Stabilizing during taper

[[Da...]]

I'm down to 10mg of v after crossover from Kpin. I tapered Kpin down to .725 then continued to taper while crossing over. Got down to and equivalent of 15mg of V and started tapering and at  currently 10mg. So halfway home from my original dosage of Kpin! The question I have is when does anybody feel stabilized? If the meds work less and less as you get off of them, the symptoms usually get more intense and prevalent. How do you stabilize from that? Just going down from 15mg to 10, I have never felt stabilized. None of the symptoms go away and new ones creep in during the taper process. I'm holding at 10mg right now for a few weeks to a month as I seem to be having other symptoms adding to the ones I already have during the withdrawal process. Can I get some people to chime in and let me know what they conceive as stabilized? There hasn't been more than 1-3 days during the taper where I would consider myself feeling well enough to taper again. Any insight or personal experiences would be greatly appreciated. I know some people can feel fine while others have quite a hard time. But are you ever stable enough to taper lower? I would think that the withdrawal symptoms would prevent someone from actually stabilizing until some time after the completion of the medication. Thanks!!

[[be...]]

It looks like you are tapering a bit too quickly. The recommended reduction rate is 5 to 10 percent every two weeks, and you are making cuts every week. Valium has a pretty long half life so it can sometimes take a bit to feel the full effects and stabilize.  Also, if tolerance was reached before a taper began it can sometimes be impossible to ever stabilize. Also, everyone has a difference definition of stable. For some it might mean feeling almost perfect and for others it could be not being miserable. The best way to minimize symptoms is a slow gradual taper.

[[Va...]]

I feel 100% normal when I stabilize between cuts. It wasn't that way when I reduced too quickly though. I actually feel better and better the lower I get now.  --V

[[Da...]]

I knew that I kind of tapered too quickly at first but I was following Ashton. I updosed once and don't want to do it again if at all possible. If I hang at 10mg for a while, will that eventually make it better? I know it's not a race but going backwards seems like an option I don't want to do if at all possible. I'm hoping holding for another 2 weeks or even a month wil help. Did I screw myself up and have to updose and do this again? Please say no! I can muster through some symptoms if it means I will eventually feel better with just a hold at this point.

[[Va...]]

I knew that I kind of tapered too quickly at first but I was following Ashton. I updosed once and don't want to do it again if at all possible. If I hang at 10mg for a while, will that eventually make it better? I know it's not a race but going backwards seems like an option I don't want to do if at all possible. I'm hoping holding for another 2 weeks or even a month wil help. Did I screw myself up and have to updose and do this again? Please say no! I can muster through some symptoms if it means I will eventually feel better with just a hold at this point.

I will say no lol. If you look at my signature, you'll see I held for 6 months. It took that long to finally feel good enough to taper again.  I'm a huge advocate of holding when necessary for as long as necessary. I found that after the hold, I began to feel better immediately as I reduced very slowly. I continue to improve cognitively, emotionally and have more energy.  --V

[[be...]]

I second no. Updosing for me was a bad thing. Harder to come back down for me. I'd hold until you feel better then cut slowly when you feel well enough. I too feel better the lower I go. Don't know why but I do. At least so far. B

[[Tw...]]

in the same spot made it to 12 mg of valium from 20 and holding for a month. I think the taper caught up to me and I just need to give my body a break. I crossed over from K as well and its been much better. The K just became unlivable and this was my last resort and even though I feel like hell at the moment, I have hope that I will actually make it off benzos. On the K I didn't think I had a chance in hell.

[[Na...]]

I agree with the others, look at my sig for my wife. The long holds have been invaluable as she has just started tapering again and having a much easier time with the cuts.

[[Da...]]

Thanks so much. That's what I was hoping to hear. I was cutting at one week per Ashton as she says 1-2 weeks. I thought I could handle it. Until boom! I thought I tapered off the Kpin slow enough I thought. I did so because I started getting heart misbeats and random almost passing out episodes while on Kpin and during the early stages of taper before the crossover. Since the crossover, no more heart palps, or passout episodes. But with those gone, on the diazepam I've been having this dizzy and boatyness feeling I never had on the Kpin. I thought maybe I was allergic to V. So I'm hoping that I just need to hold and catch up to myself. Insomnia increased, anxiety is hit or miss, always in early morning around 6-8am which subsides. Then the usual other common stuff like hard to drive anywhere because of the dizziness and some agoraphobia. I would be 100% more functional if this dizziness would ease or go away. But time will tell I guess. I don't want to get get more isolated because it's hard to do stuff because I know it's counterproductive. But can't help it momentarily until this particular symptom recedes or resolves.

[[be...]]

