Which doses to cut..and does it matter???

[[my...]]

Here is one more question...part math and part others' experiences.... I have made my most recent cuts from the mid-day dose of K.  When I was taking 2 mg I divided it into four doses.  Once I began my taper I stayed at four doses until I hit 1.5 at which point I went to three.  The interdose was a little hard but now I'm used to it..sort of. Anyhow, I've made the last two cuts from the mid-day dose, making the doses unequal.  If I continue the mid-day dose will disappear which I think could be problematic in terms of interdose w/d sxs.

 

Any suggestions how others have tapered from either K or X (they seem similar in strength if not in half-life) or really any benzo in terms of spreading out doses vs just considering the total amount and the percentage cut of the total being the most important thing.

 

Make sense??...I'm not sure I explained my question very well 

 

Thanks!

Mana

[[...]]

Good Morning My Mana! 

 

You're an early-riser! I hope you are well today

 

Your question is very interesting, I'll try to give you some points to consider but I'm sure more experienced Buddies will have better answers on their ways 

 

First, let me congratulate you on hitting your 1.5mg milestone and managing to switch to 3 daily doses!! :thumbsup:

 

It seems quite unusual though to be prescribed clonazepam 4 times a day - was this your initial prescription?

 

As for your options, well it's important that you choose what's the most comfortable for you, but you're right to think of your taper in the long term.

 

You could indeed keep cutting off the midday dose but indeed, you'll be left with 12h between you two remaining doses and your body may not like that very much, especially as it's initially been used to getting 4 doses.

 

If it were me, I think I would stick with 3 doses but aim to make them equal and spread them out 8 hours apart.

And from that point, cut from my total daily intake.

 

Let's see what other Buddies think! 

 

Hugs! xx

 

 

 

[[...]]

Hi MM,  Julz has given you good advice.  Spreading your dose evenly through the day and bringing them all down together is a helpful way to minimize symptoms.IMO the best way to do this is to liquify the K.

[[...]]

Hi MM,  Julz has given you good advice.  Spreading your dose evenly through the day and bringing them all down together is a helpful way to minimize symptoms.IMO the best way to do this is to liquify the K.

 

I learn from the best, that's why, SG! 

 

Mana Darling, if you want to talk about dosages and discuss titration vs dry cutting, please let us know 

 

In the meantime, I wish you a lovely day! 

 

[[my...]]

Thanks Julz and SG! 

 

Actually, It was last night (for me) when I wrote the post  . And no, it was not an Rx for 4x/day...just my instinct.  The Rx was for 1 mg 2 x/day.

 

That said,  I think you are both correct...that I should try to even out the doses and take them 8 hrs apart....I will work on the math today!  I am still at a point where dry cutting will work, at least until I get to 1 mg.  I passed the 1.5 mg milestone over a month ago, held, then began tapering again.  My hesitation about cutting across the board is the time it takes to split the pills and to figure out roughly equivalent doses but I have time today to figure it out. 

 

Thank you both my dears!     

[[my...]]

SG,

Once I get to 1 mg, I will be back to you about liquefying K....or if you are able to tell me now (although I suppose I could look on the Titration Method...) I would love to know how you did it...

 

Many thanks again for your sound advice!!  You are a voice of reason, SG!!! 

[[...]]

I can help with that, but need to go out for a while and will be back in an hour or two.

[[my...]]

Got it!!  I can take (for this cut): .4375 plus .4375 plus .5..... A much better idea and will go like that across the board from now on....  Thank you again Julz and SG!! 

[[...]]

Hi MM, I'm back.  Liquifying K can be done in several ways, but perhaps the easiest is to put the pill into full fat whole milk.  Be sure it is whole milk.

 

I don't know which pill sizes you have, but for example, if it is a .5mg pill you could put it into 50ml whole milk.  This way each ml will contain .01mg K.  The only equipment needed is a 1ml and a 10ml syringe and a few good sealing jars, like jam jars.

 

Once dissolved and mixed you can take your cut then split the remainder into however many doses you have for the day.  Easy.

[[my...]]

Thank you so much!  I'll print your post and keep it for when I get down further...as I wrote, it's still easy to dry cut, probably will be all the way to 1 mg. unless I need to cut less than .065 down the road. We'll see....so far so good today. 

 

So thoughtful of you to remember to post your method once you got back online....I was out too!  A nice long walk..rained earlier then the sun came out.....felt good.

 

You should be a Moderator unless you don't have the time...your advice is always right on. 

 

Mana    (MM to you SG!!  )

[[Cl...]]

Hi Mana, Julz, SG!

