Ways to stabilize a dopamine/acetylcholine (im)balance ?

[[li...]]

There are lots of ways to theorize about something.

 

Clonazepam is unique. I've had lots of issues.

 

Yet, in many ways I realized there is a related dopamine/acetylcholine imbalance. Maybe it's something like a movement disorder.

I have quite a history. A rapid taper attempt years ago. Dramatic intestinal spasms when I would rest, much less so when active.

 

A classic: when on a different benzo and I try to exercise, I get in some kind of 'withdrawal'. On lorazepam: cognitive, perception of time.

While tapering clonazepam (quite some time ago!): lower doses require me to stop exercising, as in real exercise in the gym. I remember at one time, years ago, I got the subjective experience of time moving much slower when I hit the gym after long abstinence. That, an the treshhold for falling asleep being much higher.

 

Some experience with mebeverine, a muscarinic antagonist.

 

Exercise making me more alert (more than normal), or the opposite.

 

Much, much more of this.

 

For me, it's not 'just the benzo' and 'I'm not fine'.

 

Regardless of what I do, this may be an issue. Any ideas about how to address it ? Somebody once told me that a dopamine/acetylcholine imbalance is the endpoint of several neurological diseases.

 

Say, I were to switch to a different benzo. I would go into 'withdrawal' unless I went back on clonazepam, even if for one dose ... It covers something other benzos do not.

 

I guess I can ask ... I don't have a competent and dedicated neurologist ...

[[be...]]

I personally don't trust neurologists in terms of benzodiazepines. They know how they affect the brain but are clueless when it comes to the differences between them and surely don't know how to taper them, IMHO.

[[li...]]

Wel, it seems that psychiatrists are not the answer either ... here they get people on drugs, not off drugs. No addiction psychiatrists like in the USA.

 

I've never seen a neurologist ... and yes, I need that referral although I might be able to go without one if it is something small and obvious and I pay out of pocket.

 

I've read some scary stuff, like this one: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20590830

 

Colin got 'lucky' with his neurologist.

 

[[be...]]

Liberty

 

That is one scary link. 👎🏿👎🏿

[[Pl...]]

This makes me feel like with all my motor involuntary movement issues especially my face and other parts... I'm just gonna die from this because the damage is done...

[[Ch...]]

This link is about Parkinson's disease.  Am I missing something?

[[Pl...]]

Dopamine controls body movement and disruption of this also causes tremors which I have both severely .....and akasthesthia which I also have.......

 

I cannot cope it is so terrifying and really bad....severely ill... :'(

[[li...]]

Pleasebehere,

 

You have been on it for a relatively short time. I wouldn't expect long term damage. No guarantees, though.

Please note that this is 'chewing the fat', not a support section.

 

Challis,

 

'such as Parkinson's disease.' Not limited to that.

[[Ki...]]

Liberty,

 

You have a lot of theories and questions about "other possible issues", which are often quite vague. I understand you are looking for answers, but is it at all possible that you continue to try and find "other reasons" for your issues because you aren't quite ready to taper your benzo?

 

Scaring yourself with other disorders (like Parkinson's) seems counter productive to me. How did you decide you have an dopamine/acetylcholine imbalance and not tolerance/withdrawal from benzos? You have the exact same symptoms as everyone else here I believe.

 

Also, I'm wondering how Clonazepam is unique? Can you explain?

[[li...]]

Kiddo, lots of questions !

 

Too much to really answer those, I'm afraid.

 

' How did you decide you have an dopamine/acetylcholine imbalance and not tolerance/withdrawal from benzos?' I mentioned some above.

ANY symptom can be 'benzo withdrawal'. Just taper it off, while living normally, possibly wait a few years ... to see if it's that ...

 

I think Braban once said something about that ... she's no longer around.

 

'You have the exact same symptoms as everyone else here I believe. ' No !

 

Clonazepam unique ? Lots of reasons. Highest potency benzo (Ki value lowest, with the exception of triazolam), several sources mention an effect on acetylcholine/serotonin, particulary effective for myoclonic seizures and absence seizures, long half life, long duration of action (possibly the longest, personal experiences may vary), effect on GABAB receptors in the thalamic reticular nucleus, something unique related to light sensitivity, something about 'spinal inhibition', in my experience a benzo like no other. Possibly more !

Personal: mixed sedating/stimulating effects, probably partly paradoxical at this point.

It does some things it shouldn't do !

 

As someone's doc stated, long term withdrawal effects after/post direct tapers.

 

'but is it at all possible that you continue to try and find "other reasons" for your issues because you aren't quite ready to taper your benzo? '

I suppose I'm not 'ready'. I'm not 'fine', it's not 'just the benzo'.

Where I live healthcare is quite limited. Access to healthcare is restricted, referrals by GPs are mandatory. But even for this country, I got really unlucky. I had to deal with several untreated health issues (was lied to, information was withheld), and at one point I was desperate enough to try lorazepam (idea GP) !

 

I'm trying to find a way out ... Some ideas/plans, but tapering as a panacea for all health issues ...

 

I'm sorry if I'm a bit curt. But I'm dealing with something a lot worse than mild parkinson's disease.

 

 

[[Ki...]]

I'm not following, it's still very vague. You ask for suggestions but don't really give any information. I hope you find the answers you're looking for.

[[li...]]

I know ...

 

I just recalled something, and it may have had nothing to do with the title of the thread.

 

Anyway, years ago when I was still healthy ... Generally, the clonazepam was not sedating. But if I would not exercise for 2-3 weeks, the clonazepam would become sedating ... more vivid dreams etc.

 

I still don't know what that is ... not very benzo-like. I wonder if 'central sensitization' (usually used for 'pain') is related ...

[[be...]]

I find when I exercise regularly my endorphins go up, hence more energy. I feel more sedated when I'm at home and not doing much.

[[li...]]

Not the same ... I doubt it had anything to do with endorphins in your case, natural euphoria caused by endorphines requires 99-100 % of absolute maximum effort.

[[be...]]

Not the same ... I doubt it had anything to do with endorphins in your case, natural euphoria caused by endorphines requires 99-100 % of absolute maximum effort.

 

Does passing boot camp count?

[[li...]]

It might ! You were in the army ?

[[be...]]

It might ! You were in the army ?

 

No. Boot camp at the gym. They call it that because it is a very difficult series of exercises.