Dave I think you'll stabilize soon enough and the dizzies will pass. I can't drive these days on Valium because right now it's still too sedating but tons of people are fine with it. I've been doing kind of rapid .5 cuts but when I hit 8 mg I'll stop and hold a bit. See if my body needs catch-up. I want to get to 8 because the lower I go I'm seemingly less sedated dosing 4X a day. I've ended up housebound because of it but plan to change that asap. And this is stupid but when I get to 8 I won't need to cut any pills in half or quarters for a bit. Just 4X2. Easy. You sound like you're going to be fine. Just went a bit too fast. B

[[Da...]]

I only dose twice a day. The Valium doesn't seem to have much of a sedating effect on me. My evening dose around 8-9pm. At 10 or 11 I'm still wide awake. Sleep maybe 3-5 hours and then toss and turn awake for the next 3. Morning dose at about the same 8-9 time frame. No sedating effects. I just get tired from not sleeping. I'm mostly home bound because of the dizziness. My wife drives me around. I can manage to take her to the train station twice a week witch is only a mile away. Let me tell you how hard that is! Still hopeful.

[[ly...]]

 

 

I think you'll be fine after holding for a while.  It may take a few weeks to get back on solid ground.  I've gotten the dizzies when tapering too fast.  This is the only wd sxs that I find debilitating.  Just make sure you're good before you start to taper again.  I don't cut when I'm not well and it's working out for me.  I also slowed way down (learned some lessons).  So...I would hold until  feeling well and then wait at least two weeks between cuts.  Slow down/reduce cuts if things start ramping up.

[[Ca...]]

Once i found my starting point, and waited till i felt better-ie. the new sx had eased, the lower i get the better i feel...

my cuts are getting bigger by%, and maybe i am taking a little longer to stabalize, but its much smoother and i would rather hold toward the end of a cut, while feeling not so bad, than suffer worse sx fron cutting before i felt ready... -i cut by how im feeling and how the last cut went...

But yes, -for me also, the lower i get, the less brutal... none of the mental panic anxiety stuff from December, mainly lack of sleep, but i just c/o from am to pm, and that was like a nasty cut, but feel better for it now... -still early days for me, but hope this helps... -i need every day of the 14 between cuts atm... so soon it will be smaller cuts and/or longer holds, i guess...?

Best wishes...

[[Da...]]

Are any of you able to work, go out, vacation, etc? I had to cancel my yearly vacation to see my son because of this. Obviously getting off these meds holds huge weight in the decision. But I couldn't even go if I wanted to. So I don't know how people get through all these months and years and are still able to function. I can walk around the block and the neighbors probably think I'm drunk. Are most of you just able to function better or are most of you like me and kind of trapped by all of this? I guess I'm lucky I retired a year ago. I wouldn't know how to make it through work. Or I would just keep taking the meds and possibly even more just to make a living. I'm 56 now and I'm sure it's harder than a 30 year old to deal with. You lose a bit of hope knowing you're losing some of the good times you deserve during retirement. I like to play a lot of golf, and as one ages that gets harder especially for me who did tree work all my life. I already have enough pains from that alone. Now just going to the range is impossible because I can't even walk straight. I hear it will get better and I have to believe that. Im not very patient. I don't know how you all do it if you feel as bad as I do during this long process. Bless you all.

[[ly...]]

 

I lead a full, normal life and have throughout most of my 2 yr taper.  My only advice would be to slow it down.  I'm 58 and 25 yrs on benzos.

[[Da...]]

Im happy for you! You must be one of the lucky ones. I plan to taper slower now but can't imagine being this way for more months and months on end. I'm hoping for a breakthrough of some sorts here soon. Then at least I'll feel like progress is finally taking hold. Anybody else's experiences? I'm so happy for those that can work and function through this. Trying to be positive while the light at the end of the tunnel seems to be getting smaller.

[[ly...]]

 

I wouldn't say that I am particularly lucky - just prudent.  I know how bad it can be and I don't want to revisit that.

[[Tw...]]

I stopped working but I am seeing from trial and error that holding longer and slowing things down might allow me to resume a semi normal life again. Its a tough game of chance trying to find that stable point to live from after you've been hurting for so long. I don't want to drag it out anymore than I have to but not having a life and rushing isn't working very well either. Every success story where someone had an easier taper seems to be because they slowed down. I'm learning too and I'm 29. Almost 1 year down tapering but this year I should be off the drug. It seems the more stable people are when they jump, the better the chances are for bypassing major post acute withdrawal. 

[[Jo...]]