Mana, Congratulations! You are doing so well! I agree in what Julz and SG are saying here!

 

Sorry I did not write to you before, I have sore throath and I am coughing a lot!...that plus working...at least trying

 

Wish you all the best!

 

Smile and laugh a lot during the taper, as Lord Byron once said, "...smiling it is a cheap medicine"

 

 

[[sa...]]

Hi Mana, Julz, SG!

Mana, Congratulations! You are doing so well! I agree in what Julz and SG are saying here!

 

Sorry I did not write to you before, I have sore throath and I am coughing a lot!...that plus working...at least trying

 

Wish you all the best!

 

Smile and laugh a lot during the taper, as Lord Byron once said, "...smiling it is a cheap medicine"

 

I added this to a list of quotes that I like.  I will try to smile more often. 

[[Cl...]]

Hi Saul, the exact quote is like this: "Always laugh when you can. It is cheap medicine".

I am glad that you like it!

[[sa...]]

Like it! 

[[my...]]

And YOU Clona!!!  You are doing so well!    You cut again....hope you will be just fine -- except for a sore throat and coughing....   Please take care of yourself and get as much rest as you can, drink lots of water/fluids and steam helps...

 

I also love the quote and will make a note of it...   It's so true, isn't it?

 

Always great to hear from you, Clona...  and nice to see your name on the boards too, Saul....glad we are all keeping tabs on one another. 

 

M     

[[Cl...]]

Hi Mana

You sound very well! Congratulations!...yes, I cut every day! It is a nice feeling...and very nice method for me!...just superslow!...if I were not coughing I would be great!...no time to rest my Mana...working tomorrow but happy and prepared to work more and in a nicely way! 

I hope your research is going alright!

I wish you all the best!!!

[[...]]

Hello Everybody, Dear Friends!!! 

 

Happy to see you here Clona Darling!!

I hope your sore throat clears away soon, that's never welcome! But you sound like you're fairly enjoying life 

 

Mana my Dear, I'm also really happy for you as your tapering plan is going to the next level: thinking of the long term - and the end of K in your life, yeyyyy!!!  :thumbsup:

Glad you're going to spread out your doses evenly! I think you should wait until you have adjusted to your recent cut though, it's a step in its own - well I'm not SG but... may I suggest 

I also think SG should be promoted to moderator!! At the moment I'll call him a mentor 

 

Big hugs from windy UK  

[[Cl...]]

Hi Everbody here!

Julz, it is GREAT to read you! You really sound full of life!, How are you feeling?

I agree with you, SG should be promoted to Moderator!

Mana, I agree with Julz, spreading feels like a cut, at least for me, try to hold for a little while before doing that.

I am sending you all a Big kiss!

Still no working much no problem with that for a while  but I do feel much better now of my coughing...sx are mild, daily microtaper feels like holding! ...so far.

 

[[my...]]

Hi everyone,

Clona I am interested in the daily microtaper you are doing....you will have to tell us how you are doing that...not a liquid titration is it?  I'm not sure how one cuts such a small piece on a daily basis.  But I am SO glad the daily taper is working for you!  Really really glad... 

 

Julz and Clona, I DID even out the doses and perhaps that is why I had such a bad wave last night and this morning. I had no idea it would make a difference!?!  I'm feeling much better now and hope it will hold for a while at least.  The first several days of a new cut are hard, for me at least and this time was worse than the last cut.  In fact, I wrote a REALLY depressing post on another thread....Megan's thread about being Xanax free....I'm sorry I wrote it when I was down...things change so rapidly, don't they?  I MUST remember that when a wave hits again....and it will. 

 

Have a good evening Clona...and of course Julz, sweet dreams.... 

mana     

[[Cl...]]

Hi Mana! I am sorry you had a wave after making your doses Even, I should have tell you this yesterday...I just thoght that as you were already in several doses, you will have no much problem in making them even...I feel so gulty about that!...please forgive me! 

 

SG is going to kill me about this, it is just my experience...I do think that the Ashton Method, direct Taper, cutting and holding, is a good method when we are in high doses for many years and we have reached tolerance withdrawal. It helped me a lot! Then, at mid or lower doses, when we are starting to feel bad most of the time, or even better, before that happens, it is better to move to either liquid titration or daily microtapering.

 

For solid daily microtaper we need a scale able to weight 0.001 grams, as I have read in here you can buy it by Amazon or eBay, not very easy to find this scale in Mexico. However, I have one at work, a reagent grade chemical scale, that is why I decided to keep on solid cuts.

