, with no BB, no support, no access to info.

[[Ca...]]

But lets keep it in prespective...

1.7 milion scripts, 440 000 patients -and only 301 deaths... including alcohol...

How many of these were from recreational abuse, or extracting the opiate and injecting, a number of these may well have been fentanyl abusers... opiate abuse is rampant, and i was surprised reading that article, -that the deaths werent much higher...! -I am sure very few, if any, of these deaths were from taking either medicine AS DIRECTED... (labled avoid alcohol here)..

 

But the original poster was asking about taking a "few" codeine containing tablets "as needed"...

Being aware of escalation and addiction, while important, is probably not the highest risk to life...

-toxicity from too much of the 500mg of paracetamol in the liver would be a forerunner... but only after max dosage... eg. 8 x day, for X amount of time... -there is a safety factor built in to max doses... (though at this point dependence and addiction would have to be explored)..

 

Suppressed breathing comes into it at a point way beyond a couple of codeine, but is handy to be aware of, as we are all different...  -in hospital my personal oxygen levels didnt drop much below 90%, even at doses of over 400mg/d oxycontin or morphine IV equiv... (and there were other physical reasons that impared my breathing) but i must say there was a huge level of tolerance there to factor in or i likely wouldnt b here..

point being that to get that tolerant in only a couple of years in hospital, -i was kept at max dosages, and breathing was ok most of the time...

But here we are talking about a few Codeine tablets...

And yes, finding the reason, perhaps nerve, and best treatment plan for the shoulder pain would be high on my list, try your best to keep that ROM going with physio etc...

 

Ps.. -i am quite ANTI opiates, they destroyed my life (conjunct with bad medical advice and procedures), but they do have a place that is not recreational abuse... -and genuine needs shouldnt suffer due to others misuse of them...

 

Best wishes...

 

 

 

[[Ca...]]

Just had a quick look, -which isnt the best idea...

 

http://nationalpaincentre.mcmaster.ca/opioid/cgop_b_app_b08.html

 

-this and some other sites say that oxycontin is 10X stronger than codeine...

-which if right, is, i guess why i was a bit suss on my Drs math... but there may be other factors to consider... prob asides the point...

Cheers...