I'm down to 10mg of v after crossover from Kpin. I tapered Kpin down to .725 then continued to taper while crossing over. Got down to and equivalent of 15mg of V and started tapering and at  currently 10mg. So halfway home from my original dosage of Kpin! The question I have is when does anybody feel stabilized? If the meds work less and less as you get off of them, the symptoms usually get more intense and prevalent. How do you stabilize from that? Just going down from 15mg to 10, I have never felt stabilized. None of the symptoms go away and new ones creep in during the taper process. I'm holding at 10mg right now for a few weeks to a month as I seem to be having other symptoms adding to the ones I already have during the withdrawal process. Can I get some people to chime in and let me know what they conceive as stabilized? There hasn't been more than 1-3 days during the taper where I would consider myself feeling well enough to taper again. Any insight or personal experiences would be greatly appreciated. I know some people can feel fine while others have quite a hard time. But are you ever stable enough to taper lower? I would think that the withdrawal symptoms would prevent someone from actually stabilizing until some time after the completion of the medication. Thanks!!

 

Hi Dave, I have been going much slower than you.  I keep wanting to speed it up, but whats the point.  I want to be off these drugs permanently.  So rushing probably makes no sense.  Believe me, I am writing this as much to myself as you. 

 

Stable for me means a mixed bag of good sleep nights (6 hrs straight), not too many panic attacks, a few minutes of anxiety - not hours on end.  Once I get to that point I cut again.  I am cutting 0.5 mg of V every seven to ten days.  I keep a journal, and every few days I write down my symptoms.  The remain unchanged since I started: Anxiety, some Dp or DR, Periodic, but not complete insomnia, GI issues - of the fast moving variety.  I have no real expectation of actually feeling real good anywhere along the way. 

 

I force myself to exercise alot.  I have vague recollections of the good kind of tired I have had in the past.  I haven't felt that for a long time.  Its always the overtired, strung out feeling. 

 

I am also hypersensitive to stress, and the weather.  We are having a hell winter with rain three days a week.  It take its toll on my emotions.  I would happily take -10 C and clear skies over this garbage. 

 

Hang in there. 

[[No...]]

I am in the same boat and trying to hold for,longer periods going forward. I was cutting every week (albeit small amounts) but it took a toll on me. I saw 2 docs who both told me the same thing. Cut and hold until you feel better for at least a week. I want to get off this poison in the worst way but I believe by doing it this way the end might give me a shorter recovery post benzos. I have all the classic symptoms and have been able to work and function as ,ugh as possible. I am also a single dad living alone with shared custody. Trying to keep it together and taper has not been fun at all. Hang in there!

[Guest [Lu...]]

im one of the lucky ones to have apparently hit tolerance withdrawal. for nearly a year i had no idea what was wrong with me. has made tapering really hard as i just constantly feel lousy really. occasional little windows but meh. before i even started tapering i felt AWFUL. went to every dr, had every test imaginable terrifified what the hell was wrong. they came up with nothing so on my own agaunst dr orders i said the hell with this, im coming off the medication cause tis the only factor left in the equation.

 

The ironic thing is before i knew anything about this, i updosed from 10 to 20mg's simply thinking, oh, i just need more to feel better now. i didnt feel the slightest difference, not one bit of relief. actually, i think it made me feel worse.

 

i have not stabilized at all and honestly im pushing through my taper probably alil bit quicker than "average". each cut sucks but its honestly no worse than ive already felt.

 

im now at 7.5 from 20mg, and will forge on. its been roughly 14 months of this 24/7 bad acid trip, im almost kinda used to most symptoms im not even as scared anymore ha!

[[Da...]]

I keep seeing the abbreviations dp and dr. What do those signify? And as far as the dizziness goes, most say hang tight and don't cut anymore until they pass and others say they've held for months and it has never passed. Or even after months beyond their final jump. I can't even imagine that. I have been at 10mg for the last 2 weeks and just got a new prescription to stay at 10 for another month if I have to. I'm hoping to see a difference in the next couple of weeks I hope. Otherwise, is this something I'm going to have to stay at 10mg for longer or am I one of those unlucky people that will be dealing with this for an endless amount of time? I certainly hope not. I've been lucky I guess that other symptoms have been completely tolerable. Insomnia is there as always. 3-5 hours if I'm lucky. And now anxiety is way more prevalent since the last cut. Mostly morning but a few days it has lasted for hours. Today it's been with me all day. I'm trying to hang in there but the dizzies are getting the best of me. 😖👎

[[Jo...]]

dp: depersonalization

 

dr: derealization

 

I guess there just lesser versions of panic.  Dont google it at night.  :-). 

[[er...]]

I never did really "stabilize" when I tapered over 7 months - for me, I don't think it could have been possible, unless I wanted to wait 1 1/2 years between cuts..

[[Ca...]]

My life is getting much better as i get my taper right for me...

positive feeds positive, a correct taper shouldnt b all bad...

Like i posted before, the lower i get the better i feel, and i have basicly been 2yrs in bed... on top of more years in hospital... we WILL fly again..