 

What I did was to weight ten 0.5 mg pills of Rivotril and calculated the average weight ( sum of the ten valúes divided by 10), the average weight was 0.151 grams for the full 0.5 mg Rivotril pill.

Now I am still over 0.5 mg, that is a full 0.5 mg pill + a weighted tiny piece of pill which each day weighs 0.001 gram less than the day before.

 

But suppose we are already in 0.5 mg, we use a finger nail ground ( ?, cannot find the right word, this thing we use to have our nails nicely curved) to take off very low amount of pill, by weighting and grounding using the finger nail device, weighting, grounding...do not worry, once we get experience, the procedure is are very easy.

Then:

First Day: we take a Big piece of pill that weights 0.151 - 1 = 0.150; 0.001 grams in difference of the total weight of the pill equals to 0.0033 mg Rivotril.

Second Day: 0.149 mg

Third Day: 0.148 mg

And so on...for 151 days...plus holding if necessary...

Of course at lower doses we can keep quarters or halves for the following days.

 

I normally weight a 7 days supply in one go and I am using traces of previous cuts to prepare my very tiny piece of pill...it is so tiny now...just have 6 days more to go to reach 0.5 mg.

 

Mana, Please forgive my English, I cannot remember the word for the finger nail device nor the verb of doing that...grounding...grinding...?

 

Please ask me again if you have doubts! I hope it helps!

 

Send you and all BBs in here a Big kiss!

 

 

 

 

 

[[Cl...]]

Nail file? Nail filing?

[[Cl...]]

Mana, now that Imam having two doses, in the morning I cut by hand a quarter of the full 0.5 mg pill and intake it. Then, in the evening I take the remaining of the full pill + the tiny piece of pill...

[[my...]]

My dear Clona 

 

Please please do not blame yourself for my wave!!!  I had called my dr earlier and she had said the same thing -- to try and even out my doses...no no...I think it was just the cut itself that did it and in any case I am feeling better now.

 

Thank you so much for sharing your microtaper process with me and your thinking on going down in doses.  When I get to that point I will have to hire a math tutor to help me as I swear I cannot fathom the whole ml/mg thing...but we have a way to go until that time.  I keep thinking of Saul who did not microtaper but kept dry cutting and spreading out his taper that way.  Maybe he is just acting brave, but he has written that he has felt better and better the lower he has gone...  I guess everyone is so different.

 

And btw, your English is beautiful!!!!!  Remember, we are stumbling around trying to express ourselves in our native tongue while you are bi-lingual if not multi-lingual!!

 

I am going to sign off soon and distract myself with The Good Wife (recorded last night) and other stuff until bedtime.

 

So a very good night to you Clona and to all...       

[[sa...]]

My dear Clona 

 

Please please do not blame yourself for my wave!!!  I had called my dr earlier and she had said the same thing -- to try and even out my doses...no no...I think it was just the cut itself that did it and in any case I am feeling better now.

 

Thank you so much for sharing your microtaper process with me and your thinking on going down in doses.  When I get to that point I will have to hire a math tutor to help me as I swear I cannot fathom the whole ml/mg thing...but we have a way to go until that time.  I keep thinking of Saul who did not microtaper but kept dry cutting and spreading out his taper that way.  Maybe he is just acting brave, but he has written that he has felt better and better the lower he has gone...  I guess everyone is so different.

 

And btw, your English is beautiful!!!!!  Remember, we are stumbling around trying to express ourselves in our native tongue while you are bi-lingual if not multi-lingual!!

 

I am going to sign off soon and distract myself with The Good Wife (recorded last night) and other stuff until bedtime.

 

So a very good night to you Clona and to all...       

 

I am not brave just lucky. I hope to God that continues. I think that people who are suffering greatly, but continue going forward are the bravest people in this world. I cannot imagine anyone braver.

 

I am lucky to be feeling better as I go down, very lucky. I suffered a lot for a very long time at the start, so I don't take it for granted. I do think we all are very different, but still think that we all have a chance to get better as we go down. I don't consider myself brave because I was ignorant to what was going on at the start. Doctors kept on saying it will only last 3 weeks and I believed them. If I would of known my suffering would last months, I might of crumbled. I think I would of. I still worry about what is going to happen as I go down further, but getting more optimistic.

 

I hope that continues for me and really hope that for you and everybody. I am happy people like SG , Clona and others are out there to give advice. 

[[my...]]

Thank you for that, Saul....it really means a lot.  I guess we are ALL brave in our own ways......I should really be asleep but wasn't sleepy so thought I would check in with my support network 

 

And I was happily rewarded. 

 

Now to bed!